UsAirways16bwi From United States of America, joined May 2004, 1003 posts, RR: 4 Posted (8 years 1 month 1 week 4 days 3 hours ago) and read 1887 times:
I just wanted to know what the loads are like on US from CLT/PIT/PHL to western cities such as LAX, PHX, SEA, LAS etc..
I heard they aren't doing to well on these routes due to competition from other airlines. Is this true?
Quickmover From United States of America, joined Mar 2004, 2464 posts, RR: 0 Reply 1, posted (8 years 1 month 1 week 4 days 3 hours ago) and read 1874 times:
I believe those are code share routes with UAL. How that effects the loads, I don't know, but online there are several more flight options at expedia.
Jdwfloyd From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 837 posts, RR: 4 Reply 2, posted (8 years 1 month 1 week 4 days 3 hours ago) and read 1858 times:
The last time I checked SABRE when I was looking to go out west last month it seemed you could'nt buy a seat on these routes. Every flt was within 5 seats of being full or they were over sold all together.
SHUPirate1 From United States of America, joined Sep 2003, 3661 posts, RR: 18 Reply 3, posted (8 years 1 month 1 week 4 days 2 hours ago) and read 1806 times:
I don't know about to the other cities, but I happen to fly to Las Vegas a couple of times a year, usually on US Airways, and they are frequently packed-to-overbooked. Quickmover, those are US Airways flights, US Airways does serve several western airports (SAN, LAX, LAS, SFO, SEA, PHX, and DEN are all US-served airports, and all in the Mountain or Pacific Time Zones) with their own metal.
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7E72004 From United States of America, joined Mar 2004, 3586 posts, RR: 1 Reply 4, posted (8 years 1 month 1 week 4 days 2 hours ago) and read 1765 times:
I wonder how US would be doing if they kept the PSA western routes in place
The next generation of aircraft is just around the corner!
Ouboy79 From United States of America, joined Nov 2001, 3996 posts, RR: 23 Reply 5, posted (8 years 1 month 1 week 3 days 23 hours ago) and read 1627 times:
Quoting Quickmover (Reply 1): I believe those are code share routes with UAL. How that effects the loads, I don't know, but online there are several more flight options at expedia.
They are operated by US metal, but may have a UA code on them as well.
Quoting 7E72004 (Reply 4): I wonder how US would be doing if they kept the PSA western routes in place
If they kept PSA in place, Southwest would not be anywhere as big as they are out west. Though it appears they are gonna give it a try again with HP...this should be an interesting integration. LOL
Any opinion/comment posted is that of my own and not that of Southwest Airlines Co.
SonOfACaptain From United States of America, joined May 2004, 1747 posts, RR: 5 Reply 6, posted (8 years 1 month 1 week 3 days 22 hours ago) and read 1526 times:
Quoting UsAirways16bwi (Thread starter):
I heard they aren't doing to well on these routes due to competition from other airlines. Is this true?
Where did you hear this? The routes have always been one of US more full routes. Everytime I have looked up these flights, most of them have been full.
Avek00 From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 4092 posts, RR: 18 Reply 7, posted (8 years 1 month 1 week 3 days 21 hours ago) and read 1508 times:
Quoting Ouboy79 (Reply 5): Though it appears they are gonna give it a try again with HP...this should be an interesting integration.
It's simply a rumor generated by an analyst's research note that has not been substantiated by anyone.
DCAYOW From United States of America, joined Nov 2003, 582 posts, RR: 3 Reply 8, posted (8 years 1 month 1 week 3 days 20 hours ago) and read 1458 times:
SHUPirate1 From United States of America, joined Sep 2003, 3661 posts, RR: 18 Reply 9, posted (8 years 1 month 1 week 3 days 20 hours ago) and read 1437 times:
Wow...it didn't dawn on any of those guys that Pittsburgh had the highest loadfactor to all six of those cities, did it?
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Supa7E7 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 10, posted (8 years 1 month 1 week 3 days 20 hours ago) and read 1420 times:
Load factor means little in terms of profitability.
In a route with near-infinite demand, you can fill every plane. But fares are so low that even Southwest probably loses money on cross-country flights which tie up an aircraft and crew for so many hours.
