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EK: Want Larger A380 For Longhaul LCC  
User currently offlinePANAM_DC10 From Australia, joined Aug 2000, 4162 posts, RR: 89
Posted (9 years 5 months 2 weeks 7 hours ago) and read 7444 times:
AIRLINERS.NET CREW
COMMUNITY MANAGER

I found the following report on Bloomberg but I don't have access to the German copy of the FT so I cannot access the full article. Seems interesting what they mention but if anyone can access the full interview it would be great to see exactly what Mr Clark said.

By Angela Cullen
April 8 (Bloomberg) -- Emirates, the largest Arab airline,
said a jet with 150 more seats than the Airbus SAS A380, the
world's largest passenger plane, would make a low-budget business
for long-haul flights viable, Financial Times Deutschland reported,
citing Emirates President Tim Clark.
Emirates, the A380's biggest customer, has examined the
possibility of a no-frills business for long-haul routes, Clark is
quoted as saying.
Airbus, based in Toulouse, France, has drafted plans for a
larger model, the paper said. It won't make a decision on whether
to commercialize the plan until 2006, the paper said. Emirates
would order such a plane ``immediately,'' Clark told the newspaper.


Would really appreciate if someone could get a full copy of interview

Regards


Ask the impossible to achieve the best possible
41 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineLeskova From Germany, joined Oct 2003, 6075 posts, RR: 70
Reply 1, posted (9 years 5 months 2 weeks 6 hours ago) and read 7364 times:

Well - here's the link to the article, but it's in German...

http://www.ftd.de/ub/in/2520.html

Regards,
Frank



Smile - it confuses people!
User currently offlineRJ111 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 2, posted (9 years 5 months 2 weeks 2 hours ago) and read 7040 times:

I always thought an A389 LCC would be a good idea.

Imagine how low the CASM must be!


User currently offlineBehramjee From Canada, joined Aug 2003, 4784 posts, RR: 43
Reply 3, posted (9 years 5 months 2 weeks 2 hours ago) and read 6966 times:

wont this adventure of Emirates come into conflict with their own mainline routes as the main routes that they can fill up with a 800 seater A 380 could be to India, BKK, MNL, CGK, SIN, LHR and maybe NYC. But most of these routes especially SIN, LHR and India are high yielding routes for EK, so wont it be a conflict of interest???

also EK is not the type to start a Low Cost No frills long haul airline...they will probably have an all eco class A 380 layout but with ptvs installed in every seat with dozens of tv channels like their present B 777-A 332 fleet has...maybe not 500 channels like the A 340s have...but definitely the same number of those avbl on the B 777s/ A 332s.

[Edited 2005-04-08 14:33:48]

User currently offlineAgill From Sweden, joined Feb 2004, 1011 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (9 years 5 months 2 weeks 2 hours ago) and read 6962 times:

Hmmm I wonder if this will end up in those 40 extra A380s we have heard about?

User currently offlineA350 From Germany, joined Nov 2004, 1100 posts, RR: 22
Reply 5, posted (9 years 5 months 2 weeks 2 hours ago) and read 6904 times:

I think it would make more sense just to use A389s, put 11-abreast in economy, sell eceonomy class tickets very cheap, and make money because of the low seat-mile costs. I know they have a good onboard service, but I think the cost of the sevice is justified by the better network they get when they don't operate special LCC planes.

A350



Photography - the art of observing, not the art of arranging
User currently offlineBehramjee From Canada, joined Aug 2003, 4784 posts, RR: 43
Reply 6, posted (9 years 5 months 2 weeks 1 hour ago) and read 6818 times:

I dread to think what EK would do if it was given an OPEN SKIES right to fly to any city in USA and INDIA as many times it wants and with any aircraft it so desires !!!

User currently offlineCanadianNorth From Canada, joined Aug 2002, 3390 posts, RR: 9
Reply 7, posted (9 years 5 months 2 weeks 1 hour ago) and read 6687 times:

LCC with A380 sounds great, but even with low fares is there really that many routes where you have 800+ folks all wanting to go to the same place at the same time on the same airline?



CanadianNorth



What could possibly go wrong?
User currently offlineAgill From Sweden, joined Feb 2004, 1011 posts, RR: 0
Reply 8, posted (9 years 5 months 2 weeks ago) and read 6657 times:

CanadianNorth: If the price is right I guess it can happen. But it really makes you wonder how on earth they will fill all these planes they are getting.

