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Aspen Problem For UA  
User currently offlineJayspilot From United States of America, joined May 2001, 298 posts, RR: 0
Posted (9 years 1 month 4 weeks 20 hours ago) and read 7962 times:

United has run into a problem of finding a replacement airplane for the Air Wisconsin BAE-146 that currently operates on the Ultra-high yield route. United has shown air willy the door after next april and the only other plane that can do the ASE market is a DHC-8, 30 seat prop and they can only do it when the weather is good VFR. In response, United has come back to Willy and asked them to operate a wopping fleet of 4 ageing 146's for 5 yrs into ase. It will be intersting what rates Air willy is willing to operate a fleet that small.

113 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlinePSU.DTW.SCE From United States of America, joined Jan 2002, 7598 posts, RR: 27
Reply 1, posted (9 years 1 month 4 weeks 20 hours ago) and read 7891 times:

Rumor was that Air Whisky wouldn't consider it unless United wanted to operate at a minimum of 10 146's. They said anything fewer was completely uneconomical for them.

If they don't come to an agreement, they will basically hand the market over to NW who operates the Avro RJ-85 operated by Mesaba into ASE. XJ is even operating service this summer on MSP-ASE.


User currently offlineQuickmover From United States of America, joined Mar 2004, 2494 posts, RR: 0
Reply 2, posted (9 years 1 month 4 weeks 20 hours ago) and read 7861 times:

Couldn't they use a 737 with a light fuel load?

User currently offlineSegmentKing From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 3, posted (9 years 1 month 4 weeks 19 hours ago) and read 7860 times:

United's efforts to go "cheap" will only cost them in the long run.

User currently offlineAirbazar From United States of America, joined Sep 2003, 8412 posts, RR: 10
Reply 4, posted (9 years 1 month 4 weeks 19 hours ago) and read 7806 times:

But how high yield is Aspen really? I'd think that if it was that good, you're see more airlines flying into there and that's not the case. Most of the rich people who fly into Aspen do it on private aircraft, not regularly schedulled flights.

Right now, on Expedia, I can buy a 1st Class ticket from BOS for this weekend (leaving today and returning on Monday), for $1200. I can also buy an economy ticket for only $373 on UA with 2 week's advanced purchase. That's dirt cheap.


User currently offlineCommavia From United States of America, joined Apr 2005, 11712 posts, RR: 62
Reply 5, posted (9 years 1 month 4 weeks 19 hours ago) and read 7796 times:

Quoting Airbazar (Reply 4):
But how high yield is Aspen really? I'd think that if it was that good, you're see more airlines flying into there and that's not the case.

ASE is very high-yield. The reason that only two airlines fly there is because it is a relatively inaccessible airport. ARJs are the only jets that can land there, and only NW and UA have access to those planes in the U.S., and the Bombardiers can also land there, but don't have the range to fly really anywhere but within the Rocky Mountain region.


User currently offlineJdaniel001 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 6, posted (9 years 1 month 4 weeks 19 hours ago) and read 7771 times:

Doesn't AA and DL both fly there.....duh...they do. I think? UA should use the 757 P.S. version....that will get the people paying those high fares to ASE.

User currently offlineBNAflyer78 From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 258 posts, RR: 0
Reply 7, posted (9 years 1 month 4 weeks 19 hours ago) and read 7757 times:

DL flies to EGE near Vail......and they used to go into GUC seasonally, as well as HDN. Not ASE AFAIK.


Long live the Widget!
User currently offlineJayspilot From United States of America, joined May 2001, 298 posts, RR: 0
Reply 8, posted (9 years 1 month 4 weeks 19 hours ago) and read 7732 times:

Ase is a tricky airport. THE crj or erj can not do it while carrying any decient load and get killed doing the single engine things. The only 2 operators of the 146 family in the US are air willy and mesaba. the reason they dominate the market is b/c an engine failure on a 4 engine jet is no factor. Rumors were that the new CRJ-705 or the EMB-175 would have the balls to do it but I dont' think they do.
Corporate jets go in and out of ASE all winter long but dont have the same requirements at the 121 airlines do. plus the air wisconsin, (not sure about mesaba) have much much lower mins do to their expertise and experience in the terrain. Crews have to get special ase qualified doing 4 rides up and down the hill with feds.

as for the ticket prices. ZW's 146's dont have first class. just 86-100 coach seats and its also the middle of the summer, try pricing them x-mas week.. mesaba operates first class AVro's with 16 first class seats and only 68 total to stay below the nwa scope limits, not b/c they want to but b/c they have to.

