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Boeing Announced Launch Of The 747 Adv. In Le Bourget  
User currently offlineColumba From Germany, joined Dec 2004, 7088 posts, RR: 4
Posted (9 years 5 months 2 weeks 2 days 21 hours ago) and read 15217 times:

German news station n-tv reported that Boeing had announced the launch of the 747 Adv. in Le Bourget.

Any ideas for a launch customer :
BA, CX ?

[Edited 2005-06-14 10:43:16]

[Edited 2005-06-14 10:54:58]


It will forever be a McDonnell Douglas MD 80 , Boeing MD 80 sounds so wrong
56 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offline777ER From New Zealand, joined Dec 2003, 12278 posts, RR: 18
Reply 1, posted (9 years 5 months 2 weeks 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 15071 times:
AIRLINERS.NET CREW
FORUM MODERATOR

The legacy of the B747 lives on  Smile Will be interesting to see which airline becomes the launch customer

User currently offlineTrent900 From United Kingdom, joined Dec 2003, 540 posts, RR: 0
Reply 2, posted (9 years 5 months 2 weeks 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 15018 times:

If this is true (not seen the news yet) this is good for both A and B. At least the airlines can now stop waiting around and order an aircraft best suited to their needs. IMO the 380 has much more potential.

D.


User currently offlineAeroWesty From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 20784 posts, RR: 62
Reply 3, posted (9 years 5 months 2 weeks 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 14994 times:

Hmm ... doesn't seem "announced" yet:

http://yahoo.reuters.com/financeQuot...05-06-14_07-55-23_l14308162_newsml



International Homo of Mystery
User currently offlineBestWestern From Hong Kong, joined Sep 2000, 7264 posts, RR: 57
Reply 4, posted (9 years 5 months 2 weeks 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 14968 times:

Untrue. Boeing will consider launching the 747A at next months board meeting.


The world is really getting smaller these days
User currently offlineLifelinerOne From Netherlands, joined Nov 2003, 1929 posts, RR: 8
Reply 5, posted (9 years 5 months 2 weeks 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 14930 times:

The B747 Advanced is not officially launched. The board will decide on the project at the end of this month.

Maybe we need to change the topic title??

Cheers!  wave 



Only Those Who Sleep Don't Make Mistakes
User currently offlineNA From Germany, joined Dec 1999, 10804 posts, RR: 9
Reply 6, posted (9 years 5 months 2 weeks 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 14831 times:

Signs are good. Better than ever.
Even if "747 Advanced announces launch" is not true unfortunately, unless you take the words of the head of Boeing Italy for real: "Boeing will launch, Boeing has decided".
Unfortunately another Boeing executive contradicts it. But this is the strongest signs yet that the decision might be just a formality.
Thanks for posting the Reuters-link.


User currently offlineAeroPiggot From United States of America, joined May 2005, 284 posts, RR: 0
Reply 7, posted (9 years 5 months 2 weeks 2 days 9 hours ago) and read 14038 times:

This topic is misleading, the 747Adv has not been launch. Boeing board will only launch a new/derivative model, when they have enough orders to justify the expenditure of company resources. Remember guys the taxpayers do not subsidize the launch of Boeing products.


A scientist discovers that which exists, an engineer creates that which never was.
User currently offlineSchipholjfk From United States of America, joined Jan 2005, 579 posts, RR: 6
Reply 8, posted (9 years 5 months 2 weeks 2 days 9 hours ago) and read 14008 times:

Quoting Trent900 (Reply 2):
IMO the 380 has much more potential.

Can you be more detailed and explain why you think so? Thank you.



The fun of flying... love it !!!
User currently offlineAirways From Switzerland, joined Mar 2001, 880 posts, RR: 12
Reply 9, posted (9 years 5 months 2 weeks 2 days 8 hours ago) and read 13706 times:

Alen Mulally today said that they are in talks with customers about the purchase of new 747s. Mainly freighters but also pax versions. He didn't tell whether these planes are 744s or 747adv.

Furthermore, he said that they were planning to announce the closure of the 747 production later this year, but do to strong interestest, they are keeping it open. The same goes for the 767 line. This line will stay open too.

The 747adv is being discussed at the moment. Nothing new so far, they intend to use the 787 engines and some other 787 technology. A project group is currently working on that, but nothing has been decided yet.

I saw the N-TV people at the press conference. I think they did an interview afther the presentation.

