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NW Quickly Drops IND-STL  
User currently offlineIndy From United States of America, joined Jan 2005, 4568 posts, RR: 18
Posted (9 years 3 months 1 week 4 days 21 hours ago) and read 5606 times:

This comes as absolutely no shock to me that NW is dropping the IND-STL route at the end of June. This route was advertised as being 3x daily. It quickly went to 2x daily and now it will be dropped at the end of this month. The route will have lasted 3 weeks. This comes as no shock to me as I have checked seat assignments and they have been pretty much empty. I'd guess that on average the load is 25%.

[Edited 2005-06-23 22:41:16]


Indy = Indianapolis and not Independence Air
53 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineSeptember11 From United States of America, joined May 2004, 3623 posts, RR: 21
Reply 1, posted (9 years 3 months 1 week 4 days 21 hours ago) and read 5570 times:

Quoting Indy (Thread starter):
now it will be dropped at the end of this money.

... end of this money ...  wink 

NW nonstop cities from STL:

MEM?
DTW?
MSP?

good enough for NW in STL, in my honest opinion.



Airliners.net of the Future
User currently onlineMaverickM11 From United States of America, joined Apr 2000, 17544 posts, RR: 46
Reply 2, posted (9 years 3 months 1 week 4 days 21 hours ago) and read 5558 times:

I think that goes for most of the rest of the non-hub NW flights out of MKE and IND as I've heard.


E pur si muove -Galileo
User currently offlineIndy From United States of America, joined Jan 2005, 4568 posts, RR: 18
Reply 3, posted (9 years 3 months 1 week 4 days 21 hours ago) and read 5554 times:

Good eye  Smile. I think I need you to type for me today. Having typing issues here. lol


Indy = Indianapolis and not Independence Air
User currently offlineIndy From United States of America, joined Jan 2005, 4568 posts, RR: 18
Reply 4, posted (9 years 3 months 1 week 4 days 21 hours ago) and read 5530 times:

Quoting MaverickM11 (Reply 2):
I think that goes for most of the rest of the non-hub NW flights out of MKE and IND as I've heard.

Other than STL which routes are bad? I've spot checked flights and they looked really good. God knows concourse A is always packed.



Indy = Indianapolis and not Independence Air
User currently offlineStl1326 From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 496 posts, RR: 0
Reply 5, posted (9 years 3 months 1 week 4 days 21 hours ago) and read 5525 times:

That is no surprise to me either. Who could afford to fly the route with fares averaging over $900 for such a short flight? I don't even know why they would have added this route in the first place. The O&D traffic on the route is horrible something like 50 daily passengers.

User currently offlineSeptember11 From United States of America, joined May 2004, 3623 posts, RR: 21
Reply 6, posted (9 years 3 months 1 week 4 days 21 hours ago) and read 5501 times:

Quoting MaverickM11 (Reply 2):
non-hub NW flights out of MKE

the old days! "mini-hub" look at 1988 MKE photo

 point 
View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Chris E. Novak



photo description:
Convair Heaven! The short-lived Northwest "mini-hub" at MKE featuring a trio of Convair 580's. N4811C is arriving as N2729R is moving out and N3423 is parked adjacent to a Northwest 757 N520US.

Quoting Indy (Reply 3):
Having typing issues here. lol

lol. I like to help people, that's why ...



Airliners.net of the Future
User currently offlineFedexexpress From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 284 posts, RR: 0
Reply 7, posted (9 years 3 months 1 week 4 days 21 hours ago) and read 5504 times:

Why not NWA IND to SFO????? Or IND to Portland Ore??????????


"Its not what your country can do for you its what you can do for your country" JFK
User currently offlineBHMNONREV From Australia, joined Aug 2003, 1375 posts, RR: 4
Reply 8, posted (9 years 3 months 1 week 4 days 21 hours ago) and read 5450 times:

Never understood why this route ever came to fruition in the first place. Shutting down after only 3 weeks confirms what most of here predicted in the first place.

On a related note, I would guess AA will go back to an AT7 or even a J41 on STL-IND, now that the competition has gone away...


User currently offlineERJ170 From United States of America, joined Apr 2004, 6771 posts, RR: 17
Reply 9, posted (9 years 3 months 1 week 4 days 21 hours ago) and read 5418 times:

How's IND-RDU doing?


Aiming High and going far..
User currently offlineIndy From United States of America, joined Jan 2005, 4568 posts, RR: 18
Reply 10, posted (9 years 3 months 1 week 4 days 21 hours ago) and read 5403 times:

IND-RDU looks good. Seems to be selling fine. Not sure how profitable it is.


