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Boeing Gets AI...Can It Do The Same With IA & 9W?  
User currently offlineJoyA380B747 From India, joined Mar 2005, 490 posts, RR: 1
Posted (9 years 3 months 4 days 22 hours ago) and read 4588 times:

Hello to Everyone...
Yes..that's what I want to know- Can Boeing grab fresh deals with Indian Airlines-IA and Jet Airways-9W alongside AI.
There has been rumours that IA, which has yet not finalised fresh deals with Airbus, might consider Boeing also. The Reason??....We have Praful Patel, The Indian Civil Aviation Minister, and his team who never guarantee on anything, and are quite anti-Airbus in character. Surely, here we have another UNPREDICTABLE deal from the Indian Govt.
But to be specific, if IA turns down the 43 Airbus deal(If ever), Airbus will be hailed as a potential loser to Boeing.
And then we have Jet airways. I don't have any Idea about 9W's orders. Surely they are leasing A340's but what about in the near Future. Boeing or Airbus????


If it wasn't for AI and those money mongers sitting in the parliament, 9W would have been as big as SQ...:(
34 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineMrniji From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 1, posted (9 years 3 months 4 days 22 hours ago) and read 4561 times:

Quoting JoyA380B747 (Thread starter):
There has been rumours that IA, which has yet not finalised fresh deals with Airbus, might consider Boeing also.

i doubt this to happen, as this might have an inquiry by the vigilance dept as consequence.. that would be too obvious


User currently offlineAvioGuy From India, joined Jan 2001, 99 posts, RR: 0
Reply 2, posted (9 years 3 months 4 days 22 hours ago) and read 4502 times:

See it this way.... USA is happy with AI deal and as it should go Airbus should be decently happy with scoring the IA deal of 43 aircraft.

As for 9W...its a faithfull Boeing customer and will in no chance change to Airbus specially right now when they have just decided to lease 5 more B738s.



the scale of my sanity is not linear..
User currently offlineMrniji From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 3, posted (9 years 3 months 4 days 22 hours ago) and read 4488 times:

Quoting AvioGuy (Reply 2):
As for 9W...its a faithfull Boeing customer and will in no chance change to Airbus specially right now when they have just decided to lease 5 more B738s.

What about the 340s they leased from SAA?? I would be surprised if they switch to the 777 aftyer training their crew on the former


User currently offlineAvioGuy From India, joined Jan 2001, 99 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (9 years 3 months 4 days 21 hours ago) and read 4476 times:

oh they will switch to the 777 alright, the government has a clause in the agreement to allow private careers that they HAVE to start operations immideately and the routes offerd to them must be operational as soon as possible. There were no 777s apparently available immediately (are there still any UA 777s free?) so 9W was forced to go the 340 way.

S2 on the other hand is planning to start LHR operations with an A310!  Wow!



the scale of my sanity is not linear..
User currently offlineOURBOEING From United States of America, joined Aug 2004, 475 posts, RR: 0
Reply 5, posted (9 years 3 months 4 days 21 hours ago) and read 4468 times:

Whats up with 9W A340s? Where are they? I just want to see a 9W heavy Smile

OURBOEING


User currently offlineJoyA380B747 From India, joined Mar 2005, 490 posts, RR: 1
Reply 6, posted (9 years 3 months 4 days 21 hours ago) and read 4415 times:

I can predict 9W 340 interiors will be as good as any top airline of the world and we may find 9W flights pretty full all the way to EWR or JFK.


If it wasn't for AI and those money mongers sitting in the parliament, 9W would have been as big as SQ...:(
User currently offlineDAYflyer From United States of America, joined Sep 2004, 3807 posts, RR: 3
Reply 7, posted (9 years 3 months 4 days 20 hours ago) and read 4386 times:

I seriously doubt anymore big orders from India for Boeing. Airbus will do all it can to secure any order there to save face now, especially any A-350 order it can lay it's hands on.

Geopolitically speaking, India would do well to have a carrier throw an order to Airbus so that it does not alienate itself from it's European allies.



One Nation Under God
User currently offlineAvioGuy From India, joined Jan 2001, 99 posts, RR: 0
Reply 8, posted (9 years 3 months 4 days 20 hours ago) and read 4327 times:

India might giving its "european allies" a good military order...already 80 BAe Hawks and a possibility of 120 M2k5's if USA doesent win the F 16 order too. And in todays world geopoliticaly it doesent matter.


the scale of my sanity is not linear..
User currently offlineNYC777 From United States of America, joined Jun 2004, 5735 posts, RR: 48
Reply 9, posted (9 years 3 months 4 days 19 hours ago) and read 4284 times:

Quoting DAYflyer (Reply 7):
Geopolitically speaking, India would do well to have a carrier throw an order to Airbus so that it does not alienate itself from it's European allies.

