Sponsor Message:
Civil Aviation Forum
My Starred Topics | Profile | New Topic | Forum Index | Help | Search 
USA: Non-tickd Pax Be Allowed Back To Gates?  
User currently offlineSoundtrack From United States of America, joined Feb 2001, 284 posts, RR: 0
Posted (9 years 3 months 2 weeks 2 days 18 hours ago) and read 7502 times:

I heard a rumor of some airports possibly lifting the restriction of allowing non ticketed passengers passed security.

Anyone have info on this?

plse advise

51 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineRDUDDJI From Lesotho, joined Jun 2004, 1483 posts, RR: 3
Reply 1, posted (9 years 3 months 2 weeks 2 days 17 hours ago) and read 7456 times:

To my knowledge, the only airport you can proceed w/o a BP or gate pass is PIT because of lobbying by their Airmall.

I personally think people who are not travelling do not need to be clogging up the already long lines for the rest of us, not to mention the security concerns.



Sometimes we don't realize the good times when we're in them
User currently offlineGQfluffy From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 2, posted (9 years 3 months 2 weeks 2 days 17 hours ago) and read 7422 times:

I've heard of Gate Passes for adults/parents of Unaccompanied Minors. That's about it as far as non-ticketed people beyond the checkpoints...

fluffy


User currently offlineN1120A From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 26499 posts, RR: 75
Reply 3, posted (9 years 3 months 2 weeks 2 days 15 hours ago) and read 7361 times:

Quoting RDUDDJI (Reply 1):
not to mention the security concerns.

What concerns? Those without passes still get screened and airlines sure as hell don't want to let someone who has not paid on the aircraft, so there is no reason to worry about that

Quoting RDUDDJI (Reply 1):
I personally think people who are not travelling do not need to be clogging up the already long lines for the rest of us

It was never an issue before, when passenger numbers were still higher than they are now (particularly at some airports), and the screening procedure is for all intents and purposes the same



Mangeons les French fries, mais surtout pratiquons avec fierte le French kiss
User currently offlineMir From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 21637 posts, RR: 55
Reply 4, posted (9 years 3 months 2 weeks 2 days 14 hours ago) and read 7317 times:

In the US, a lot of the concessions are in the secure area, so the airports could make some good money off of it. Especially if they charged people a fee to get in if they aren't going on a flight.

And the extra people going through security might force the TSA to get its act together with regards to how it screens passengers.

-Mir



7 billion, one nation, imagination...it's a beautiful day
User currently offlineBurnsie28 From United States of America, joined Aug 2004, 7546 posts, RR: 8
Reply 5, posted (9 years 3 months 2 weeks 2 days 12 hours ago) and read 7151 times:

The fee to get in wont work, but after 9/11 when the new terminal in DTW opened many businesses just shut down instead of moving because sales were not high enough to warrent moving over due to the no non-ticketed people beyond security.


"Some People Just Know How To Fly"- Best slogan ever, RIP NW 1926-2009
User currently offlineHT From Germany, joined May 2005, 6525 posts, RR: 23
Reply 6, posted (9 years 3 months 2 weeks 2 days 11 hours ago) and read 7127 times:

Quoting Burnsie28 (Reply 5):
The fee to get in wont work

As an aviation enthusiast, I would take the bait and also would use a designated checkpoint for non-ticketed pax in order to enter any concourse.
This basically would be the same procedure as when trying to enter observation desks in FRA or ZRH. Both levy an entrance fee and perform a security check of bags & people using the usual equipment. Even with these "hurdles", www.zurich-airpirt.com can brag: "With over half a million visitors each year, Zurich Airport is one of Switzerland's most popular destinations". And I assume, they are counting the people entering the observation desk.

With designated check-points those non-flying pax would not clogg up the check-points for (flying) pax (seperate check-points of course, only if demand is high enough).
-HT



Carpe diem ! Life is too short to waste your time ! Keep in mind, that today is the first day of the rest of your life !
User currently offlineDtwclipper From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 7, posted (9 years 3 months 2 weeks 2 days 11 hours ago) and read 7109 times:

It would be great for DTW. The NW Worldgateway was designed with retail space that depended on such traffic.

