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Air France A340 Off Runway In YYZ  
User currently offlineJetCaptain From Canada, joined Dec 2000, 236 posts, RR: 0
Posted (10 years 4 months 9 hours ago) and read 100626 times:

Just listening to YYZ approach on LiveATC.com.

ATC reports aircraft off the runway. Any further info ?


[Edited 2005-08-02 22:21:54]

570 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
User currently offlineChrisA330 From Canada, joined Oct 1999, 662 posts, RR: 0
Reply 1, posted (10 years 4 months 9 hours ago) and read 100575 times:

Believed to be an Air France jet...

News reports are trickling in now...reports of smoke/fire.

User currently offlineBWIA330 From Canada, joined Jan 2001, 921 posts, RR: 0
Reply 2, posted (10 years 4 months 8 hours ago) and read 100519 times:

Just heard it on 680 news. They said its an unconfirmed report that its an Air France jet. Has to be the daily 340 from CDG. They said its on fire.



whats the yyz atc website that I can listen to? That website doesnt work.

User currently offlineJCS17 From United States of America, joined Jun 2001, 8065 posts, RR: 36
Reply 3, posted (10 years 4 months 8 hours ago) and read 100509 times:

I just heard it on Fan590.

America's chickens are coming home to rooooost!
User currently offlineYyz717 From Canada, joined Sep 2001, 16493 posts, RR: 55
Reply 4, posted (10 years 4 months 8 hours ago) and read 100503 times:

Local news reporting an AF aircraft (343 I presume) ran off end of runway on landing in the rain. Nosewheel collapse and fire on board.

I dumped at the gybe mark in strong winds when I looked up at a Porter Q400 on finals. Can't stop spotting.
User currently offlineAccargo From Canada, joined Sep 2004, 610 posts, RR: 8
Reply 5, posted (10 years 4 months 8 hours ago) and read 100501 times:

Air France acft off runway and on fire. YYZ closed

User currently offlineChrisA330 From Canada, joined Oct 1999, 662 posts, RR: 0
Reply 6, posted (10 years 4 months 8 hours ago) and read 100487 times:

My brother is on the 401 parellel to the runway - reporting "a ton of smoke" and he couldn't see the aircraft yet. Will try and get more information.

User currently offlineJetCaptain From Canada, joined Dec 2000, 236 posts, RR: 0
Reply 7, posted (10 years 4 months 8 hours ago) and read 100474 times:

Live pictures now on CTV News Net, Air France A340, on fire, doesn't look good.


User currently offlineAsstChiefMark From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 8, posted (10 years 4 months 8 hours ago) and read 100456 times:

Live audio on TV.


User currently offlineFly_yhm From Canada, joined Dec 2000, 1698 posts, RR: 9
Reply 9, posted (10 years 4 months 8 hours ago) and read 100433 times:

I've just herd of report of Possible Lufthansa Flight its on Cable Pulse 24 and there is Smoke and fire

Where will you spend eternity? He,s more real then you think!!!!!
User currently offlineAsstChiefMark From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 10, posted (10 years 4 months 8 hours ago) and read 100403 times:

Turn on CNN


User currently offlineLonghaulheavy From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 402 posts, RR: 2
Reply 11, posted (10 years 4 months 8 hours ago) and read 100402 times:

First lines are coming across the AP wire right now. Motorists on the 401 indicating that "this is not a small plane."

User currently offlineFly_yhm From Canada, joined Dec 2000, 1698 posts, RR: 9
Reply 12, posted (10 years 4 months 8 hours ago) and read 100389 times:

Now can see that its Air France.

Where will you spend eternity? He,s more real then you think!!!!!
User currently offlineC-GRYK From Canada, joined Apr 2000, 751 posts, RR: 33
Reply 13, posted (10 years 4 months 8 hours ago) and read 100383 times:

Turn on CP24 looks like its off 24R in the ditch off the end on the perimeter road! Air France A340..... it's on fire as we speak!


Think before you type!
User currently offlineJetCaptain From Canada, joined Dec 2000, 236 posts, RR: 0
Reply 14, posted (10 years 4 months 8 hours ago) and read 100326 times:

CNN reporting it live as well, saying it is a Lufthansa B737. However it is definately an Air France A340.


User currently offlineJtamu97 From United States of America, joined Mar 2001, 665 posts, RR: 2
Reply 15, posted (10 years 4 months 8 hours ago) and read 100308 times:

The wonderful media is reporting a 737..Yeah right.Hopefully it will not be too bad

Propeller, we don't need no stinkin propeller
User currently offlineMtnmanmakalu From Ireland, joined Nov 2004, 515 posts, RR: 3
Reply 16, posted (10 years 4 months 8 hours ago) and read 100263 times:

GEEZ!! It sure has been a rough past few days for widebodies landing in bad weather!! Hopefully it won't be raining in MSP when I fly back to work next week!!!


I do, I don't, whatever.......
User currently offlineANstar From United Kingdom, joined Nov 2003, 5538 posts, RR: 6
Reply 17, posted (10 years 4 months 8 hours ago) and read 100196 times:

Just watching CNN, seems like the whole plane is on fie. Loads of smoke. Doesn;t look good. Hope some people managed to get away ok.


User currently offlineKLMA330 From Canada, joined Feb 2005, 719 posts, RR: 2
Reply 18, posted (10 years 4 months 8 hours ago) and read 100054 times:

I am looking at the smoke right now, as I work in a building only a few hundred feet away!!!!!

User currently offlineFriendlySkies From United States of America, joined Aug 2004, 4131 posts, RR: 5
Reply 19, posted (10 years 4 months 8 hours ago) and read 100035 times:

They seem to be pretty sure it's a Lufthansa 737...sigh...

Hope there aren't too many casualties, any word on that?

User currently offlineB742 From United Kingdom, joined Mar 2005, 3820 posts, RR: 18
Reply 20, posted (10 years 4 months 8 hours ago) and read 99870 times:

WOW shocking!


Anyone know the reg of today's YYZ flight?

Approx. 200 people on board, any casulities?

Rob!  Sad

User currently offlineDL021 From United States of America, joined May 2004, 11454 posts, RR: 73
Reply 21, posted (10 years 4 months 8 hours ago) and read 99841 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

Holy crap...this is ugly. The thing is still burning.

They are saying that this can't be a 737. They are now calling it an Airbus and a LH bird.

I think I see a winglet.

Is my Pan Am ticket to the moon still good?
User currently offlineYhz78 From Canada, joined Apr 2004, 147 posts, RR: 0
Reply 22, posted (10 years 4 months 8 hours ago) and read 99827 times:

CTV Newsnet is reporting Lufthansa A340 overran on landing. Possible lightning strike. Approximately 200 on board.

Canada Rocks! From the west coast to the best coast!
User currently offlineAirlinelover From United States of America, joined Jun 2001, 5580 posts, RR: 21
Reply 23, posted (10 years 4 months 8 hours ago) and read 99791 times:

Lufthansa would not have a 737 at YYZ..

It's an Air France A340-300.. Just saw it on TV.. (not reported by them)


Lets do some sexy math. We add you, subtract your clothes, divide your legs and multiply
User currently offlineScarletHarlot From Canada, joined Jul 2003, 4673 posts, RR: 55
Reply 24, posted (10 years 4 months 8 hours ago) and read 99665 times:

CNN is saying A330 or 340

Also saying Lufthansa

Showing live footage from traffic cam on 401

Not sure if t/o or landing

CBC Newsworld is live with footage as well

But that was when I ruled the world
25 DL021 : Now the police are saying Air France
26 ANstar : Skynews is saying the AP agency says it is an Air France plane. Ran into trouble on landing.
27 FriendlySkies : Ok, now they're saying Air France Airbus...good enough for me.
28 777XI : CNN is finally discounting the "737" thought thanks to one reporter who actually knows something about aviation (is talking about the A330/A340). AP i
29 LHZXF : LH737 to YYZ.... please. Our thoughts are with all on board.
30 AsstChiefMark : Is this it? Airline Air France Flight Number 358 Departure City (Airport) Paris, France (LFPG) Departure Time 08/02/2005 01:15 PM Arrival City (Airpor
31 Yyz717 : CP24 has a live cam on site. It's def an AF 343. The fuselage is burning out.
32 Jtamu97 : GET THIS GUY OFF THE AUDIO!! HE HAS no clue what he is doing.
33 OHLHD : They are speaking about A340 now on CNN. Horrible accident. It was about to land and came into some kind of trouble. quotes from CNN
34 Rootsgirl : The livery looks white so does the tail, Air France A 340? It is terrible, it appears the fire engines cant get near it and I am watching it just burn
35 USAFHummer : MSNBC is calling it an AF flight, CNN is saying either AF or LH... Greg
36 Kaitak : Now on the BBC News 24; right wing/winglet clearly visible; not much more. Aircraft engulfed in flames. AF 358, Scheduled arrival time 3.35pm. A340-30
37 Aerobalance : Doesn't look good, plane in ravine, broken apart, hoping for a lot of survivors....
38 ScarletHarlot : Shit, we saw the AF A340 land last weekend...how awful. I will pray for survivors.
39 Accargo : That's it, in ravine at end of 25L. Smoke still pouring from fuselage.
40 Longhaulheavy : Pearson saying AF358.
41 Krisyyz : Peel regional police confirming that it is an Air France Airbus A340. Lighting strikes and heavy down pours where reported at the time the AF A340 ove
42 KL808 : I hope every body is ok. Drew
43 Tockeyhockey : can anyone who is there or watching it confirm that no escape slides deployed?
44 UAXDXer : Good Hell... watching Fox News and Neil Cavuto just asks "Is the Toronto Airport a safe place to land?"
45 AA B777-200 : Is it just me, or is it taking FOREVER to get that one Firefighting closer?????
46 MauriceB : they said there is a great possibility that its done by terrorists...
47 Pilatusguy : any live video feed on the net?
48 ScarletHarlot : CTV website is overloaded. Can't get into the article about the incident.
49 FutureFO : AF 358 type 343 as being reported by MSNBC at this time. Anyone got a live ATC feed link to hear what is happening at YYZ. Sean from MCO and MKE
50 BlueSky1976 : Looks like this could be windshear-related accident...
51 OHLHD : The camera is too far away to see, as smoke is also heavy.
52 YVR99 : CBC Newsworld is showing 401 traffic cams and fuselage is still in flames more than an hour after it first crashed... Definitely an AF 340. Speculatio
53 Aerobalance : Who's 'they'?
54 Aither : Damn... hope many have survived... the fuselage seems about together.
55 Tockeyhockey : who is reporting this?
56 DL021 : I can't make out from the television picture about any slides. The thing is still burning, though. There's a vertical stab. sticking out. Plenty of EM
57 UAXDXer : Who said that?
58 Mbm3 : My thoughts and prayers go out to everyone on board. Based on the current pics on the news sites this unfortunately looks to be a major catastrophe.
59 RJpieces : Looks like the fire is starting to come under control....Were pax evacuated before the fire became serious? Any word at all?
60 MAAN : Sky News: "it does appear that some sort of difficulty has befallen this plane." Good lord. They've finally got hold of the aircraft type and operator
61 Post contains images EZEIZA : Just got it on the Argentine news. Sad images arriving They are saying that there are unconfirmed rumours that a passenger might have attempted to tak
62 B4real : Some dingo that thinks they know something about an airplane on the streaming radio link listed above.
63 Flashmeister : CTV has an expert on that's being very careful now about terrorism and jumping to conclusions, and he mentioned that most lightning strikes should be
64 MauriceB : the lifestream CNN audio....
65 Trekster : MR GOD, just seen CNN, Hope there are surviors My god!!!!!!!!
66 RJ111 : I hope to hear of many survivors.
67 RJpieces : Any word on the exact time it crashed? I tuned into CNN about 5-10 minutes ago and they were reporting a Lufthansa 737, so I assume it just happened.
68 TPASXM787 : I can only get so much online here at work...terrible. Hopes and prayers that all survived.
69 Supa7E7 : Winds at YYZ are N - 42 km/h, quite windy. Raining. {{{{{{{{{ AF PAX }}}}}}}}} get out.
70 Post contains links JMV : Watching it live through a feed on www.clickondetroit.com. Still see flames periodically.
71 Bar032 : Definitly an A343. The first potentially fatal accident with the type. Very sad day for aviation, especially since there have been so few serious inci
72 DL021 : Have they closed the airport? Where will they divert aircraft if so?
73 Post contains links A300 American : Hello All, I´m hearing its an AirFrance wide bodied jet. http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/8801092/ Hope all is well.
74 Post contains images Blackhawk144 : Oh boy, this is bad...I certainly hope there are survivors... I'm kind of surprised CNN said that there is little optimism for any survivors. I didn't
75 Rootsgirl : Who said terrorism? Lightening is what they are saying and I am sitting here in Toronto. The thing that scares me, I saw it before it was totally engu
76 Flashmeister : How do we know that today's loads were only at 200? What's the source?
77 CainanUK : This dont look good. Think that an evacuation looks like it would have been really damned difficult. Prayers for the victims and their families, but I
78 DL021 : Pilot is alive debriefing
79 N737af : I know I'll be skinned alive for speculating, but wasn't the windshear crash at DFW exactly 20 years ago today?? N737AF
80 TPASXM787 : have the video...smoke still pouring out of the A340
81 Blasphemystic : Flight #358 is what they are saying. All I can do is say a prayer for all involved as I am watching it live on CNN.
82 DC10rules : Fox News is reporting that both pilots survived...lets pray for many more survivors.
83 DL021 : The news says that the pilot and copilot are being debriefed. That would indicate they are alive. REgularly sked AF A340 with 200 pax is latest update
84 Post contains images AKelley728 : At least he's better than the woman doing the interview (Quote from her: "the ailerons would be used to stop the aircraft" - at least he corrected he
85 Mbm3 : I too find it odd that there doesnt seem to be any slides deployed or the like. How unfortunate for all involved. Tragic.
86 Longhaulheavy : CFRB saying that people have made it off of the plane.
87 BlueSky1976 : CNN is now running a comparison to L-1011 at DFW now...
88 Cainanuk : Reports are surfacing of survivors according to Sky News
89 UAXDXer : Fox news reporting that the pilots are out & safe.
90 Sleekjet : Yes, this is 20 years to the day since the Delta 191 crash at DFW.
91 Rootsgirl : Air France Fl 358 - Paris to Toronto. Pearson closed.
92 Post contains images Muchswatch : it looks really bad. God bless all on board. Jay
93 IwantaBBJ : Can anyone else see the white foam appearing on the lower left of the picture? Mike
94 Keesje : damn, big explosion...
95 KL808 : fire is still on. wow Just hope everybody made it. Drew
96 Slider : AF flight 358 CDG-YYZ from CNN. CNN's coverage sucks. Can't see much of anything from the single angle they've got. Camera is from the opposite side o
97 Rootsgirl : Thank God there are some survivors, I was very chilled and concerned.
98 Texan : Air France lists seating capacity of the 340-300 at 252 pax. Most ops at YYZ had been halted due to severe thunderstorms, more info as it comes in. T
99 Indy : Is it possible that everyone was already off the plane before it burst into flames?
100 SDLSimme : Looks nasty. May god be with the pax and the people trying to rescue them...
101 TrappedInMKG : Our local news (WWMT Channel 3 in Kalamazoo...asshats) is reporting that the aircraft is a "Boeing 737 with about 200 people on board." Naturally, tha
102 Post contains images EZEIZA : CNN Latin America is reporting that apparently there are no fatal victims or badly injured pax or crew hopefully this will be confirmed soon!
103 Post contains links and images Clickhappy : Why did it take them so long to get the fire out View Large View MediumPhoto © Royal S King
104 AirbusfanYYZ : Air France's daily A340-300 flight AF358 has overrun 24R at YYZ. The flight is currently in a ravine among the trees west of the the threshold of 6L.
105 FutureFO : Windshear was the cause of the DL L1011 crash in DFW. This is a possible cause to this incident. I have not seen anything posted that YYZ is closed. C
106 CV580Freak : Reports on SKY News via CBC that survivors getting off and are under "bridge over the ravine" , no numbers quoted. CBC had people at YYZ filming the b
107 BSU747 : If it is the regular AF flight into Toronto AF358, a friend of mine picked it up on ACARS this lunchtime over the UK as F-GLZQ. BSU747
108 Sabena332 : Great news! I really, really hope that it is true! Patrick
109 Post contains images Backfire : Give the media a break. This is the same guesswork I usually see on A.net
110 ScarletHarlot : CBC Newsworld is not yet reporting any survivors. Pearson is completely closed.
111 Trekster : Fire still going, just seen a HUGE explosion from the right side of the plane while i was on ITV NEWS At least there are reports of surviors
112 BA767s : Its on BBC news here in the UK at the moment, 22:00hrs. John
113 Longhaulheavy : Police saying that there are injuries, but no fatalities.
114 Palladium : The plane came in without any problem and skid off on the runway due to severe thunderstorm weather and poor visibility. The Airplane is A340-300, not
115 DL021 : Global TV news say that pilots are alive....nothing on PAX yet. 291 persons on the plane being reported now. Ambulance busses pulling away from site w
116 Keesje : just saw a major fire ball hopefully nobody hurt firefighters will probably be even more carefull..
117 Bhxfaotipyyc : Bizarre these days how the most important thing on these TV news channels is to grab the first "expert" in their phone book, and get him to talk total