THis is for ase specifically, not hdn or any other airport.


User currently offlineJayspilot From United States of America, joined May 2001, 298 posts, RR: 0
Reply 9, posted (9 years 1 month 4 weeks 19 hours ago) and read 7720 times:

i did a search myself and found xmas week tickets from nyc to ase for 1000 dollars each. I would say thats pretty high yield for a us domestic flt.

User currently offlineFoxBravo From United States of America, joined Nov 2003, 2998 posts, RR: 4
Reply 10, posted (9 years 1 month 4 weeks 18 hours ago) and read 7708 times:

Sounds like the Q400 might come in handy here, and I wonder if this could be an opportunity for Horizon if UA ends up dropping out of the market due to lack of suitable aircraft. I assume the Q400 could handle the approach to ASE, and QX seems to have had success with its LAX-SUN flights, which are similar in distance, serve a similar demographic, and present similar operational challenges. Thoughts?


Common sense is not so common. -Voltaire
User currently offlineJayspilot From United States of America, joined May 2001, 298 posts, RR: 0
Reply 11, posted (9 years 1 month 4 weeks 18 hours ago) and read 7677 times:

people want a jet, not me in particular, but rich folks. they want a jetway and jet engines on the wings. i think the Q400 falls in the same boat as the CRJ-705 though

User currently offlineFoxBravo From United States of America, joined Nov 2003, 2998 posts, RR: 4
Reply 12, posted (9 years 1 month 4 weeks 18 hours ago) and read 7657 times:

Quoting Jayspilot (Reply 11):
people want a jet, not me in particular, but rich folks. they want a jetway and jet engines on the wings.

You may be right. Although once people give the Q400 a try, I think they find it's surprisingly jet-like...and besides, it hasn't deterred the Sun Valley crowd, which isn't exactly riffraff either...



Common sense is not so common. -Voltaire
User currently offlineCommavia From United States of America, joined Apr 2005, 11712 posts, RR: 62
Reply 13, posted (9 years 1 month 4 weeks 18 hours ago) and read 7640 times:

Quoting Jdaniel001 (Reply 6):
Doesn't AA and DL both fly there.....duh...they do. I think?

AA, DL, and every other airline except UA and NW fly into EGE (UA and NW both also fly to EGE, in addition to ASE). EGE is Eagle County Airport, in Vail, which is the closest 'big' airport to Aspen. At EGE, AA heavily dominates and has for years, but UA and CO both also have a large presence.


User currently offlineDLKAPA From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 14, posted (9 years 1 month 4 weeks 18 hours ago) and read 7625 times:

Quoting Jdaniel001 (Reply 6):
Doesn't AA and DL both fly there.....duh...they do. I think? UA should use the 757 P.S. version....that will get the people paying those high fares to ASE.

No, AA and DL do not fly into ASE, they don't have the equipment suitable, and there's no way a 757 could safely drop into the valley.

Quoting BNAflyer78 (Reply 7):
DL flies to EGE near Vail......and they used to go into GUC seasonally, as well as HDN. Not ASE AFAIK.

DL still goes into GUC with 757 every winter, not sure about HDN but I think they still fly MD-88 in there.


User currently offlineSaab2000 From Switzerland, joined Jun 2001, 1610 posts, RR: 11
Reply 15, posted (9 years 1 month 4 weeks 18 hours ago) and read 7625 times:

I would like to see UA keep Air Wisconsin, and for more than just the ASE flights. It works for both parties so why are they trying to separate??????