SonOfACaptain From United States of America, joined May 2004, 1747 posts, RR: 5 Reply 11, posted (8 years 1 month 1 week 3 days 20 hours ago) and read 1422 times:
Quoting SHUPirate1 (Reply 9): Wow...it didn't dawn on any of those guys that Pittsburgh had the highest loadfactor to all six of those cities, did it?
Yes, but you also have to take account that most of the PIT flights are on A319's whereas, most of the PHL and CLT flights are on A320's and A321's.
SHUPirate1 From United States of America, joined Sep 2003, 3661 posts, RR: 18 Reply 12, posted (8 years 1 month 1 week 3 days 20 hours ago) and read 1404 times:
Supa-I realize that. However, the fares on those routes from Philadelphia can't be any worse than on those routes from Pittsburgh, particularly when Pittsburgh had some of the highest fare premiums in the country.
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PITA333 From United States of America, joined Mar 2005, 391 posts, RR: 3 Reply 13, posted (8 years 1 month 1 week 3 days 19 hours ago) and read 1344 times:
SOAC: True, some are on A319's (and on A320's), but when they were with 321's, the flights were still full, as PIT saw more connecting traffic.
Ouboy79 From United States of America, joined Nov 2001, 3996 posts, RR: 23 Reply 14, posted (8 years 1 month 1 week 3 days 19 hours ago) and read 1334 times:
PIT also had costs nearly 3 times higher than CLT to operate from.
Quoting Avek00 (Reply 7): It's simply a rumor generated by an analyst's research note that has not been substantiated by anyone.
I understand completely where the rumor is coming from. This pattern is quite similar to the time before the UA/US announcement. We'll see what happens...I would be somewhat suprised if M&A activity started this year without US being a player in one aspect or another. HP/US make the only logical hook up that would benefit either system versus a US/UA hook up which would require some more downsizing - particularly the DCA operation.
Any opinion/comment posted is that of my own and not that of Southwest Airlines Co.
Avek00 From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 4092 posts, RR: 18 Reply 15, posted (8 years 1 month 1 week 3 days 19 hours ago) and read 1297 times:
Quoting Ouboy79 (Reply 14): HP/US make the only logical hook up that would benefit either system
That's just it - HP/US doesn't benefit EITHER system.
N670UW From United States of America, joined Jul 2003, 1595 posts, RR: 8 Reply 16, posted (8 years 1 month 1 week 3 days 18 hours ago) and read 1238 times:
Quoting SonOfACaptain (Reply 11): Yes, but you also have to take account that most of the PIT flights are on A319's whereas, most of the PHL and CLT flights are on A320's and A321's.
Yes, but that list is from 2004. PIT was still a hub through much of 2004 (until November) and had 320's and 321's to most of those cities.
Aloha73G From United States of America, joined Jul 2003, 2301 posts, RR: 5 Reply 17, posted (8 years 1 month 1 week 3 days 16 hours ago) and read 1179 times:
Quoting Supa7E7 (Reply 10): Load factor means little in terms of profitability.
In a route with near-infinite demand, you can fill every plane. But fares are so low that even Southwest probably loses money on cross-country flights which tie up an aircraft and crew for so many hours.
BUT you must remember that when the plane is in the air, you dont have people checking in passengers, loading/unloading bags, refueling, provisioning, etc. In the end it probably a wash.
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DeltAirlines From United States of America, joined May 1999, 8771 posts, RR: 13 Reply 18, posted (8 years 1 month 1 week 3 days 16 hours ago) and read 1171 times:
From what I've seen on FlyerTalk, these routes are extremely full in both cabins. Chairman's often complain about barely clearing the upgrade lists, even on the A321, and said that coach is pretty full on these flights as well.
Ouboy79 From United States of America, joined Nov 2001, 3996 posts, RR: 23 Reply 19, posted (8 years 1 month 1 week 3 days 13 hours ago) and read 1084 times:
Quoting Avek00 (Reply 15): That's just it - HP/US doesn't benefit EITHER system.
How can you say adding their strong east coast and west coast networks wouldn't benefit either? Sure there is a lack of something in the middle to help with various connections - but that can be solved by adding flights to either CLT or PHX from larger markets.
That would be like saying NW and AS hooking up would be bad, or CO and F9...certain combinations of airlines each help to patch wholes in various networks. Of course if you put UA, AA, or DL with anyone...it really doesn't work since they have some of the more spread out networks that already cover more of the lower 48.
Any opinion/comment posted is that of my own and not that of Southwest Airlines Co.
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