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GOL To Invest In Mexican Airline  
User currently offlinePzurita1 From Greenland, joined Sep 2002, 1393 posts, RR: 14
Posted (9 years 4 months 3 weeks 1 day 17 hours ago) and read 4114 times:

A couple of weeks ago, some a.netters were discussing about what country was next for LAN. It seems it was not LAN we should have had in our radar, but GOL.

GOL will invest in a new airline partnering with Fernando Chico-Pardo, who currently owns Grupo ASUR (which operates 12 airports in Mexico, among them CUN).

Chico-Pardo's Grupo ASUR and other investors will own 75% of this joint venture while GOL will keep 25% and might become the operational partner due to its very succesful experience.

According to El Norte newspaper, GOL México might start as a domestic airline flying to MEX, GDL, MTY and surely to some of ASUR airports, especially CUN and MID.

GOL MX is to use 737NG, just like its Brazilian cousin, having 5 to 10 a/c in its first stage.

Well, it seems 2005 is the year when LCC will enter Mexican market. We have:

1. Vuela: Protego and TACA new airline to be based in TLC
2. Interjet: Miguel Alemán-Magnani's based in TLC
3. A Volar: To be based in PBC.
and now
4. GOL Mexico

But hey!!!! Caution here... Though there is an agreement between Chico Pardo and GOL, they have yet to apply for the license to start operations.

PZ


Next flight: IAH-DBX-MRU-ANT
38 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineLipeGIG From Brazil, joined May 2005, 11456 posts, RR: 58
Reply 1, posted (9 years 4 months 3 weeks 1 day 17 hours ago) and read 4092 times:
AIRLINERS.NET CREW
FORUM MODERATOR

Hope the same success as Brazilian operations! A Gol network is also a strong confirmation that Gol become in the future a huge international airline. Gol will become a south American strong player and if Gol Mexico go ahead, it will be more one Latin Player!

Rgds,
Felipe



New York + Rio de Janeiro = One of the best combinations !
User currently offline737-990 From United States of America, joined Apr 2000, 370 posts, RR: 1
Reply 2, posted (9 years 4 months 3 weeks 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 4077 times:

The fact that an airport group wants to start an airline raises some serious anti-trust questions. I doubt the Mexican authorities would allow a direct invest by the ASUR group. I would imagine that if they did it would come with a lot of strings attached to ensure that the new airline didn't have an unfair advantage with lower rent or landing fees.
A few questions: How many capital investments has this group made in the airports it runs? Are they considering building a second runway at CUN? What is the limit of foreign ownership of an airline in Mexico, is it 25% or 49%?



Happiest is a man who has his vocation as a hobby
User currently offlineBilly From United Kingdom, joined Jul 2000, 895 posts, RR: 7
Reply 3, posted (9 years 4 months 3 weeks 1 day 10 hours ago) and read 4007 times:

I think that you will find that ASUR is not financially involved int he airline. This is Pardo's own investment.

Interestingly, Mexican airports can own 5% of an airline.


User currently offlinePzurita1 From Greenland, joined Sep 2002, 1393 posts, RR: 14
Reply 4, posted (9 years 4 months 3 weeks 1 day 4 hours ago) and read 3953 times:

Billy,

You are right. It is not ASUR which is financially involved, but its holding firm. ITC or ITA or some acronym I cannot remember. Chico Pardo is leading a group of investors who currently also own ITC (or ITA...)

737-990,

In Mexico, foreign shareholders can have up to 25% of total shares.

PZ



Next flight: IAH-DBX-MRU-ANT
User currently offlineBilly From United Kingdom, joined Jul 2000, 895 posts, RR: 7
Reply 5, posted (9 years 4 months 3 weeks 1 day 4 hours ago) and read 3952 times:

Pzurita1
Yes, it is an investment vehicle. The Gol press release does state this and draws a link with the Copenhagen shareholding rather than the ASUR links.

Aircraft will be 737NG. Route network is more or less planned. Usual suspects.


User currently offlinePzurita1 From Greenland, joined Sep 2002, 1393 posts, RR: 14
Reply 6, posted (9 years 4 months 3 weeks 1 day 3 hours ago) and read 3931 times:

Billy,

That is weird. Chico-Pardo owns 63.5% of ITA and Copenhagen Airports only 36.5%. And as I understood, agreement is between ITA and Gol.
May be GOL used Copenhagen Airports' name as it is more recognized.
Am I right?

Do you have route network to share?



Next flight: IAH-DBX-MRU-ANT
User currently offlineN77014 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 7, posted (9 years 4 months 3 weeks 1 day 3 hours ago) and read 3918 times:

Why not just buy Azteca?