118 UAXDXer : All early indications point towards the same thing (windshear/micro bursts) that brought down Delta 191.
119 ScarletHarlot : I have not heard reports of survivors on Canadian news - on CBC Newsworld or CTV. I am hoping it is true that there are survivors!
120 Cubedweller : I hope this is more like the Mandarin Airlines crash in HK a few years ago that looked horrific but miraculously only three people lost their lives. O
121 FlyCaledonian : BBC Ten o'clock News at least being cautious on its facts, reporting an Air France A340, skidded off the runway, with unconfirmed reports that about 2
122 DL021 : The secondary explosion was probably an engine or fuel tank. They are now evacuating a larger area around the area. They are repeating the 291 pax num
123 FutureFO : Noone on the TV has given any definite info as to survivors and crew and such. Hopefully there will be some vital info shortly from the GTAA for all t
124 Jamman : BBC News 24 talking about thunderstorms over the airport, could this be a possible weather related problem after landing? heavy rain fall before landi
125 Siafan : Was that the DL L1011?
126 FriendlySkies : Wow, they just said it was 20 years to the day of DL191 (L1011 down at DFW)..eerie.
127 DL021 : How many pax does an A343 carry? How many crew? How valid is this number?
128 Phatfarmlines : I'm watching it on CNN. Can anyone tell what area of YYZ the accident occured? Also, this accident falls on the same day as the 20th anniversary of DL
129 Blackbird1331 : CNN: A340. Not good. Wind shear probably the cause.
130 FutureFO : MSNBC now posting there are believed to be survivors. Sean
131 OPNLguy : Online story from Reuters is headlined "Plane misses runway, aflame at Toronto airport" but text says it landed and ran off the end of 24L. The first
132 Post contains images KL713 : My god, that explosion was horrible. I'm praying for the passengers, just hoping they all survived, but this is certainly looking really bad.
133 Post contains links Goose : There's a view of the aircraft from this Ontario Highways webcam, updated every 90 seconds.
134 Sebring : Activity picking up at the airport. Planes now getting ready for takeoff. Storms have largely departed the vicinity. Certainly using other runways.
135 Indy : My guess is that there have been injuries sustained during the exiting from the plane. That seems to happen all to often. If the plane was on fire and
136 Post contains links TedTAce : UPDATED 1710 EDT http://apnews.myway.com/article/20050802/D8BNTU282.html
137 Texan : Once fires start burning on an airplane they just have to wait it out. It burns too hot to get close enough to it to make a difference, and the jet f
138 Zkojh : getting more bits as it comes, Air France A340, AF#358 CDG to YYZ
139 YULQC : Nothing on French-Canadian channels, they are awaiting a news conference from the emergency team in YYZ around 17:15 EST... All my thoughts to the peo
140 KYIPpilot : It seems that it may have been hydroplaning rather than windshear, as windshear would affect the approach and initial touchdown, but not causing it to
141 EZEIZA : CNN LAtAm talking about poor weather seems to be probable cause, and still claiming no fatalities by the waym they just showed a picture of the plane
142 ScarletHarlot : Eyewitness on CTV says that it landed safely and says that lightning struck it on the runway, losing all power. Says pilot managed to maintain some co
143 Hmmmm... : Miles O'brian, what a dink. Just announced that there were no survivors of DL 191 in Dallas. Claimed that type of disaster is non-survivable. Many, ma
144 Alcregular : Apparently 291 pax and crew on board and around 60 managed to escape. Obviously, just speculation at the moment.
145 TedTAce : Unconfirmed 291 on board Unconfirmed 60 out fine.
146 Tornado82 : Unless terrorists can control convective atmospheric events nowadays... No.
147 Texan : To repeat, Air France's website states the A340-300 carries a max of 252 passengers.
148 Redngold : Let us all say a prayer for the people on board, the rescue crews, and the friends and families of those involved. redngold
149 YVR99 : CTV news now reporting that lightning strike occurred after plane had touched down, ie while it was on the runway and that the lightning strike caused
150 NW727251ADV : Date: 02 August 1985 Airline: Delta Air Lines Flight No.: 191 Aircraft: L1011-385-1 Location: Dallas/Ft. Worth, TX Fatalities: 137:162+1
151 PVD757 : With the plane in a ravine, it makes it very difficult for the rescue crews to assist and suppress the fire due to the inability to get there. Does an
152 KC135TopBoom : My prayers are with them. Conflicting reports from 200 to 291 SOB. Sounds like he got caught in a quartering tail wind, due to the t-storm, as reports
153 Kaitak : 291 seems a bit high, given that there are only 252 seats; a maximum load would be about 266 (assuming 14 crew); I guess the 200 reported earlier were
154 RedAirForce : Would the Ontario Highways Webcam have caught the actual crash on film? Glad that it sounds like alot of people made it out.
155 ScarletHarlot : You are watching same broadcast as me.
156 IwantaBBJ : Sort of a planespotter now talking on CNN...
157 ScarletHarlot : CTV says Peel Regional Police says pilot and some passengers taken to hospital. Passengers wandering around near 401. First official confirmation of s
158 Aviationwiz : Spotter saying that the plane cracked in half. Wow.
159 Rev3oh2 : Reports on CBS and Fox News now of everyone getting out safely, although with some injuries....
160 Post contains images Pilot kaz : This is Terrible I Pray for those on board.
161 Post contains images EZEIZA : Now that is good news
162 DL021 : My prayers go out to the passengers and crew of that plane, and their families.
163 Flashmeister : There's a secondhand passenger account on the audio stream I'm listening to: Reports that they were too high, then quickly lost altitude and hit the r
164 AsstChiefMark : The explosion that happened several minutes after the crash... It appeared to come from the front of the aircraft. Could that have been oxygen tanks?
165 Vsa340 : The Pilot and Co Pilot are safe. There was 291 passengers on the aircraft. Jamie
167 Cainanuk : About 15 minutes ago, the dingbat anchorwomanon Sky News speculated that because of this, all Airbus aircraft must be unsafe and that perhaps the CAA
168 Longhaulheavy : Numerous reports now saying that survivors were picked up by motorists on the freeway. (CP24, CFRB)
169 FutureFO : What site are you listening to streaming from. Sean
170 Venezuela747 : Yeah a spotter on CNN called in he said he was on the highway parallel to the runway, apparently the aircraft overran the runway and there are no barr
171 Ppostro : My prayers are with everyone on board. CNN, my god, please get these guys educated on reporting these events, i love the sensationalism of their repor
172 Post contains images TFSPhoto :
173 Philb : Given the frequency of summer storms does Pearson have active or passive windshear and microburst detection systems?
174 Post contains links Schipholjfk : An Air France passenger jet overruns a runway at Toronto's International Airport and burst into flames, CNN confirms. http://www.cnn.com/2005/WORLD/am
175 Post contains links Pilot kaz : Live Stream: http://www.pulse24.com/Plugins/CP24Live/popup_player.asp?speed=56
176 Hrhf1 : We're now in the official 'nobody really knows anything' phase on CBC. They're interviewing a televsion host that works for them who flies a F*&king C
177 PVD757 : Nice picture, any ideas which way is north on the map?
178 Henny : Horrible for AF, ghastly for Toronto Aiport, and shear hell for those passengers. God pray they get the hell off in time.
179 KC135TopBoom : White smoke now, that is good, they are getting a hand on the fire and putting it out.
180 TedTAce : Someone saying that the AC was struck by lightning on landing...
181 Post contains links and images TFSPhoto :
182 Jj : Just one thought... CNN seams to be talking about windshear all the time... but had it been a windshear the plane would have crashed before the runway
183 Backfire : From A.net judging by some of the wild speculation here - and given that CNN is interviewing a spotter (gotta love the reliable news sources) then it
184 FutureFO : They are reporting on CNN that there are a few survivors. No word as to how many. Sean
185 Post contains links Vegasplanes : It just came up on yahoo. http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20050802/ap_on_re_ca/canada_plane_crash
186 ScarletHarlot : CTV reports nine planes have diverted from Pearson. Also showing interesting footage from crash in same place in 1978. AC DC-9. No fire, and many surv
187 Vasi : Today we had thunderstorm after thunderstorm in YYZ, the first one coming over the city centre at around 11:30 am. Left our warehouse at around 30 min
188 Post contains links and images Andz : guess you gotta be fast to post in this kind of thread![Edited 2005-08-02 23:29:45]
189 Boeing7E7 : Wow... Not much of a safety area with the drop off. Not good.
190 Texan : how bout we hold off on the rest of the conjecture until the news conference unless some facts quickly become known. Texan
191 Post contains links and images Cbphoto : Here she is View Large View MediumPhoto © Kazim Alikhan - t.dot photography Very Sad..I hope there are no fatalities, God be with them!!
192 EnviroTO : CNN has had the worst coverage of the news networks available in Canada but the best quality picture. CNN is focusing on microbursts even though the p
193 YYZUla : I am watching the local news right now. So far they are sayig that their are no reports of casualties, but many have been sent to local hospitals. Pil
194 AviationMaster : It's amazing how all the news channels are acting as if they invented aviation.
195 FlyCaledonian : BBC News 24 quoting eyewitness who says plane made good landing, thrust reversers deployed (Heard them) but plane continued straight off the end of th
196 Pilot kaz : Last I heard 60, Pilots in hospital apprently.
197 Boeing7E7 : No doubt... I love the qualifying statements... I visited Airbus in France and.... Etc...
198 EnviroTO : One quote from a stewardess is they think they got everyone out but wasn't 100% sure.
199 Post contains links Phkrs : live stream at www.clickondetroit.com... 'Eyewitness: I saw that they had enough time to get EVREYONE off the plane'