It already has..the IA order for 43 A320s

Quoting AvioGuy (Reply 8):
India might giving its "european allies" a good military order...already 80 BAe Hawks and a possibility of 120 M2k5's if USA doesent win the F 16 order too. And in todays world geopoliticaly it doesent matter.

Over many years India has bought military equipment from primarily Rusiia and france. They now have an opportunity to buy US fighter (F-16s or F/A-18E/Fs). India has been giving it's European allies business for a great number of years.



That which does not kill me makes me stronger.
User currently offlineAvioGuy From India, joined Jan 2001, 99 posts, RR: 0
Reply 10, posted (9 years 3 months 4 days 19 hours ago) and read 4264 times:

IA has not ordered 43 A320s..they only intend to.

And yes India has given France a decent amount of military hardware including the Mirage 2000s and Submarines for the navy.



the scale of my sanity is not linear..
User currently offlineNYC777 From United States of America, joined Jun 2004, 5735 posts, RR: 48
Reply 11, posted (9 years 3 months 4 days 19 hours ago) and read 4243 times:

Quoting AvioGuy (Reply 10):
IA has not ordered 43 A320s..they only intend to.

IIRC they're just one mininster approval away from being able to sign the final contract.

I can totally see 9W orderingthe 777/787 combo for the various international destinations they hoped to open up. It's a no brainer and I would think that they may even announce an order this year in order to get theearliest delivery spots available. Heck they could even trump AI's Boeing order by signing a firm contract before AI thus guaranteeing an earlier delivery spots vis a vis AI (who still have to get govt approval for the order something which 9W doesn't have to worry about). The sooner 9W gets their new widebodies for international routes the more time they have to establish a proven international service identity with Indian travelers.

[Edited 2005-04-28 16:44:07]


That which does not kill me makes me stronger.
User currently offlineMrniji From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 12, posted (9 years 3 months 4 days 19 hours ago) and read 4189 times:

Quoting AvioGuy (Reply 10):
IA has not ordered 43 A320s..they only intend to.

No, most of them are A321s.. rest A320 (I think 4) and A319


User currently offlineAvioGuy From India, joined Jan 2001, 99 posts, RR: 0
Reply 13, posted (9 years 3 months 4 days 19 hours ago) and read 4177 times:

ah yes well i meant from the A320 family. Big grin


the scale of my sanity is not linear..
User currently offlineAseem From India, joined Feb 2005, 2046 posts, RR: 10
Reply 14, posted (9 years 3 months 4 days 18 hours ago) and read 4156 times:

Quoting NYC777 (Reply 11):
Heck they could even trump AI's Boeing order by signing a firm contract before AI thus guaranteeing an earlier delivery spots vis a vis AI (who still have to get govt approval for the order something which 9W doesn't have to worry about).

I heard in one of these threads that there is some early delivery clause in AI deal, that will allow it to have B787 as early as 2006/8. Just what I've heard/read.
VT-ASJ



ala re ala, VT-ALA ala
User currently offlineAvioGuy From India, joined Jan 2001, 99 posts, RR: 0
Reply 15, posted (9 years 3 months 4 days 18 hours ago) and read 4145 times:

AI wants the 777 by end of 2006, and no chance of 787 before 2008 anyway.


the scale of my sanity is not linear..
User currently offlineMrniji From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 16, posted (9 years 3 months 4 days 18 hours ago) and read 4122 times:

Quoting Aseem (Reply 14):
that will allow it to have B787 as early as 2006/8

I thought the 787 will only come into operation in 2008.. that was A's main argument


User currently offlineNYC777 From United States of America, joined Jun 2004, 5735 posts, RR: 48
Reply 17, posted (9 years 3 months 4 days 18 hours ago) and read 4128 times:

Quoting Aseem (Reply 14):
I heard in one of these threads that there is some early delivery clause in AI deal, that will allow it to have B787 as early as 2006/8.

Unless AI has put a deposit for 2008 delivery spots it will be very hard to get the 787 that early as Boeing has said that 08 and 09 spots are all sold out. But the point still goes back that the GOi must give it's approval in a timely manner if AI wants these planes in 06 (777) and 08 (787). If not it can open the door for 9W to establish an international network with outstanding service (I just love 9Ws service..the best I've ever experienced even on a short flight like BOM to Bhavnagar) with modern aircraft before AI does.



