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New Airbus Boss Calls For A320 Output Boost  
User currently offlineKeesje From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Posted (9 years 4 months 3 weeks 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 6637 times:



"We have not yet decided to launch a successor to the A320, which, I would remind you, is selling very well and for which we need to increase our production from 25 to more than 30 a month,"

That is 360 narrowbodies per year.


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IMO there is no need for A to invest in a succesor. Boeing indicated they will not invest in such an aircraft before 2010. A continuation of the step by step modifications seems sufficient ATM.

http://today.reuters.co.uk/news/news...660_RTRUKOC_0_TRANSPORT-AIRBUS.xml

83 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineBill142 From Australia, joined Aug 2004, 8463 posts, RR: 8
Reply 1, posted (9 years 4 months 3 weeks 2 days 18 hours ago) and read 6520 times:

Yes but A probably want to be first to Market with a new narrowbody jet. So initial planing will probably need to be done sooner rather than later.

User currently offlineFlyAUA From Austria, joined May 2005, 4604 posts, RR: 56
Reply 2, posted (9 years 4 months 3 weeks 2 days 18 hours ago) and read 6511 times:

Quoting Keesje (Thread starter):
IMO there is no need for A to invest in a succesor. Boeing indicated they will not invest in such an aircraft before 2010. A continuation of the step by step modifications seems sufficient ATM.

I agree. Airbus' latest version of the A320 family and Boeing's latest B737NG aircraft are doing very well. Airlines do not seem to be moaning about them so why fix something that isn't wrong?

Good to see they will be boosting production. I also heard something about the A320 line being moved to the rest of the A318, A319 & A321 line. Is this true or pure rumours? Also, airbus has confirmed the A350 line will be located in Toulouse with the rest of the widebody lines. I saw the latter on RTL news this morning.

Quoting Bill142 (Reply 1):
Yes but A probably want to be first to Market with a new narrowbody jet. So initial planing will probably need to be done sooner rather than later.

I am sure they already have quite a few ideas in mind. Why go public with them so early though?  Wink



Not drinking, also isn't a solution!
User currently offline777ER From New Zealand, joined Dec 2003, 12265 posts, RR: 18
Reply 3, posted (9 years 4 months 3 weeks 2 days 12 hours ago) and read 6354 times:
AIRLINERS.NET CREW
FORUM MODERATOR

A320s are still selling like hot cakes and the technology in them is still 'state of the art', just like the B737NGs is still selling like hot cakes. There is totally no need to launch a replacement model. Once the B787 and A350s are handed over to their first customers then yes it will be time to replace the A320s and B737NGs due to the new technology

User currently offlineDfwRevolution From United States of America, joined Jan 2010, 997 posts, RR: 51
Reply 4, posted (9 years 4 months 3 weeks 2 days 12 hours ago) and read 6345 times:

>> A320s are still selling like hot cakes and the technology in them is still 'state of the art', just like the B737NGs is still selling like hot cakes

That is hardly true anymore: by the time the A350 and 787 enter service, the A320 and 737NG will be well obsolete. They are dated as it is, there simply exist no more modern product, so it's a zero sum game. There isn't anything cutting-edge when a product has been in production for more than 15 years  Wink

>> There is totally no need to launch a replacement model.

That depends on when the first manufacture, and first airline, wants to jump. As you said, the A350/787 EOS window would be an approx. time for customers to start looking around... and I don't think anyone expected a new product before then anyway...

>> Yes but A probably want to be first to Market with a new narrowbody jet. So initial planing will probably need to be done sooner rather than later.

I would disagree with two letters: Y1. Boeing has had a road-map for their future family for some time, and I think other indications would point to Boeing moving first.

#1. Boeing has mentioned a 737NG replacement more frequently. They havn't specified anything, but I think this shows that it's a more pressing matter in their camp.

#2. A huge bulk of options, purchase rights, etc terminate in 2012 whether they were signed in 2004 or 1998. Deliveries are planned past this date (namely AA, FR for sure), but if WN doesn't extend their options past 2012, I think the writing is on the wall.

#3. Southwest Airlines is going to be a star-gate on this project, big suprise. Their 733 fleet will, by 2012-2015-ish be ready for bulk replacement. Some early builds will require replacement near-term, but does anyone expect WN to replace the bulk of their 733 with current generation airplanes?