Also, the excellent screening areas would provide enough access, imho.


User currently offlineNWADC9 From United States of America, joined May 2004, 4897 posts, RR: 9
Reply 8, posted (9 years 3 months 2 weeks 2 days 11 hours ago) and read 7108 times:

Quoting RDUDDJI (Reply 1):
To my knowledge, the only airport you can proceed w/o a BP or gate pass is PIT because of lobbying by their Airmall.

Wrongo. You NEED a Boarding Pass, Gate Pass, or Crew/Employee ID to get through those jerks.

When this TSA bull$#!* came in to PIT, the Airmall's revenue took a severe plunge. The mall was made for everyone, not just passengers, so people would go to the airport just to shop, taking advantage of mall prices and tax-free clothing.



Flying an aeroplane with only a single propeller to keep you in the air. Can you imagine that? -Capt. Picard
User currently offlineYYZYYT From Canada, joined Apr 2005, 955 posts, RR: 0
Reply 9, posted (9 years 3 months 2 weeks 2 days 11 hours ago) and read 7102 times:

Quoting N1120A (Reply 3):
and the screening procedure is for all intents and purposes the same

Do you really find that? In my experience, screening has been a lot more careful since 9/11, and thus a lot slower... more careful look at all electronics, quicker to search out any pointy object found, more swabs taken for chemical analysis, magnanometres (apologies for any spelling error) set to higher sensitivity, not to mention removing all shoes.

As for non-travelers going to the gate, I always found that odd (it was never permitted here).


User currently offlineSeptember11 From United States of America, joined May 2004, 3623 posts, RR: 21
Reply 10, posted (9 years 3 months 2 weeks 2 days 11 hours ago) and read 7096 times:

Quoting Soundtrack (Thread starter):
I heard a rumor of some airports possibly lifting the restriction of allowing non ticketed passengers passed security.

I hope the rumor is true ... it's always nice to greet passengers at arrival gates.



Airliners.net of the Future
User currently offlineFI642 From Monaco, joined Mar 2005, 1079 posts, RR: 2
Reply 11, posted (9 years 3 months 2 weeks 2 days 11 hours ago) and read 7091 times:

Think about the gate agents. Not only would they be dealing with the 150 pax on the plane, but the 40 "meeter's and greeter's"- and the family and friends of those on the outbound.

The fewer folks through security, the less chance for error. Life is so much more civilized at the gates with JUST customers.



737MAX, Cool Planes for the Worlds Coolest Airline.
User currently offlineTornado82 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 12, posted (9 years 3 months 2 weeks 2 days 11 hours ago) and read 7081 times:

Yep... PIT Airmall merchants are mandated by their lease stipulations to charge "Fair Market Value." If they are caught trying to gouge the Airmall patrons by charging more than at their retail stores in other malls, their websites, etc. they are penalized via the terms they signed on to. Tax-free clothing is all of PA, not just Airmall.

Many people in that end of town used to go to Airmall just to shop, this was ended by 9/11, and even if they ended that boarding pass stipulation now the Airmall would still be hurting from the loss of US connecting pax (a large source of revenue), and to a lesser extent the Mall @ Robinson or whatever they call that one out that way.


User currently offlineKFLLCFII From United States of America, joined Sep 2004, 3303 posts, RR: 30
Reply 13, posted (9 years 3 months 2 weeks 2 days 11 hours ago) and read 7058 times:

Quoting September11 (Reply 10):
I hope the rumor is true ... it's always nice to greet passengers at arrival gates.

