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Question On Fair Compensation  
User currently offline777DadandJr From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 1516 posts, RR: 12
Posted (9 years 5 months 3 weeks 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 1594 times:

Hope to get your thoughts on this question.
Here are the details.

My brother's family and my parents recently returned from a trip to Hawaii. They are not big travelers, so this was a trip of a lifetime for them.
The were scheduled to leave BWI on 6/20, 7:30 am, flying on HP A321.
There flight was delayed due to mx issues and was tentatively rescheduled for a 9am departure. One of the mx personnel was send to IAD to pick up a spare part, and the flight was again rescheduled to depart at 11:30am. The part that was picked up at IAD didn't work or fit and the flight was cancelled at 11am.
Now, my family was to connect in PHX for their flight to HNL on Hawaiian. Needless to say, they missed their connection.
HP scrambled to redirect all the pax on the cancelled flight and my family was patiently waiting at BWI for 15 hours until HP could get them on a flight to LAS, to connect to SFO. They put them up in a hotel in SFO until their new flight to HNL on United, which was to depart at noon on 6/21.
They arrived at SFO from the hotel at 10am and were in the security line. They were "red flagged" by security because they had switched airlines, and need to go through a thorough security screen, which involved inspecting all the bags. There were 5 of them traveling together. One of the screening machines broke which backed everything up. My father got through first, and without his shoes, he ran down the concourse to the gate to try and tell the gate agent that they were coming. It's almost noon at this time. When he got to the gate, they (UA) were just about to board 5 stand by pax to fill my family's seats. My father explained that they were stuck getting through security, but they were ready to close the flight, so they put the 5 standby's on, and the flight pushed back.
UA booked them on the next flight, departing at 2pm, bumped them up to first class, and they were finally off to HNL.
They arrived 29 hours late.

HP gave them food vouchers while they were at BWI, and gave them each a $100 travel voucher for a future flight.

My question is this: In your opinion, is this fair compensation? The travel vouchers expire in one year, and frankly, $100 won't by a ticket to anywhere.

I know that they did receive the services of HP, but they also lost 1 1/2 days of their vacation and 2 nights of lodging that they paid for but couldn't use.

Please give me any suggestions or advice that I can give them.

Thanks in advance!

Russ


My glass is neither 1/2 empty nor 1/2 full, rather, the glass itself is twice as big as it should be.
8 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineSllevin From United States of America, joined Jan 2002, 3376 posts, RR: 6
Reply 1, posted (9 years 5 months 3 weeks 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 1572 times:

If it's maintenance, no, HP owes you and your family. I forget the rules, but, in general, if it's not weather or ATC, and they don't get you to your destination within four hours, there's more than token compensation due.

Steve


User currently offline777DadandJr From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 1516 posts, RR: 12
Reply 2, posted (9 years 5 months 3 weeks 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 1554 times:

Quoting Sllevin (Reply 1):
If it's maintenance, no, HP owes you and your family. I forget the rules, but, in general, if it's not weather or ATC, and they don't get you to your destination within four hours, there's more than token compensation due.

What could they expect to recieve, and how persistent do they need to be? Who within HP would they contact?

Thanks for the reply.

Russ



My glass is neither 1/2 empty nor 1/2 full, rather, the glass itself is twice as big as it should be.
User currently offlineDrewwright From United States of America, joined May 2001, 621 posts, RR: 1
Reply 3, posted (9 years 5 months 3 weeks 21 hours ago) and read 1527 times:

It appears that your family members recieved a fairly standard compensation given the circumstances. Unfortunately, delays and screwups are some of the joys of air travel!
When you purchase a ticket, the airline has an obligation to get you there somehow, but there is no guarantee that you will get there on time. In that respect, HP made good on their end of the deal. I understand that your family members may feel somewhat victimized and entitled to additional compensation, but countless people find themselves in the same exact situation every day and on every airline. Obviously HP is not obligated to compensate for the days missed of vacation, but perhaps they will offer something additional as a gesture of goodwill. I say it is worth a try, but the reality is that they will have already heard the same story a hundred times that morning.


User currently offlineFlyPIJets From United States of America, joined Oct 2003, 926 posts, RR: 3
Reply 4, posted (9 years 5 months 3 weeks 13 hours ago) and read 1509 times:

In order for HP to be responsible for loss incurred outside the contract of carriage, you would need to prove that HP was negligent or greater (breech of contract) in their handling of the MX issue. And though the burden of proof for negligence can be appallingly low at times, I suspect in the aviation industry, regarding MX issues, it would be really hard to prove. It should be, airlines need to have the pressure off on issues involving safety of flight. That is, they need to be able to feel free to cancel a flight if an MX issue comes up without feeling the pressure to compensate everyone for loss of time, business, etc....