#4. Does Airbus have any number of factors that would combine to pressure them to take the greater risk of launching first? I can't see any that would demand they go first, so it would naturally behoove them to "wait and see" to attempt a one-up on Boeing.

>> That is 360 narrowbodies per year.

I read on Yahoo! Orders that Airbus calcuates deliveries based on an 11-month year? Anyone else have details, because otherwise Airbus would *actually* produce 330 NBs...


User currently offlineHAWK21M From India, joined Jan 2001, 31692 posts, RR: 56
Reply 5, posted (9 years 4 months 3 weeks 2 days 12 hours ago) and read 6318 times:

Quoting Keesje (Thread starter):
"We have not yet decided to launch a successor to the A320, which, I would remind you, is selling very well and for which we need to increase our production from 25 to more than 30 a month,"

Out here the A320s & the B737NGs are doing very well.In fact a Bigger tilt in Favour of the A320 orders from Indian Operators.

A Production Increase is Welcomed.
regds
MEL



Think of the brighter side!
User currently offlineAdria From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 6, posted (9 years 4 months 3 weeks 2 days 11 hours ago) and read 6248 times:

Quoting DfwRevolution (Reply 4):
That is hardly true anymore: by the time the A350 and 787 enter service, the A320 and 737NG will be well obsolete. They are dated as it is, there simply exist no more modern product, so it's a zero sum game. There isn't anything cutting-edge when a product has been in production for more than 15 years

It's the airliners not the cars

Quoting DfwRevolution (Reply 4):
#1. Boeing has mentioned a 737NG replacement more frequently. They havn't specified anything, but I think this shows that it's a more pressing matter in their camp.

.....and they have also talked about the Sonic cruiser a lot and where is it now?


User currently offlinePM From Germany, joined Feb 2005, 6955 posts, RR: 63
Reply 7, posted (9 years 4 months 3 weeks 2 days 10 hours ago) and read 6205 times:

Quoting Bill142 (Reply 1):
Yes but A probably want to be first to Market with a new narrowbody jet.

They were "first to market" with the A345/A346 and much good it did them!


User currently offlineTS-IOR From Tunisia, joined Oct 2001, 3489 posts, RR: 6
Reply 8, posted (9 years 4 months 3 weeks 2 days 10 hours ago) and read 6172 times:

The A32X and B73S families remind me of the Volkswagen's Polo and Golf models  Wink Old brands, new conceptions !!!

User currently offlineMark_D. From Canada, joined Aug 2001, 1447 posts, RR: 5
Reply 9, posted (9 years 4 months 3 weeks 2 days 10 hours ago) and read 6145 times:

The A32Xs probably are getting a bit long in the tooth --especially if basically all-composite-hulled airliners are in fact about to hit the market in the next few years or so, as the 787 program initmates. I guess though with this current Airbus PR blurb they're maybe just trying to deflect speculation away from anything but their current major concerns, the 380 and 350.

Given how many times the A350 saga has shucked and jivved so far though I sure wouldn't be surprised if their comments about the A32X line change similarly as time goes on, particularly starting in about two years from now when hopefully the A380 at least is very much a done deal and airlines and passengers like it and so on.


User currently offlineAdria From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 10, posted (9 years 4 months 3 weeks 2 days 9 hours ago) and read 6108 times:

Quoting Mark_D. (Reply 9):
The A32Xs probably are getting a bit long in the tooth --especially if basically all-composite-hulled airliners are in fact about to hit the market in the next few years or so, as the 787 program initmates. I guess though with this current Airbus PR blurb they're maybe just trying to deflect speculation away from anything but their current major concerns, the 380 and 350.

but the same goes for the 737NG so no need to make a new aircraft if it is selling so good as it is. The 30 aircraft per month production rate is a sign that the A320 family is far from being replaced


User currently offlineTheSonntag From Germany, joined Jun 2005, 3675 posts, RR: 29
Reply 11, posted (9 years 4 months 3 weeks 2 days 6 hours ago) and read 5897 times:

One thing is for sure, the A320 and the 737 successors are so crucial and important, that neither manufacturer can afford to have an inferior product. The 737NG and the A320 are equal on almost all points, the A320 having a more modern cockpit design and FBW, the 737NG having a better wing, costs are almost the same.

Even though they do not want to lose that market, Airbus can survive even if an A350 would be inferior to the 787, but neither Boeing nor Airbus can afford having an inferior product in the A320/737 class.