200 ScarletHarlot : Why has thread been retitled that some are dead? We have no confirmation of deaths yet, as we have no confirmation of all survivors either. Eyewitness
201 Pflueeb : You'd think they would invent a type of automatic fire hose sprayer situated on the ends of runways. They could be tall platforms which could be robot
202 Jumbolino : German television (ARD) said that it was due to the heavy rain but they don't know more about aircraft/route than it was an Airbus from Air France (th
203 Hmmmm... : Simply not true. He said there were no survivors. There were survivors. He said that accident is not survivable. That accident was and is survivable.
204 Aggieflyboi04 : CNN is reporting that there are surivors wondering around the secen and that one of the pilots was on his way to the hospitol. News confrence coming u
205 KC135TopBoom : FoxNews says the live pictures are because the A-340 crashed near a traffic camera on the 401.
206 1MillionFlyer : They probably said it came out of the clouds on fire too. Witnesses are very bad about those types of details. A microburst could have caused the acc
207 Post contains links and images Gdabski : CNN also mentioned this 1993 acident in WAW in reference to reports that the aircraft had problems with braking. Weather conditions are similar too. h
208 Jamman : BBC News 24 are getting pilots to comment over the phone seem to be good non sensational reporting. Also receiving reports from CTV. Main fire seemed
209 ScarletHarlot : CTV showing earlier pictures: Fire at back of A340, but not fully engulfed. DEFINITELY Air France, can see "CE" on the fuselage. Wow, you can see it b
210 FutureFO : They are still saying on CNN form the gentleman from the Globe and Mail that there were about 290 pax onboard. Saying that the a/c carried anywhere fr
211 Post contains images Backfire : Typical A.net. Slag off the news channels for trying to do a tough job with little information, but steal all their reports to cut and paste here.
212 Kaitak : F-GLZQ, LN 289, in service with AF since Sept 1999. JP shows config as J36Y236, so add a significant number of crew (surely not 19?) and you come clos
213 KL808 : The aircraft would have survived if the ditch wasnt there! Drew
214 DL021 : GlobalTV is currently reporting zero fatalities. Let's keep our fingers crossed.
215 Post contains links FlyCaledonian : BBC News 24 just had close-up pictures. Front two-thirds of aircraft and wings clearly visible and intact. Fire was coming from rear third of fuselage
216 Aloges : This is very bad, I wish all pax and crew the best. Heard someone on CNN Int'l talk about the LH A320 that skidded off at WAW in 1993 (?) due to the b
217 Slider : This is the most plausible recap I've heard yet. Reasonable.... Can anyone refresh my memory as to how the 340's fuselage is mated? Two sections near
218 RJ111 : Some unconfirmed reports are saying everyone survived. However i'd imagine there where a few fatalities, but talk of bus loads of people evacuating is
219 Trekster : As would be expected, the Air France website appears to be down. Reports saying Captain and Co Pilot alive, but i dont trust the news. Just seen a rep
220 Longhaulheavy : GlobalTV say no fatalities. CP24 says airport is closed.
221 Halibut : Just heard that too from a different news outlet ! Hope for the best ![Edited 2005-08-02 23:44:20]
222 SKYSERVICE_330 : And you know this how.....?
223 Mikephotos : I'm not familiar with YYZ (or the exact details of this accident so far) but wondering if an arrestor bed would have helped? Mike
224 AC777233LR : PAX on the flight being interviewed on CBC NOW![Edited 2005-08-02 23:43:31]
225 Boeing7E7 : Not necessarily. However, US airports are feverishly working to improve airport safety areas for exactly this reason by either ensuring a 1,000' Safe
226 Londoncenter : Windshear is a sudden change in wind velocity which occurs faster than an aircraft can adjust its own speed to accomodate it. Therefore it could be a
227 TacSupport1 : I hate the geniuses who say to the likes of "I wouldn't hold out much hope for survival" etc etc. Totally inappropriate and disrespectful comments, es
228 BoeingPride800 : CNN is reporting there are no fatalities so far. It's an Air France Airbus A340. Pilot and co-pilot survived. Smoke and some fire visible on CNN live
229 KL808 : im speculating. of course if there was a flat piece of land the aircraft stays horizontal. With a ditch the plane droped into the ditch and might hav
230 Brido : This is another testament to the power and importance of Flight Attendant emergency training. This is why the Flight Attendants sit near the doors, ev
231 Pflueeb : rub me Scarlet--the rules say "NO CRITICIZING of others"
232 Longhaulheavy : Estimated time to news conference 15 minutes. (6pm local). Although we all know that at times like this, we may be waiting longer than that until they
233 Trekster : Hey, stop bitching guys. This is a serious situation, u wanna bitch, open a thread in non av Hopefully, from what is being said, there are alot of sur
234 EZEIZA : Hey, a survivor is being interviewed on CNN now!
235 Philhyde : How would an eyewitness know that?
236 Udo : It was just a matter of time for the WAW accident to be thrown in... So what? Many people do a tough job every day. The journalists should simply not
237 AC777233LR : According to the passenger being interviewed CBC: Interior lights turned off directly after landing He saw lightning He escaped from the rear of the p
238 Efranrider : Detroit News interviewed (live) a stewardess and a passenger, and they both say that there are no fatalities. Aircraft landed, overran runway, power s
239 VS747SPUR : My prayers are with all those involved. How comes this was the only plane that done this though and not others before it ? Very sad indeed VS747SPUR
240 BHXFAOTIPYYC : French pax being interviewed on Sky News, stating "power went out about 1 minute before touchdown"
241 AlitaliaMD11 : Just heard someone trying to blame it on the fly-by wire system. Apparently a lot of people got out of the plane. Miracles do happen!
242 Efcar98 : they have survivors on CNN International
243 Aloges : He said that one minute before they crashed, the lights in the cabin went out completely. Of course, one minute can be anything from a few seconds to
244 Longhaulheavy : Passenger Olivier DuBois? saying that aircraft lost power just before touchdown.
245 Tom_EDDF : The warsaw comment made on CNN does not apply to this plane. The acutators on the airbus fbw aircraft have been changed.
246 Andz : Newsguy interviewing another passenger says "we're glad you're safe, and welcome to Canada!"
247 Post contains images Msl747 : Holy crap, just turned on CNN! God, I hope there are no fatalities .... But I fear that isn't the case... -Msl747
248 BlueSky1976 : CNN now: "everyone got out alive, there are some injuries"
249 KL808 : Thats exactly what I mean, if there was a 1000 feet safety area then maybe the aircraft would have still been intact. The ravine COULD HAVE BEEN the
250 Blackhawk144 : Did he say where? Anthony
251 TWAMD-80 : There is now a reporter from City TV that is reporting that all passengers have made it out of the airplane, although some have serious injuries. I ho
252 Post contains images Aloges : That would clear up the CNN guy's uncertainty. I hope that it will turn out one of these is appropriate:
253 3204ever : all pax made it out alive.......
254 ZOTAN : Sounds like everyone got out ok. Thank god everyone is ok.
255 KC135TopBoom : Global TV is interviewing a "professional pilot" he says he has had a private pilot license for almost 1 year now. The news media is so stupid. FoxNew
256 STARalliance24 : They say all passengers survived.LUCKLY!!! And they also say thunder could be the cause of the crash!!! Weird. No?
257 TACAA320 : I sincerely hope that everybody on board [passengers and crew] are alive.
258 RJ111 : That's terrific news!
259 Blackbird1331 : Talk about miracles. Everyone survived. This pilot should quit while he is ahead.
260 PHKRS : live stream at BBC: 'Survivor: I believe the plane was full' 'Toronto City Television: ALL passengers are safe'
261 Post contains images EZEIZA : Most sources are saying everyone survived!! Yup, miracles do happen CNN Intl is now questioning ATC's responsability as to why they allow planes to la
262 STARalliance24 : 243 passengers aboard all survived. Thank God!
263 Trintocan : I am truly shocked by this crash. I just put on BBC News 24, as I usually do to get the latest news and I am presented with this horrible story. There
264 B707Stu : It's looking like most survived, if not all. Good news. That's what I'm hearing.
265 Longhaulheavy : CFRB: Everyone is off, no reported fatalities, 3 buses taken to medical services. 4 pax to regular hospital, 1 to pediatric hospital.
266 BCal10 : Survivor speaking on BBC News 24 says plane lost power before it landed. Could this be the effects of a lightning strike and and could this effect the
267 Jetpixx : This is exactly 20 years to the day since a windshear incident downed a DL L1011 in DFW - Aug. 2, 1985. It sounds like this worked out a lot better...
268 Aloges : The Beeb is acknowledging cabin crew's efforts and their training... very well deserved, as it seems!
269 QuestAir : CNN says no fatalities.
270 KennyK : I see a 100+ Quincys are off like a shot, almost every major accident or incident comes down to not one cause but many. Jumping the gun does not help,
271 AC777233LR : Eyewitness on cbc says plane deployed reversers then started swerving form side to side also saying reports of no casualties
272 Aither : This would be miraculous !
273 Sabena332 : YEEEEEEEEEESSSSSSSS!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Great news!!! Patrick
274 PipoA380 : I'm hearing now that in Canada, the crew reminds people the safety rules just before the landing.. is that true? I also just heard that all passengers
275 British767 : 291 pax. All out alive.
276 Post contains images ATAIndy : CNN reports all aboard survived. Thank God.
277 Cruiser : CP24 just confirmed that there was 243 people on this flight.
278 LGA777 : Very ironic that the 3 most recent photo's of this aircraft on this site where taken at YYZ ! Looks like all AC fliights between LGA-YYZ are cancelled
279 KL808 : The crew must have done an excellent job. Thank goodness everybody survived. Drew
280 LoveDFW : If this turns out to be weather related ( Big ' if ' at this point ) -- how ironic that it is exactly 20 years to the day as DL 191.....
281 YOWza : Certain Canadian outlets are saying there are no known casualties at this time. Fire crews were at the scene in about 45 seconds. Pilot and FO were am
