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What Happens If UA Go Out Of Business?  
User currently offlinePaul From United Kingdom, joined Feb 2005, 374 posts, RR: 3
Posted (9 years 3 months 1 week 6 days 6 hours ago) and read 5863 times:

I am getting increasingly worried with all of the bad press that worms its way onto the forum. I am booked on a flight with United Airlines LHR- IAD-MIA return in C Class from July 8th- 26th. I have used my Aerpolan airmiles to buy the ticket so it is clearly not generating the airline any money. I am booked on a £2000 (non refundable, unless cancelled a month in advance) adventure holiday in Peru. If United Airlines decide to cease trading before my holiday what will the airline do to honor my ticket?

Will they put me on another Star Alliance carrier via a different route?
Will it be in Business Class?
Will they refund my airmiles if I dont fly?

I stand to lose a lot of money if the Airline that i love so much does go belly up?

If anyone can offer any idea of what normally happens in situations like these I will be most grateful!

Regards

Paul


Veni, vidi, vici.
28 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineJwenting From Netherlands, joined Apr 2001, 10213 posts, RR: 18
Reply 1, posted (9 years 3 months 1 week 6 days 6 hours ago) and read 5847 times:

If UAL is incapable of flying you they'll also be incapable of paying someone else to fly you.
Your only resort then would be your travel insurance either paying for another ticket or refunding your trip.



I wish I were flying
User currently offline777ER From New Zealand, joined Dec 2003, 12092 posts, RR: 18
Reply 2, posted (9 years 3 months 1 week 6 days 6 hours ago) and read 5822 times:
AIRLINERS.NET CREW
FORUM MODERATOR

When one airline goes out of business or two airlines combine then the other US airlines will be better off and the pressure would have lowered

User currently offlineGalapagapop From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 910 posts, RR: 4
Reply 3, posted (9 years 3 months 1 week 6 days 5 hours ago) and read 5805 times:

Party at AA's house!

User currently offlinePaul From United Kingdom, joined Feb 2005, 374 posts, RR: 3
Reply 4, posted (9 years 3 months 1 week 6 days 5 hours ago) and read 5791 times:

Thanks for the info.... not. I dont need any lame ass replies stating the obvious. I need facts from previous experience, or people who know what they are talking about.

honestly Jwenting, thank you!

Paul



Veni, vidi, vici.
User currently offlineDelta777jet From Germany, joined Jun 2000, 1249 posts, RR: 3
Reply 5, posted (9 years 3 months 1 week 6 days 5 hours ago) and read 5753 times:

Hey Paul isnt Aeroplan the programme of Air Canada ? In case its another alliance partners programme you entitled for a refund, but if UA is going off market then their FF programme as well. May be STAR will do something for stranded PAX from another member I don t know ?!? May be the guys affected from Ansett Australia collaps could tell ?!?


Fly easyJet
User currently offline767-332ER From United States of America, joined Mar 2001, 2030 posts, RR: 10
Reply 6, posted (9 years 3 months 1 week 6 days 5 hours ago) and read 5749 times:

There shouldn't be a reason why you wouldn't be flown by another carrier whether in Star or just any other american carrier. When PANAM and Eastern went out, their passengers weren't left stranded with invalid tickets...they were accomodated by other carriers. Just check with where you purchased the tickets and if need be, check with BA or AA to see if they will honor your tickets...you know, doing a little homework in case the test was to come. Tell them how concerned you are about UAL's financial status and they should give you some light on this.
Regards my friend



Twinjets...if one fails, work the other one twice as hard!!!
User currently offlineMariner From New Zealand, joined Nov 2001, 25080 posts, RR: 85
Reply 7, posted (9 years 3 months 1 week 6 days 5 hours ago) and read 5737 times:
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Despite the bad press, it is extremely unlikely that United would go out of business by July - if at all.

For all the huffing and puffing, it appeares that the unions are unlikely to strike. It is possible - unlikely but possible - that there may be some CHAOS action by the FA's, but I doubt it.