Indy = Indianapolis and not Independence Air
User currently offlineLGAtoIND From United States of America, joined Jan 2005, 490 posts, RR: 1
Reply 11, posted (9 years 3 months 1 week 4 days 20 hours ago) and read 5340 times:

I've heard that NW is doing fabulous out of IND. Anyone who has recently been in Concourse A will know that it is usually packed. Also, every time I fly NW out of IND my flights are full or overbooked. I was thinking about non-reving from LGA-IND and heard that it is near impossible, especially on the weekends.

User currently offlineKarlB737 From United States of America, joined Mar 2004, 3108 posts, RR: 10
Reply 12, posted (9 years 3 months 1 week 4 days 20 hours ago) and read 5341 times:

Anybody now where the CV-580s are today? Or should I say which desert airfield............

User currently offlineTornado82 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 13, posted (9 years 3 months 1 week 4 days 20 hours ago) and read 5335 times:

Quoting BHMNONREV (Reply 8):

On a related note, I would guess AA will go back to an AT7 or even a J41 on STL-IND, now that the competition has gone away...

It already is a J41 at least on some times... my girlfriend is booked IND-STL-OKC and IND-STL is a J41.


User currently offlineBurnsie28 From United States of America, joined Aug 2004, 7547 posts, RR: 8
Reply 14, posted (9 years 3 months 1 week 4 days 17 hours ago) and read 5122 times:

IND loads (From IND) tomorrow June 24.
Flight Load Aircraft
IND-PHL
4794 26/44 CRJ
4796 25/44 CRJ
4798 43/44 CRJ

IND-LGA
146 3/16 & 69/84 DC-9-30
4777 35/44 CRJ
637 3/16 & 61/84 DC-9-30

IND-BOS
4784 43/44 CRJ
4786 40/44 CRJ

IND-BDL
4767 35/44 CRJ
4786 40/44 CRJ

IND-LAS
151 5/16 & 121/108 A319
153 1/16 & 116/108 A319

IND-SEA
1091 7/16 & 104/108 A319

IND-DEN
1937 3/16 & 110/108 A319

IND-MCO
822 3/16 & 90/84 DC-9-30
824 4/16 & 93/84 DC-9-30

IND-FLL
500 5/16 & 88/84 DC-9-30

IND-TPA
478 13/16 & 69/132 A320
1076 8/16 & 96/84 DC-9-30

IND-RSW
1228 4/16 & 90/84 DC-9-30

IND-RDU
4758 44/44 CRJ
4760 44/44 CRJ

IND-DFW
2983 43/44 CRJ
2985 43/44 CRJ
2979 30/44 CRJ

IND-AUS
4789 41/44 CRJ

IND-LAX
205 9/16 & 89/108 A319

IND-MEM
1873 13/16 & 103/109 DC-9-50
1589 1/16 & 74/84 DC-9-30
1877 16/16 & 114/108 A320

IND-MSP
395 11/16 & 133/132 A320
501 12/16 & 97/108 A319
497 15/16 & 83/84 DC-9-30
503 6/16 & 112/109 DC-9-50
505 2/16 & 92/94 DC-9-40
499 10/16 & 135/132 A320

IND-DTW
1102 6/16 & 113/109 DC-9-50
478 13/16 & 69/132 A320
3722 42/44 CRJ
1016 10/16 & 84/84 DC-9-30
656 15/16 & 81/84 DC-9-30
1008 16/16 & 76/84 DC-9-30
1004 20/22 & 146/162 757-200
838 4/16 & 95/84 DC-9-30

IND-DCA
4792 29/44 CRJ
4790 39/44 CRJ
1596 11/16 & 50/84 DC-9-30

IND-STL
2933 2/44 CRJ
2937 24/44 CRJ

From PARS.



"Some People Just Know How To Fly"- Best slogan ever, RIP NW 1926-2009
User currently offlineERJ170 From United States of America, joined Apr 2004, 6771 posts, RR: 17
Reply 15, posted (9 years 3 months 1 week 4 days 17 hours ago) and read 5077 times:

Quoting Burnsie28 (Reply 14):

IND-RDU
4758 44/44 CRJ
4760 44/44 CRJ

Wow! Shut up! Can we get a switch to the Avro for one of these flights, please?



Aiming High and going far..
User currently offlineRoseFlyer From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 9661 posts, RR: 52
Reply 16, posted (9 years 3 months 1 week 4 days 17 hours ago) and read 5070 times:

Thanks for the numbers. It looks like some of the flights are doing really well. I am not surprised at all that the business traffic destinations are not doing as well as some of the more leisure markets. But honestly, wouldn't it be fun to be on a CRJ with only two people? More staff than passengers.


