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Why Rare Flights To La Paz?  
User currently offlineRootsAir From Costa Rica, joined Feb 2005, 4186 posts, RR: 40
Posted (9 years 4 months 4 days 7 hours ago) and read 3180 times:

La paz is currently bolivia's biggest city. However I see that most international flights depart from and arrive to Santa Cruz


The altitude of La Paz is 3,600 m. I think that must be the reason why not many international flights fly there .I think its difficult for airplanes to land and take off at such altitude (why ?? )

Nevertheless there are still many flights to and from La Paz so it can't really be the real reason.
Would anyone be able to clarify my dilemma


Regards


A man without the knowledge of his past history,culture and origins is like a tree without roots
17 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineACDC8 From Canada, joined Mar 2005, 7642 posts, RR: 36
Reply 1, posted (9 years 4 months 4 days 7 hours ago) and read 3167 times:

Quoting RootsAir (Thread starter):
The altitude of La Paz is 3,600 m. I think that must be the reason why not many international flights fly there .I think its difficult for airplanes to land and take off at such altitude (why ?? )

Due to the airports elevation, the air is not as dense as it is at sea level resulting in a loss of performance. The engines need to work much harder with less air then they usually need to under normal conditions, that's why La Paz also has a fairly long runway, 13 000ft I believe. So I guess there are not many international flights there because their weight restrictions wouldn't make it worth while.



A Grumpy German Is A Sauerkraut
User currently offlineOB1504 From United States of America, joined Jul 2004, 3309 posts, RR: 9
Reply 2, posted (9 years 4 months 4 days 6 hours ago) and read 3136 times:

Quoting ACDC8 (Reply 1):
Due to the airports elevation, the air is not as dense as it is at sea level resulting in a loss of performance. The engines need to work much harder with less air then they usually need to under normal conditions, that's why La Paz also has a fairly long runway, 13 000ft I believe. So I guess there are not many international flights there because their weight restrictions wouldn't make it worth while.

This also why many carriers that serve Bolivia serve, say XYZ-LPB-VVI-XYZ, for similar reasons to KLM (in the "KLM Cruel Triangle Flights" thread), so that from LPB to VVI not much fuel is needed, and the aircraft can depart fully loaded to its final destination from VVI, which is at a lower elevation.

[Edited 2005-03-31 14:54:11]

User currently offlineMason From United States of America, joined Jun 1999, 748 posts, RR: 1
Reply 3, posted (9 years 4 months 3 days 19 hours ago) and read 2981 times:

This is puzzled me as well. The closest major international city to La Paz is Lima, which is only served via TWO daily non-stop flights, one on LAB (727) and one on TACA (A319). Flights to other cities are sparse. I have no idea why there are only two daliy non-stop flights between LPB and LIM. I am flying there next month, and have to connect in CUZ to avoid spending 10+ hours in LIM. My first time to Bolivia, so I'm excited.

User currently offlineMason From United States of America, joined Jun 1999, 748 posts, RR: 1
Reply 4, posted (9 years 4 months 3 days 19 hours ago) and read 2970 times:

BTW, since when does KLM serve Bolivia? To my knowledge, the only non-southamerican airline serving Bolivia is AA from MIA (752). Correct me if I'm wrong.

User currently offlineAirbazar From United States of America, joined Sep 2003, 8232 posts, RR: 10
Reply 5, posted (9 years 4 months 3 days 19 hours ago) and read 2963 times:

Could it also be something as simple as not enough demand? I've never been to La Paz so I'm not familiar with its economics but, how much business is there in La Paz to justify air service to anywhere else other than a few flights here and there?

User currently offlineMiguel0881 From United States of America, joined Sep 2004, 73 posts, RR: 0
Reply 6, posted (9 years 4 months 3 days 19 hours ago) and read 2947 times:

I've flown from LPB many times, and flights to Lima are very often near empty, so I don't think more frequency are needed there. And AA flights to LPB from MIA are not really that much more than to LIM, so it's not that difficult to get there from North America at least if you want, and most Europeans can connect with only one connection via MIA.