So far, there is only a small amount of "booking away" from United, some, but not to any great degree.

So - I think you can relax.

However, with that said, the bad news is not new. United has been in bk for over two years, the pension thing has been in the works for some time and it was fairly common knowledge that ti would come to a head about now.

So why did you book on United at all?

cheers

mariner



aeternum nauta
User currently offlineSenorcarnival From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 8, posted (9 years 3 months 1 week 6 days 5 hours ago) and read 5727 times:

Quoting Mariner (Reply 7):
So why did you book on United at all?

Probably b/c he had miles to blow before they go tits up. Seeing I don't travel too often, I'm blowing my UA and DL miles this summer...


User currently offlineMariner From New Zealand, joined Nov 2001, 25080 posts, RR: 85
Reply 9, posted (9 years 3 months 1 week 6 days 5 hours ago) and read 5707 times:
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Quoting Senorcarnival (Reply 8):
Seeing I don't travel too often, I'm blowing my UA and DL miles this summer...

As I say, I think it is highly unlikely they (United) will go t.u. The only thing that could force it now is the unions, and they have pretty much said a strike isn't on.

I would agree about DL though. They are so determined to avoid Chapter 11 that they may run out of cash and be forced to file Chapter 7.

If I were the DL CEO, I'd have been in Chapter 11 some months ago.

cheers

mariner



aeternum nauta
User currently offlineBicoastal From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 10, posted (9 years 3 months 1 week 6 days 4 hours ago) and read 5654 times:

Word from my sources at Dulles Customer Service and Ramp is that next Thursday, May 19, is the strike date at United.

My neighbor says that management brought in ice cream and cake to thank employees for United's great performance at Dulles. However the employees refused to accept it. Cake and ice cream don't make up for massive wage and benefit cuts.

[Edited 2005-05-13 14:34:17]

User currently offlineMariner From New Zealand, joined Nov 2001, 25080 posts, RR: 85
Reply 11, posted (9 years 3 months 1 week 6 days 4 hours ago) and read 5650 times:
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Quoting Bicoastal (Reply 10):
Word from my sources at Dulles Customer Service and Ramp is that next Thursday, May 19, is the strike date at United.

Well, that would be interesting - it goes against all the stuff being leaked from the unions (and, I guess, from United) today. And thwe AFA has gone remarkably quiet.

My own feeling, as an old Lefty, is that a strike is anti-apathetic to most Americans, and that they will go a long way to avoid an actual strike.

But hey, I wouldn't cross the picket lines if they did.

cheers

mariner

[Edited 2005-05-13 14:28:08]


aeternum nauta
User currently offlinePaul From United Kingdom, joined Feb 2005, 374 posts, RR: 3
Reply 12, posted (9 years 3 months 1 week 6 days 2 hours ago) and read 5545 times:

The reason I booked with United is becuase it is the most practical route to fly when leaving from LHR. If I was to fly with Air Canada then Executive First requires slightly more miles to purchase the ticket.

Due to the time of my connecting flight into Lima from Miami Lufthansa (747) was the only other option to take. IMHO UA's Business Class product is far superior to Lufthansa's old C Class!

If the unions do strike, will that be the end for United?

Paul



Veni, vidi, vici.
User currently offlineC133 From United States of America, joined Jan 2005, 225 posts, RR: 0
Reply 13, posted (9 years 3 months 1 week 6 days 2 hours ago) and read 5524 times:
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It's all a great unknown. Who knows if UA could survive a strike? If you want to stop worrying about your travel plans, rebook elsewhere....


Fine: Tax for doing wrong. Tax: Fine for doing well.
User currently offlineMariner From New Zealand, joined Nov 2001, 25080 posts, RR: 85
Reply 14, posted (9 years 3 months 1 week 6 days 2 hours ago) and read 5511 times:
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Quoting Paul (Reply 12):
If the unions do strike, will that be the end for United?