Regards from Paris,
Michael


User currently offlineBestWestern From Hong Kong, joined Sep 2000, 7264 posts, RR: 57
Reply 10, posted (9 years 5 months 2 weeks 2 days 8 hours ago) and read 13612 times:

Quoting NA (Reply 6):
head of Boeing Italy for real

As if he knows whats going on.

Quoting Airways (Reply 9):
Alen Mulally today said that they are in talks with customers about the purchase of new 747s. Mainly freighters but also pax versions. He didn't tell whether these planes are 744s or 747adv.

He was on Bloomberg yesterday - and basically said the same thing, but discussed the 747A more - seems like more interest coming from Freight. He was very fluffy about it.

Quoting Airways (Reply 9):
Furthermore, he said that they were planning to announce the closure of the 747 production later this year

First ever mention of this. Are you sure he said this?



The world is really getting smaller these days
User currently offlineTrent900 From United Kingdom, joined Dec 2003, 540 posts, RR: 0
Reply 11, posted (9 years 5 months 2 weeks 2 days 8 hours ago) and read 13592 times:

Quoting Schipholjfk (Reply 8):
Can you be more detailed and explain why you think so? Thank you.

The 747 Adv would be a great aircraft for current 747 operators that do not need much more extra capacity. The 380 on the other hand has been designed to be extended if need be and with a larger floor area airlines have greater freedom on how to make passengers feel more comfortable. Even Singapore Airlines have said they would rather 'miss-use' a 380 on routes it wasn't really designed for.

D.


User currently offlineWhiteHatter From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 12, posted (9 years 5 months 2 weeks 2 days 7 hours ago) and read 13086 times:

Quoting Trent900 (Reply 11):
The 747 Adv would be a great aircraft for current 747 operators that do not need much more extra capacity

The issue is not so much capacity (the 744 is already an enormously flexible aircraft) as economy.

Current capacity for the 744 is at a useful market point. What would sell the aircraft is a significant change downward in fuel burn and ZFW/space ratio, and with the Trent 1000 and GENx coming on line too then it starts to look like a desirable product again.

I wouldn't be surprised to see the 747-800 carrying the torch into the next decade or two (my little crystal ball prediction for the new aircraft, the 748!)


User currently offlineKennyK From United Kingdom, joined Apr 2005, 482 posts, RR: 0
Reply 13, posted (9 years 5 months 2 weeks 2 days 7 hours ago) and read 12929 times:

Are Boeing further along the path of launching a new 747 or are we going over the same ground again when Boeing was going to 'launch' 747 derivatives in the past?

User currently offlineAvek00 From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 4412 posts, RR: 19
Reply 14, posted (9 years 5 months 2 weeks 2 days 7 hours ago) and read 12868 times:

Quoting Trent900 (Reply 11):
a larger floor area airlines have greater freedom on how to make passengers feel more comfortable.

The weight of cabin furnishings is posing a MAJOR problem for the A380, and airlines will be lucky to install EXISTING longhaul premium products into the plane as it is.



Live life to the fullest.
User currently offlineScotron11 From United Kingdom, joined Feb 2004, 1178 posts, RR: 3
Reply 15, posted (9 years 5 months 2 weeks 2 days 6 hours ago) and read 12766 times:

Quoting BestWestern (Reply 10):

First ever mention of this. Are you sure he said this?

He said it last week, in so many words. If they don't get some serious orders for the current 744/767, then they will decide next month to shut the lines down.


User currently offlineAtmx2000 From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 4576 posts, RR: 37
Reply 16, posted (9 years 5 months 2 weeks 2 days 6 hours ago) and read 12203 times:

Quoting Schipholjfk (Reply 8):
Quoting Trent900 (Reply 2):
IMO the 380 has much more potential.

Can you be more detailed and explain why you think so? Thank you.

His username is Trent900. He doesn't need another reason  Wink

Quoting WhiteHatter (Reply 12):
I wouldn't be surprised to see the 747-800 carrying the torch into the next decade or two (my little crystal ball prediction for the new aircraft, the 748!)

That's my prediction as well. It continues this obsession with putting 8s into model numbers, but it also indicates that the aircraft has a range of ~8000nm.



ConcordeBoy is a twin supremacist!! He supports quadicide!!
User currently offlineDfwRevolution From United States of America, joined Jan 2010, 997 posts, RR: 51
Reply 17, posted (9 years 5 months 2 weeks 2 days 6 hours ago) and read 12005 times:

Quoting KennyK (Reply 13):
Are Boeing further along the path of launching a new 747 or are we going over the same ground again when Boeing was going to 'launch' 747 derivatives in the past?