User currently offlineBilly From United Kingdom, joined Jul 2000, 895 posts, RR: 7
Reply 8, posted (9 years 4 months 3 weeks 1 day 3 hours ago) and read 3916 times:

Pzurita1
TLC to the big markets - they would be mad not to do them; GDL, MTY, CUN etc.

Incidentally, I flew on Azteca last week. Dreadful flight though about half the price of the AM. I went up on the AM 73G (nice, but only ten on board)and back on the ZE 733 (full, but it was routing on to CUN). ZE landing at MEX was one of the worst I have ever experienced. I did not realise that ZE did a business class service (empty on my flight).


User currently offlineN77014 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 9, posted (9 years 4 months 3 weeks 1 day 3 hours ago) and read 3909 times:

Sorry about the poor Azteca impression. However, they also fly B73G's, and they have some important routes both domestic and international, including MEX-ONT.

User currently offlineBilly From United Kingdom, joined Jul 2000, 895 posts, RR: 7
Reply 10, posted (9 years 4 months 3 weeks 1 day 3 hours ago) and read 3904 times:

N77014,
Thanks for the reply. You should not need feel obliged to apologise for ZE. I have flown extensively in Mexico (love the place) and do about 150 flights per year around the world, so these things happen.

I think that Gol wants to get its own cost base established in Mexico. It would have been easier to purchase the operating licence of ZE, I grant you. However, I think that they not want to inherit any of ZE's issues, which includes the inability to make money.

Billy


User currently offlineRojo From Spain, joined Sep 2000, 2475 posts, RR: 9
Reply 11, posted (9 years 4 months 3 weeks 1 day 3 hours ago) and read 3901 times:

Quoting Billy (Reply 10):
I think that Gol wants to get its own cost base established in Mexico. It would have been easier to purchase the operating licence of ZE, I grant you. However, I think that they not want to inherit any of ZE's issues, which includes the inability to make money.

Azteca is not for sale, so Gol or Pardo could not buy ZE license. Although ZE could be in the red (we don't know since they are not a public company), they don't even care about it, since it works as a money laundry machine!!


User currently offlineMexicana757 From United States of America, joined Apr 2001, 3047 posts, RR: 28
Reply 12, posted (9 years 4 months 3 weeks 1 day 1 hour ago) and read 3868 times:

Seems like the Mexican aviation market will be flooded with a lot of LCCs. The war of the LCCs is about to start. Lets see who survives.
Here is the press release of GOL's and Mexican investors intentions.
http://biz.yahoo.com/prnews/050705/nytu061.html?.v=16


User currently offlineLeoDF From Mexico, joined Aug 1999, 359 posts, RR: 5
Reply 13, posted (9 years 4 months 3 weeks 1 day 1 hour ago) and read 3855 times:

Welcome GOL Mexico! If they do things right, they surely can take advantage on the mexican market.

And it just hit me! If they invest with Chico Pardo, they can negotiate "special" rates on every single ASUR airport... This could be fabulous as Cancun is one of the most expensive airports in America and I think in the world! WOW! This combination could be deadly!!!

Bienvenidos sean los 737-800 (really don't know what their fleet would be, but considering GOL I assume either -700 or -800)!!!

Great news!! 2006 will be THE year!!! Or so it seems!!

Saludos!

A. De Leo
"PiloT"

P.S. LAB: are you interested in starting LAB Mexico?? No? Ok! It could have been something!



Lloyd Aereo Boliviano
User currently offlineJuventus From United States of America, joined Dec 2004, 2835 posts, RR: 2
Reply 14, posted (9 years 4 months 3 weeks 21 hours ago) and read 3782 times:

Any Mexico to the USA on GOL?

User currently offlinePzurita1 From Greenland, joined Sep 2002, 1393 posts, RR: 14
Reply 15, posted (9 years 4 months 3 weeks 21 hours ago) and read 3774 times:

Quoting Juventus (Reply 14):
Any Mexico to the USA on GOL?

If they follow the business model used in Brazil, it will take them at least 3 years to break ground off national boundaries.

Moreover, if GOL MX is trully to follow GOL path (as I expect), we could see a very interesting network in a couple of years.

They might start with the usual suspects (as Billy called them): MEX, MTY, GDL, CUN, TLC. If their business model proves succesful in Mexico we could see them flying thin routes which currently have few traffic due to high prices. They could estimulate demand through low prices. Hence, routings such as BJX-CUN, MTY-MID, MTY-PBC, MEX-CEN, GDL-VER, GDL-SLW, etc.

I hope to see them in a couple of years.



Next flight: IAH-DBX-MRU-ANT
User currently offlineLipeGIG From Brazil, joined May 2005, 11456 posts, RR: 58
Reply 16, posted (9 years 4 months 3 weeks 20 hours ago) and read 3752 times:
AIRLINERS.NET CREW
FORUM MODERATOR

Quoting Juventus (Reply 14):
Any Mexico to the USA on GOL?



