Northernlights From Iceland, joined May 2004, 87 posts, RR: 1 Posted (9 years 6 months 2 weeks 6 days 19 hours ago) and read 10385 times:
KLM to start Business Class only flights to the States.
Source: Telegraaf newspaper 13may05
AMSTERDAM - KLM will start this fall with a new service between Amsterdam and Houston aimed at the business class travellers. In the aircraft used on this route there will be a single business class configuration.
After Houston KLM will also start special business class only flights from Amsterdam to New York, Chicago and Detroit. These flights will be operated along the existing services to these destinations. The Swiss lease company Privat Air will operate the services to Houston on behalf of KLM. The service will apparently be operated by specially fitted and configurated Boeing 737-700's.
KLM wishes to attract the bigger Dutch multinationals, such as Shell, Akzo Nobel, Nationale-Nederlanden and Unilever and other major suppliers of business class pax.
Thomasphoto60 From United States of America, joined Jan 2000, 4014 posts, RR: 26
Reply 2, posted (9 years 6 months 2 weeks 6 days 19 hours ago) and read 10250 times:
Certainly is an honour for IAH to be the launch city for these operations. I'll have to notify my friends and fellow spotters down in H-Town about this. BTW, does a 737-700 have the range to make a n/s flight from AMS to IAH (assuming that this will be a n/s flight)?
Joost From Netherlands, joined Apr 2005, 3181 posts, RR: 4
Reply 3, posted (9 years 6 months 2 weeks 6 days 19 hours ago) and read 10217 times:
What surprises me even more is that they decided to run them along the existing flights from AMS. I would expect this rather at RTM, that would be a very nice option for companies based in the Rotterdam-area.
On the long run, I don't think it's the best news. It could be a preparation for transfering more flights to CDG.
AF-A319 From France, joined Oct 1999, 603 posts, RR: 4
Reply 4, posted (9 years 6 months 2 weeks 6 days 19 hours ago) and read 10192 times:
What surprises me is the fact that KL has decided to outsource this new service to PrivatAir. On the other hand, KL's sister company, AF, also operates narrowbody services to business destinations (the A319LR Dedicate). However, the AF's Dedicate flights are mostly operated by AF (only one a/c is operated by a franchise partner).
So why don't KL follow AF's path and operates these flights on its own?
MDL21483 From United States of America, joined Nov 2004, 169 posts, RR: 0
Reply 5, posted (9 years 6 months 2 weeks 6 days 18 hours ago) and read 10171 times:
Sounds like KLM is interested in doing something similar to what Lufthansa did on the Munich (i think) to Newark route operated by PrivatAir BBJs as well. What are KLM's payload statistics for the current 744/763 operations into IAH?
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FlySSC From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 7425 posts, RR: 57
Reply 6, posted (9 years 6 months 2 weeks 6 days 18 hours ago) and read 10117 times:
Quoting AF-A319 (Reply 4): On the other hand, KL's sister company, AF, also operates narrowbody services to business destinations (the A319LR Dedicate).
No. "Dedicate" is NOT an "all-business" service. Dedicate is simply a long haul flight operated with a narrowbody A319LR, with a different inflight service from the regular "Espace Affaire" long-haul.
AF's Dedicate A319LR are configured with 28 Business and 54 Economy.
KLMA330 From Canada, joined Feb 2005, 697 posts, RR: 2
Reply 9, posted (9 years 6 months 2 weeks 6 days 18 hours ago) and read 10010 times:
BBJ's have extended range due to the fact that they're alot lighter than normal 737's. Still though seems like a loooong way to go on a narrowbody. I can imagine it being a pretty comfortable plane for sure!
Good on KLM. It makes sense though, considering the oil business in both cities! I wonder if this is a market British Airways will ever enter.. I mean, if anyone needs dedicated Business flights, it's BA from London! Think of all the possible destinations. Then perhaps they can use smaller widebodies for the rest of the "commoners"
Northwest 777 From United States of America, joined Sep 2000, 224 posts, RR: 0
Reply 10, posted (9 years 6 months 2 weeks 6 days 17 hours ago) and read 9938 times:
Does anyone ever think their could be some type of all-biz only or a mix of biz and first class operation from the west coast to Europe, or even from the West Cost to high yield spots in Asia? Before you laugh about the transpacific service, of course it wouldn't be with 319/320 or 737s, but 757s (As a stop-gap measure until the 787 arrives.) Of course, for the operation of West-Coast to Asia flights, the 757's be modified with, FIRST AND FOREMOST, the addition of extra fuel tanks in the belly where there would be freed up space due to the lack of coach class bags and for extra measure make sure you've go some winglets on it.
And of course, these setups are not setup like the now defunct National had them with over 100 business seats all the way down the plane, but instead have about 60 (or however many they could get away with and still not go over weight considering the amount of fuel they'll have onboard) lie flat business seats allowing LAX-NRT or LAX-LHR, easily! (Remember, we're not talking about the CO 757s flying over the pond on 5 hr flights that don't need modifications. I'm talking about adding a big belly fuel tank. They've easily got the powerplants to haul up the extra weight.). I even wonder (and you may have to really hold your laughter on this one) but if someone did a 757 with a setup having 5 or 6 rows up front or 1x1 'Emirates' style Suites for first class and the remaining space going to some lie-flat biz class seats, allowing for some high-yeild spots in Asia, mainly Japan and China, for exampe. Operating a 757 setup in a config. like this (in most cases) would only seem to make sense if the carrier can operate 2 flights a day. With this 757, it could allow the airline to switch to a smaller widebody for the other flight of the day to pick up the coach passengers, a few more business class pax. (they love flight time options!) and of course the cargo. Of course, Like I kind of mentioned, airlines that fly the routes I have mapped out in the link beliow have no porblem operating them with big 747s, I was thinking of the carriers that wont to get rid of their 4-holers and add more frequency for business travelers. Also, I was thinking of carriers that may be in financially booming city in China that would like to serve such a flight.