User currently offlineCOSPN From Northern Mariana Islands, joined Oct 2001, 1606 posts, RR: 0
Reply 7, posted (9 years 4 months 3 days 19 hours ago) and read 2943 times:

Aero Peru used to fly the 727 LIM-Cuzco-LaPaz...

SOmeone can look it up but a few people have died upon de pressurization of flites in LaPaz Just cant take the pressure change...

Also no Fires there (Like a Building) not enough oxgen to burn but they have fire stations wow..can someone confirm these stories...thanks  Smile


User currently offlineACDC8 From Canada, joined Mar 2005, 7642 posts, RR: 36
Reply 8, posted (9 years 4 months 3 days 19 hours ago) and read 2937 times:

Quoting COSPN (Reply 7):
SOmeone can look it up but a few people have died upon de pressurization of flites in LaPaz Just cant take the pressure change...

Now that you mentioned it, I remember reading an article in a magazine about La Paz and that due to the elevation, non local pilots (people who are not used to the high altitudes and thinner air) are supposed to wear their oxygen masks during that landing.



A Grumpy German Is A Sauerkraut
User currently offlineOS-A330 From Austria, joined Aug 2001, 75 posts, RR: 0
Reply 9, posted (9 years 4 months 3 days 11 hours ago) and read 2843 times:

Quoting COSPN (Reply 7):
SOmeone can look it up but a few people have died upon de pressurization of flites in LaPaz Just cant take the pressure change...

This isn't really common though or is it?
Up to my knowledge CUZ is even at 3.700 m and I don't think depressurization is an issue there.


User currently offlineAirKas1 From Netherlands, joined Dec 2003, 3969 posts, RR: 55
Reply 10, posted (9 years 4 months 3 days 7 hours ago) and read 2789 times:

Quoting Mason (Reply 4):
BTW, since when does KLM serve Bolivia?

They don't I think. He was just using it as an example in his comment about triangle flights.


User currently offlineLatinAviation From United States of America, joined Nov 2003, 1276 posts, RR: 15
Reply 11, posted (9 years 4 months 3 days 6 hours ago) and read 2769 times:

Quoting ACDC8 (Reply 8):
Now that you mentioned it, I remember reading an article in a magazine about La Paz and that due to the elevation, non local pilots (people who are not used to the high altitudes and thinner air) are supposed to wear their oxygen masks during that landing.

You're correct. I've flown to LPB before and a friend of mine is a 757 F/O for AA based in Miami. He says they put the oxygen masks on descent to LPB and keep them on until after take-off enroute to VVI.

For AA, the crew does not layover in LPB. They fly MIA-LPB-VVI and swap crews there.

But apparently LAB does not.

As far as people having heart attacks, I don't know, I cannot confirm. Would it surprise me? No. It is a slap in the face when that door opens. They do offer a "coca de manta" tea upon arrival, which is supposed to ease the affects of altitude sickness.

If Bolivia passes a 50% tax rate on the petro industry, I suspect the J class cabins on those LIM and MIA flights will be even more empty. The five int'l companies that operate in the energy sector in Bolivia said that passing such a high tax would certainly crush the industry there. This movement is being pushed by Evo Morales, a Bolivian chavista more or less, who wants to renationalize much of what Bolivia privatized in the early-to-mid 1990s.


User currently offlineOrion737 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 12, posted (9 years 4 months 3 days 4 hours ago) and read 2717 times:

Its time IB went into Bolivia. If they are serious about South America, why exclude the wonderful Bolivia?

User currently offlineDiezel From Netherlands, joined Oct 2002, 646 posts, RR: 11
Reply 13, posted (9 years 4 months 3 days 4 hours ago) and read 2704 times:

Departure from La Paz is breathtaking by the way. You will pass the mighty mount Illimani at very close range. Be sure to sit on the left side of the plane.