The posting about UA trying to keep it cheap is already costing them. Dropping AWAC is a HUGE mistake. Not that we are the best or anything (though statistically we are better than most other UAX carriers most of the time) but does anyone really think that spending a dollar to save a dime is the way to do it?

I wish cooler heads would prevail and that UAL and AWAC could get an agreement based on common sense!!! They work well together and have done so for years.

Regarding the main question here, the 146/Avro is the only jet that can make it out after losing an engine.

757s and 737s maybe could empty, but they are twins. The 146 platform is ideal for this type of flight and AWAC has years of experience making it in and out of this tricky field.

Yes, it is very high yield and it would make good business sense for UAL to keep AWAC doing at least this. But business sense seems to not rule the roost in this industry too often.



smrtrthnu
User currently offlineJayspilot From United States of America, joined May 2001, 298 posts, RR: 0
Reply 16, posted (9 years 1 month 4 weeks 17 hours ago) and read 7544 times:

the short reason that united dumped awac has nothing to do with the 146 and everything to do with the crj200. united actually deserves some credit for realizing that the 50 seat rj is not practical. They found a loop hole in their contract with zw which allowed them to dump their 50 seaters and aquire larger 3 class cabin crj and erj's for probably the same cost. On paper it was a win win, but in real life they screwed a lot of regional employees and their families. Guess it helps to show the majors don't give a crap about them now.

User currently offlineGigneil From United States of America, joined Nov 2002, 16347 posts, RR: 85
Reply 17, posted (9 years 1 month 4 weeks 17 hours ago) and read 7494 times:

More people could fly in with props if they wanted... DCI could fly in with an ATR from SLC if they were so inclined, America West also serves with a DHC8 from PHX at least and sometimes LAS.

UA is going to just have to stick it out with Mesa, and I hope AWAC gives them the finger on the 146 fleet.

N


User currently offlineERJ170 From United States of America, joined Apr 2004, 6771 posts, RR: 17
Reply 18, posted (9 years 1 month 4 weeks 17 hours ago) and read 7486 times:

Quoting Gigneil (Reply 17):
UA is going to just have to stick it out with Mesa, and I hope AWAC gives them the finger on the 146 fleet.

ZW should see if UA would rather purchase the 146 fleet.. for original selling price.. otherwise, ZW should wipe their hands clean of that problem...



Aiming High and going far..
User currently offlineUnited787 From United States of America, joined May 2005, 2714 posts, RR: 1
Reply 19, posted (9 years 1 month 4 weeks 16 hours ago) and read 7444 times:

Why won't the CRJ work? I flew a NW CRJ from Memphis to ASE a couple of years ago. UA doesn't fly very far from ASE anyway, most of the flights got to DIA.

[Edited 2005-08-05 19:13:16]

User currently offlineAirbazar From United States of America, joined Sep 2003, 8412 posts, RR: 10
Reply 20, posted (9 years 1 month 4 weeks 16 hours ago) and read 7415 times:

Quoting Jayspilot (Reply 9):
i did a search myself and found xmas week tickets from nyc to ase for 1000 dollars each. I would say thats pretty high yield for a us domestic flt.

Yes, maintaining a route with 4 aircraft for only 2 weeks of high yield traffic a year is nearly as good an idea as buying an A380 fleet for the Summer Olympics  Smile


User currently offlineApodino From United States of America, joined Apr 2005, 4281 posts, RR: 6
Reply 21, posted (9 years 1 month 4 weeks 16 hours ago) and read 7410 times:

Quoting Jayspilot (Reply 16):
the short reason that united dumped awac has nothing to do with the 146 and everything to do with the crj200. united actually deserves some credit for realizing that the 50 seat rj is not practical. They found a loop hole in their contract with zw which allowed them to dump their 50 seaters and aquire larger 3 class cabin crj and erj's for probably the same cost. On paper it was a win win, but in real life they screwed a lot of regional employees and their families. Guess it helps to show the majors don't give a crap about them now.