Therefore I expect both the A320 and the 737 successors to be available at the same time, so both get the same kind of engines.

But I already look forward to A vs B in Airliners.net in 2012. I will guess both products will be almost equal, but lets wait and see.


User currently offlineFlyAUA From Austria, joined May 2005, 4604 posts, RR: 56
Reply 12, posted (9 years 4 months 3 weeks 2 days 5 hours ago) and read 5808 times:

Quoting DfwRevolution (Reply 4):
That is hardly true anymore: by the time the A350 and 787 enter service, the A320 and 737NG will be well obsolete. They are dated as it is, there simply exist no more modern product, so it's a zero sum game. There isn't anything cutting-edge when a product has been in production for more than 15 years

The A320/B737 and A350/B787 are completely different markets. They will not impact eachothers markets as much you have mentioned. They have different capacities, ranges, etc... I can only see this happening if airlines wish to operate less thin routes (which I doubt). There will always be need for low-medium capacity aircraft. The latter is too large.

Quoting DfwRevolution (Reply 4):
That depends on when the first manufacture, and first airline, wants to jump. As you said, the A350/787 EOS window would be an approx. time for customers to start looking around... and I don't think anyone expected a new product before then anyway...

True  thumbsup 

Quoting PM (Reply 7):
They were "first to market" with the A345/A346 and much good it did them!

Yeah silly! Let's hope history doesn't repeat itself. Then again there was the Sonic Cruiser. Also a dodgy story!



Not drinking, also isn't a solution!
User currently offlineEBJ1248650 From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 1932 posts, RR: 1
Reply 13, posted (9 years 4 months 3 weeks 2 days 4 hours ago) and read 5605 times:

My guess is that Boeing will be the first with a new narrow body airplane. A friend of mine in Germany told me that Boeings are considered much too heavy and the design is too old. If this reflects what many Europeans in the aviation industry there actually think, it follows that they probably expect Boeing to make a move to get a replacement for the 737 on the drawing board as soon as the 787 has been well established on the production line. The 737 is a good airplane. Don't get me wrong. But a new design would be welcomed by the airlines; something that reflects the current state of the art in aerospace engineering. Will the Europeans rush to produce a competitor to the 737 replacement? Most likely they will, but I suspect it's apt to be an upgrade of the current A320 family of airplanes rather than a whole new design.


Dare to dream; dream big!
User currently offlinePM From Germany, joined Feb 2005, 6955 posts, RR: 63
Reply 14, posted (9 years 4 months 3 weeks 2 days 4 hours ago) and read 5573 times:

Quoting EBJ1248650 (Reply 13):
Most likely they will, but I suspect it's apt to be an upgrade of the current A320 family of airplanes rather than a whole new design.

A recent item in FLIGHT showed what looked like a very familiar A320 body but on very different wings and with completely new engines. I guess that apart from different meterials (to reduce weight, improve durability and so on) there isn't much you can do with a basic fuselage (which is why the 737NG still 'looks' like a 737) but new wings, engines and so on are where the future lies.


User currently offlinePANAM_DC10 From Australia, joined Aug 2000, 4211 posts, RR: 89
Reply 15, posted (9 years 4 months 3 weeks 2 days 4 hours ago) and read 5549 times:
AIRLINERS.NET CREW
COMMUNITY MANAGER

Quoting PM (Reply 7):
Quoting Bill142 (Reply 1):
Yes but A probably want to be first to Market with a new narrowbody jet.

They were "first to market" with the A345/A346 and much good it did them!

From Flight International Edition week ending June 1st 1985

Boeing, McDonell Douglas and Airbus do not quite mean the same thing when they talk about the Advanced Technology Airliner. Again, this covers the 100 - 160 seat category market only.

McDonnell Douglas: "Improved performance without the cost of technological change just for change's sake" That is the marketing message on which MDC sells it's MD-80 Series today. Airlines are buying MDC's airplanes which presumably means they buy the argument. The MDC sales philosophy suggests that a further advance in technology is available, but MDC has made a deliberate decision not to go for it because of cost. The A320 is what MDC is talking about when it refers to "technological change for change's sake"

Boeing:Boeing's 737-300 is selling faster than any other airliner on the market today, and the manufacturers sales message is similar to MDC's. "Boeing has chosen not to respond immediately because the market has been slow to develop" says Joe Sutter, BCAG's Executive Vice President. The company says that it has made a positive decision to ply the market with derivative airplanes, and only to set out on the costly path of developing brand new products when the market is unmistakeably there.

