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A380 & Emergency Landings  
User currently offlineRicardoFG From Spain, joined Feb 2005, 677 posts, RR: 0
Posted (9 years 4 weeks 20 hours ago) and read 3983 times:

In the unthinkable, yet enevitable event that an A380 will have to make a quick emergency landing for whatever reason, how are certain airports who cannot support the a380 for many reasons especially runway length going to deal, and how safe will it be to have to divert much further for the passengers on board?

Rgds from MP at YYZ!

16 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineGlom From United Kingdom, joined Apr 2005, 2815 posts, RR: 10
Reply 1, posted (9 years 4 weeks 20 hours ago) and read 3944 times:

It's quad so it'll be okay.

User currently offlineKL911 From Ireland, joined Jul 2003, 5114 posts, RR: 12
Reply 2, posted (9 years 4 weeks 20 hours ago) and read 3950 times:

Quoting RicardoFG (Thread starter):
In the unthinkable, yet enevitable event that an A380 will have to make a quick emergency landing for whatever reason, how are certain airports who cannot support the a380 for many reasons especially runway length going to deal, and how safe will it be to have to divert much further for the passengers on board?

Rgds from MP at YYZ!

It has been said before, the A380 uses LESS runway then the 747. Taxiways and gates are problems, but you don't need those in case or a real emergency.

KL911



Next trip : DUB-AUH-CGK-DPS-KUL-AUH-CDG-ORK :-)
User currently offlineNewark777 From United States of America, joined Dec 2004, 9348 posts, RR: 30
Reply 3, posted (9 years 4 weeks 20 hours ago) and read 3927 times:

I'm pretty sure it can be handled by many of the same airports that handle the 747, but taxiway width is the real big problem. Of course, in an emergency, you don't worry about the taxiways, and just get it on the ground. If it has any problems finding diversion airports, it would probably be some of the same problems the 747 has.

Harry



Why grab a Heine when you can grab a Busch?
User currently offlineBirdbrainz From United States of America, joined May 2005, 453 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (9 years 4 weeks 19 hours ago) and read 3832 times:

Speaking of runway required, how does the 380 achieve it's landing (and rejected take-off) performance with thrust reversers on the inboard engines only? Or am I mistaken and it has them on all four? I'd expect it to be compromised.


A good landing is one you can walk away from. A great landing is if the aircraft can be flown again.
User currently offlineNewark777 From United States of America, joined Dec 2004, 9348 posts, RR: 30
Reply 5, posted (9 years 4 weeks 18 hours ago) and read 3759 times:

Speaking of runway required, how does the 380 achieve it's landing (and rejected take-off) performance with thrust reversers on the inboard engines only? Or am I mistaken and it has them on all four? I'd expect it to be compromised.

On any airliner, the thrust reversers are not considered when deciding required runway length for landing. It is just thought of as extra, and is not part of the calculation.

Harry



Why grab a Heine when you can grab a Busch?
User currently offlineRedDragon From United Kingdom, joined Jul 2004, 1135 posts, RR: 7
Reply 6, posted (9 years 4 weeks 16 hours ago) and read 3606 times:

...And to confirm, reversers are indeed fitted to the inboard engines only. (Outboard reversers have been omitted due to FOD concerns, given that the engines will overhang the taxiway edge.)

Rich


User currently offlineKen777 From United States of America, joined Mar 2004, 8164 posts, RR: 8
Reply 7, posted (9 years 4 weeks 16 hours ago) and read 3569 times:

Medical emergencies will probably be the most frequent reason for an emergency landing and in these situations the pilot will be looking for the closest airport where medical facilities are available. A gate is very nice for this situation, but it can be handled without one.

The one time I was on a flight that made an emergency landing because of the plane was a QF 747 SYD-LAX via Fiji that immediately returned to SYD with no chance to dump fuel. Fortunately this was due to a faulty warning light for fire in #3 (and they did punch the bottle). This does raise the issue of a maxed out l3800 doing the same thing without time to dump fuel. I have no doubt that Airbus engineers have addressed this situation so it can be done safely.

For the 380 the real test will be if there is a need to carry out an emergency evacuation (and there probably will be a few over the life of the plane) and how well this is carried out with average pax.


User currently offline4xRuv From Israel, joined Dec 2003, 388 posts, RR: 2
Reply 8, posted (9 years 4 weeks 5 hours ago) and read 3342 times:

I remember reading on a thread here a couple of month ago, that when the emergency slides were tested, some people who slide from the second level (floor is for a buildings isn't it), broke their legs, or twisted their ankle
Does anybody know if this has really happened, and if so, how (or if) did they solve this issue?


User currently offlineRichardPrice From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 9, posted (9 years 4 weeks 4 hours ago) and read 3308 times:

Quoting Birdbrainz (Reply 4):
Speaking of runway required, how does the 380 achieve it's landing (and rejected take-off) performance with thrust reversers on the inboard engines only? Or am I mistaken and it has them on all four? I'd expect it to be compromised.

The A380 has more wheels than the 747 and thus it has more brakes and it has a lower approach speed. The larger mass generally helps it as well. Plus the engines are more powerful.