First of all thats not true. Only 30 of the 70 jets were replaced with the 70 seaters, the ones with Skywest and GoJets. The 40 planes that Mesa is operating are still going to be 50 seaters. And the 146 had a lot to do with AWAC. The 146 pilots are among the highest paid in the regional industry, in many cases these guys are paid more than Mainline captains. And because AWAC wasn't growing, you had captains who were moving up the pay scale. The new airlines bid on incremental growth, which means new and cheap captains constantly coming through. Thats where the savings is realized and thats why AWAC was told to pack sand.

United from what I understand tried to get other regionals to start flying the 146 for them for ASE. Mesa, Skywest, Chautaqua all told United to pack sand. Also remember that AWAC has approaches and procedures in ASE unique to AWAC that no other airline enjoys, and unlike Mesa, they can serve ASE at night.

AWAC nearly got Frontier to agree to put 146's with them so AWAC could fly the ASE route under the Frontier flag. They said no, but can you imagine what United would have said about that?


User currently offlineGigneil From United States of America, joined Nov 2002, 16347 posts, RR: 85
Reply 22, posted (9 years 1 month 4 weeks 16 hours ago) and read 7406 times:

Quoting United787 (Reply 19):
I flew a NW CRJ from Memphis to ASE a couple of years ago.

No sir, you didn't.  Smile

N


User currently offlineHjulicher From Liechtenstein, joined Feb 2005, 880 posts, RR: 2
Reply 23, posted (9 years 1 month 4 weeks 14 hours ago) and read 7291 times:

America West also flies into ASE. I know that a 737 does have the capabilities of flying into ASE from DEN, because sometimes UA does use them (rarely) but otherwise, it's a very difficult approach. Aspen might be expensive but that doesn't mean ordinary people don't go there. During the summer, students from all over the world go to Aspen to work? How do they get there, there is the music school of aspen and various other events that attract people, and not only the rich and wealthy. I'm not saying it's not expensive to go there, but it's affordable enough, even in the winter. Eating is the hardest part about aspen. You won't find a meal less than $20 except for the McDonalds there.


LH 442
User currently offlineQuickmover From United States of America, joined Mar 2004, 2494 posts, RR: 0
Reply 24, posted (9 years 1 month 4 weeks 14 hours ago) and read 7277 times:

I think Frontier could make a killing at ASE, even with props. Perhaps horizon would lease out a couple.