MDC and Boeing are making profits on their MD-80 Series and 737-300 respectively, both of which have now sold more than 1000 machines. Has Airbus got the better binoculars?

Airbus:Theoretically, the A320 has one considerable advantage as a new-technology product: it will be available first, and the company will gain much if the worldwide airline business continues to recover and carriers decide that re-equipment can wait no longer. But to take full advanage of being "first with 3rd generation" it must convince customers that the technology it offers in the A320 represents a significant advance over the MD-80 Series and 737-300


Airbus, first to the market and look where it got them  Wink

Regards

PANAM_DC10



Ask the impossible to achieve the best possible
User currently offlineAZA330 From Italy, joined Feb 2004, 289 posts, RR: 0
Reply 16, posted (9 years 4 months 3 weeks 2 days 4 hours ago) and read 5537 times:

There are more than just Airbus and Boeing making aircrafts like the A320 and the 737, so I was wondering if these other companies could take advantage from A and B "waiting" a few more years before developing the next version of these airplanes...

User currently offlineN1120A From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 26691 posts, RR: 75
Reply 17, posted (9 years 4 months 3 weeks 2 days 4 hours ago) and read 5494 times:

Quoting DfwRevolution (Reply 4):
Some early builds will require replacement near-term,

Which is why WN has more 73Gs coming anyway

Quoting DfwRevolution (Reply 4):
but does anyone expect WN to replace the bulk of their 733 with current generation airplanes?

Not at all. I am betting most of their options for 73Gs get turned into 737NNG and possibly 739X.

Quoting PM (Reply 7):
They were "first to market" with the A345/A346 and much good it did them!

Well, start with an inferior product and you will make an inferior evolution

Quoting Adria (Reply 10):
The 30 aircraft per month production rate is a sign that the A320 family is far from being replaced

Actually, I think it is possibly that the production increse may be a sign that they want to wrap up production. There is a rather healthy backlog of narrowbody aircraft at both Airbus and Boeing and if they are looking at a 2012-2013 EIS for their new narrowbodies, they may want to flesh out near-term needs at airlines now and allow themselves more wiggle room to ramp up production on the new planes.

Quoting FlyAUA (Reply 12):
Then again there was the Sonic Cruiser.

I think that design study came out quite well if you ask me. It turned into the 787

Quoting EBJ1248650 (Reply 13):
that Boeings are considered much too heavy and the design is too old.

Well, considering they are lighter in basically every case than their Airbus counterpart, that is false logic.



Mangeons les French fries, mais surtout pratiquons avec fierte le French kiss
User currently offlineJDD1 From United Kingdom, joined Jan 2005, 94 posts, RR: 2
Reply 18, posted (9 years 4 months 3 weeks 2 days 3 hours ago) and read 5337 times:

AZA330 There are more than just Airbus and Boeing making aircrafts like the A320 and the 737, so I was wondering if these other companies could take advantage from A and B "waiting" a few more years before developing the next version of these airplanes...

I think there is a risk, as you described, for A and B. Other countries such as Japan, China and Russia, in addition to Brazil and Canada, are just waiting for the opportunity. Japan and China have already proved that they can meet the technology and quality standards, that the world has come to expect, in cars and electronics. And they have stated that an aircraft industry is a strategic necessity.
It is a question of time.


User currently offlineKen777 From United States of America, joined Mar 2004, 8414 posts, RR: 9
Reply 19, posted (9 years 4 months 3 weeks 2 days 3 hours ago) and read 5285 times:

I'm just Pax that loves planes, but I find it hard to believe that both A & B are not working on the next generation now at some level.

B would be out of their minds not to be transferring transferring knowledge from the 787 program to a 73E program as the knowledge is gained. I'm not talking about a huge engineering team at B, but a well rounded group of very good engineers. I believe that the 73E is gaining shape as the 787 advances to production.

I also believe A is aware (or understands) what B is probably doing and they have a team working on a 32E program, pulling lessons from the 350 program that has been increased in scope over the past year.

As development resources are freed from the 787/350 programs they will be added to the 73E/32E programs at some levels. Same with working with suppliers.

The fact is that both would be nuts not to be paying some attention to the next generation single aisle planes. A very big lesson was learned when Airbus got caught with their pants down on the 787 announcement, and Boeing learned how nice it was to catch them with their pants down. Both want to avoid A's position and both want to be in B's position.