If they strike? It would depend on when and for how long. It would also depend on other inponderables - to what extent are the banks and financiers prepared to give United leeway?

At the moment, the unions appear to be more mellow than they were, and at the moment, no date has been given to a strike, and, generally speaking, Americans don't like strikes.

So - without a crystal ball, that's the best I can do.

cheers

mariner



aeternum nauta
User currently offlineArrow From Canada, joined Jun 2002, 2676 posts, RR: 2
Reply 15, posted (9 years 3 months 1 week 6 days 2 hours ago) and read 5483 times:
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I'm booked on a combination of AC/UAL to Maui in early June, and I too am concerned about what happens if this airline gets struck. I'm going to talk to AC today to see if they have any ideas. The flight to SFO is AC, so I'll get that far -- but who knows what happens after that. Coming back, I go through LAX, and then AC back to Vancouver.

AC has non-stops YVR-OGG, but when I booked there were no seats. I wonder if that becomes an option (like, re-mortgage the house and fly 1st class).

If those unions mess this up, I'll never book a flight on UA again. Of course, if the unions actually do strike, there won't be a UA to book on anyway, so I guess that's not much of a threat.



Never let the facts get in the way of a good story.
User currently offlineAA B777-200 From Netherlands, joined Mar 2001, 505 posts, RR: 4
Reply 16, posted (9 years 3 months 1 week 6 days ago) and read 5392 times:

Ofcourse UAL will try to rebook you on a Star Alliance partner, but usually in cases like these, other airlines will also accept you, perhaps with a certain charge.

When Eastern went down, I remember AA accepting tons of their tickets.
Back in the 90s when NW's flight attendants were on strike, all KLM passengers were rebooked to the US on A N Y airline that had a seat for you.


User currently offlineBAW716 From United States of America, joined Nov 2003, 2028 posts, RR: 27
Reply 17, posted (9 years 3 months 1 week 5 days 23 hours ago) and read 5313 times:

You are holding an Aeroplan mileage ticket. If there is an irregular operation due to an partner carrier, you would be entited to the same FIM rights as any other revenue passenger. They will rebook you on any other Star Alliance carrier to get you to your destination. If you can't to your destination, then you can elect to get as close as you can and then get you back the same way.

The fact that you are holding an Aeroplan ticket is the key. If you were holding a Mileage Plus ticket, is en entirely different problem.

Good luck
baw716



David L. Lamb, fmr Area Mgr Alitalia SFO 1998-2002, fmr Regional Analyst SFO-UAL 1992-1998
User currently offlineMD11junkie From Argentina, joined May 2005, 3148 posts, RR: 57
Reply 18, posted (9 years 3 months 1 week 5 days 23 hours ago) and read 5276 times:

Quoting Mariner (Reply 7):
Despite the bad press, it is extremely unlikely that United would go out of business by July - if at all.

Mariner,
As much as I agree with you, the bad press DOES hurt UA. That's why either Paul or Joe Schmucatelli are worried and are about to change (to another carrier)/cancel their ticket with UA. That HURTS UA business, sadly. The press has a major influence on the non informed general public. So... AA, DL, CO, NW will be getting more business from frightened UA former customers. - That's my view, though. I don't want to give up my hopes for seeing UA prevail this raging shitload of bad press by uninformed press, but as things go... UA will not be able to get through 2005. I hope I'm not right.

Quoting Mariner (Reply 9):
If I were the DL CEO, I'd have been in Chapter 11 some months ago.

Grinstein has saved Western years before. His transformation plan has been paying off pretty good and it WOULD be better if the fuel costs were so damn high. He will file Chapter 11 if things don't shape up, he is a clever man and he will not force the company into Chapter 7. I'm all on board with Grinstein's transformation program as an MD-11 junkie and DL junkie I am, he's the right man to save the airline from YEARS of mis-management.