If you have never designed an airplane part before, let the real designers do the work!
User currently offlineTornado82 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 17, posted (9 years 3 months 1 week 4 days 17 hours ago) and read 5028 times:

Quoting RoseFlyer (Reply 16):
But honestly, wouldn't it be fun to be on a CRJ with only two people? More staff than passengers.

The question is... can you get 2 bags of pretzels.. and the WHOLE can of pop??


User currently offlineMAH4546 From Sweden, joined Jan 2001, 32884 posts, RR: 71
Reply 18, posted (9 years 3 months 1 week 4 days 16 hours ago) and read 4997 times:

Quoting ERJ170 (Reply 15):
Wow! Shut up! Can we get a switch to the Avro for one of these flights, please?

Just because a flight fills up, doesn't mean you instantly upgrade it to a larger aircraft. If the RDU-IND flights are filling up and making money, which I'm sure they are, then unless adding more capacity would boost yields (which it likely wouldn't), there is no point. It wouldn't be wise of Northwest to dramaticlly increase seats on these routes unless there is a very obvious need (like when ATA dropped out of IND-LGA).

If anything, I think NW would add a third daily CRJ departure to better suit business travelers' needs.

[Edited 2005-06-24 03:50:33]


a.
User currently offlineSHUPirate1 From United States of America, joined Sep 2003, 3670 posts, RR: 17
Reply 19, posted (9 years 3 months 1 week 4 days 16 hours ago) and read 4945 times:

ERJ-There is also the part of one of the NW work groups' contracts that state any point-to-point flying must either be done by planes with 44 seats or less, or by mainline crews and metal. It's either the CRJ-440 or the DC-9-30 (or larger)


Burma's constitutional referendum options: A. Yes, B. Go to Insein Prison!
User currently offlineTornado82 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 20, posted (9 years 3 months 1 week 4 days 16 hours ago) and read 4936 times:

Quoting SHUPirate1 (Reply 19):
ERJ-There is also the part of one of the NW work groups' contracts that state any point-to-point flying must either be done by planes with 44 seats or less, or by mainline crews and metal. It's either the CRJ-440 or the DC-9-30 (or larger)

Don't they run normal CRJ-200's to PHL from IND?


User currently offlineOkie From United States of America, joined Jul 2003, 3064 posts, RR: 3
Reply 21, posted (9 years 3 months 1 week 4 days 16 hours ago) and read 4919 times:

Quoting BHMNONREV (Reply 8):
On a related note, I would guess AA will go back to an AT7 or even a J41 on STL-IND, now that the competition has gone away...

Yeah, but that ATR on the morning flight with about 45 minutes between flights on an OKC-STL-IND connection still beats the heck out of going through DFW in my opinion.

Interesting note TWA's IND-STL morning flight before AA was a 57 and they would be turning away passengers. AA's way of shifting routing through ORD & DFW to cut down loads to STL and add delays to ORD & DFW.

Okie


User currently offlineSHUPirate1 From United States of America, joined Sep 2003, 3670 posts, RR: 17
Reply 22, posted (9 years 3 months 1 week 4 days 16 hours ago) and read 4911 times:

Quoting Tornado82 (Reply 20):
Don't they run normal CRJ-200's to PHL from IND?

Nope...that is the CRJ-440.



Burma's constitutional referendum options: A. Yes, B. Go to Insein Prison!
User currently offlineERJ170 From United States of America, joined Apr 2004, 6771 posts, RR: 17
Reply 23, posted (9 years 3 months 1 week 4 days 16 hours ago) and read 4913 times:

Quoting SHUPirate1 (Reply 19):
It's either the CRJ-440 or the DC-9-30 (or larger)

DC930 would be too much, I think.. I'm just happy the route is doing well. IND was, for a long time, a decent count unserved destination. Glad NW jumped on it. Now if they could add a 1 daily to MKE on the CRJ. I think 1 daily will be a plenty. Perhaps it would tick off YX for dropping the route. (although it would be nice to see YX do RDU-MKE/MCI on Skywest again) LOL.. perhaps not. Oh well, one can wish for more service.

And please no flaming from anyone.. I"m just wishing upon a star!  praise 



Aiming High and going far..
User currently offlineIndy From United States of America, joined Jan 2005, 4568 posts, RR: 18
Reply 24, posted (9 years 3 months 1 week 4 days 16 hours ago) and read 4912 times:

Burnsie28... thanks for the numbers. Looks like NW has made some equipment changes. Based on the routes and equipment at http://www.nwa.com/features/newindservice/ it looks like they've upgraded...

