AeroWesty From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 20322 posts, RR: 64 Reply 3, posted (8 years 7 months 4 weeks 1 day 20 hours ago) and read 7540 times:
Also from the linked press release:
In winter 2005-06 the new aircraft will replace other aircraft withdrawn for maintenance connected with the refurbishment of the long-haul fleet's business class cabins. The additional capacity will be available for use from spring 2006.
Good to see that not only is Finnair continuing to acquire MD-11's, but refurbishing the existing fleet. Seems like they plan on keeping them for a while.
Cornish From United Kingdom, joined Feb 2005, 8187 posts, RR: 55 Reply 5, posted (8 years 7 months 4 weeks 1 day 20 hours ago) and read 7507 times:
Quoting DIJKKIJK (Reply 4): Why is there so much demand for Finland -China flights? Is there a large Chinese diaspora in Finland?
No, but Finnair have made themselves a nice little niche for Europe-Asia flights (particularly from Scandinavia and northern Europe). Many of the passengers on these flights will have connected at HEL rather than just originated there.
Just when I thought I could see light at the end of the tunnel, it was some B*****d with a torch bringing me more work
Killjoy From Finland, joined Dec 1999, 646 posts, RR: 0 Reply 7, posted (8 years 7 months 4 weeks 1 day 19 hours ago) and read 7447 times:
Quoting Doona (Reply 6): Cornish is right. Flying from HEL to Asia cuts about 2 or 3 hrs compared to LHR or CDG. So people prefer shorter flights... Nevermind that flying from LHR to HEL takes 3 hrs...
MAH4546 From Sweden, joined Jan 2001, 31722 posts, RR: 72 Reply 8, posted (8 years 7 months 4 weeks 1 day 18 hours ago) and read 7255 times:
Great news, they need this. Finnair was having problems finding a way to operate to Miami next winter with only six aircraft and the increased flying to Asia, such as Guangzhou. The new MD11 will help solve this problem.
OHLBU From Finland, joined Jan 2005, 226 posts, RR: 0 Reply 11, posted (8 years 7 months 4 weeks 1 day 17 hours ago) and read 7001 times:
Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 8): Finnair was having problems finding a way to operate to Miami next winter
Currently Finnair is not selling MIA for next winter, I believe this winter´s flights were unprofitable for the airline. Loads were quite low and as there is no business-class it´s hard to make a profit with half-full economy cabin.
Quoting DeltaWings (Reply 9): Where will they get the MD-11 from? from McDonnell Douglas?
This is the million dollar question. A great portion of MD11 airframes have been converted to freighters. To find a CF6-powered example with a common cabin layout to either of Finnair´s must be quite hard. I wonder if KLM would be interested in selling/leasing one? What other carriers still operate passenger MD11s with CF6s?
KL808 From United States of America, joined May 1999, 1579 posts, RR: 2 Reply 13, posted (8 years 7 months 4 weeks 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 6918 times:
Thai has some GE powered MD-11's, that they might want to get rid of in the near future to reduce types in the fleet. KL could possible lease out one of the MD-11's to Finnair. Varig has some too in the fleet, however IM not sure if they would get rid of em.
OHLBU From Finland, joined Jan 2005, 226 posts, RR: 0 Reply 17, posted (8 years 7 months 4 weeks 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 6850 times:
Quoting KL808 (Reply 13): Varig has some too in the fleet, however IM not sure if they would get rid of em.
I believe Varig has just added some ex-Swiss MD11s to their fleet so that would suggest they also plan to keep their current examples. How about DL/AA and their MD11s? Are they in storage and which engines did they have?
GodBless From Sweden, joined Apr 2000, 2752 posts, RR: 17 Reply 18, posted (8 years 7 months 4 weeks 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 6813 times:
Quoting Tavve (Reply 2): Quoting Killjoy (Thread starter):
In other news, the MD-80 will be decommissioned earlier than expected, to be replaced by a combination of existing A320 and new E170 aircraft.
I wish SK was doing the same thing.
I just hope that SK keeps to the slow paste of removing the MD80's. Once all the MD-80's are gone it will be quite boring with only 737's and A320's left plus all those RJ's...
I am always amazed how AY manages to serve a niche market and then use such a large a/c type. A 767 or A330 seems to make more sense, but it's good if they have success with their MD-11 fleet.
MAH4546 From Sweden, joined Jan 2001, 31722 posts, RR: 72 Reply 20, posted (8 years 7 months 4 weeks 1 day 15 hours ago) and read 6705 times:
Quoting OHLBU (Reply 11): Currently Finnair is not selling MIA for next winter, I believe this winter´s flights were unprofitable for the airline. Loads were quite low and as there is no business-class it´s hard to make a profit with half-full economy cabin.
They haven't put them into the schedule because they have some aircraft scheduling conflicts. They do plan on flying to Miami next winter, again between December and April, 3x a week, though it may be only twice because of aircraft availability.
Loads were definitley not low...they averaged over 90%, with more than half the seats sold by the end of summer 2004, which is why they added a third frequency on Mondays. The service is indeed profitable. Clearly not as profitable as their Asian flights, but it makes money. It definitley does not get priority though, Asian flights do, rightfully so.
The decision to forego a clearly superior Boeing product was mostly due to political pressure from the California state government, plus the fact that McDonnell Douglas was selling the aircraft at a loss, as witnessed by their subsequent collapse.
Seriously though, the MD-11 can carry a lot more freight.
I seriously doubt this. Like with the BKK-route a great portion of seats on MIA was sold through tour operators, which is charity-work on scheduled flights. Just look at the prices, it´s the premium class passenger who brings in the money and none of those were on MIA flights. The business-class seats were offered with economy service for full-fare economy pax but there were few takers.
CAN will be direct. From September HKG will again be an extension of the BKK service 3x week.
Quoting GodBless (Reply 18): I am always amazed how AY manages to serve a niche market and then use such a large a/c type. A 767 or A330 seems to make more sense, but it's good if they have success with their MD-11 fleet.
It´s the same thing that SQ and EK among others are doing, albeit on a much smaller scale. Great circle route makes HEL an ideal transfer point between Japan/China and the rest of Europe. And the small size of Helsinki-Vantaa airport makes a 40min transfer a reality. Finnair has adapted its route network to suite the size of the MD11, not the other way around. On the passenger side HEL-BKK-HEL would be unprofitable but cargo revenue makes the route feasible.
Orion737 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 24, posted (8 years 7 months 4 weeks 1 day 14 hours ago) and read 6475 times:
I thought Finnair had one MD11 in a high density configuration for charter flights? If this is no longer the case what aircraft do they use for those winter flights to Las Palmas because they need a big plane for that.
Finns love Gran Canaria in winter!
25 Wjcandee: Maybe they can wet-lease one from World.
26 TPASXM787: I know it makes sense for their fleet, just not a great aircraft in general.
27 UpperDeck79: They reconfigured that bird a long ago to fly the Asian routes. Charter flights to Canaries and elsewhere are flown with charter-configured 757's (an
28 Orion737: Big drop in capacity then. The charter configured MD11 was very useful for winter flights to Las Palmas, surely Finns fave holiday place!
29 UpperDeck79: True. They still sometimes use normally configured MD11 on leisure flights to Malaga and scheduled flights to Finnish Lapland during high ski season.