As far as the Europe flights, they're really the ones operating a long haul 757 like this for. I would assume its just a matter of time until we see some wingletted, all biz or maybe first and biz 757's flying west coast to Multiple spots in Europe. I used LAX as the starting part just for demo purposes only, and not because of any ties between LA and any of the cities I should the distances to. I could easily see these types of 757 Business or Bus/First flights originating in YVR as well. I'D love something like that here in SEA but don't know of any specific Commercial ties between my area and Europe, not that they don't exist.
I guess I see the West-Coast to Europe All Bus or Bus/First 757 flights as feasible simply because of carriers already flying the route that could ( if permitted to do so ) just operate two flights on the route day, one being the 757 while being able to downgrade from whatever their sole aircraft was before, say a 747 to a smaller aircraft, A332/763 for example, simply to pick up the lower class passengers as well as maybe a few more business passengers, but mostly allowing the full use of the underbelly to carry money-making cargo. Also, with a second flight, even if you only have the plane setup to carry a smaller number of business class passengers, these passengers are they given flexibility in scheduling which they may not have had on the carriers previous once a day flight.
I don't know, I'm just having fun with this post so please don't bash me to too hard if its completely ludicrous, got it I'm fully aware, that, for example, the the 757s flying Trans-Pacific flights (although if modified, they could probably do it with an extra fuel tank because of the freed up space from not hauling tourists' luggage and a set of winglets, even at 120 mins. ETOPS) are not that realistic, most likely because if the carrier doesn't have the ability to operate another daily flight, this time with a widebody to enable them to carry the the coach passengers, a few more business travelers (whom now have more flexibility might I add ) and the all important cargo.
Feel free to pick my post apart, I've been up all night and I can't sleep, saw this post so I decided to run this idea I've had.
Dutchjet From Netherlands, joined Oct 2000, 7864 posts, RR: 57
Reply 12, posted (9 years 6 months 2 weeks 6 days 10 hours ago) and read 9472 times:
I was rather surpirsed by the announcement. Its interesting that KL plans to operate the all J class flights IN ADDITION TO its regular flights, different from the LH strategy where the PrivatAir flights operate in markets that do not have a standard LH flight. Its an interesting way to increase J class seats on specific routes without flooding the market with excess capacity - its going to be interesting to see which service premium pax prefer - the front cabin of a widebody or an all J class 737BBJ. Does Privatair have 4 or 5 additional 737BBJS on order?
LJ From Netherlands, joined Nov 1999, 4471 posts, RR: 0
Reply 13, posted (9 years 6 months 2 weeks 6 days 10 hours ago) and read 9446 times:
Quoting Joost (Reply 3): What surprises me even more is that they decided to run them along the existing flights from AMS. I would expect this rather at RTM, that would be a very nice option for companies based in the Rotterdam-area.
MauriceB From Netherlands, joined Aug 2004, 2490 posts, RR: 25
Reply 15, posted (9 years 6 months 2 weeks 6 days 10 hours ago) and read 9376 times:
this will not mean the end of AMS-IAH regular service, since KLM is marketing the route already for a long time, since it will be the first City to be served with the A330.. Also the business class is at its best at the AMS-IAH route so im not suprised.....
KLMcedric From Belgium, joined Dec 2003, 812 posts, RR: 22
Reply 19, posted (9 years 6 months 2 weeks 6 days 9 hours ago) and read 9207 times:
Unless this is completely new, I'm afraid you're wrong about the A-330 serving
IAH as first destination.
The first A-330 will be delivered the 25th of august and will begin commercial
service shortly after flying to IAD (Washington Dulles).
Is it possible you got confused because of the resembling airport codes IAD-IAH?
HT From Germany, joined May 2005, 6525 posts, RR: 23
Reply 20, posted (9 years 6 months 2 weeks 6 days 8 hours ago) and read 9167 times:
Regarding use (and experience) of Privat Air 737BBJ1 for LH service MUC-EWR there´s thread MUC To NYC (B-Class) In A B737: Experience? (by HT May 13 2005 in Civil Aviation) incidentally initiated by me earlier today.
Replay #4 of that thread contains a link to a Trip Report created by FlyK; other useful bits of information can be found in replies 11 & 12.
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KaiGywer From United States of America, joined Oct 2003, 12263 posts, RR: 35
Reply 23, posted (9 years 6 months 2 weeks 6 days 8 hours ago) and read 9056 times:
AIRLINERS.NET CREW FORUM MODERATOR
What is funny on this site is how many people say they wouldn't fly a narrowbody across the pond. Now, this is a narrowbody, but I'd like to see who WOULDN'T fly it, based on the fact that it's only a narrowbody
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