User currently offlinePANAM_DC10 From Australia, joined Aug 2000, 4162 posts, RR: 89
Reply 9, posted (9 years 5 months 2 weeks ago) and read 6612 times:
AIRLINERS.NET CREW
COMMUNITY MANAGER

Quoting Leskova (Reply 1):
Well - here's the link to the article, but it's in German...

Thanks Leskova, I've just had a read of the article now, much appreciated.

Regards

PanAm DC10



Ask the impossible to achieve the best possible
User currently offlineA350 From Germany, joined Nov 2004, 1100 posts, RR: 22
Reply 10, posted (9 years 5 months 2 weeks ago) and read 6555 times:

Quoting Behramjee (Reply 6):
I dread to think what EK would do if it was given an OPEN SKIES right to fly to any city in USA and INDIA as many times it wants and with any aircraft it so desires !!!

That is near to what will happen anyway. It will not be nonstop, but with one connection in Dubai. They will have to lobby for traffic rights, but finally, they'll get them and they already have some. And if they think they don't have enough rights, they use the A389. There is a reason why they ordered 40 A380s!

A350



Photography - the art of observing, not the art of arranging
User currently offlineOrion737 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 11, posted (9 years 5 months 2 weeks ago) and read 6536 times:

Emirates really gets up my nose, almost as much as Virgin keep briefing the press on starting up airlines in every corner of the earth.

Emirates has its head truly in the clouds!


User currently offlineYYZ4RADD From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 131 posts, RR: 0
Reply 12, posted (9 years 5 months 2 weeks ago) and read 6510 times:

EK is an airline from a different world.....if they were allowed they will kill all the airlines in the world and eventually become a monopoly in the airline business. With customers like EK, Boeing and Airbus will never go out of business.

Already they are a monopoly in South Asia and Africa.....even in Europe to a point they are and certainly in the Middle East and Central Asia.

YYZ4RADD


User currently offlineZvezda From Lithuania, joined Aug 2004, 10511 posts, RR: 64
Reply 13, posted (9 years 5 months 1 week 6 days 23 hours ago) and read 6417 times:

Quoting A350 (Reply 5):
I think it would make more sense just to use A389s, put 11-abreast in economy, sell eceonomy class tickets very cheap, and make money because of the low seat-mile costs. I know they have a good onboard service, but I think the cost of the sevice is justified by the better network they get when they don't operate special LCC planes.

Lower seat-mile costs enable higher loads. The A380-900 should be able to offer seat-mile costs even lower than those of the B747Adv. The key for EK will be getting a lot of people on the planes. At least for operations to India, China, and Africa, expect to see either 11-across or 12-across seating.  crowded  For North America, Europe, Australia, and New Zealand, EK will probably offer more generous seating.

Quoting YYZ4RADD (Reply 12):
EK is an airline from a different world.....if they were allowed they will kill all the airlines in the world and eventually become a monopoly in the airline business. With customers like EK, Boeing and Airbus will never go out of business.

Already they are a monopoly in South Asia and Africa.....even in Europe to a point they are and certainly in the Middle East and Central Asia.

YYZ4RADD, do you have any idea what the word "monopoly" means other than what you were able to infer from the board game? Your statement is absolutely false.


User currently offlineAgill From Sweden, joined Feb 2004, 1011 posts, RR: 0
Reply 14, posted (9 years 5 months 1 week 6 days 23 hours ago) and read 6381 times:

Good thing to see that good taste still is plentiful here  Yeah sure

User currently offlineFA4B6 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 15, posted (9 years 5 months 1 week 6 days 23 hours ago) and read 6373 times:

Quoting CanadianNorth (Reply 7):
LCC with A380 sounds great, but even with low fares is there really that many routes where you have 800+ folks all wanting to go to the same place at the same time on the same airline?

LOL yes! Have you seen the B6 flights to FLL? I say we get a few A380's to take over the JFK-FLL flights, and maybe do one or two MCO's  Smile


User currently offlineLeelaw From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 16, posted (9 years 5 months 1 week 6 days 23 hours ago) and read 6343 times:

Quoting YYZ4RADD (Reply 12):
Already they are a monopoly in South Asia and Africa.....even in Europe to a point they are and certainly in the Middle East and Central Asia.