Quoting 4xRuv (Reply 8):
I remember reading on a thread here a couple of month ago, that when the emergency slides were tested, some people who slide from the second level (floor is for a buildings isn't it), broke their legs, or twisted their ankle

I didnt hear anything like that about the A380 slides, but I do know of injuries occuring from evacs of the upper deck of the 747 - pretty much exactly what you describe. Concorde was also prone to this.


User currently offlineFlyAUA From Austria, joined May 2005, 4604 posts, RR: 56
Reply 10, posted (9 years 4 weeks 4 hours ago) and read 3237 times:

Quoting 4xRuv (Reply 8):
I remember reading on a thread here a couple of month ago, that when the emergency slides were tested, some people who slide from the second level (floor is for a buildings isn't it), broke their legs, or twisted their ankle
Does anybody know if this has really happened, and if so, how (or if) did they solve this issue?

All a.net speculation... don't worry  Wink

The slides have a lower gradient closer to the bottom. The friction force (there was also a nice thread about synthetic clothes and emergency slides Big grin) will make sure you don't get off the slide with a too high velocity. Everything has been accounted for. The people who make emergency slides are not amateurs  Smile



Not drinking, also isn't a solution!
User currently offlineZRH From Switzerland, joined Nov 1999, 5566 posts, RR: 36
Reply 11, posted (9 years 4 weeks 3 hours ago) and read 3170 times:

Quoting RicardoFG (Thread starter):
especially runway length going to deal

As said, the 380 needs less runway lenght than the 747. For that at any airport where a 747, 777 or 340 can land, a 380 can land to.


User currently offlineAMSSFO From Netherlands, joined Feb 2005, 952 posts, RR: 10
Reply 12, posted (9 years 4 weeks 3 hours ago) and read 3070 times:

Quoting 4xRuv (Reply 8):
I remember reading on a thread here a couple of month ago, that when the emergency slides were tested, some people who slide from the second level (floor is for a buildings isn't it), broke their legs, or twisted their ankle
Does anybody know if this has really happened, and if so, how (or if) did they solve this issue?

This MIGHT happen when they do the test THIS summer....
What you read where expectations/wishes of some people on this forum.
It will work out well.


User currently offlineRichardPrice From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 13, posted (9 years 4 weeks 2 hours ago) and read 3048 times:

Quoting AMSSFO (Reply 12):
This MIGHT happen when they do the test THIS summer....
What you read where expectations/wishes of some people on this forum.
It will work out well.

I thought the A380 rating tests had already been done, and that included evacing the aircraft with slides?


User currently offlineLorM From United States of America, joined Jun 2004, 409 posts, RR: 1
Reply 14, posted (9 years 3 weeks 6 days 20 hours ago) and read 2863 times:

Quoting RichardPrice (Reply 9):

The A380 has more wheels than the 747 and thus it has more brakes and it has a lower approach speed. The larger mass generally helps it as well. Plus the engines are more powerful.

According to photos taken by A.Net photographers, and looking at two press photos that were released on the Airbus.com website it appears the A380 has the same number of wheels that are equipped with brakes as the 747.

Like the 747 the A380 employs a similar main landing gear configuration, with a two axle wing gear truck, and two body gear systems mounted aft of the wing gears.

BUT the A380's body gear system has a 3 axle bogie like the 777 and Tu-154. The difference is if you look carefully at the pictures, you will notice that the aft 3rd axle of the body gear truck does not have the disc brake pucks, pistons, pads, and the brake fans mounted on the hubs.

Here's the pictures taken directly off of the Airbus A380 website looking into the main body gear bay. Note the forward direction in these pictures is to the right of each picture. Looking at the far left of the pictures you don't see the brake discs (large round black cylinders), and the brake pistons like the other 2 axles have.

It looks like also what appears to be that the third axle also has a steering system hydraulic piston mounted to the topside of the bogie, which would explain the pivot (the white circle) and not being mounted to that silver brace that attaches to both forward axle brakes.



Airbus has a habit of putting brake fans on their demonstrators. You can see the brake fans mounted inside the hubs as the silver discs. Note the absence of the brake fan on the most aft axle on the body gear.


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Photo © French Frogs AirSlides
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Photo © Marlo Plate - Iberian Spotters



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Photo © Fabrice Sanchez - Brussels Aviation Photography



I'm wondering if this is just for the demonstrator that the 3rd axle isn't equipped with brakes or if the production versions will include brakes. Boeing's similar 3 axle bogie on the 777 has 3rd axle steering and brakes.



Brick Windows
User currently offlineSidewinder From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 15, posted (9 years 3 weeks 6 days 20 hours ago) and read 2795 times:

Quoting RichardPrice (Reply 9):
The A380 has more wheels than the 747 and thus it has more brakes and it has a lower approach speed. The larger mass generally helps it as well. Plus the engines are more powerful.

Does anyone know the v-speeds yet? Or at least Vso


User currently offlineOldAeroGuy From United States of America, joined Dec 2004, 3473 posts, RR: 67
Reply 16, posted (9 years 3 weeks 6 days 17 hours ago) and read 2714 times:

Quoting Newark777 (Reply 5):
On any airliner, the thrust reversers are not considered when deciding required runway length for landing. It is just thought of as extra, and is not part of the calculation.

True, but reverse thrust can come in mighty handy when landing on icy runways.



Airplane design is easy, the difficulty is getting them to fly - Barnes Wallis
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