Much much further along than other stillborn concepts of the 1995-2001 timespan. The -400XQLR would run second place, but even that was never really close to launch. A good deal of -400XQLR design work will go into the Adv, especially noise reducing features (cheverons, flap tweaks) and aerodynamic improvements (wingtip).

Quoting Airways (Reply 9):
Alen Mulally today said that they are in talks with customers about the purchase of new 747s. Mainly freighters but also pax versions. He didn't tell whether these planes are 744s or 747adv.

Furthermore, he said that they were planning to announce the closure of the 747 production later this year, but do to strong interestest, they are keeping it open. The same goes for the 767 line. This line will stay open too.

Alan Mulally was also quoted to say the Adv has a "very, very good chance of proceeding." If the Adv will enter service at the end of 2008, Boeing will have to switch to Adv production by atleast mid-2007. That's only another 18-24 months of 744 backlog, and at the rate they are being produced (slowly), that's only one or two 744 orders from being secure.

It isn't an impossible task for Boeing to bridge production of these two aircraft nor a necessity to give them away at cost.


User currently offlineCXYYZ From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 18, posted (9 years 5 months 2 weeks 2 days 5 hours ago) and read 11693 times:

Quoting AeroPiggot (Reply 7):
Boeing board will only launch a new/derivative model, when they have enough orders to justify the expenditure of company resources

That statement has an inherent chicken/egg problem to it.

Boeing's board will only give final approval once there are enough orders, but they will give approval to sell (or however they word it) before that.


User currently offlineYUL332LX From Canada, joined Feb 2004, 820 posts, RR: 1
Reply 19, posted (9 years 5 months 2 weeks 2 days 5 hours ago) and read 11685 times:

747 Advanced launch slips

Boeing has pushed back its planned launch of the Boeing 747 Advanced from its previous mid-year target by several months, but remains confident that it will secure airline backing for the stretched aircraft.

http://www.flightinternational.com/A...042/747+Advanced+launch+slips.html



E volavo, volavo felice più in alto del sole, e ancora più su mentre il mondo pian piano spariva lontano laggiù ...
User currently offlineAither From South Korea, joined Oct 2004, 859 posts, RR: 0
Reply 20, posted (9 years 5 months 2 weeks 2 days 5 hours ago) and read 11387 times:

Who want to bet the launch customers will be the Japanese ?


Never trust the obvious
User currently offlineDfwRevolution From United States of America, joined Jan 2010, 997 posts, RR: 51
Reply 21, posted (9 years 5 months 2 weeks 2 days 5 hours ago) and read 11317 times:

Quoting Aither (Reply 20):
Who want to bet the launch customers will be the Japanese ?

Not me.

Stong indications are CX will be the first launch customer, with response in the Japanese markets rated to be lukewarm at best. NH have largely picked the 773ER/787 as the backbone of their future fleet, and JL isn't in a hurry to "trade-up" anytime soon.

They could come around in time, but not by the July-August launch that some sources indicate.


User currently offlineAtmx2000 From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 4576 posts, RR: 37
Reply 22, posted (9 years 5 months 2 weeks 2 days 4 hours ago) and read 11088 times:

Quoting DfwRevolution (Reply 21):
NH have largely picked the 773ER/787 as the backbone of their future fleet,

And they have been making noises about adding a lot of 773ERs to replace their larger widebodies.



ConcordeBoy is a twin supremacist!! He supports quadicide!!
User currently offlineJumbojet From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 1159 posts, RR: 0
Reply 23, posted (9 years 5 months 2 weeks 2 days 4 hours ago) and read 10740 times:

Quoting Trent900 (Reply 2):
IMO the 380 has much more potential.

how so? The 380 has limited potential due to its size and airport capabilities. Boeing, with no doubt tons of research, believes they can fill a lucrative market for the 747A which fits the needs of more airlines then the A380 ever will. Of course, I dont have a crystal ball, and only time will tell.


User currently offlineDIA From United States of America, joined Jan 2001, 3273 posts, RR: 27
Reply 24, posted (9 years 5 months 2 weeks 2 days 2 hours ago) and read 9855 times:

Even if not totally true yet. . .it will be. . .good news for airliner lovers around the world.

Airbus better start seriously considering coming out with the shortened version of the A380, or else Boeing will have that segment all to themselves.



