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Chartering A Flight From Europe  
User currently offlineAio86 From United States of America, joined Sep 2000, 928 posts, RR: 0
Posted (9 years 1 month 6 days 20 hours ago) and read 3242 times:

Hi everyone,

I’m working at my new job and we’re putting on an event in August where we need to get 60 people from Europe to Orange County, California and back. We were thinking it would be really cool and innovative if we put them on a charter flight. They would all be leaving from the same city in Europe (most likely AMS or CDG – or another city easily accessible by rail from the rest of the continent) and arriving into SNA, LGB or LAX (I know the latter is most likely).

So my question is how I go about arranging something like this. Is this group too small to charter a plane? Do all airlines offer this? What would a company charge for this service? How do I even get in contact with these people?

A couple carriers that came to mind were World Airways, with a decent concentration in LA and Dutch Martinair.

My boss really likes this charter idea, although I suggested it might be cheaper to buy a large block of seats on the same flight from KLM, Air France or another airline with a nonstop flight.

Let me know if you have any ideas.

Thanks!

-aio86

25 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineAa757first From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 3347 posts, RR: 8
Reply 1, posted (9 years 1 month 6 days 20 hours ago) and read 3211 times:

Quoting Aio86 (Thread starter):


A couple carriers that came to mind were World Airways, with a decent concentration in LA and Dutch Martinair.

World does a lot of military stuff. I think that is their primary interest. Try North American, they use some 767-300s. The problem is that you have so few people. If you had a 120 people or so, it would probobly be worth it. Delta Air Elite can get you an aircraft, too. Now maybe you could get a 757 from North American with a stop in JFK. That would make more economic sense. I was going to suggest PrivatAir, but their A319s only seat 47 people and the 757s only a tad more than that. I would go for the group purchase thing on Air France or American, something like that.

AAndrew


User currently offlineS12PPL From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 2, posted (9 years 1 month 6 days 20 hours ago) and read 3197 times:

My guess is 60 people from Europe is too small to charter a flight. The group is too large for a private jet, and too small to make a plane capable of that distance make sense. Also, taking into account that you can't land too large a plane at SNA because of obstructions and runway length. You can almost certainly get a group discount, however, on a flight from CDG or AMS. I don't think there are any airlines that don't offer a group ticket option.

[Edited 2005-06-25 00:23:05]

User currently offlinePipoA380 From Switzerland, joined May 2005, 1594 posts, RR: 51
Reply 3, posted (9 years 1 month 6 days 19 hours ago) and read 3182 times:
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You can get a private charter from Privatair in Geneva

Airbus A319 LR 48pax 870 km/h 541 MPH 4'200nm range
http://www.privatair.ch/_library/fleet/slideshow/a319-LR-48.swf
Boeing 757-200 49pax 850 km/h 528 MPH 4'000nm range
http://www.privatair.ch/_library/fleet/slideshow/b757.swf

You're gonna have to shoot a few away then. Otherwise there's the basic A319 for 126pax but the range is only 2000nm.

GVA-LAX is 5923 mi though, so it gets hard there. Keep us informed!

http://www.privatair.ch

Cheers, PipoA380



It's not about AIRBUS. it's not about BOEING. It's all about the beauty of FLYING.
User currently offlineAio86 From United States of America, joined Sep 2000, 928 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (9 years 1 month 6 days 19 hours ago) and read 3157 times:

What about a smaller plane, like a 737 or A32X, that could make a stop somewhere on the East coast?

Thanks for your ideas and input.


User currently offlineWjcandee From United States of America, joined Jun 2000, 5118 posts, RR: 22
Reply 5, posted (9 years 1 month 6 days 19 hours ago) and read 3147 times:

If it were I, I would investigate both options, because it only takes a few phone calls and folks would doubtless be interested in your business. I would also point out to you and your boss that, at least as of a few years ago, the major carriers are willing to offer significant FF perks (miles/status) to the folks who arrange transportation for big groups. Something to think about, but I'd get the information on all your options first. Then you can see what you've got.

I would call the following US charter carriers, or put in a request for a quote from their web site: ATA (737-800 and 757); North American (757); Miami Air (excellent reputation, 737); Omni (757), and Pace (737, 757, including a luxury 757). There are others like Planet and Transmeridien, but I think the ones I mentioned all have reputations for quality and reliability.

I would also contact the group departments at USAirways [probably first -- they're probably pretty aggressive right now and their international service is surprisingly good]; Delta, United, Northwest and American. Among the European carriers, I would call Virgin, Air France, British, KLM, Lufthansa, and see what they can offer you. So, with about 15 phone calls, you can have a terrific matrix of your options. Frankly, I would be interested to see what you can come up with; if you post it here, I'm sure it would be very interesting to us.