25 Apodino : For a very good reason, ASE is located in a valley, that is surrounded by high terrain on three sides, with one funnel into and out of the airport. D
26 Post contains links Hjulicher : I have absolutely no idea about the technical aspects of aircraft, hence I am asking this question. Would an AN-148-100 be able to take off from ASE.
27 AirWest : The runway at ASE is also only 100 ft wide, another reason why there isn't mainline service there.
28 PSU.DTW.SCE : A lot of people are confusing EGE & ASE. EGE is a walk in the park compared to ASE. ASE is unique due its elevation, runway length, width, surrounding
29 Post contains links Quickmover : Interesting that on the Aspen airport website, there is a link titled "fear of flying". http://www.aspenairport.com/index.asp?topmenu=geninfo Any stor
30 DLKAPA : So that's why Mesa and Skywest still fly tons of 50 seaters out of DEN every day? A little lean, yes, but not so thin that mainline can't use it. The
31 FlyHoss : One advantage that AWAC inherited from Aspen Airways was the TACAN approach and night operations authority/approval (Rocky Mountain Airways also had i
32 Quickmover : Doesn't Midwest Express have some avros that they were banking on using for Delta? I think the Delta deal fell through.
33 Artsyman : Couldn't UAL just negotiate a deal with Air Whisky and then just reneg on the deal later when it comes to paying the bill. don't bother telling me tha
34 DLKAPA : Not only would it not be fair, it probably also wouldn't be legal. Also, if I was AirWhiskey and they tried to reneg a deal on me like that, I wouldn'
35 Texan : 737s cannot use ASE, but ARJs are also not the only jets that can land there. Planes at ASE are limited to a 95' wingspan, which would allow a 717, w
36 Post contains images Saab2000 : AFAIK, the CRJ and ERJ cannot operate ASE because of the single-engine go-around or single-engine balked landing. Simple as that. Just being able to t
37 VEEREF : Plus with ASE being a high yield destination, doesn't everyone agree that if something like a 757 or 737 could be used effectively at ASE, someone wou
38 Legacy135 : We tried to do ASE with the ERJ in the simulator for fun only. The main problem on approach is the steep descend angle, as the ERJ is not the real ch
39 Burnsie28 : They also have First Class unlike the 2 other airlines United and America West into ASE Nope they fly to EGE, and P.S. is not happening for VAIL. Not
40 Saab2000 : Legacy, As you know, the problem is not being able to do it in the sim. Real life is different. Anyway, I used to be based in LUG in yours and my favo
41 United787 : I am sorry, were you there? Maybe it was a fill in for a BAE but it was a CRJ, it surprised me too. It was about 4-5 years ago so I could be wrong, b
42 PSU.DTW.SCE : Do answer some questions...... This was simply because there were too many 50 seat RJ's in the United Express system, not at one specific hub. United
43 Apodino : This may actually be true. I was loooking through Jepp Plates for ASE, and there is one approach certified for use at night, which is an RNAV/GPS to
44 DLKAPA : Would you even be able to see the horizon in a CRJ flighdeck doing that kind of noze down?
45 FlyHoss : Mesaba does have night authority. They have an evening arrival in ASE from MSP at 10:30pm all winter long. As mentioned, special training is required.
46 SegmentKing : Its apparent that only 2 or 3 of you in this thread have EVER been to Aspen. The real issue is the Go-Around.... you have to be able to TURN your plan
47 Apodino : I doubt that, because Mesa also flies into ASE for United and they are not night certified. Its the name on the certificate for the carrier operating
48 CODC10 : Would the COEX ERJ-145XR be better suited for ASE ops? (more power, better climb performance, etc.)
49 PSU.DTW.SCE : Nope. Again, it still does not meet the strict procedures in effect that are meant for safe operations. Basically, can the aircraft still safely clim
50 C680 : For all of you speculating about Boeings going into ASE, read Texan's post: He is correct. This is how ASE banned the BBJ. There are also severe ramp
51 Tornado82 : Would a CRJ even have the range to make it all the way from MEM to ASE with any kind of decent payload at all... operational restrictions aside?? I d
52 KcrwFlyer : Actually , they seem to climb okay.. its that getting off the ground that takes a while. Could a Crj even get out of Ase empty?
53 AvroArrow : Q400 all the way to a destination like this. The range profile makes it just as fast as a jet of any type at lower cost. Plus it could do a full load