User currently offlineFlyAUA From Austria, joined May 2005, 4604 posts, RR: 56
Reply 20, posted (9 years 4 months 3 weeks 2 days 3 hours ago) and read 5234 times:

Quoting N1120A (Reply 17):
I think that design study came out quite well if you ask me. It turned into the 787

If it came out well, why did nobody buy any of them and why did it never happen? I really doubt the sonic cruiser has anything to do with the dreamliner.

Quoting AZA330 (Reply 16):
There are more than just Airbus and Boeing making aircrafts like the A320 and the 737, so I was wondering if these other companies could take advantage from A and B "waiting" a few more years before developing the next version of these airplanes...

Isn't that what Embraer did with the 170, 175, and 190? You've got a very valid point and I don't believe for a second that they haven't taken advantage (or started to do so now) of the A & B delay in developing these aircraft.



Not drinking, also isn't a solution!
User currently offlineKeesje From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 21, posted (9 years 4 months 3 weeks 2 days 3 hours ago) and read 5201 times:

Quoting N1120A (Reply 17):
Then again there was the Sonic Cruiser.

I think that design study came out quite well if you ask me. It turned into the 787

 Yeah sure

Other people think Boeing got it totally wrong & decided to build a plastic 330 instead when the airlines informed them.

However I think Boeing took the right decision. They responded to the A320 twice, first with the 737-300/400 and later on with the NG.

Some technology on the 737NG is state of the art. Some technology is 40 years old.

I think upgrade potential for the A320 series is more realistic then for the 737NG. If A decides to go for a A320NG, Boeing will have to respond with a new design.


User currently offlineAdria From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 22, posted (9 years 4 months 3 weeks 2 days 2 hours ago) and read 5092 times:

Quoting N1120A (Reply 17):
Actually, I think it is possibly that the production increse may be a sign that they want to wrap up production. There is a rather healthy backlog of narrowbody aircraft at both Airbus and Boeing and if they are looking at a 2012-2013 EIS for their new narrowbodies, they may want to flesh out near-term needs at airlines now and allow themselves more wiggle room to ramp up production on the new planes.

could be true and if so there are still 7 or 8 years to come and that is a long period.

Quoting Ken777 (Reply 19):
The fact is that both would be nuts not to be paying some attention to the next generation single aisle planes. A very big lesson was learned when Airbus got caught with their pants down on the 787 announcement, and Boeing learned how nice it was to catch them with their pants down. Both want to avoid A's position and both want to be in B's position.

The 787 announcement was not a big surprise for the aviation industry, so if we connect your statement to the A380/B747Adv then Airbus caught them "with pants down"


User currently offlineFCKC From France, joined Nov 2004, 2348 posts, RR: 4
Reply 23, posted (9 years 4 months 3 weeks 2 days ago) and read 4651 times:

Already A and B have asked Snecma to work on a very very efficient engine for their new narrow bodies to come.
I remember some months ago to have read in a thread , here , in A.Net , that Boeing was thinking at a Twin Aisle plane to replace 737NGs , being pushed by Southwest , which prefers this kind of plane to be quicker at the desembarking that passengers will appreciate very much , and thus winning time on each turn around ,of course if they can have two jetways each time.
I must say , it's a bit long to desembark an A321 right now.
Any fresh news about that ?


User currently offlineBeauing From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 24, posted (9 years 4 months 3 weeks 2 days ago) and read 4573 times:

Quoting FlyAUA (Reply 12):

Yeah silly! Let's hope history doesn't repeat itself. Then again there was the Sonic Cruiser. Also a dodgy story!

And then there was the "A330 Lite" from Airbus

Airbus may try to recertify its A330-220 for lighter loads and shorter distances — a move that would save airlines money — to compete with Boeing's new 7E7 Dreamliner.

The fuselage of the plane would remain unchanged, though some modifications might be made to save weight, such as removing galleys.

http://archives.seattletimes.nwsourc...s+at+offering+%27lite%27+A330+


Remove the galleys? That's not only dogey, that's pathetic...