282 STARalliance24 : Where will the rest of the flights coming to toronto be diverted!?!
283 ScarletHarlot : Yes. Had this happen on SEA-YYZ.
284 Blackhawk144 : Considering the plane broke in two...there were 2 good-sized explosions...there was fire nearly everywhere as it looked, it is nothing short of amazin
285 DL021 : A French pax being interviewed says there were flames as they left the aircraft. He says they were delayed in landing, then as they came in seemed to
286 N270ft : FoxNews just said that it was lightning. I thought that planes didn't come down due to lightning.
287 Climb1 : 291 Pax and Crew on board. Latest update from BBC. At the moment it "appears" no one lost their life.
288 SAS-A321 : CNN is showing earlier pictures from the crash and it seems as if the spoilers are not up! But as the guy talking said, it is difficult to see!
289 PHKRS : BBC: '291 pax aboard...ALL SAFE'
290 S.P.A.S. : VirginA346, Almost sure it was F-GLZQ according reply #107 Luck, a good crew and some divine help indeed helped to save all on board. Cheers, Salz
291 YULQC : No fatalities apparently confirmed by Air France also Thank God!
292 AAFLT1871 : Question, Is that a stationary traffic camera providing the live video? If so, they would have the crash captured on it. Just wondering, I will to con
293 ScarletHarlot : I have not yet heard confirmation of all passengers surviving on CTV. Should be a news conference any time now. CTV reports all passengers surviving a
294 SAS330GOT : City news "A340-300 the biggest airbus" A380? Good everyone seem to have lived. My thought with the injured. Pulse 24 reports that the Airbus 340 is a
295 Post contains images TWAMD-80 : Yeah CNN is saying a lot of things. Miles O'brien has at least 10 different scenarios as to what happened. Maybe he should try to get a job with the
296 Trekster : Air France website saying No problems reported, but i do belive they have better things to do at the moment Just listening to Eric moody talking again
297 ScarletHarlot : CBC.ca confirming NO FATALITIES!!!!! YES!!!!!!
298 Post contains links and images Phxplanes : Here is the news from phoenix Air France 340 http://phoenix.cox.net/cci/newsnatio...aximized&view=article&id=D8BNUK5O0 Got a pick to
299 Rtfm : Press confernece live on BBC streaming reporting that all survived with 14 minor injuries. Great result considering the initial pictures!!
300 HBIHLtoEZE : Oh yes! This is indeed wonderful, worst's best. if only all plane crashes ended like this fairy tale.
301 AsstChiefMark : What is the accent of the spokeman on TV now? His name is Steve Shaw. Mark[Edited 2005-08-03 00:10:21]
302 Post contains images Msl747 : Thank god everyone is ok! -Msl747
303 Dc10guy : Just heard CNN report 14 injured. If only 14 people where injured and everyone else got out .... Great job Air France Crew !!!! Probably was a bad dec
304 AC777233LR : Airport Manager saying all survived
305 PHKRS : BBC covering live News Conference: 'Plane skid 200 metres off runway' 'Fire broke out AFTER evacuation'
306 A388 : Yep, CNN had Mr. Gord Martineau from Anchor City tv (don't know who he is) who says all passengers were evacuated safely before the aircraft caught fi
307 ScarletHarlot : Wow, a reporter has asked the GTAA guy, Steve Shaw, how everybody surviving makes him feel. I think he almost cried. He went silent and looked down fo
308 Venezuela747 : The guy in the news conference said 297 passengers and 14 crew members...thank god no death, just 14 minor injuries
309 YOWza : The guys is an He's Australian by the sound of things. YOWza
310 Hrhf1 : The cameras are movable and was probably just set to monitor traffic at the time of the crash. Perhaps there was a lucky shot of it, but it would be
311 Venezuela747 : The guy in the news conference said 297 passengers and 14 crew members...thank god no death, just 14 minor injuries
312 Dash8Pilot : Eyewitness are saying that the first Officer got out of the plane safely and walked to 401, flagged a motorist down and went to the hospital. Apparent
313 Tommy777 : You guys are worse than a sewing circle! Some of you should stop opening your pieholes before you know for sure what’s going on when there are lives
314 Pilot kaz : Great news that everyone got out safe, lets hope all the injured make a full recovery, Well done AF Crew!
315 David L : But, as one of those interviewed said, it may well have stopped the aircraft ploughing across the highway. It's all looking so much better now. Anyon
316 FlyTweed : I could be wrong, but if they were under a red alert and not allowing any activity to depart from the airport, why was the acft allowed to land? I wou
317 Boeing7E7 : Creepie.... Considering wind sheer/microburst is a potential contributing factor.
318 Palladium : The pilot now are being treated in local hospital, 14 passengers suffuered minor injuries and it appears they manage to evacuate all the passengers sa
319 AIHTOURS : My thoughts and prayers are with everyone affected by this terrible Crash. The BBC are reporting that all passengers have survived. That is excellent
320 Venezuela747 : Does anyone know the diversions from YYZ?
321 SAS330GOT : now when we have reports of only injuries... we have a massive death in CLOTHES and Carry on items. hope the computers did not suffer. poor PAX loosin
322 Tsnamm : a local Toronto weather woman said at the time of the crash wind gusts exceeded 100KMH...strangely enough an eyewitness who sounded like he understood
323 Climb1 : 297pax and 12 crew. Reuters (or however u spell it!)
324 PHKRS : Reuters: 279 Pax and 12 crew aboard. No fatalities.
325 TWPHIL : Confirmed by Air France all 297 pax and 12 crew members ALL ALIVE.14 pax injured seriously..Thats great news at this stage.
326 Ari : It's great that everyone is ok......what effect will this have on the aviation industry for the next couple of days...months????? ari
327 AeroPeru : According to MSNBC right now, 297 on board with 14 minor injuries. Hopefully, that's an accurate number. Our prayers are with all involved.
328 Socal : I just listen to Fox News and they said the A340 over shot the runway...this is terrible.....I hope everyone is safe
329 BCal10 : Latest report 297+12 on board. No known fatalaties. 14 taken to hospital.
330 PHLapproach : Alright, I have been listening to the 15:30 and 16:00 archives on liveatc.net 15:30 Archive 23:49 AFR358 down to 5000 25:19 AFR358 down to 4000 26:05
331 BoogyJay : Thanks GOD, everyone seems to be OK! I hope that will remain true. My mum is on duty right now at the French Foreign Ministry. She gets all calls, rep
332 Noelg : FBOWeb is showing 5 flights within a radius of 50 miles of YYZ right now...there's normally dozens showing up around YYZ so I imagine it must be causi
333 Hrhf1 : Wouldn't have happened. If you know the area, or have seen the ariel photos the runway parallels the highway, but supposing it was clear field the ai
334 Post contains images FlyGuyClt : Kudos to a fast acting crew and passengers that there were no fatalities ! Safe Flying
335 ScarletHarlot : CBC.ca reports landings are diverting to Ottawa.
336 Post contains links LorM : 20 years ago today, on August 2, 1985, a Delta Air Lines Lockheed L1011-385-1 crashed while attempting to land at Dallas/Ft. Worth Airport, Texas in a
337 Milan320 : Media in T.O. keeps reporting that no fatalities ... great news for that!!! 30 people taken to hospital /Milan320
338 PHKRS : New video now showing at least front half of the plane not affected by fire. Fire was in the back part which broke apart.
339 Post contains images Mtnmanmakalu : Kudos to my fellow F/A's for getting everybody off the airplane safely!! CNN is reporting no deaths and 14 minor injuries- pretty good considering!! S
340 RTFM : Great video on BBC streaming at the moment - closer shots of fire-fighting vehicles in action...
341 TACAA320 : Thanks God everybody is alive!
342 B744F : Why were the pilots the first to leave the airplane... and why did the FO flag a motorist down and take himself/herself to a hospital without seeing
343 David L : That type of question really gets my goat. Take a frickin' guess!
345 Qantas744ER : Hey i watched on CNN the past 2hours Toronto airport authority Just had a press conference 297 passenger onboard no fatalities. plane is A airbus A340
346 Vulindlela744 : Well, this situation seems to have the best possible outcome. CNN is reporting no lives lost. GREAT!!!!! I work as a f/a for a major US airline so I a
347 Post contains images Muchswatch : everyone's alive? Great!!! now I can have my dinner.
348 Post contains images Aloges : Probably because they have their own escapes and are better trained than the passengers.
349 Grimey : I did a search of F-GLZQ on A.netters and if you check out Photo ID: 766121, someone has edited the text already. Spooky? Grimey
350 BCal10 : Anybody got a reg from Acars?
351 Keesje : it is completely burning down i just saw the tail falling down..
352 Hjulicher : It's surprising that the crew did decide to land. When I have flown on AF, it seems to me that they are overly cautious, and I remember everytime we w
353 PADSpot : All people survived, although some got some scratches ... on the other hand the airplane is surely a write-off. But insurances will certainly pay for
354 Venezuela747 : CNN interviewed this guy who was on board the plane at the very back..Major kudos and congrats on the F/A for doing their job and helping everyone who
355 Post contains images EZEIZA : If it is confirmed that there are no fatalities and only minor injuries ( ), then I see no major negative effect on the aviation industry. No deaths
356 Glideslope : CNN has an interview on with a passenger from 48A. He states that 30-45 sec prior to touchdown all the cabin lights went out. He states the cabin was
357 ETStar : Looks like KLM is flying out of SYR (point of diversion) to Montreal, as opposed to back to YYZ.
358 Rotate : this really looked bad-thankful everybody okay ...
359 Scbriml : In the press conf. Steve Shaw said that the red-alert system just stops all ground work. It doesn't stop planes landing or taking off. If a plane lan
360 MUCflieger : slightly off topic, but I�m too curios: is Corey Marx speaking with a typical Canadian accent?
361 Scotland1979 : Shocking after learning this news... what registrataion # anybody? My heart goes to all passengers/crews
362 Aloges : Hey, could you guys please just ignore them and suggest deletion? After all, pissing you off is just what they want to do.
