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Cargo Capacity On The 787  
User currently offlineMrComet From Ireland, joined Mar 2005, 561 posts, RR: 8
Posted (9 years 5 months 3 weeks 3 days 17 hours ago) and read 4541 times:

I read the NW announcement. In it, B claims its typical 20% fuel gain vs the A330 but then they claim a 45% increase in "cargo revenue capacity". What does this mean? Is it saying the 787 has 45% more volume in its hold than the A330?


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11 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offline777ER From New Zealand, joined Dec 2003, 12218 posts, RR: 18
Reply 1, posted (9 years 5 months 3 weeks 3 days 17 hours ago) and read 4531 times:
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Quoting MrComet (Thread starter):
What does this mean? Is it saying the 787 has 45% more volume in its hold than the A330?

If thats what it says then yes it does


User currently offlineZvezda From Lithuania, joined Aug 2004, 10511 posts, RR: 64
Reply 2, posted (9 years 5 months 3 weeks 3 days 17 hours ago) and read 4520 times:

I believe they are talking about cargo by weight, not by volume, but it's really not clear.

User currently offlineHa763 From United States of America, joined Jan 2003, 3663 posts, RR: 5
Reply 3, posted (9 years 5 months 3 weeks 3 days 15 hours ago) and read 4458 times:
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It seems it is 45% more volume. After pax bags for a full flight, the 787-8 can hold 5 pallets and 5 LD3s, compared to only 5 pallets for the A330-200. Taken from each manufacturers' websites:

Quote:
After allowing for full passenger baggage in containers, the A330-200 offers space for five underfloor freight pallets, more than in the 767s.

http://www.airbus.com/product/a330_a340_freight.asp

Quote:
Cargo Capacity After Passenger Bags:
5 pallets + 5 LD3s

http://www.boeing.com/commercial/7e7/facts.html


User currently offlineKeesje From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 4, posted (9 years 5 months 3 weeks 3 days 15 hours ago) and read 4432 times:

Any reasonable person would look for what B or A don´t mention in these kind of statements.. Common sense would tell that a longer aircraft usually fits more LD3´s..

These statements are for the general public to create a general feeling about the superiority of an aircraft.

Airlines don´t hear them, A/B won´t come with these statements talking to airlines to avoid looking unprofessional.


User currently offlineQFA001 From Australia, joined May 2000, 673 posts, RR: 53
Reply 5, posted (9 years 5 months 3 weeks 3 days 15 hours ago) and read 4422 times:

Quoting Keesje (Reply 4):
Any reasonable person would look for what B or A don´t mention in these kind of statements.. Common sense would tell that a longer aircraft usually fits more LD3´s..

You must have missed the B787 cargo thread. The -8 version will carry 28 LD-3s compared to the 26 on the A330-200 or A350-800. The -9 version will carry 36 LD-3s compared to the 32/33 on the A330-300 or A350-900.

Even without counting bags, the B787 has a definite advantage.


User currently offlineSpacepope From Vatican City, joined Dec 1999, 2952 posts, RR: 1
Reply 6, posted (9 years 5 months 3 weeks 3 days 11 hours ago) and read 4336 times:

Quoting Keesje (Reply 4):
Any reasonable person would look for what B or A don´t mention in these kind of statements.. Common sense would tell that a longer aircraft usually fits more LD3´s..

Depending on the upwards slope of the rear fuselage this can be misleading. Just compare the underfloor storage of the 747 and the MD-11...



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User currently offlineMrComet From Ireland, joined Mar 2005, 561 posts, RR: 8
Reply 7, posted (9 years 5 months 3 weeks 3 days 3 hours ago) and read 4185 times:

Quoting QFA001 (Reply 5):
You must have missed the B787 cargo thread. The -8 version will carry 28 LD-3s compared to the 26 on the A330-200 or A350-800. The -9 version will carry 36 LD-3s compared to the 32/33 on the A330-300 or A350-900.

Thank you for your patience and forgive my ignorance but this still doesn't add up to 45%. I assume pallets are something larger that holds LD-3s. If you have 28 vs. 26 containers or 36 vs. 32 that is about a 10-15% gain.



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User currently offlineN1120A From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 26620 posts, RR: 75
Reply 8, posted (9 years 5 months 3 weeks 3 days 3 hours ago) and read 4185 times:

Quoting Keesje (Reply 4):
Any reasonable person would look for what B or A don´t mention in these kind of statements.. Common sense would tell that a longer aircraft usually fits more LD3´s..

The 787's length is not so much what helps it. It is wider than the traditional Airbus widebody.



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User currently offlineQFA001 From Australia, joined May 2000, 673 posts, RR: 53
Reply 9, posted (9 years 5 months 3 weeks 3 days 1 hour ago) and read 4123 times:

Quoting MrComet (Reply 7):
Thank you for your patience and forgive my ignorance but this still doesn't add up to 45%. I assume pallets are something larger that holds LD-3s. If you have 28 vs. 26 containers or 36 vs. 32 that is about a 10-15% gain.

I'm not sure how Boeing calculates their 45% value. For example, it might be payload by weight after bags + pax have been loaded on a 6,000nm trip. I just don't know. However, I think you can clearly see from your own calculations that Boeing will put it in the best possible light for themselves!

Anyhow, with a pending redesign of the A350 tail, Airbus might be able to make up some volume on the new Boeing. FWIW, the reason why the shorter airplane (B787) in this case has more capacity than the longer airplane (A350) is primarily due to the smaller wing box on the B787.


User currently offline777ER From New Zealand, joined Dec 2003, 12218 posts, RR: 18
Reply 10, posted (9 years 5 months 3 weeks 3 days 1 hour ago) and read 4082 times:
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Quoting QFA001 (Reply 9):

It will involve some type of complicated maths, most likly algabra


User currently offlineQFA001 From Australia, joined May 2000, 673 posts, RR: 53
Reply 11, posted (9 years 5 months 3 weeks 3 days ago) and read 4049 times:

Quoting 777ER (Reply 10):
It will involve some type of complicated maths, most likly algabra

I don't think it would be too complicated. Anyhow, I thought of an additional item: Boeing would count both the A330/350 and B787 with "long haul rules". It is Boeing's usual practice to then "put" cargo-hold crew rests in the Airbus but have overhead crew rests for their own airplanes (eg. B777/787). That is another 2-4 LD-3s worth of space that would "disappear".


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