Cheers! wave 
Gastón - The MD-11 Junkie



There is no such thing as Boeing vs Airbus as the queen of the skies has three engines, winglets and the sweetest nose!
User currently offlineFriendlySkies From United States of America, joined Aug 2004, 4105 posts, RR: 5
Reply 19, posted (9 years 3 months 1 week 5 days 23 hours ago) and read 5253 times:

Quoting AA B777-200 (Reply 16):
Ofcourse UAL will try to rebook you on a Star Alliance partner, but usually in cases like these, other airlines will also accept you, perhaps with a certain charge.

Even though it is about 97% likely that UA isn't going to die, if they do, they couldn't give a crap about any stranded pax. If they're out of business, what reason do they have to help you? None.


User currently offlineWDBRR From United States of America, joined Jan 2005, 610 posts, RR: 0
Reply 20, posted (9 years 3 months 1 week 5 days 17 hours ago) and read 5115 times:

Never say NEVER.....everyone thought that Eastern
and Pan Am would be around forever. At one time,
Pan Am sold tickets for future moon flights.


User currently offlineAR385 From Mexico, joined Nov 2003, 6180 posts, RR: 30
Reply 21, posted (9 years 3 months 1 week 5 days 15 hours ago) and read 5038 times:
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As I have mentioned in another thread, this U.S. administration will not let UA go into liquidation. I do not want to get into philosophical discussions on populist government economics but I do think that is the case. So, PAUL, I would not worry if I were you.


MGGS
User currently offline1rocco From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 119 posts, RR: 0
Reply 22, posted (9 years 3 months 1 week 5 days 15 hours ago) and read 5021 times:

As far as the answer to your topic. It would be a blessing for the rest of the industry.

User currently offlineUadc8contrail From United States of America, joined Sep 2003, 1782 posts, RR: 9
Reply 23, posted (9 years 3 months 1 week 5 days 10 hours ago) and read 4944 times:

1rocco,
you are a refreshing voice to that anti christ kahala777....



bus driver.......move that bus:)
User currently offlineMariner From New Zealand, joined Nov 2001, 25080 posts, RR: 85
Reply 24, posted (9 years 3 months 1 week 5 days 10 hours ago) and read 4929 times:
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MD11junkie:

Quoting MD11junkie (Reply 18):
As much as I agree with you, the bad press DOES hurt UA

Oh, surely, but what I said was that "despite the bad press it is extremely unlikely that UA would go out of business by July..."

I still think that is true. I think that the bad press may be causing some passengers to "book away", but even so, I don't think United is going out of business.

My gray area is that the union contract negotiations are a total wild card to me. I cannot get a read on the present union attitude(s).

Quoting MD11junkie (Reply 18):
Grinstein has saved Western years before. His transformation plan has been paying off pretty good and it WOULD be better if the fuel costs were so damn high.

I am sure Mr. Grinstein is a clever man, but I think he is playing a very high wire game.

The cash in hand keeps dwindling. United went into Chapter 11 with a couple of billion, and I think Delta is below that already?

And I don't see much evidence that the transformation plan is paying off, if only because they keep having to give more warnings.

I'm not entirely convinced that some of the old time airline management people have understood how great the change has been in the industry the past few years and I'm not sure that solutions that would have worked once apply anymore.

So - um - good luck.

cheers

mariner



aeternum nauta
25 PlaneSmart : AR385 '....this U.S. administration will not let UA go into liquidation. I do not want to get into philosophical discussions on populist government ec
26 Post contains images MD11junkie : Actual cash reserves (non-restricted) 1.1 billion dollars. DL is having a constant credit line with AmEx and General Electric (I can't remember if GE
27 Post contains links and images Mariner : Hooroo? Gee, if you picked that up, you have been in the wilder shores of some of my posts. Welcome to a.net. As to Delta, the present cash level is
28 SQ773 : Absolutely right. If the administration didn´t let US to go out of bizz, for sure they will protect UA somehow. Nothing to worry about. By now .
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