363 HBIHLtoEZE : Quoting ConcordeBoy (Reply 344): This is actually pretty cool: one A340 dead, and everyone else in good condition. Good stuff Come on, this is way too
364 MEL : Winnipeg is receiving several diversions: ACA180 Vancouver-Toronto B763 - divert to Winnipeg ACA1152 Vancouver-Toronto B762 - divert to Winnipeg ACA2
365 GLAGAZ : Thankfully everyone is safe !! Lets give it a few hours to see what really happened. A survivor said that all power went out just before touchdown. Th
366 Speedbrds : Latest video on MSNBC shows the entire tail section practically melts of from the intense fire.
367 SAS330GOT : I was thinking as they are saying that the wheels where blown on landing and that the fire was in the back. Could the fire has been started by brakes
368 UA777222 : It is procedure to turn the lights out during arrival/depature as it causes your eyes to dilate and could hamper your evacuation speed in the case of
369 Vfw614 : How far away from the crash site are the emergency services based ? Witnesses said they were on the scene in as little as 30 seconds, so the reaction
370 Canuckpaxguy : Thankfully everyone appears to have made it alive. Traffic is at a stand-still all over the city and I can smell the burning aircraft from house 21 km
371 AlitaliaMD11 : Apparently Ottawa was sopposed to be the diversion destination but weather conditions are not good there so planes have diverted to BUF and SYR. That
372 FlyGuyClt : Even though people can hide behind a keyboard and be anonymous on here. You still have an online reputation. So let the ones who type evil things stan
373 Canuckpaxguy : The GTAA has its own emergency services on the ground. There are several hospitals nearby also. G
374 PVD757 : Could YYZ have a proceedure in place for crews to be on standby to assist during bad weather? 30 seconds is extremely quick for a response time.
375 Skyguy : Fantastic news that there was no loss of life, I hope the injuries to any of the passengers are not too serious. Aircraft probably aquaplaned just at
376 Post contains links and images AlitaliaMD11 : The ill-faited plane that will probably never grace our skies again View Large View MediumPhoto © Anthony Jackson View Large View MediumPhoto &co
377 DL021 : Just saw a closeup of the vert stab and a winglet. It appears that the fire is reduced to smoldering now. A 'well done' to Air France, YYZ EMS and Fir
378 Post contains links Boeing7E7 : What's really sad is that in terms of the over-run, thus the impending injuries and hull loss this may have been avoidable. The aircraft came to rest
379 Post contains links Jyatlantic : Article on Yahoo just came out: http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20050802/ap_on_re_ca/canada_plane_crash
380 Canuckpaxguy : Emergency services at GTAA were on standby as YYZ was on red-alert due to heavy lightning activity. G
381 Mtnmanmakalu : Probably?? I think that is quite an understatement!!!
382 YOWguy : YOW has it regular flights arriving and departing except those to YYZ ...no flights out of the ordinary. They are expecting the same weather cell here
383 Post contains images N751PR : Here's a few shots of F-GLZQ: Thank heavens there were no fatalities....
384 Refueler1974 : Thank God that everyone survived! My hat's off to the pilots and the cabin crew who, in the worst of times, performed their emergency evac duties as t
385 Floorrunner : Last I heard, Toronto is Closed and they were diverting to Ottawa.
386 Post contains links and images UA777222 : So much for the media... Matt
387 Vfw614 : Sure, I was aware of that. I was wondering if the location where these emergency services are based is somewhere nearby the crash site. While they ar
388 Trintocan : Well, the news that everybody onboard was safely evacuated is reassuring - it reflects the professionalism of the crew onboard the stricken plane and
389 Flynavy : I'm glad everyone escaped safely. What angered me was an MSNBC anchor implying that the "tank traps" were dangerous and potentially hazardous. I'll gi
390 Goose : Hamilton, London (YXU) and Montreal are getting diversions as well.
391 FlyMIA : Could lighting really cause this? I really dont think so. Lighting has never been known to crash an airliner. Or really make any serious problems.
392 Usnseallt82 : Wow, I just now caught wind of this. I'm glad everyone's relatively okay. Wild that everyone got out of that without any problems but good!
393 Milan320 : Quoting ConcordeBoy (Reply 344): This is actually pretty cool: one A340 dead, and everyone else in good condition. Good stuff What's his respect ratin
394 Post contains images Birdbrainz : It's way to early for speculation but I'm just curious... There was a report that it was zapped by lightning after it landed. It it possible that a se
395 Mir : First off all, fantastic news to hear that nobody was hurt. From the images on TV, that's truly impressive. Two witnesses (passengers on the plane) ar
396 M404 : BlatantEcho It's an expression no matter what. By restricting their speech as you are doing you are actually the one preaching a "theology" You have y
397 OPNLguy : Weather at the time.... Time of accident reportedly 2003Z... CYYZ 022100Z 18013KT 8SM -TSRA BKN055 BKN140 22/19 A3004 RERA RMK SC5AC2 CB ASOCTD FU ALF
398 Post contains images Craviation : CNN Latin America showed an image from Airliners.net to illustrate the Air France A340....only that they used an A321 image!!! Way to go Press!!! Alwa
399 FutureFO : Well all of you that do not listen to the safety briefings from us F/A's this may teach you a lesson. Remember that we are there for your safety and s
400 Tom_EDDF : I'm wondering about a couple of things here: - why did the fire, as it looks like, brake out in the aft fuselage section? As far as I know there's no
401 Ushermittwoch : Good job on the Air France website: "No particular event to be reported at this time on our whole network. For information about our flights, please r
402 CV580Freak : Well I see that this thread broke up a few previous friendships....... On another matter, the KLM flight that diverted to SYR declared a fuel emergenc
403 SAS330GOT : In my believes lighting is almost harmless to a airplane that size. There has been reports of the plane was "slammed" down onto the runway. It was hi
404 ZakHH : Couldn't agree more. There is several eyewitness statements (incl. pax) that indicate a possible lightning strike just as the plane touched down. Som
405 Post contains images Climb1 : Sooo glad that it worked out ok. Thank god for that! Just been listening to the recording from ATC at YYZ (thanks to LorM ) if you listen to the secon
406 Liedetectors : Since everyone else is posting on this thread I thought I'd get in on the action too.
407 LipeGIG : Reading your post, should we can face some "Ground the A340-300 Fleet" during a more detailed investigation ? Or it's early to this ? Felipe
408 N754AN : And the above is your contribution right? Very constructive isn't it.
409 BristolFlyer : And the US site for AF is down. BF
410 Kykevin54 : Comparing this accident where no lives were lost to the terrorist attacks of 9/11 is not exactly a tasteful remark. A joke about a runway overrun, al
411 SAS330GOT : the accent of the airport pokesperson i think was south african.
412 Starlionblue : "A witness, Corey Marx, said, "Everything looked good, sounded good. It hit the runway nice, then all of a sudden we heard the engines backing up." It
413 YYZatcboy : Wow that was intense. I could not pick up anything on my scanner after the crash on the south tower or Terminal Control Unit freqs. Very happy that ev
414 JAL : I'm glad no one was seriously hurt or killed.
415 Airbazar : Lightening in flight may not be a big issue, but this was lightening on the ground or at least at a very critical stage of the flight, right before t
416 Luisca : They just said on CNN that all the lights went out just before touchdown, but that it felt like a normal landing, hard but normal. The reporter also s
417 Post contains images Ushermittwoch : That must have just happened after I was on it.
418 Starlionblue : Indeed. But if the lights went out right before shutdown, this may (yes I am speculating) indicate a lightning strike. However this should not have a
419 Leskova : The suggestion has already been made, so, unfortunately, it's not too early... THANK GOODNESS THAT EVERYONE GOT OUT ALIVE! Let's just hope that none
420 ScarletHarlot : Yes, I think so.
421 YOWza : I did not actually compare the two events I was simply illustrating that people are more sensitive to things closer to them than those that are not.
422 Tom_eddf : I know there're stabilizer tanks on the A340 but the fire - at least that's how it looked like on the TV pictures - broke out about 10 feet or so for
423 Post contains images Ushermittwoch : Actually it still works for me at least. Must be that Elite status I've got with them and after seeing how GREAT their emergency procedures work, I am
424 Arsenal@LHR : It's a relief that all the passengers walked away unharmed, most crashes are fatal. Initial pictures on the news made it look quite nasty, but the fac
425 Post contains images LorM : - how does braking work on FBW aircraft? If all sources of braking power, i.e. wheel brakes and spoilers, are actuated by electrical power, which migh
426 EZEIZA : Isn't that quite normal on landings? Maybe it was an unusual way in ehich the lights went off, but I recall light off on most flights during landing.
427 Indy : I think that all survived is absolutely incredible news. I can only imagine the emotional rollercoast ride the families went on upon hearing the news
428 Espion007 : Yea usually lights are turned off before landing as a safety precaution.
429 Thenoflyzone : Glad to see everyone is safe! Now...on to the diversions! Here are the ones I know about: BAW93 from LHR diverted to YOW BAW99 from LHR to YUL AFL303
430 Tom_eddf : Well, a lot of suggestions have been made on CNN, Fox etc. but I'd say it's unlikely that they'll ground the entire A340 fleet. I also found it inter
431 Comorin : Great crew, great outcome. I wonder if the fact that the plane was low on fuel (after a long flight) helped delay the fire?
432 StarAC17 : CBC has reported that because of the heavy rainfall that the plane could have hydroplaned when touching town and therefore could not stop, and also an
433 Thenoflyzone : All planes are slowly making their way back to YYZ now. Each one is individually asked by ATC if they are able to accept the fact that there is no cra