LGA - 2 CRJ upgrades to DC9-30
TPA - 1 DC9-30 upgrade to A320
MEM - DC9 upgrade to A320
DCA - 1 CRJ upgrade to DC9-30

Drops
BOS - 1 CRJ dropped. Now 2x daily
BDL - 1 DC9-30 dropped. Now 1x daily
STL - Ending Service 6/30

For the most part very nice loads. While PHL is a bit low on a couple of the flights it is slowly picking up since the route started. It has to be a hard sell with US flying there and all the connections US offers from there.



Indy = Indianapolis and not Independence Air
25 Tornado82 : For awhile, they and US were in a bit of a fare-war. I saw them as low as $145 once. That seems to have subsided now as they're back up to around $22
26 Indy : I wonder if NW will try a single daily flight from IND to MKE on a CRJ? Isn't Midwest Connect the only airline flying that route?
27 Burnsie28 : Possibly in the future, I just took what PARS said for tomorrow then looked at the loads.
28 Blhp68 : Burnsie, What about the MCI-IND loads? Do you have those by chance?
29 Burnsie28 : MCI-IND for June 24 4769 39/44 2902 20/44 Also, Cancun only runs saturdays, so ill throw that one in since its operating right now, many of the other
30 LambertMan : STL-IND never even had a chance the way they priced it, I looked into flying it because I needed to go back to Bloomington for a day and it was just i
31 Indy : You are missing a flight. There are 3 daily departures to MCI. 4799, 4791, 4768 to MCI and 4786, 4769, 2902 from MCI.
32 MAH4546 : The IND-PBI and IND-SRQ flights are not in the schedule for next winter. I know it is early, but I point it out because the seasonal IND-CUN (IND-CUN
33 Post contains links Burnsie28 : Pars is only showing two flights non-stop MCI-IND tomorrow thats Flight 4769 and Flight 2902 which is odd that their official pax count and flight is
34 N200WN : Well even at WN's fares the IND-STL market wasn't strong...as WN went from 5 flights daily to dropping the route all together in '03. So I'm not surp
35 MAH4546 : This route has not seen a mainline jet since Southwest pulled out. AA is props and RJs.
36 Indy : Problem with that route in my opinion is that its a 4 hr 30 minute drive to STL from IND. If you do the 2 hours early nonsense and the hour flight you
37 Iowaman : As said, IND-STL is such a short route and so expensive why bother flying. I wonder if IND-SFO would work as a new route? I would think they wouldn't
38 Indy : If I had to put cities on a short list I think I would put PHX (95% sure it will be back), SFO, PDX and the less likely but possible routes would be M
39 MAH4546 : I think MKE/YYZ/PIT are much more likely than IND-PDX. I don't think that would happen. MEM doesn't even have PDX flights.
40 Indy : Isn't PDX the gateway city on the west coast? Or is that SEA?
41 MAH4546 : Northwest has a decent operation out of PDX with non-stops to MSP, PDX, HNL, DTW (which until recently was seasonal) and NRT. Though Seattle is a big
42 BOS2LAF : LOL now you cant even get any pretzels.
43 Eric777 : I don't think BDL-IND was ever dc9. -Eric
44 Tornado82 : There's already a few PIT-IND's on US... and pretty cheap too! It's surprising the traffic on that route, except for alot of Pittsburghers moved towa
45 Mtnmanmakalu : You've heard wrong- most of the flights are doing very well, I have been told, by the powers that be at NWA.... mtnman
46 Willbdsp : I fly that route often and it isn't always that cheap. Today, I'm flying IND to PIT on UA because it is close to $300 cheaper than US. The highest I'
47 Indy : $1000 14 days advance? Was it business class?
48 MaverickM11 : Just about everything that Pinnacle flies out of IND and MKE is awful with the possible exception of IND/RDU and IND/LGA.
49 Post contains images Burnsie28 : You dont read do you, STL is the only route that is doing poorly. PHL, BDL, RDU, LGA, BOS, AUS, DFW, DCA flights are pretty much full
50 Jetpixx : I would like to see CAK-IND or CLE-IND, only so I could connect there from FLL or PBI instead of DTW - but I am sure that is just not realistic. I wou
51 STLGph : ive looked for various dates ahead in the calendar and thus far AA is keeping their STL-IND ER runs. can anyone look and see what their load factors a
52 Ejmmsu : It would surprise me if IND got PDX service before MEM did.
53 MAH4546 : "the Asia flights"? NW offers a daily PDX-NRT flight, that's it. They also offer MSP-NRT, DTW-NRT, LAX-NRT, and SEA-NRT, so if IND passengers needs t
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