In order to be taken seriously, this thesis requires much elaboration, not a conclusory statement.


User currently offlineYYZ4RADD From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 131 posts, RR: 0
Reply 17, posted (9 years 5 months 1 week 6 days 22 hours ago) and read 6267 times:

Zvezda....I didnt refer to the board game to understand what Monopoly means...you might want to check your translator before starting to write personal attacks like that...

If you read my statment carefully...you will understand that EK wants to become the airline for the world....

If you didnt understand...here is the dictionary definition..EK fits right in that category...

If you dont agree with it...Its fine...you are entitled to your opinion

_________________________________________
mo·nop·o·ly (mə-nŏp'ə-lē Wink pronunciation
n., pl. -lies.

1. Exclusive control by one group of the means of producing or selling a commodity or service: “Monopoly frequently … arises from government support or from collusive agreements among individuals” (Milton Friedman).
2. Law. A right granted by a government giving exclusive control over a specified commercial activity to a single party.
3.
1. A company or group having exclusive control over a commercial activity.
2. A commodity or service so controlled.
4.
1. Exclusive possession or control: arrogantly claims to have a monopoly on the truth.
2. Something that is exclusively possessed or controlled: showed that scientific achievement is not a male monopoly.

______________________________________


I can't believe how personal people get over few comments such as that.....

Regards,

YYZ4RADD


User currently offlineBCAL From United Kingdom, joined Jun 2004, 3384 posts, RR: 16
Reply 18, posted (9 years 5 months 1 week 6 days 21 hours ago) and read 6068 times:

I think there are two reasons why an A380 would be unsuited for a LCC

  • The turn around time. How long would it take to unload 580 passengers and their baggage and then load up again with another 580 passengers and their baggage
  • Not many airports currently served by LCCs would be equipped to deal with A380



  • MOL on SRB's latest attack at BA: "It's like a little Chihuahua barking at a dying Labrador. Nobody cares."
    User currently offlineRJ111 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
    Reply 19, posted (9 years 5 months 1 week 6 days 20 hours ago) and read 5651 times:

    Quoting Zvezda (Reply 13):
    The A380-900 should be able to offer seat-mile costs even lower than those of the B747Adv

    I'm pretty certain the A380 will offer a lower CASM than the 744adv despite what Boeing says, unfortunately we'll probably never know?

    Quoting BCAL (Reply 19):
    The turn around time. How long would it take to unload 580 passengers and their baggage and then load up again with another 580 passengers and their baggage

    There' would be a lot more than 580 in an all economy A380 esp a -900. NH gets 580 in their 747D's, you could probably get 1000 in an A389, perhaps though EK will fit the plane with an LCC section and the other classes up front. Assuming these will be used on long haul routes, i'd imagine turnaround time is not as critical as shorter haul flights.


    User currently offlineKaitak From Ireland, joined Aug 1999, 12466 posts, RR: 37
    Reply 20, posted (9 years 5 months 1 week 6 days 20 hours ago) and read 5533 times:

    Hasn't EK already said that one of its three configurations for the -800 would include a 644 pax aircraft (or thereabouts). If we knew the length difference between the -800 and -900, we should be able to make a prediction as to the likely configuration(s) and pax numbers of the -900.

    Does anyone have any info on the -900's dimensions?


    User currently offlineYUL332LX From Canada, joined Feb 2004, 820 posts, RR: 1
    Reply 21, posted (9 years 5 months 1 week 6 days 17 hours ago) and read 4535 times:

    Quoting Kaitak (Reply 20):
    Does anyone have any info on the -900's dimensions?

    The proposed length of the -900 was 79.4 m when Airbus was actively promoting all variants of the aircraft.



    E volavo, volavo felice più in alto del sole, e ancora più su mentre il mondo pian piano spariva lontano laggiù ...
    User currently offlineMaverickM11 From United States of America, joined Apr 2000, 17495 posts, RR: 45
    Reply 22, posted (9 years 5 months 1 week 6 days 17 hours ago) and read 4455 times:

    To everyone who moans and hollers when meals disappear from domestic flights...an A380-900 LCC network will do the same to the international long haul market.