434 Palladium : If I were on that doomed plane and survived , I as a passenger wouldn't be able to describe what was just happened, I would be like stunned for quiet
435 Cruiser : I am just listening to YYZ Approach, and it sounds as though planes are beginning to land again, but are being advised that "No crash fire vehicles ar
436 Canuckpaxguy : Me too! Planes are flying over my house now. Has YYZ actually reopened already? Wow. G
437 Olympus69 : A short while ago I got home from YYZ, where I had been hoping to get a picture of a Saudi Arabian B747SP that was expected at about 4:15 ET. I was in
438 Phollingsworth : I agree that the FDR "tapes" may be very educational. While I believe that the the thrust reversers are probably not critical (if they were the pilot
439 Post contains images Espion007 : Well since No one has died we can start joking now "It was on autopilot!!"
440 YOWguy : Some are diverting to other airports...because of fire vehicles not available. Insurance dictates that there is fire coverage. Some AC flights and oth
441 EMBQA : UA777222...reply 418... So much for the media... So tell me what's wrong with those numbers...? They look exactly the same as what's on Airbus.com...?
442 SAS330GOT : Crash fire service will be available at YYZ with in 1 hour 1.5 hour. From Liveatc.net sas330got
443 Cruiser : I guess I will answer my own post! I was listening some more, and apparently, many airlines are not allowed to land under these conditions. This is d
444 Glideslope : May the Luck of the Irish be with ya!!!!
445 Simong : Does anyone know what hotel that the Air France crew now stays at in Toronto. We would like to go there with flowers for all the crew members onboard.
446 LipeGIG : At that time we will see a lot of "experts" like ex-capitains talking about the probabilities. Same happen in Brazil when the JJ F100 crashed near CG
447 Post contains links KarlB737 : Video Report Via CTV In Toronto: http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/HTMLTempla...108000-00108119-clip3&subhub=video
448 Derik737 : Though I am not stating what occurred, this accident sounds similar to the Taca 767 in Guatemala City, Guatemala in April, 1993. In that accident the
449 Post contains images Brian_ga : See it really does pay to listen to the safety announcements during pre-flight. Again kudos to Air France and the flight attendants and the passengers
450 Olympus69 : One item I forgot to mention in my rather lengthy post (currently reply 463) was that I heard the tower telling one arriving plane - it could have bee
451 Post contains links and images Captaingomes : I was at work at the time by the airport, and found out pretty shortly afterwards. I could only see the smoke from where I was, and the whole operatio
452 Post contains links and images Mr Spaceman : Hi guys. >> Hello Mir ........ Yes that is correct. The Air France A340 involved in todays crash at YYZ came to rest in almost the exact same spot in
453 Milan320 : liveatc.net has the mp3 archives from today's events at YYZ - 16h00 archive at about 2:15 time stamp in the mp3 file. First diversion went to London,
454 Post contains links and images Sharpnfuzzy : Live 401 traffic Cam http://www.mto.gov.on.ca/english/tra...er/compass/camera/loc37.htm#camera
455 EZEIZA : boy do I remember that one ... both my dad and my uncle were supposed to be on that flight since they frequently flew the SP-Rio ponte aereo for busi
456 Post contains links Aseem : funny part is that The Globe and Mail still says that "a small plane has crashed".. http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servl...50802.wcrash0801/BNStory/Na
457 Post contains links Neverest : Some people are quick to take advantage of any situation. http://www.hshlawyers.com/
458 BeechNut : Yes Transport Canada now requires a safety briefing before landing on all flights greater than 4 hours duration. Mike
459 UA772IAD : All passengers and crew are safe, Thank God! An accident like this, where the airplane overshot the runway makes me VERY skeptical of cell phone usage
460 Spacecadet : Some pax said that the plane came in "much too fast", but I am rather suspicious about such statements, as most pax would certainly have difficulties
461 Post contains images ChrisNH : THE most important thing is that there was no loss of life. For the experts throwing out 'reasons why,' here's mine: There was a cow on the runway.
462 Cltguy : It is clearly the great engineers that designed this plane and the great Air France crew that saved the lives of these people today.
463 Post contains images STARalliance24 : This is going to hurt Air France!!! But at least their where no casulties. The pilot and co-pilot are safe.
464 UA772IAD : Exactly-- that's key to understanding what went on, and I'm certainly not ruling out cell phone usage in my mind. Once again, it's good to see everyo
465 TGV : After 20 years of flying, I finally have an explanation to this fact. Thanks! Now we know everybody is OK, I will, after having praised the AF crew,
466 NBC News1 : Air France is receiving families, friends (maybe passengers?) at the Terminal 3 Sheraton.
467 Jyatlantic : I doubt an automatic landing was in place on this flight. YYZ was under "red-alert" even before AF358 touched down.
468 Starlionblue : There are plenty of survivable crashes. Yes, but note that thrust reversers are not included in landing distance calculations. Yes but reports say th
469 Danny : I was wondering why the hell would you go to Syracuse? It's a 240 miles drive for the pax. Why not London in the first place, and if not why not BUF?
470 Starlionblue : Could be bad weather in BUF. Also can BUF take a transatlantic heavy?
471 Danny : First of all there is London, ON which has 8800ft (which is enough especially in emergency) and had good weather. That is where most of other flights
472 Tom in NO : From reply #370: "How far away from the crash site are the emergency services based ? Witnesses said they were on the scene in as little as 30 seconds
473 Kmh1956 : I've read so many posts on this suject now that my mind is spinning.I think we can glean from this some very important facts: *We should all be thankf
474 Falcon flyer : KLM691 was shown as a 747-400, CYXU might not have been feasible with other aircraft diverting there. It looks like FIN2417 went to london.
475 HZ747300 : Cool, I wonder if someone could snap a picture of the KLM plane in SYR! Other than that, this reminds me of the plane that broke apart on Christmas D
476 YYZatcboy : the KL flight went to SYR and then YUL IIRC
477 VirginA340 : Yeah ........... they arrived, alright... My thoughts and prayers for the people on board and their families.
478 Post contains links Yhmfan : Air France's Press Release: http://www.airfrance.ca/presse/en/yto50802_2.htm Excerpt: The aircraft, an Airbus A340, registered F-GLZQ was received by
479 StevenUhl777 : Amen. But I've read comments on this board implying that f/a's are just that. Pathetic! That's right...it may not dawn on these pax what truly happen
480 KC135TopBoom : You are close, Tom. The first ARFF unit must be at the site (if on the airport) within 3 minutes, all ARFF equipment must be there within 4 minutes (
481 HZ747300 : There was a program on about the MD80 AA crash in Little Rock, ironically, also in wet conditions. The lady at the end of show remembered looking out
482 Fly_yhm : Diversions to YHM There were roughly 6 westjet 737-700 and 1 737-800 Air Canada about 4 A320s and 1 A319 Skyservice had 3 A320s SkyService/Sky Tours 1
483 MissedApproach : I saw the press interviewing a "survivor". That was a close call! Not the crash, the press- he's lucky they didn't suck the blood right out of him! He
484 Post contains images OPNLguy : Understatement of the year...
485 Post contains images TRVYYZ : I went to YYZ, the plane is below the ground level and only smoke can be seen It is really a miracle that all passengers are alive. Saved all of us fr
486 Thenoflyzone : OK....some update on the diversions, continuation wiht regards to my previous post... ACA891 from FCO, diverted to YUL, now safely landed in YYZ ACA81
487 Falcon84 : Well, since I didn't get to join in the "fun", as it were, since I was at work, a few thought: -Amazing the incredible speculation that takes place im
488 TACAA320 : Great pics! Thanks for sharing. Sad event: Any accident is. Happy ending: No casualties to regret.
489 AsstChiefMark : He said people were clapping when they first touched down- wonder how long that lasted? Idiots. Maybe this will put an end to this stupid tradition. D
490 Indy : I've had a mailman in the past that was so bad it was almost necessary.
491 Travatl : Anybody happen to have the routing for this aircraft for the past week? I was on an AirFrance A343 CDG-BOS a week ago today (26JUL05). Due to a tight
492 Lnglive1011yyz : I personally witnessed this flight return to YYZ around 930 pm local time tonite. It was a welcomed site, to be honest. Again, saw this flight return
493 Lnglive1011yyz : That's two crashes for us this year Santhosh. I hope it's the last. Scary. 1011yyz
494 Usnseallt82 : Okay, I'll jump in on this real quick as well. To all those bashing the media...true, they are as ignorant as ever about aviation. But the jumping to
495 Lnglive1011yyz : That may work well when you have ROOM for a 600' arrestor bed. Unfortunately, in this case, you have paved runway, some paved working area (inc. a cr
496 TRVYYZ : Me too.
497 Tnsaf : The investigation will take months to come to the true cause and like all incidents it will be the result of a chain of events, not just one specific
498 Post contains links Ha763 : This may or may not have any relevence, but this accident reminds me of two similar accidents that occurred at PPT. One involved an AF 747-400 (F-GITA
499 Flybynight : Certainly the best outcome for a bad situation. But, man, these TV reporters are annoying. First of all they question if YYZ is safe. The damn area is
500 ScarletHarlot : My God, imagine if this happened on 5. That would have been carnage.[Edited 2005-08-03 06:19:10]
501 Post contains images Jacobin777 : Is this the biggest thread ever on A.net (views/responses)??....I haven't been here long enough to know... that being said...I'm very happy and reliev
502 TACAA320 : Sorry but that sound so bitter. I can't stop clapping AF's crew members and YYZ ground staff for their job... More than 300 persons re-borned today t
503 60Victor : Just glad to hear everybody survived! Well done Air France Crew! It will be interesting to find out if the plane was doing an autoland or a manual lan