Ding! You are now free to keep supporting Frontier.
25 BoeingBus : I dont see why Airbus has too... look, this is small piece of the pie when it comes to aircraft as a whole. Airbus created a new segment with the int
26 DIA : I agree completely. But I do think Boeing will sell more 747advs than Airbus will sell A380s, unless they shrink the Airbus giant. And, no, they don'
27 DfwRevolution : I doubt that is possible: #1. Weight- the A388 is built with growth variants in mind. One of the reasons the A388 is a bit heavy is that it's built w
28 Post contains images Freedom4all : Please change the topic title. I thought they launched it!!! Still that article seems like good news, I would say that it is pretty much certain that
29 Ken777 : I still believe that Boeing will go with the 747A and Airbus will not shrink the 380 for a long time. Shrinking the 380 looked like a good idea when i
30 Cloudy : That statement has an inherent chicken/egg problem to it. Boeing's board will only give final approval once there are enough orders, but they will giv
31 Monteycarlos : Why? Even Boeing says that this segment is not that big - forecasting a market for 400 planes I believe. When you think about it, it would make it ve
32 Atmx2000 : I wonder whether Airbus will build a family that spans the 350-500 pax range if the A346 continues to lose against the 773ER, or whether they will tr
33 Monteycarlos : Yeah I'm not too sure either - but the truth is that the A346 and 77W are just no comparison at all. The 77W economics and operations just kill the A
34 Atmx2000 : A further stretch of the A350 is likely going to need much more thrust than the current GEnx and Trent1000 engines will provide.
35 Monteycarlos : Yeah, I mean if you take the 77W it has a massive 115k lbs turbofan on it. For the A350 to be competitive it would need a thrust rating similar (mayb
36 Jush : LOL yeah
37 Lehpron : If/when Boeing's 747Adv is launched, what will it be called? 745X and 746X were taken, I suppose the 747Stretch could have bee the 747-700 and the 747
38 Monteycarlos : Lehpron, I am guessing 747-800... Both Airbus and Boeing are obsessed with 8's because they are a lucky Chinese number (i.e. orders from China). Who k
39 Post contains images Trent900 : You guys are quick today I do like to be optimistic for both side though. D.
40 NumberTwelve : Always the old comment. And here is mine: Better subsidiying civil planes than wars.
41 Post contains links AlanUK : BBC News seems to believe Boeing will launch its 747A: http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/business/default.stm Click on the "Fighting back: Boeing take on Air
42 DIA : Of course they did! They don't want to give out figures that would attract too much attention from Airbus! I'd say there is no market for the darn th
43 Atmx2000 : That's not true. It doesn't appear that there is a good path for Airbus to build a direct 744 and 747Adv challenger by creating a derivative of an ex
44 Monteycarlos : I take issue with that for one reason - Airbus completes the same studies as do many independant bodies so they would very quickly see through Boeing
45 PlaneSmart : Who do you think told the BBC? For a $2-3b project, there are 3 pre-requisites before you make a public launch - risk sharing partner/s, funding, 2-3
46 Zvezda : Airbus were having a tough time selling the A340-600 against the B777-300ER even before Airbus drove an A350 through the heart of their "4 engines 4
47 Pyxisnautica : An excellent question. I think Airbus has had the A380 in the works for far longer than most seem to realize. The whole project has always struck me
48 Post contains images DIA : wow. . .it is much too late at night for me to get into all this. . . Let's just say this: 1. Boeing is smart. 2. airbus probably won't offer a short
49 AirFrnt : More to the point, the A380 is designed to be extended in the future not shortened. This is part of the reason why the economics of the 747A are look
50 Monteycarlos : 100% whole heartedly agree! Again, agreement and as AirFrnt says it will if anything be extended. I didn't mean to shoot you down or tear you apart b
51 Post contains images Jacobin777 : it means "end of statement(s)" in an affirmative way..hope that helps..
52 Monteycarlos : Oh ok, like a way of saying "thats all I have to say" or something? Thanks.
53 Jacobin777 : yup..!
54 DarthRandall : My mother calls it her "special visitor." Of course it depends on just how efficient Boeing can make a 747, but, if they can make one that will be as
55 Post contains images Monteycarlos : LOL! I'm afraid there is nothing special about it!
56 Astuteman : Absolutely spot-on! IMHO A350/A340 fuse diameter does not compete above 300 seats - just look at A346. Option 3 sounds like the perfect way to assaul
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