25 Post contains images Adria : But from that one the A350 (the one that made the big orders lately ) was developed and what happened with the sonic cruiser? Or do you think that th
26 Mark_D. : Adria-- but the same goes for the 737NG so no need to make a new aircraft if it is selling so good as it is. The 30 aircraft per month production rate
27 Post contains links and images Jacobin777 : the Sonic Cruise had and a good response initially (especially with BA), but then the dot.com/stock market implosion and 9/11 occured, with that, the
28 Beauing : Boeing dropped the Sonic Cruiser in favor of the 787 because airlines showed more interest in the 787 design. Airbus dropped the A330 Lite in favor o
29 Post contains links DCrawley : I disagree with this statement. While I remain neutral in the A vs B debacle, I must say that Boeing was far from "being caught with their pants down
30 Mark_D. : Beaung-- The 787 has made FAR bigger orders than the A350. It's had about a year headstart so it better. And even there so much of the 787 interest is
31 Beauing : One could say the same things about the A350...
32 Post contains images Mark_D. : Beauing-- One could say the same things about the A350... Oh sure, just likely not as emphatically (at least not at this point anyway)
33 Beauing : I would disagree. Boeing has a reputation of meeting or exceeding their performance targets. Look at the 777 vs the A340.
34 Mark_D. : Picking those two particular examples, Beauing, I'd agree with you. However the recent sorry exhibition from them over the 'Sonic Cruiser' which prove
35 Post contains images Jacobin777 : I fail to see why you believe the Sonic Cruiser was a "colossal" lie... there is more than enough info to show that the Sonic Cruiser was indeed some
36 Post contains images Mark_D. : Jacobin777, kaman. At Mach ~0.98, and all the rest of it?   Not to mention the huge amount of energy wasted around here from so many very zealously p
37 Astuteman : You can bet your bottom dollar that BOTH manufacturers are working HARD on the development of their next generation narrowbodies - their most importa
38 Jacobin777 : as I previously stated, the market was there orginally....and it was still not considered a "failure" because many of the 787 concepts/technologies c
39 Mark_D. : Jacobin777, kaman. Condit and Mulally going around with their "point-to-point" vision of the future (as opposed to the A380's "hub-and-spoke"), and al
40 Post contains images Jacobin777 : Mark, I'm not going to get into semantics or philosophies of future air travel (point-to-point vs hub-spoke)... at least we agree on the fact we disa
41 Theredbaron : Lets get down and dirty with the prospect of next generation Single aisle (SA) aircraft... Do you think Boeing will keep its 40 year old fuselage? wil
42 Post contains images Mark_D. : Well Jacobin maybe Condit and Mullaly would have some interesting fessing up sessions if we could buy 'em a few drinks and they let their guard down a
43 Post contains images Jacobin777 : the child of the Sonice Cruiser is coming..787....
44 Beauing : A colossal lie? As I said previously, Boeing did not go forward with the Sonic Cruiser because the airlines wanted fuel efficiency over speed. That's
45 Adria : yes so they were both doing business the same way....that's my point Well with those "pants down" I was just referring to the post that said the same
46 Beauing : No, that wasn't your point. Go back and read your post: Your point was that the A330 Lite morphed into the A350 but the Sonic Cruiser morphed into no
47 Keesje : good feel story, IMO factual untrue Yellowstone like studies were done since 1999. Sonic cruiser was started later and shelved in dec 2002 Boeing pic
48 AirbusDriver : How many B787 come at the expense of the 767 and B772??? Stupid question stupid answer.
49 Post contains images FlyAUA : " target=_blank>http://archives.seattletimes.nwsourc...A330+ That's an old article. Look at the date. And the fact it still refers to the 787 as the 7
50 Post contains images Jacobin777 : Excuse me??? Those were YOUR quotes..not mine....My comment was regarding you mentioning that the Dreamliner (787) had nothing to do with the Sonic C
51 Beauing : Just as all the articles about the Sonic Cruiser are old. If we are discussing the Airbus response to the 787 we have to go all the way back to the b
52 Post contains images FlyAUA : Ok let me clarify this out to you. Perhaps you need glasses if you don't have any, or an eye check-up if you already wear some! NO similarity at all a
53 Post contains images DfwRevolution : >> .....and they have also talked about the Sonic cruiser a lot and where is it now? Yes Adria, and Boeing moved first on a next-generation 200-300 s
54 FlyAUA : I agree with you regarding the technological aspect. But I do not see (nor agree) that A320NG/B737NG sales would reduce A350/B787 sales. In that sens