504 Post contains links Smeagol : OMG! There was a heavy shower this morning in Beijing and I was shocked to see this news when I finally arrived in office. Check out the news on China
505 Stirling : Since I've been working all day, this is my first chance to chime in. When I first heard about this, I imagined the worst...so pleased and overjoyed t
506 Post contains links and images Flybynight : A much more pleasant look at the same plane View Large View MediumPhoto © Josh Akbar
507 HAWK21M : When will the Preliminary report be out. Wonder what actually caused this. thats the 1st A340 written off I guess. Any official statements. regds MEL
508 Post contains links Jonathan L : A survivor has no nice words for the crew: http://news.yahoo.com/s/cpress/20050.../ca_pr_on_na/plane_crash_survivors
509 Flybynight : Nope, there have been other A340's written off. In fact, Air France had one burn up a few years ago.
510 AC777LR : I just drove past it on my way home from the Coldplay concert, its still smoking at 12:00 and crews are still around it.
511 NW727251ADV : I dont agree. WTF are you two applauding the crew for??? This isn't United Airlines Flight 232. The pilots didnt do anything spectacular. They attemp
512 Post contains images F9Widebody : Sorry Royal, but that is terrible plugging my friend. You don't even have the right reg!
513 AirbusCanada : seat guru reports the two class AF 343 has a capacity of 276 passanges. (240 Econ, 36 bus). Air-France press release said there were the aircraft was
514 Post contains links Shonandai : Decent article at the Globe and Mail. http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servl...50802.waquaplane0802/BNStory/Front
515 A340Spotter : Well some 500 posts into it and time to throw my two cents in... This is the 3rd A340 written off. F-GNIA cn 010 written off by fire at CDG under susp
516 Cltguy : OK Lets Review: #1: This was the 2nd landing attempt for AF538. The first attempt was aborted due to bad weather. #2: The passengers clapped after the
517 IDAWA : I was at YYZ on Jul 29 and my KL 744 was parked next to an AF 343..I seem to remember it was F-GLZQ but I'm absolutely not sure. May anyone check the
518 Post contains images AA767400 : Yes, because screwing in a light bulb is just like landing a plane. It is a nice tradition, and one that makes people feel happy. Most people like it
519 YULQC : Quote: Gwen Dunlop, a Toronto resident who was returning from a summer vacation in France, said she was unimpressed with the way the flight attendants
520 Post contains links and images MEL : Some photos of diversions: -------------------------- Montreal: London-Toronto diversion Budapest-Toronto Moscow-Toronto diversion -------------------
521 UA777222 : Honestly? Just bad weather + poor judgement. However, regarding the poor judgement, you can't really judge ever changing conditions and once you reac
522 Aa777jr : I am so glad no one was killed. Praise God for looking over all of them. Best Regards to the families.
523 Post contains links Jakekwon90 : Yes, I agree. I visited many websites and looked for the Air France Airbus A340-300 capacity, and I found varied numbers, but none as high as 297. (S
524 Baw716 : First,thank God everyone survived. Second, bravo to the Air France crew for getting everyone out before the fire engulfed the entire aircraft. It woul
525 Theredbaron : 56000 views for this thread Holy cow! And they erased my post ! Good thing they are all alive. lets wait for the inquiry, after being in 2 emergency l
526 Olympicbis : This is unbelievable. I read elsewhere she was telling " we were thrown into the rain and into the mud...." What did she expect, to exit the plane an
527 HZ747300 : Infants under 2, perhaps? Just guessing...
528 AlitaliaMD11 : Forgive me if this question was asked before and answered, but are all operations bad to normal at YYZ?
529 Ha763 : Check out the links to the accident reports I posted in reply 498. If points 3 and 4 turn out to be true, it sounds very close to what happened in PP
530 DCrawley : It is fine to not agree, so I will do the exact same with this statement. Why was it necessary to use WTF? The word "Why" was sufficient? Were you in
531 Kykevin54 : Well put, Matt. I read something the other day that made me rethink a bit about how I conduct myself on this forum and elsewhere. It went something li
532 UN_B732 : Well, I believe I know what happened. Could the flight have been booked to 297 pax, while in reality, carying fewer passengers? -Mr. X
533 Post contains links and images LFutia : wow. there's a photo of it already! View Large View MediumPhoto © Lee Thomas
534 Widebody : Aircraft capacity is quoted in seats - the actual pax numbers include childen sitting on laps - i.e. 2 pax per seat. Same mis-understanding comes up i
535 Robcol99 : I think some news agencies corrected the number of passengers to 197 from 297. 197 makes a lot more sense.
536 AMSMAN : Well done to all the Emergency Services who helped out and well done to the crew also for avoiding a major death toll.
537 NumberTwelve : Is that the "forest" German n-tv was talking about? Have to say that it's a shame from a partner broadcast company of CNN to publish lots of cr*p las
538 Bluewave 707 : Thank God all the pax and crew survived! The crew must be commended for getting everyone off the A343 with only injuries. Credit also goes to the YYZ
539 UA777222 : Passengers were quoted as stating it was a completely full flight... and that few passengers on such a popular route? Thanks, Matt
540 Jamesbuk : i know for sure everyone here is thankful to the AF crew on getting how ever many people off the aircraft and i think they have shown that they are re
541 Post contains images Flying Belgian : My deepest congratulations for the professionalism of the whole crew. Being a F/A myself I will give extra congrats to my fellow AF friends who realiz
542 Post contains images Udo : No? It's not a modern aircraft? Is it a classic then and B757 or B767 are stone age aircraft right? Better get some facts before posting... Regards U
543 JumboJim747 : Thank GOD everyone is OK. Terrible news
544 Post contains images AviationMaster : "I think some news agencies corrected the number of passengers to 197 from 297. 197 makes a lot more sense." Nopes, there actually were 297 people on
545 Milan320 : For those of us who either don't know or don't live in T.O, could you enligthen us what's at the end of 5? /Milan320
546 TAP1972 : Congratulations to the AIR FRANCE crew, they did an outstanding job.... CNN was mentioning it was a jumbo jet (not sure if this is a common expression
547 TGV : So the news agencies are wrong (are you surprised?). If you look above (reply 525) you will see that AF official press release mentions 297 PAX and 1
548 FlySSC : The aircraft invoved is F-GLZQ and was fitted with the new "NEV" configuration : 30J/261Y = 291 PAX. The flight was full with 297 PAX on board includi
549 Ryanair737 : Are operations running as normal out of YYZ now? I see that YYZ flights into MAN this morning are a few hours late. Will the accident effect aircraft
550 Vunz : KLM692 from YYZ to AMS today is delayed over 6 hours, zo operations are not not on time yet.
551 Post contains images BoogyJay : This morning, french radio EUROPE 1 reported that "After every passenger got out the plane, and despite the fire having already caught the airframe,
552 B707Stu : Thank You! It's been very interesting watching reactions. It feels like the press, focused on fatalities and using "Miracle on Flight 358" as the lea
553 David L : Agreed, unless she's had a few similar experiences to compare this one to. I suppose it might just be that people react in different ways and a few r
554 CPDC10-30 : Just posting now as this thread was taking forever to load last night. Everyone was calling me trying to find out details yesterday as I work at YYZ (
555 ChrisNH : I love Toronto and Torontonians (or whatever you call them) as much as the next person, but here's Gwen Dunlop from Toronto recounting the experience
556 S.p.a.s. : Cltguy, Are you sure about this? I downloaded the archived audio files on LiveATC.com and it appears that it was the first and only attempt to land. T
557 Olympus69 : Some comments on previous posts. It is pointless to quote reply numbers as they keep changing all the time. (Why are so many posts being deleted?) Fir
558 David L : Well, if you could be sure that an aircraft the size of an A-340 would always skid/slide along the extended runway centreline, then, yes, you could s
559 Henny : The picture shows the reverser buckets extended. A hypothesis would be that biting winds floated the landing of the A340 to 1/3, if not 1/2 way down t
560 Starlionblue : Agreed. While I have no doubt the 340 is well built, similar situations with other widebodies are also quite survivable. The aircraft slid off the ru
561 Falcon84 : Most major news outlest still say 297, not 197. This the same "crap" station you get your Iraq news from, Number 12?
562 Hrhf1 : Indeed it may have. It may also have veered right, cartwheeled forward or landed safely. I've never understood the point of hypothesizing what COULD
563 Olympicbis : Hello ChrisNH, This nice Mrs Gwen is the one I was writing about. I fully agree with your message to that b....h !
564 LH477 : If I ready the map correctly..there is no gulley/ravine at the end of 5L, it ends with Airport Road, a Major street in the GTA with alot traffic and
565 Usnseallt82 : Geez...something horrible happens and you get retards on here posting threads about how stupid the crew was. Those of you who want to keep doing this
566 Ciaran : Could have been worst T/G. Landing an aircraft in a storm is by all accounts "hair raising" even for the most capable of pilots. The fact if it be tru
567 IrishMD11 : Maybe she's just a poor stupid c.w? If fire had broken our on one side only of the aircraft( remember BA 737 in Manchester?), that's reason enough fo
568 Frequentflyer : Well said DCrawley. I think we should be grateful this went perfectly with all souls saved. NW7..ADV, think of how many ways the evac could have gone
569 David L : All I said was that an "expert" said it may have kept the aircraft off the highway. You said it couldn't happen. And my original comment was in respo
570 Post contains links VirginFlyer : This thread has become very long, so for everyone's sake I am going to archive it. A follow on thread can be found here: Air France A340 Off Runway In
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