Especially when you are unfamiliar with the concourse layout upon arrival. I had a hell of a time trying to find my way out of the concourse in which Song resides at JFK, but maybe that was just me  confused 



"About the only way to look at it, just a pity you are not POTUS KFLLCFII, seems as if we would all be better off."
User currently offlineHT From Germany, joined May 2005, 6525 posts, RR: 23
Reply 14, posted (9 years 3 months 2 weeks 2 days 11 hours ago) and read 7043 times:

Quoting FI642 (Reply 11):
Think about the gate agents. Not only would they be dealing with the 150 pax on the plane, but the 40 "meeter's and greeter's"- and the family and friends of those on the outbound.

But that was standard procedure in the U.S. before 9/11 and it worked & was great !



Carpe diem ! Life is too short to waste your time ! Keep in mind, that today is the first day of the rest of your life !
User currently offlinePiedmontbrat From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 15, posted (9 years 3 months 2 weeks 2 days 11 hours ago) and read 7007 times:

As a frequent flyer, I hope they don't allow non-ticketed people thru security. It's bad enough trying to get thru the gangs of people waiting outside the security area to get out of the airport but to have them waiting in the seating area prior to boarding would be a pure pain in the neck.

Let people say their good-byes as they drop the passengers off at the door or their hellos when they pick them up at baggage claim!


User currently offlinePitflyer From United States of America, joined Jun 2000, 40 posts, RR: 0
Reply 16, posted (9 years 3 months 2 weeks 2 days 11 hours ago) and read 6990 times:

I live ten minutes from PIT airport and never would go through security just to shop there. Plenty of the same options outside the airport. However, what did happen is folks who lived further out and were picking someone up would arrive early to the airport and do some shopping (at least get something to eat) at the many choices at the airport. That loss really hurt the AirMall (the meet and greet traffic).

User currently offlineMikeTheActuary From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 69 posts, RR: 0
Reply 17, posted (9 years 3 months 2 weeks 2 days 10 hours ago) and read 6903 times:

Quoting GQfluffy (Reply 2):
I've heard of Gate Passes for adults/parents of Unaccompanied Minors. That's about it as far as non-ticketed people beyond the checkpoints...

Also, disabled pax are allowed to request a gate pass for a non-flying friend/family member/etc. if they need assistance getting to the gate.

My wife is disabled, but frequently flies between our home and her parents'. I've been back to the gate with her several times. At BDL at least, security screening is exactly the same for the gate-pass holder as it is for pax.


User currently offlineCha747 From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 785 posts, RR: 6
Reply 18, posted (9 years 3 months 2 weeks 2 days 9 hours ago) and read 6844 times:

When I lived in Pittsburgh for a short period of time pre-9/11 I knew people who would pay for parking, pass through security, and go shopping in the Airmall. As a matter of fact, that was the only place that a friend of mine at the time could find some special Toblerone bars that she liked.

In anycase, I think congested airports like ATL, PHL, and LGA to name a few would find it difficult to process extra visitors, even for a fee, when they have so much trouble dealing with the large volume of passengers. But at smaller airports or airports with more security lanes to go through, I'd pay up to $5 to be airside when a friend or relative arrives. Pre-9/11 I used to go and visit relatives and friends who were connecting through PHL and had two hours to kill.



You land a million planes safely, then you have one little mid-air and you never hear the end of it - Pushing Tin
User currently offlineAtmx2000 From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 4576 posts, RR: 37
Reply 19, posted (9 years 3 months 2 weeks 2 days 9 hours ago) and read 6782 times:

This is a bad idea. They will have to check IDs at boarding again if they do this. Otherwise someone who would not be authorized to fly could get into the boarding area and take the boarding pass/ticket of someone who could get through airline screening and get on board a plane.


ConcordeBoy is a twin supremacist!! He supports quadicide!!
User currently offlineContinentalFan From United States of America, joined Oct 2000, 357 posts, RR: 0
Reply 20, posted (9 years 3 months 2 weeks 2 days 9 hours ago) and read 6760 times:

Not strictly related to the topic at hand, but some food for thought:

Christopher Hitchens article on Slate


User currently offlineBrons2 From United States of America, joined Sep 2001, 3013 posts, RR: 4
Reply 21, posted (9 years 3 months 2 weeks 2 days 9 hours ago) and read 6760 times:

Quoting FI642 (Reply 11):
The fewer folks through security, the less chance for error. Life is so much more civilized at the gates with JUST customers.