    E pur si muove -Galileo
    User currently offlineBehramjee From Canada, joined Aug 2003, 4784 posts, RR: 43
    Reply 23, posted (9 years 5 months 1 week 6 days 16 hours ago) and read 4299 times:

    Quoting MaverickM11 (Reply 22):
    To everyone who moans and hollers when meals disappear from domestic flights...an A380-900 LCC network will do the same to the international long haul market.

    dont be silly...Emirates are not fools to get bad publicity by not serving meals on intl long haul flights to their pax. GF Traveller is what probably theyre going to base themselves like except having ptvs too in every seat...and GF Traveller too serves meals on all its AUH-India/Pakistan flights!!!

    Quoting Kaitak (Reply 20):
    Hasn't EK already said that one of its three configurations for the -800 would include a 644 pax aircraft (or thereabouts).

    EKs A 380s configured in a 2 class 650 pax layout will be used on high density lower yielding international flights that do not have much first class demand if any at all!!! These destinations include KHI, BKK, MNL, CGK, BEY, MAN etc...I would love to say India as the aircraft is aimed towards them too but it wont happen unless their airports first get upgraded to handle the A 380!!!


    User currently offlineStarlionblue From Greenland, joined Feb 2004, 17039 posts, RR: 66
    Reply 24, posted (9 years 5 months 1 week 6 days 16 hours ago) and read 4208 times:

    Quoting YUL332LX (Reply 21):
    Quoting Kaitak (Reply 20):
    Does anyone have any info on the -900's dimensions?

    The proposed length of the -900 was 79.4 m when Airbus was actively promoting all variants of the aircraft.

    And that (plus the engines) would most probably be the only significant change from the 388. The wingspan is already at the max imposed by the 80 meter box.



    "There are no stupid questions, but there are a lot of inquisitive idiots."
    25 MaverickM11 : "Emirates are not fools to get bad publicity by not serving meals on intl long haul flights to their pax." Mmmhmmm...famous last words.
    26 TWA902fly : i think he means that no one will effictively be able to compete against Emirates and their A380-900s, so say some airline flying the route with a 77
    27 MaverickM11 : "i think he means that no one will effictively be able to compete against Emirates and their A380-900s," What I really mean is that the same competiti
    28 Behramjee : what I meant was even if EK has A 380s flying long haul in an all economy class layout, they will still have ptvs in every seat + offer meals. They ma
    29 Post contains images DfwRevolution : It's easy to compete with EK if they had an A389 LCC: you deny them overflight and landing privliges. Hard to fill those airplanes if you can't fly t
    30 Aerofan : just u wait and see what happens when the oil runs out. see how many orders they put in for planes then
    31 N79969 : This is an interesting idea. What markets could sustain year-around demand of that kind without much seasonality? I hope that everyone remembers to we
    32 Boeing7E7 : Screw them. First the 787, now the 380. How about they try and fill one plane first. Here's your peanuts and a coke, now shut up for 14 hours. No than
    33 Post contains images Lockheed1011 : Boeing7E7, Thank you! What is up with EK? Do they want to screw up EU & USA? What is the strategy here? It does not sound good! I have a bad feeling a
    34 Jacobin777 : I've posted before, EK's service has gone down the past few years..in fact, I've read that other Middle East Air Carriers (such as Qatar) have better
    35 Post contains links Behramjee : Yes you are 100% correct, if u go to http://www.airlinequality.com/Forum/qatar.htm? you will see for yourself the excellent review comments left by p
    36 777ER : An A380 operating for a LCC......oh boy. Just image all the emergency exits that would be needed. Real Ultra cattle class
    37 Post contains images Propulsion : 1.) Oil money is better than arms money 2.) EK are nowhere near being a monopoly, but do have a monopolistic advantage in certain areas and with parti
    38 6thfreedom : FYI - The original article is in April 2005 edition of Airline Business Magazine. If my memory serves me.... Tim Clark said that 'an' airline could po
    39 Post contains links 6thfreedom : http://www.airlinebusiness.com/ab_frame.htm?path=ab_issue/is_forum.asp actually, here's the link....
    40 Jacobin777 : i read those comments, and it does seem that QR is doing quite well and EK's service has lost some quality.... that being said, all the reports state
    41 Zvezda : EK does not meet the definition of monopoly that you provided. They are not the exclusive providers of air service in South Asia and Africa. There ar
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