54 ASFlyer : I wasn't there either but I agree with Gigneil, you couldn't have flown a CRJ into ASE. First, Mesaba flies to ASE on the ARJ and Pinnacle (until rec
55 Gigneil : Sorry boss. The CRJ simply is not certified to operate to the airfield. Neither is the 737. N
56 NWA ARJ : FAA INFORMATION EFFECTIVE 07 JULY 2005 ARPT RESTRICTED TO MAXIMUM ACFT WINGSPAN OF 95 FT. So as one can see this airport is limited to smaller aircraf
57 Uadc8contrail : burnsie, that wacko you referred to that operated a 27 into ase was the trump 727-100 and it did make make it and landed in ege.....i was there(ege)..
58 Planespotting : also, engine out performance is an issue, and most of the airplanes in question (the two holers) don't have the engine out performance to effectively
59 NorthstarBoy : this is probably a stupid question, but if there's a restriction as to the wingspan that can operate into ASE, how did Aspen Airways ever get away wit
60 Skiordie : "I say bring back Aspen Airways and the old Convairs!" What a ride that was from Stapleton to Aspen. I flew back from ASE a week ago on a 146 and it w
61 Uadc8contrail : Not trying to steal pitkins thunder but....Anyone remember flying out of AVON?????those dash7s that i flew out as a kid and eventually drove my cj7 do
62 SegmentKing : You guys need to do some reading of the newspaper in Aspen. You throw them some Q400s and they will have kiniption fits! the local crowd as well as in
63 Post contains images N1120A : No Besides operational restrictions, that would be an economic nightmare The E170 is likely to get certified into LCY, so there is a chance that it c
64 Post contains links and images FoxBravo : Unfortunately I never got the chance, but I definitely remember being in Vail as a kid (already obsessed with planes, of course) while the service wa
65 Post contains images Legacy135 : Hi SAAB2000, Thank's for the regards from "overseas". I just didn't get your message, I do not understand what you want me to tell about the ERJ in As
66 Jeb94 : Aspen is considered one of the worlds most dangerous approaches. You need an aircraft with excellent low speed performance. STOL capability is a huge
67 Azjubilee : Just to recap for those morons who can't read the entire thread and who refuse to use their brains. - Nobody ever flew a CRJ with NWA on the side of i
68 PSU.DTW.SCE : Thanks for the concise summary...... Ah, I see why the ASE schedule is the way it is for the summer, I wondered why they were RON'ing an Avro in ASE.
69 Post contains images Jano : Oh boy! That seems like almost an NW focus city in ASE ! Only too bad we will lose some more ARJ doing East Coast flying, if this rumor becomes reali
70 Azjubilee : Agreed... if these ASE rumors become reality it will take a LARGE portion of our fleet to cover these long flights. But as Mesaba brings on CRJs there
71 Hjulicher : I know that NW flies the avro between PHL and DTW. So I guess it is wasted on this route as their is a lot of flexibility on what aircraft can fly int
72 Rampart : Interesting that this topic finally prompted me to drop a dime on this net. I'm not employed in the industry, and have no specific expertise. I'm simp
73 Midex461 : WHEN have we EVER flown ASE - LAS? I've worked for both HP and YV, and I've NEVER heard of service from ASE to LAS. And what about flying an ATR into
74 Blackhawk144 : I see 2 solutions: 1) Blow the mountains up! 2) Build another airport! Anthony PS: I was kidding
75 Uadc8contrail : iirc...didnt rocky fly some atr42s in the end of their operation?????i had a rocky guy tell us that the atr was not a great mtn flying plane...
76 Dinker225 : From your post it sounds like your still in Avon? I remember driving past before the Walmart and Hells Depot opened and seeing the runway. My parents
77 Uadc8contrail : dinker, no had have made my way to the front range via chicago,awatukee and chandler...still have family in the "valley"(singletree).....wasnt to long
78 Post contains images Saab2000 : Legacy, Thanks for your comments! I have many happy memories from flying in Switzerland. Yeah, the SB-20 was the ideal airplane for those types of rou
79 Legacy135 : OK, I keep my fingers crossed! Let us know then and good luck! Blue Skies and Rgds Legacy135
80 PSU.DTW.SCE : No, a route like DTW-PHL is a good one for the Avro since it allows for a smaller aircraft, yet still maintains a First class cabin, in fact the high
81 DLKAPA : Tell that to the YV captains flying their Dash-8's in there everyday.
82 Gigneil : Jets and props are just not the same in terms of field performance. The 328 was/is a FANTASTIC mountainous terrain prop. The jet just is not. N