All the best,

Bill


User currently offlineWjcandee From United States of America, joined Jun 2000, 5118 posts, RR: 22
Reply 6, posted (9 years 1 month 6 days 19 hours ago) and read 3133 times:

Don't be shy about calling these people -- it's their JOB to help get business for their company, so they SHOULD be very receptive. If they aren't, I'd drop their boss a note. Indeed, I'd call rather than filling in a form because a call can answer some of your more basic questions about which airport is better to go from, what catering options are available, etc. Here is some helpful information to get you started:

Miami Air: Quote request form at http://www.miamiair.com/quote.asp or call Diane Clark at 305-876-3600.

Pace: http://www.paceairline.com/charter/quote.asp or call Fran Bassett at 336-776-4103

North American: Quote request form at http://www.northamericanair.com/charterusForm.asp or call Marketing Department at (718) 656-2650 between 8:30 am and 6:00 pm EST

Omni: just an email address: information@omniairintl.com

ATA: ATA Charter Sales call 1-317-282-4150 or fax 1-317-282-4164.


User currently offlineWhiteHatter From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 7, posted (9 years 1 month 6 days 18 hours ago) and read 3122 times:

Might be expensive if a US carrier is asked to do a pickup in Europe. Chartering locally could be more cost effective.

Titan Airways do a lot of specialist charter work with their 737 and 757 aircraft

http://www.titan-airways.com/

Privatair is another one, also Astraeus

http://www.flyastraeus.com/whereweflyto/index.asp?id=39

There is also a specialist charter agency who could quote you for the job, who use several airlines and operators

http://www.jetair.co.uk/


User currently offlineAvek00 From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 4336 posts, RR: 19
Reply 8, posted (9 years 1 month 6 days 18 hours ago) and read 3099 times:

Quoting Aio86 (Thread starter):
My boss really likes this charter idea, although I suggested it might be cheaper to buy a large block of seats on the same flight from KLM, Air France or another airline with a nonstop flight.

Your boss might like the charter idea, but you'll likely impress the top brass of the company more by arranging a block of deeply-discounted business class seats on a commercial carrier instead. Even under the best of circumstances, you simply will not get a charter flight to carry so few people over such a long distance at anything approaching a reasonable rate.



Live life to the fullest.
User currently offlinePetertenthije From Netherlands, joined Jul 2001, 3353 posts, RR: 12
Reply 9, posted (9 years 1 month 6 days 18 hours ago) and read 3088 times:

Would it have to be non-stop? Cause KLM Cityhopper charters out all their types for just these kinds of events. Although I am not sure if they also go outside Europe.

http://www.klmcityhopper.nl/e-charter/index_english.htm



Attamottamotta!
User currently offlineCopter808 From United States of America, joined Dec 2000, 1059 posts, RR: 0
Reply 10, posted (9 years 1 month 6 days 13 hours ago) and read 3029 times:

You might also try a block of seats on Continental. AMS or CDG to EWR, then on to LAX. You could also connect in Houston (IAH) instead of EWR if you wanted.

CO 47, a 757-400 originates in AMS, stops in EWR, then continues on to LAX.


User currently offlineWjcandee From United States of America, joined Jun 2000, 5118 posts, RR: 22
Reply 11, posted (9 years 1 month 5 days 18 hours ago) and read 2899 times:

Two other thoughts: First, as you note, KLM has nonstop 747 service to LAX, which is nice and convenient. Second, it is certainly true that sending an American carrier to pick them up would appear to require a costly postioning move. However -- and here's why you should just make all the calls and get quotes from multiple carriers, using firm or close-to-firm dates -- you can get a major break in price if the carrier happens to plan to have an aircraft already over there waiting for a group or ready to ferry back. If ATA has used a 757 to drop some military folks off in Frankfurt, for example, and was planning on ferrying back empty to IND, you could end up with a favorable rate for your trip to LAX.

All the best,

Bill


User currently offlineClipperNo1 From Germany, joined May 1999, 672 posts, RR: 2
Reply 12, posted (9 years 1 month 5 days 12 hours ago) and read 2854 times:

For all Your charter needs: Chapman Freeborn !
Kind Regards



"I really don't know one plane from the other. To me they are just marginal costs with wings."� Alfred Kahn, 1977
User currently offlineB757capt From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 1366 posts, RR: 0
Reply 13, posted (9 years 1 month 5 days 7 hours ago) and read 2803 times:

Bill Lee is who you want to talk to at Pace Airlines 336-776-4104.

Or

You can contact Judy Tull at 843-916-4600 Judy is from Hooters Air.