I agree.

Furthermore, on the security question, there is a security principle involved here. That principle is the "least access principle", that is, give people the least amount of access necessary in order for them to complete their travel. It's the most secure way.



Firings, if well done, are good for employee morale.
User currently offlinePanAm747 From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 4242 posts, RR: 8
Reply 22, posted (9 years 3 months 2 weeks 2 days 9 hours ago) and read 6712 times:

I kind of have mixed emotions about it all.

On the one hand, seating can be limited at the gate for the departing passengers...adding entire families to the crowd just makes it harder for people in a hurry (or people like me who don't meander and despise people who stop and gawk and get in the way) to get around.

However, airports were not designed with a "designated waiting area" for meeting incoming passengers. Not everyone off an airplane is going to know where to go or be able to navigate the system, including unaccompanied minors.

I am of the feeling that allowing non-ticketed passengers beyond security should only be done in cases of extreme situations.

One unique thing that has helped ease congestion somewhat here at SAN has been the new "Cell Phone Lot". Since virtually all passengers to San Diego are O&D, there are sometimes very long lines at the front of the terminals of people waiting to be picked up. Allowing drivers to wait for free in a lot adjacent to the airport for a short period of time (up to one hour, and they must stay with their car) has greatly cut down on traffic congestion, as coordinating pick-ups has been much easier, not to mention harbor police are no longer "shoo-ing" away vast numbers of cars.

It has worked well for me as both an arriving passenger and a chauffer - boom, boom, boom - no reason to go in, no reason to park, no time wasted. Could this be an alternative for other airports as well?

Happy flying to all!!  cloudnine 



Pan Am:The World's Most Experienced Airline - P(oor) S(ailor's) A(irline): San Diego's Hometown Airline-Catch Our Smile!
User currently offlineCXYYZ From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 23, posted (9 years 3 months 2 weeks 2 days 8 hours ago) and read 6590 times:

What major industrialised countries allow non-pax up to the gates? I never understood why it was allowed pre-9/11. In my lifetime in "unsafe" Canada we've never had such access.

As a passenger, I don't want another 50 people hanging around my gate, it's busy enough as it is. As a passenger, I don't want the duty free shops to be crowded with random people who think it's a regular mall. Sorry, but say your goodbyes before you go through security. It makes the secured area a much calmer environment.


User currently offlineYYZYYT From Canada, joined Apr 2005, 955 posts, RR: 0
Reply 24, posted (9 years 3 months 2 weeks 2 days 8 hours ago) and read 6565 times:

In fact, there is at least one other thread which is full of complaints as to congestion at the security lines... why would you want to add to that?

United We Stand (in Line) (by Dtwclipper Jun 1 2005 in Civil Aviation)