Quoting Pzurita1 (Reply 15):
If they follow the business model used in Brazil, it will take them at least 3 years to break ground off national boundaries

With a strong hub on Mexico, Gol MX can probably receive widebodies from Brazil and distribute pax to the US with 737NG. Imagine a company that can merge Mexico + Brazil traffic. Gol in 5 years could become a major player on Brazil-US.

Rgds,
Felipe



New York + Rio de Janeiro = One of the best combinations !
User currently offlineBrasuca From Brazil, joined Mar 2004, 717 posts, RR: 10
Reply 17, posted (9 years 4 months 3 weeks 19 hours ago) and read 3730 times:

Quoting LipeGIG (Reply 16):
With a strong hub on Mexico, Gol MX can probably receive widebodies from Brazil and distribute pax to the US with 737NG. Imagine a company that can merge Mexico + Brazil traffic. Gol in 5 years could become a major player on Brazil-US.

Brazilians are forbidden to transit between Mexico and USA directly, even being legal. I know someone (brazilian passport holder) who tried to take a flight from MIA to CUN and was denied boarding because of this rule.



Varig, Varig, Varig
User currently offlineLipeGIG From Brazil, joined May 2005, 11456 posts, RR: 58
Reply 18, posted (9 years 4 months 3 weeks 19 hours ago) and read 3722 times:
AIRLINERS.NET CREW
FORUM MODERATOR

Quoting Brasuca (Reply 17):
Brazilians are forbidden to transit between Mexico and USA directly, even being legal. I know someone (brazilian passport holder) who tried to take a flight from MIA to CUN and was denied boarding because of this rule.

Hi Brasuca! I've added you on Orkut.
It's sounds crazyness ! I can't believe on this as my Director has just travel from MIA to MEX to attend a bankers Meeting. I do believe that someone with a valid passport is authorized to travell wherever it wants (and the passport states that is valid on any country that keeps diplomatic relations with us). Does anyone knows any other case ? Am i wrong ?

Rgds,
Felipe



New York + Rio de Janeiro = One of the best combinations !
User currently offlineJuventus From United States of America, joined Dec 2004, 2835 posts, RR: 2
Reply 19, posted (9 years 4 months 3 weeks 19 hours ago) and read 3717 times:

This is begining to look like a very good idea. GOL can battle the LCCs from the US such as Airtran, ATA, America West, Frontier, and Spirit.

User currently offlineBrasuca From Brazil, joined Mar 2004, 717 posts, RR: 10
Reply 20, posted (9 years 4 months 3 weeks 18 hours ago) and read 3709 times:

LipeGIG,

Ei, valeu, cara!! Vou lá ver!!

I too find it very strange. Tried to find a reason to it, but nothing came up in my mind.

Quoting LipeGIG (Reply 18):
I do believe that someone with a valid passport is authorized to travell wherever it wants (and the passport states that is valid on any country that keeps diplomatic relations with us)

This does not automatically grant us entrance to them. There are always anomaly rules to be accomplished. And the issue isn't about our passport validity, but the way we might be using it.

For example, if you hold Isareli stamp in your passaport, you will definitely be denied entering most of arab countries. The same happens with a cuban stamped passports, when entering the US.

Maybe this applies only if you are going for tourism purposes to MEX, case in which we brazilians don't need a visa. Never realised to check it out, but I will and post here.



Varig, Varig, Varig
User currently offlineLipeGIG From Brazil, joined May 2005, 11456 posts, RR: 58
Reply 21, posted (9 years 4 months 3 weeks 18 hours ago) and read 3706 times:
AIRLINERS.NET CREW
FORUM MODERATOR

Quoting Brasuca (Reply 20):
Maybe this applies only if you are going for tourism purposes to MEX, case in which we brazilians don't need a visa. Never realised to check it out, but I will and post here.

I will be on MIA and LAX during august and first days of september. I should check it too. Hope i can get into Mexico by plane from the US.  Smile

Regards,
Felipe



New York + Rio de Janeiro = One of the best combinations !
User currently offlinePPVRA From Brazil, joined Nov 2004, 8971 posts, RR: 39
Reply 22, posted (9 years 4 months 3 weeks 15 hours ago) and read 3662 times:

Quoting LipeGIG (Reply 18):
Quoting Brasuca (Reply 17):
Brazilians are forbidden to transit between Mexico and USA directly, even being legal. I know someone (brazilian passport holder) who tried to take a flight from MIA to CUN and was denied boarding because of this rule.

Hi Brasuca! I've added you on Orkut.
It's sounds crazyness ! I can't believe on this as my Director has just travel from MIA to MEX to attend a bankers Meeting. I do believe that someone with a valid passport is authorized to travell wherever it wants (and the passport states that is valid on any country that keeps diplomatic relations with us). Does anyone knows any other case ? Am i wrong ?