From what you described, I think HP fulfilled the contract. On the bright side, hey, a ride in UA's F/C.



DC-8, DC-9, DC-10, F28, 717, 727, 737, 747, 757, 767, IL-62, L-1011, MD-82/83, YS-11, DHC-8, PA-28-161, ERJ 135/145, E-1
User currently offline777DadandJr From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 1516 posts, RR: 12
Reply 5, posted (9 years 5 months 3 weeks 13 hours ago) and read 1491 times:

Quoting FlyPIJets (Reply 4):
From what you described, I think HP fulfilled the contract

I agree FlyPiJets. I did tell my brother that. I told him "HP did give you the services that you paid for, being that they got you to your destination." Besides, I told him, on the bright side, wasn't it better that they found a faulty hydraulic pump BEFORE they got into the air?

My main concern was whether what HP offered in compensation was "fair."

My brother is not the type that would beat this thing into the ground. I mean, he's not a big flyer anyway, so if HP doesn't offer any more than what they have already give, then he would just not fly HP again. Which in this case is no big loss, seeing that this is probably only the third or fourth time that he has ever flown in his life. He wouldn't be the type to make a huge fuss or go off on some litigious route. None of my family is like that.
I just wanted to offer him some advice, being that I am more versed in the workings of the airline industry, than he.

Russ



My glass is neither 1/2 empty nor 1/2 full, rather, the glass itself is twice as big as it should be.
User currently offlineFlyPIJets From United States of America, joined Oct 2003, 926 posts, RR: 3
Reply 6, posted (9 years 5 months 3 weeks 12 hours ago) and read 1472 times:

Quoting 777DadandJr (Reply 5):
I just wanted to offer him some advice, being that I am more versed in the workings of the airline industry, than he.

Everybody has their own tolerance for feeling that they received satisfactory service. For me, I am happy with did I get everything I need, not did I get everything I can get. The latter will always leave you with a question.

Maybe this will help.

I had a similar situation happen to me once on AA. I got the AA station manager's name and address and gathered my thoughts about the problems wrote a letter explaining my unhappiness and ways I thought AA could have handled it better. I got a wonderful letter back from an station manager that obviously had actually read the letter. That is all I needed.

Maybe you and your brother could research the alternate routing HP provided and offer suggestions to HP on how you think this could have been handled better. You may get nothing back from HP, but, you will have put yourself through an exercise that will help you to understand the situation a little better. Maybe that's all you really need.

Sounds kind of wimpy, but it might help.



DC-8, DC-9, DC-10, F28, 717, 727, 737, 747, 757, 767, IL-62, L-1011, MD-82/83, YS-11, DHC-8, PA-28-161, ERJ 135/145, E-1
User currently offlineJGPH1A From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 7, posted (9 years 5 months 3 weeks 12 hours ago) and read 1468 times:

Sounds like both HP and UA pretty much fell over themselves to help out - reaccomodation plus hotels, and reaccom on UA even though they were carrying your family members on a FIM. OK the compensation is pretty low, but seems to me, from reading your post, that the airlines did their absolute level best to get your family where they were going. I don't know many European airlines that would have tried that hard.

User currently offline777DadandJr From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 1516 posts, RR: 12
Reply 8, posted (9 years 5 months 2 weeks 6 days 13 hours ago) and read 1424 times:

Thanks for all the advice guys.

Quoting JGPH1A (Reply 7):
Sounds like both HP and UA pretty much fell over themselves to help out

My brothers says that UA was extremly helpful and accomodating. He would fly them again anytime.

I wouldn't characterize HP as "falling all over themselves." Yes, the did make accomodations, but they were still stranded for 15hours at BWI. That's a bit excessive in my book.

Also, adding to the original problems, when they were returning and making their connection in PHX, HP somehow "lost" my niece in their system. The gate agent was working to try and figure out why she wasn't on the passenger list, even though she had a ticket. She ended up taking a boarding pass, which had someone elses name on it, scratching the name off and giving it to my niece. All this while the flight was waiting to close. Close to missing that flight also.

They are all back safe and sound though.

Russ



My glass is neither 1/2 empty nor 1/2 full, rather, the glass itself is twice as big as it should be.
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