25 Scott0305 : Reply 11: "The fewer folks through security, the less chance for error. Life is so much more civilized at the gates with JUST customers" Reply 21: "I
26 MKEdude : I am split on this. Having non-ticketed people on the concourses is not a security risk, it never has been. You still need a boarding pass to get on a
27 Ckfred : Considering the extra scrutiny that goes on at security, letting non-passengers would be a pain. I can only think of a couple of instances of classes
28 PHLBOS : In the issue released a week after 9/11/01, Time magazine showed a diagram showing the enhanced post-9/11 security corridor. In the pictoral diagram,
29 CitationJet : That has not been my experience post 9/11.... Since 9/11 having flown to Europe, Asia, Mexico, and Central America and have found the lines move much
30 CitationJet : I flew out of Kansas City (MCI) airport last week. Because of their airport design, the security is at the gate. Once you pass thru security there ar
31 CBERFlyer : DEN also has a "Cell Phone Lot", installed several years ago on Pena Boulevard where the old parking fee collection plaza was located. In fact, it ha
32 Xpat : I cannot disagree with you on that point!
33 Brons2 : As noted by CitationJet, this is the way that MCI (Kansas City International) is set up. It's okay if you are a KC originating or destination traffic
34 PHLBOS : PHL has one as well. However, it's located on the opposite side of I-95 from the airport and the signage directing people to the lot is somewhat limi
35 Schipholjfk : A very nice Delta agent at JFK once allowed me to accompany my parents to the gate who were ticketed passengers. From what I understand, the agent at
36 HT : IIRC: Australia - or to be more specific: SYD
37 Trvlr : I believe there is no problem with letting passengers back into the terminals. How do you solve the congestion problem? Build a seperate security chec
38 VEEREF : I think that's the least thing TSA should be considering! What they need to focus on is how to get similarly named pax off the no-fly list! I'm an air
39 ODwyerPW : Prior to 9/11 a group of 40 or so Banjo, Guitar, Fiddle, Tin Whistle, Flute players were permitted to play Traditional Music in one of the Lobbies pas
40 FI642 : Interesting to see who has worked the gate, and who hasn't here. It's very clear. .........and anyone who has seen the new Southwest Terminal at BWI c
41 Access-Air : The problem here is that TSA has chased out the non-ticket passengers from going past security and made no alternative for them. All the Observation d
42 727EMflyer : As to security at the gate, YES it can work. As mentioned it seems ok at MCI, and other small airports like my hometown of GTF. I also saw it work qui
43 Venezuela747 : Wouldnt it either be an all or no airports lifting the ban? Passes are giving on special occasions, you would have to make up some story of how your g
44 Checksixx : US Military families can proceed to the gate for returning troops.
45 DLX737200 : It's been spectulated among forum members here in the past to let non-ticketed pax down to the gates only during off-peak travel times. Not during the
46 Blrsea : Two years back, a kind security agent at Seattle airport allowed me to accompany my parents who didn't understand english well to the gate. It is real
47 JET1977 : Allowing non-ticketed passengers to roam the gate area will dull a security officer's suspiciousness and ability to spot abnormal situations in the ga
48 Blrsea : I was given a pass to accompany my parents. At LAX, I asked for a similar pass to accompany my parents to the gate, and they said they didn't have suc
49 Schipholjfk : Well... you would not be able to meet them at the gate on an international flight anyway. They must clear immigration and customs first. In the old d
50 Blrsea : I meant after the immigration and customs check of course, before trying to find the baggage claim/connecting gate/terminal for the next leg of domest
51 YYZYYT : Freak out? us? Nahhh.... we Canadians never freak out ... I (speaking for myself) just found it odd that the non-passengers were ever let past securi
Top Of Page
Forum Index

This topic is archived and can not be replied to any more.

Printer friendly format

Similar topics:More similar topics...
Aviation Security Bill-Non Pax To Gates? posted Mon Nov 19 2001 19:47:10 by 727LOVER
Cargo Converted Back To Pax? posted Thu May 25 2006 06:51:00 by Irobertson
Should The Mentally Ill Be Allowed To Fly? posted Fri Dec 9 2005 00:51:18 by Hmmmm...
Would The Embraer 170 Be Allowed To Land At LCY? posted Sat Aug 20 2005 13:56:35 by Dsa
UA Gives Two Gates Back To DIA - For $$$ posted Sat Jul 30 2005 12:44:45 by Mariner
Mobile Phones To Be Allowed In Airplanes :( posted Sun Jul 3 2005 19:44:43 by TheSonntag
Will Pax A380s Be Easily Converted To Freighters? posted Thu Jun 17 2004 22:47:44 by Leelaw
Should Branson Be Allowed To Start Virgin America? posted Fri Feb 13 2004 07:04:46 by Rjpieces
Should Bankrupt Carriers Be Allowed To Operate? posted Sat Jan 10 2004 20:22:25 by Matt D
"Pax Not Allowed To Congregate Near Toilets" posted Sun Jan 4 2004 18:45:49 by Teahan