Quoting LipeGIG (Reply 21):
I will be on MIA and LAX during august and first days of september. I should check it too. Hope i can get into Mexico by plane from the US. Smile

My uncle flew GRU-MEX-ATL-GRU about 3 years ago. Unless this is something new, it really is very strange.

PPVRA



"If goods do not cross borders, soldiers will" - Frederic Bastiat
User currently offlineTheredbaron From Mexico, joined Mar 2005, 2296 posts, RR: 9
Reply 23, posted (9 years 4 months 3 weeks 15 hours ago) and read 3649 times:

It seems to me the market has become crowded before first flight!..

I think who survives will depend on 2 factors, loads and taxes, as you may know the taxes and fees imposed on tickets are quite high, maybe they know something we dont know but, if taxes on flying do NOT go down, basically we see the start AND the end of real LLC in MExico..

example of lineas Azteca: fare cost r/t 426 plus 7 dollar taxes MEx other taxes 96.30 remember this si suposedly a LLC and this is the super cheap fare... totals.... 530 USD$ !!!

Aeromexico Costs 506 USD$ and 549 to LAX!

United : 534.95 USD$

I have a wait and see attitude....

TRB



The best seat in a Plane is the Jumpseat.
User currently offlineFly727 From Mexico, joined Jul 2003, 1789 posts, RR: 19
Reply 24, posted (9 years 4 months 3 weeks 13 hours ago) and read 3633 times:

Quoting Brasuca (Reply 20):
For example, if you hold Isareli stamp in your passaport, you will definitely be denied entering most of arab countries. The same happens with a cuban stamped passports, when entering the US.

I have a Cuba stamp in my passport and haven't had any problems when entering the US (both air and land); although I know that in Cuba it is not uncommon for scared -or ignorants- tourist to fold a dollar inside the passport for the immigration officer not to stamp it.

Quoting Pzurita1 (Thread starter):
1. Vuela: Protego and TACA new airline to be based in TLC
2. Interjet: Miguel Alemán-Magnani's based in TLC
3. A Volar: To be based in PBC.
and now
4. GOL Mexico

As a matter of fact I was just informed from a reliable source that A volar will, instead of PBC, be based out of TIJ. Also, add to the newcomers list Aerolineas Mesoamericanas headed by Manuel Heredia.

Heard that Interjet will be having crew bases in CUN to attend the charter market once held by Allegro. Sounds interesting.

We should also add to the list those that currently are on their way of expansion or survival: Nova Air, Global Air, Tropical and Republic Air. Don't want to be negative on this, but don't see success for either of them once the super powers listed above start ops.

RM  Smile



There are no stupid questions... just stupid people!
25 Mexicana757 : Do you know the reason why they decided to start at TIJ instead? Maybe they are seeing that the area airports around MEX are getting crowded or going
26 Juventus : Gol to bring its low-fare model to Mexico (ATWONLINE.COM) Wednesday July 6, 2005 Brazil's Gol announced plans to establish a low-cost carrier in Mexic
27 Post contains images Fly727 : I ignore the stats but I believe that TIJ hasn't had a stronger operation than now. The ethnic flow is impressive and A volar surely wants a bite of
28 Stirling : Are there not limitations to the terminal facilities at TIJ? Is there any type of existing ground transportation links from the US side of the border
29 Pzurita1 : Surprisingly, TIJ current traffic is only a fraction of what it used to be around 1994. In the past few years (2000-2004) it has shown a minimal annu
30 Stirling : Why is that? Fares? It will be interesting to see the "Southwest Effect" on TIJ.
31 Post contains images Fly727 : Yes, there are some, although the real business takes place from TIJ to the US side; there are several bus companies along the border line (San Ysidr
32 N77014 : Actually there is tremendous travel from the interior to TIJ. With MEX weight restricted, it can get hard moving all those who want to do the route.
33 Stirling : So the dropoff in traffic can be attributed to TAESA going out of business? It's hard to believe that it's taken this long for another airline to fin
34 Ghost77 : Smart move! If they start out from TIJ I'm sure they won't suffer with LF, traffic and yields are there! AFAIK they will start with a sole B735 follo
35 PPVRA : Any guesses of when service might begin? How about Q1/06? PPVRA
36 Post contains images Fyano773 : According to América Economía magazine, service will start Q2/2006: Goal creates new airline to compete with Cintra (AméricaEconomía.com) An alli
37 EddieDude : Just some random comments on some of the opinions and facts posted in this thread. 1. The 25% equity ownership limit is a voting stock limit. In other
38 Ghost77 : Correct, which by law is limited to a 49%. This is a 25% stake of voting shares plus 24% of non-voting shares. Ricardo APM
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