83 Hoya : Just throwing out an idea here... Why won't UA just have one of its Express partners buy and fly the Q400 in ASE, or any other prop, and launch a larg
84 DLKAPA : If anybody picked it up, it'd be Mesa, but even then you're still short 30 seats.
85 United787 : Does anyone know if the Embraer 170/175/190/195 family could be feasible out of ASE?
86 Post contains links and images Boeing7E7 : Problem solved: (In UA Colors of course...) View Large View MediumPhoto © H. Meier
87 Post contains images UAXDXer : Good idea but that is like telling the Aspen Elite that they have to eat at McDonalds for dinner. It ain't gonna work! I would say AWAC has UAL by th
88 UAalltheway : Why wouldn't they start flying UA 737s into Aspen in peak season (winter/ski season) like they do in HDN? And than regular express a/c the rest of the
89 Post contains images Legacy135 : At least the 170 will get a London City approval (5.5° Glide). We do have flights this summer with the 170 of German Cirrus Airlines out of Bern (LS
90 United787 : UAalltheway, you should read the rest of the thread, 737's can't fly into ASE
91 Post contains images UAalltheway : Oh, sorry.. my computer only loaded like the first 20 posts.. sry about that.
92 Post contains images UAXDXer : [Edited 2005-08-08 23:53:32] It's ok.... it happens [Edited 2005-08-09 00:01:32]
93 United787 : Well, since UA (Chautauqua) is already using 170s, could UA start to fly them into ASE?
94 Gigneil : Honestly, the "Aspen elite" flies on their own craft. And really, UA is the only regular jet operator. If they stop, NW isn't going to necessarily ge
95 SLUAviator : Saab2000, one of our RJ captains (who used to fly the 146s as an F/O) said the 146s are specially certified and can do CAT II GPS approaches. Would yo
96 Texan : Or more recently, Aspen Mountain Air, which I think flew 328s from ASE-DFW and DEN, as well as DFW-SAF. If an RJ could be made with similar performan
97 Saab2000 : SLU Aviator, I was not in MLI on Thursday. I was there on Saturday. I am not aware of any such thing as a Cat II GPS approach. By definition, a GPS ap
98 Apodino : Just to follow up, I have never heard of a CAT 2 approach for anything except the ILS, and AWAC is presently not certified to do CAT 2 approaches, onl
99 Big777jet : All I remembered that ANet was posted here sometimes 2 or 3 years ago. Continental asked FAA to get try to fly to ASE with a 737-500 from IAH. FAA tol
100 Saab2000 : Apodino, I am sure you have dispatched some of my flights if you are an AWAC dispatcher. I fly the CRJ out of ORD. Going to PHL with the first wave an
101 Hjulicher : Maybe the RRJ, whenever built and designed, may have the capabilities of flying into ASE. Knowing the way russians do things, it may have three engine
102 Apodino : I think management is very serious about the 190, knowing that the larger capacity is the wave of the future. And looking at other issues, I think we
103 Alphascan : I found this article in a June 2005 Airbus newsletter while looking for something else and it reminded me of this thread. It has to do with approaches
104 NLINK : Another cool airport to that Co Express used to fly into with the DH7 I beleive was the SBS airport in steamboat springs 4452 feet long, 100 foot wide
105 Post contains links and images FoxBravo : Yes, the Dash 7 can get in and out of some pretty amazing places. It's a small niche, but still too bad no one has come up with a real replacement. If
106 Azjubilee : DLKAPPA - I forgot to add one key word in my post. The avro/146 is the only part 121 certified JET that can get in and out of ASE. Turboprops are a di
107 UAL Bagsmasher : Saab2000, if you ever taxi an RJ to the hangar in ORD in the evening, stop in and say hi.
108 Saab2000 : UALBagsmasher, I was only at the hanger on ORD one time and that was about 14 months ago........ Anyway, I guess we are on the same side! I am ORD rig
109 TOLtommy : A steep approach is one thing, a steep approach with mountains in the way is another. A 170 going into LCY has a lot of options if they need to cance
110 Post contains images UAL Bagsmasher : Saab2000, if your trip to MSN is FFD for the plane, chances are I taxied it down this morning for ya
111 UN_B732 : What about this 318 business? If the 318 gets certification, I can see F9 benefiting immensely.
112 Srbmod : Even with this certification, you still couldn't fly it into ASE. Wingspan of an A318 is 111ft 10in (34.09m), so that's a no go. ZW would be stupid t
113 Vfw614 : Maybe the Fokker 70 could do ? It is certified for LCY with some additional software and should be quite a hot rod. Too bad none of the US airlines bo
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