Roel.



Never be afraid of what you like. (Miles Davis)
User currently offlineNYCFlyer From United States of America, joined Jan 2005, 1387 posts, RR: 10
Reply 14, posted (9 years 4 months 3 days 4 hours ago) and read 2694 times:

There's a key component that many of you are missing here, and that is simply that Santa Cruz is the business capital of Bolivia. It's also a larger city in terms of population. So no surprise that it gets more, or better, service to the outside world.

Quoting Mason (Reply 3):
This is puzzled me as well. The closest major international city to La Paz is Lima, which is only served via TWO daily non-stop flights, one on LAB (727) and one on TACA (A319). Flights to other cities are sparse. I have no idea why there are only two daliy non-stop flights between LPB and LIM. I am flying there next month, and have to connect in CUZ to avoid spending 10+ hours in LIM. My first time to Bolivia, so I'm excited.

It doesn't surprise me at all that there aren't more than two flights. That's all the demand there is. When you get outside the "developed world," far fewer people fly. To show comparison, there are only two flights a day between Cairo and Amman (one each on RJ and MS), and same b/w AMM and BEY, and those three cities are among the biggest business cities in the Middle East.

That said, have a blast in Peru/Bolivia! I took a bus between CUZ and LPB back in 2001, it's long but beautiful. Those are two of my favorite cities in the world. I envy you - have fun!


User currently offlineRatypus From United Kingdom, joined Apr 2004, 176 posts, RR: 0
Reply 15, posted (9 years 4 months 3 days 3 hours ago) and read 2670 times:

I flew into LPB from sea level (not strictly recommended)....you definitely notice the altitude on first arriving: I felt really dizzy in the queue for immigration.

As for people dying - its possible, though I imagine you'd have to be pretty unfit or have a mild heart condition to trigger that sort of reaction.

The impression I got at LPB is that there simply isn't the demand to justify any more flights than go there already - the daily (at most, may even be only 3x week) flight I came in on - LAN from Arica - felt like a big event up there: there were no other aircraft movements at the time. The terminal is really small and run-down - I'm not sure how it would cope with an IB long-haul Airbus!

La Paz is a fantastic city though - I'd recommend the journey to anyone - even if you do have to change planes in LIM. And between ourselves....more flights is no bad thing, right?


User currently offlineMiguel0881 From United States of America, joined Sep 2004, 73 posts, RR: 0
Reply 16, posted (9 years 4 months 2 days 19 hours ago) and read 2576 times:

Quoting Ratypus (Reply 15):
La Paz is a fantastic city though - I'd recommend the journey to anyone - even if you do have to change planes in LIM. And between ourselves....more flights is no bad thing, right?

This is very true...you can even enhance your trip if you have the time by flying to LIM...while I've flown straight from MIA to LPB, I've also traveled via LIM several times and either flown straight on to LPB on LB, or taken the scenic route by flying to Tacna (Peru), crossing to Arica and bussing to La Paz (Arica-La Paz, 8 hrs.) or visiting Nazca, Arequipa, Puno, etc. before coming into La Paz. Besides AA, many carriers fly from MIA-LIM...I've done Copa with a stopover in Panama City, and you can do Taca in SJO too. So if you like air travel and visiting new places, there are many interesting ways to get to LPB even if it isn't the world's busiest place!


User currently offlineSOUTHAMERICA From Colombia, joined Dec 2003, 2497 posts, RR: 10
Reply 17, posted (9 years 4 months 2 days 16 hours ago) and read 2506 times:

Quoting Miguel0881 (Reply 16):
I've done Copa with a stopover in Panama City, and you can do Taca in SJO too.

...or with Avianca via BOG too. It's in the way, short connection times, and one fair advantge over the other two airlines you mentioned: widebody aircraft on both BOG-LIM/LIM-BOG and BOG-MIA/MIA-BOG segments.

 cheerful 


SOUTHAMERICA


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