55 Post contains links and images Jacobin777 : gee..thanks for the pics....what was the purpose of the pics anyway? To prove your point that the 787 and the Sonic Cruiser aren't the same plane?? G
56 Post contains images DfwRevolution : >> NO similarity at all as you can see. Also 2 very different concepts when you look at the technical specs. So no, I am not admitting I am wrong bec
57 Jacobin777 : DfwRevolution...I think we've proved him wrong enough, we can't do anything if he is too pragmatic (not to mention too pretentious) to believe he's wr
58 Post contains images DfwRevolution : >> How many B787 come at the expense of the 767 and B772??? Stupid question stupid answer. AirbusDriver, if you can't understand that all new program
59 Post contains images Adria : well the 747Adv. is more related to the 787 that the Sonic Cruiser is to the 787. This subsonic project was never meant to be built and the 787 is a
60 Post contains images QFA001 : I do not disagree with your assessment of the indicators. However, I think that we should also be wary of gamesmanship. Why? Boeing has historically
61 Post contains images FlyAUA : I would hardly worry when I look at your RR When I said that the initial sonic-cruiser programme was dropped and the 787 was launched instead. Thanks
62 Post contains images DfwRevolution : >> Perhaps if you asked at Orders, you might get an answer? Eh... for the most part, I just enjoy being a fly on the wall there. Point taken, however
63 Post contains images Jacobin777 : that's what I've been trying to point out.... darn, I didn't know you intellectually capable of catching it....I'm over it....... ...but I'm glad tha
64 Post contains images QFA001 : Signs of a pompous megalomaniac? Probably. However, I do hear that the pressure of being as popular as FlyAUA can indeed make one do or say irrationa
65 Post contains images Jacobin777 : QFA001...your terrific comments are spot on (unlike someone else's vacuous comments)....I'm putting you on my RUL (but that doesn't mean I won't be ha
66 Post contains images FlyAUA : ...and the thread reaches a new low... From your side maybe See above What, in the same way the 767 has something to do with the 787?
67 QFA001 : Thank you, sir. And, I look forward to them. Are you three years old? (This is where you come in and say, "no, you are!" and prove my point.) At leas
68 Post contains images FlyAUA : I am not going to sink to your level. You can repeat my name as often as you want in your posts but that only shows your obsession and desperation. I
69 Beauing : Saying the 737NG has a 40 year old fuselage is like saying the A350 has a twenty year old fuselage. But to answer your question, of course not; they
70 Post contains images QFA001 : Anything else, Ptolemy? I forgot to mention, DFW, that Airbus has apparently been doing some "construction work" vv new materials at Hamburg. So, it
71 Post contains images FlyAUA : You are mixing up the A330 with the A350. The A330 has a 20 year old fuselage, the A350 hasn't even been built yet. No doubt both manufacturers will
72 Beauing : Using composites in the fuselage is not quite the same as having a composite fuselage, now is it? Airbus has stated an all composite fuselage is too
73 Post contains images Jacobin777 : ...don't bother..it will probably be twisted against you in some sort of way......as I've found out first hand...
74 Astuteman : Just out of interest, have you had a look at the ALL COMPOSITE rear fuse section of the A380? OK, it may be largely conical, but the open end of the
75 QFA001 : Astute, I understand that mistakes happen. However, I didn't make that comment. It came from Beauing. FWIW, I think Airbus will have the ability to l
76 Post contains images Udo : It's very naive to assume Airbus aren't able to or don't have the know-how to build a composite fuselage... Nothing's more entertaining than hearing
77 ComeAndGo : "proven"? When the 787 / 350 enter service nothing is "proven". You can talk about proven in ten years down the line.
78 ComeAndGo : And what is that exactly? No! Airlines didn't like it. So Boeing shelved it and went for the plastic 767 replacement. You can't compare the Sonic Cru
79 QFA001 : As I said, the B787 certainly didn't morph from the Sonic Cruiser. However, I also pointed out that it was [Boeing] who placed the "Super Efficient"
80 Post contains images FlyAUA : ComeAndGo, Astuteman, Udo... thanks for pointing out the above remarks in the last few posts. The A380 uses a lot of composites in it's wings, fuselag
81 Astuteman : Please accept my apologies - the gremlins seem to be at play again......
82 Lehpron : With regards to the confusion of the 787 origins: In 1999 Boeing began work on a fast M0.95 airliner concept as a rational high speed civil tranport a
83 Shenzhen : "New Airbus Boss Calls For A320 Output Boost" This is great news, as it will allow more purchases near term before the cycle completes itself. I belie
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