That which does not kill me makes me stronger.
User currently offlineAseem From India, joined Feb 2005, 2046 posts, RR: 10
Reply 18, posted (9 years 3 months 4 days 18 hours ago) and read 4111 times:

sorry for the confusion..just too many thread in a short span of couple of days. Simply hard to remember. Big grin
VT-ASJ



ala re ala, VT-ALA ala
User currently offlineHAWK21M From India, joined Jan 2001, 31667 posts, RR: 56
Reply 19, posted (9 years 3 months 4 days 4 hours ago) and read 3980 times:

Should not happen.Else what about the existing A320s in thier [IC] fleet.
9W will def go in for B777s as & When Available.
The A340s are a stop gap lease.
I hope the IC deal goes to Airbus.It makes more sense.
regds
MEL



Think of the brighter side!
User currently offlineFriendlySkies From United States of America, joined Aug 2004, 4105 posts, RR: 5
Reply 20, posted (9 years 3 months 4 days 4 hours ago) and read 3957 times:

Quoting Mrniji (Reply 16):
I thought the 787 will only come into operation in 2008.. that was A's main argument

And they responded with an airplane that's due out two years later...go figure.


User currently offlineN60659 From United States of America, joined Mar 2005, 654 posts, RR: 25
Reply 21, posted (9 years 3 months 4 days 3 hours ago) and read 3907 times:

Quoting NYC777 (Reply 9):
Over many years India has bought military equipment from primarily Rusiia and france. They now have an opportunity to buy US fighter (F-16s or F/A-18E/Fs). India has been giving it's European allies business for a great number of years.

The issue with military aircraft acquisition in India has always been the question of license production in India. If Lockheed/Boeing offer the possibility of that, they will remain in the running. If not, I wouldn't hold my breath on getting F-16s or F/A-18E/F. One of the primary reasons why there are only a few squadrons of Mirage 2000s.
The other big issue with purchasing from the US is the risk of embargoes.



Nec Dextrorsum Nec Sinistrorsum
User currently offlineJoyA380B747 From India, joined Mar 2005, 490 posts, RR: 1
Reply 22, posted (9 years 3 months 4 days 2 hours ago) and read 3869 times:

Quoting NYC777 (Reply 17):
If not it can open the door for 9W to establish an international network with outstanding service (I just love 9Ws service..the best I've ever experienced even on a short flight like BOM to Bhavnagar) with modern aircraft before AI does.

Got that right NYC...
9W infact might not only be a serious competitor to AI but expect it to also compete with other major TransAtlantic Airlines. Infight meals,entertainment will surely be world class. The Quesion is, on which Aircraft... 340 or 777 or maybe leased 747's also???
 hyper 



If it wasn't for AI and those money mongers sitting in the parliament, 9W would have been as big as SQ...:(
User currently offlineHAWK21M From India, joined Jan 2001, 31667 posts, RR: 56
Reply 23, posted (9 years 3 months 4 days 2 hours ago) and read 3844 times:

Quoting JoyA380B747 (Reply 22):
or maybe leased 747's also???

That was doing the Rounds a few months ago  Smile
When will the B777s be available by Boeing for sale at the earliest.

regds
MEL



Think of the brighter side!
User currently onlineHamlet69 From United States of America, joined Mar 2000, 2735 posts, RR: 58
Reply 24, posted (9 years 3 months 4 days 2 hours ago) and read 3838 times:

Quoting Mrniji (Reply 3):
What about the 340s they leased from SAA?? I would be surprised if they switch to the 777 aftyer training their crew on the former

I wouldn't be so sure. 9W has been looking to make their own purchase NOW! The SAA lease is only for 2 years, in other words, it is a complete stop-gap measure intended to get their foot in the international door, nothing else. Every indication I have heard on this is that the 777 is the preferred option. However, since no order has been announced, it could of course go either way.

Regards,

Hamlet69



Honor the warriors, not the war.
25 Keesje : I think Air India has got the Boeing deal now as part of a bigger US-India geo ploitical deal that is much bigger. India now has do to do something to
26 Post contains images DIJKKIJK : IC will do well to stick with Airbus. It is going to be very cost effective for them to induct more A320/A321/A319 than to go for a new Boeing type.
27 Post contains images Mrniji : IC is ordering Airbus. But they don't have to do anything in that regard. Who tells that they have to level the field? Who asks Pakistan to level the
28 Sammyk : I don't know why Airbus is crying. If the IA deal goes through and you include King Fisher and Air Deccan plus all their options, they'll have deals t
29 Karan69 : What MrNiji says above makes perfect sense, What is surprising is that Tony Blair wil push EU nations and others to buy Airbus products, whereas 85% o
30 Jwenting : Keesje will never give up trying to blame every Boeing win over his gods on government backstabbing (while of course every divine Airbus sales is base
31 Cruiser : Or, similarly, they wanted AI to look at the A380 because we all know that it is in the same size class! (Note the sarcasm!) AC locked into the last
32 DAYflyer : Welcome to my respested users list!
33 Post contains images Keesje : pathetic! pls save this for the non-av forum..
34 Sammyk : Not really sure what point you were trying to make by breaking those prices down. In my post I was including all A32x orders/options/proposals that A
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