[Edited 2005-06-26 13:21:41]


The views written by this user are in no manner the views of my employer and should not be thought as such.
User currently offlineMH017 From Netherlands, joined Apr 2005, 1684 posts, RR: 31
Reply 14, posted (9 years 1 month 5 days ago) and read 2721 times:

Petertenthije,

KLM cityhopper cannot operate to/from the USA, as it's not covered by their AOC, although it would have been a fantastic routing (via Iceland, Canada to the US  Smile



don't throw away tomorrow !
User currently offlineAio86 From United States of America, joined Sep 2000, 928 posts, RR: 0
Reply 15, posted (9 years 1 month 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 2610 times:

Thanks for your input everyone. If you have any other ideas, please let me know.

aio86


User currently offlineLegacy135 From Switzerland, joined May 2005, 1052 posts, RR: 26
Reply 16, posted (9 years 1 month 2 days 14 hours ago) and read 2564 times:

PipoA380 is absolutely right with his suggestion for Privatair. Imagine the cost that will result, if you take an American carrier who sends the plane over first from the US and once the mission is complete, the plane needs to ferry back. You will pay it twice. You also need to consider that the traditional European charter companies have their fleets contracted with tour operators and we are just heading in the European vacation period. Privatair is the specialist for flights as you are looking for. They might offer you a BBJ with an arrangement to take this load or their 757. Jet Aviation is running a DC-8-72 in the charter market but as far as I remember it has a VIP interior that does not accomondate that many people you are looking for.

User currently offlineC172 From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 109 posts, RR: 0
Reply 17, posted (9 years 1 month 2 days 9 hours ago) and read 2525 times:

How about you charter 5 Gulftstream jets? 5 flights of 12 passengers. Everyone would be comfy! Nonstop in style!

User currently offlineLegacy135 From Switzerland, joined May 2005, 1052 posts, RR: 26
Reply 18, posted (9 years 1 month 2 days 9 hours ago) and read 2513 times:

Quoting C172 (Reply 17):
How about you charter 5 Gulftstream jets? 5 flights of 12 passengers. Everyone would be comfy! Nonstop in style!

 Wink Do you have an idea how much it will cost you to charter 5 Gulfstreams for this trip? It just matters how much you want to spend for this stylish trip but be aware that it will be starting with discount offers of about 170'000 $ per aircraft, but most operators will be more expensive.


User currently offlineC172 From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 109 posts, RR: 0
Reply 19, posted (9 years 1 month 2 days 8 hours ago) and read 2510 times:

Quoting Legacy135 (Reply 18):
Do you have an idea how much it will cost you to charter 5 Gulfstreams for this trip?

It would be ~$15,000 per person. I'm not sure how important these people are.


User currently offlineLegacy135 From Switzerland, joined May 2005, 1052 posts, RR: 26
Reply 20, posted (9 years 1 month 2 days 8 hours ago) and read 2493 times:

Quoting C172 (Reply 19):
Quoting Legacy135 (Reply 18):
Do you have an idea how much it will cost you to charter 5 Gulfstreams for this trip?

It would be ~$15,000 per person. I'm not sure how important these people are.

Sure, there are people money doesn't matter. Just be aware, if they are real important, this 15'000 $ solution is an old GIII not really offering the greatest comfort if you are 12 people as a couple of them needs to seat on a divan or around a table. There will also be a fuel stop. If you are going to look at G V's or Global Expresses it can easily double the prices. What often happens then, is the chairman in the G V and the other guy's on airlines, flying business or first class, as it's simply much more cost efficient.


User currently offlineMACDADDY From United Kingdom, joined Jul 2004, 174 posts, RR: 0
Reply 21, posted (9 years 1 month 2 days 5 hours ago) and read 2424 times:

www.aircharter.co.uk
matthew.purton@aircharter.co.uk

email for a quote. Its my job!

It is gonna cost a very high figure to charter. But we'd still be cheeper than Chapman Freeborn !

MAC



www.plane-sight-images.photoshelter.com
User currently offlineZSOFN From United Kingdom, joined Jun 2005, 1413 posts, RR: 6
Reply 22, posted (9 years 1 month 2 days 5 hours ago) and read 2407 times:

PrivatAir's BBJ2 seats 56 - it's close. Might need an east coast tech stop though

User currently offlineWjcandee From United States of America, joined Jun 2000, 5118 posts, RR: 22
Reply 23, posted (9 years 3 weeks 6 days 16 hours ago) and read 2306 times:

SO --- what ever happened?

User currently offlinePlaneSmart From New Zealand, joined Dec 2004, 871 posts, RR: 0
Reply 24, posted (9 years 3 weeks 6 days 15 hours ago) and read 2293 times:

Quoting Avek00 (Reply 8):
Even under the best of circumstances, you simply will not get a charter flight to carry so few people over such a long distance at anything approaching a reasonable rate.

And even if you were to charter locally, there will be an aircraft sitting on the ground for the duration of your event (OK if only a day or less).

You could try A & B. A delivery flight one way, and a traded or expired lease aircraft in the opposite direction. For 60 passengers, the red tape might just make it too hard.

Personally i would go for the deep discount with add-ons.


User currently offlinePWM2TXLHopper From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 1321 posts, RR: 1
Reply 25, posted (9 years 3 weeks 6 days 14 hours ago) and read 2263 times:

You could call Primaris, I'm sure they are looking for some fast cash to get off the ground! hehe Seriously though, its worth a shot if your serious. I think their 757s are configured in all business class as well.

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