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Mesaba CRJ  
User currently offlineAzjubilee From United States of America, joined Apr 2000, 4021 posts, RR: 27
Posted (9 years 4 months 2 weeks 1 day 22 hours ago) and read 2202 times:

Incase anyone was wondering or keeping track, here's some Mesaba CRJ news. Certification for CRJ entry into the Mesaba fleet remains on schedule. Work groups are training at this time and the introduction of the a/c into service is on track for mid October. The first a/c N601XJ is in TUS for paint right now and is expected to be delivered to Mesaba in early September. It will look exactly like the Pinnacle CRJs, but will have tail numbers ending in XJ as well as the obvious, "Operated by Mesaba Airlines" on the left side aft. Flight numbers appear to be in the 33xx series. The first 15 a/c will be 50 seat planes and the full lot will be delivered by the end of the first quarter 2006. Mesaba has rights to the next 20 a/c should NWA exersize those options (which is fully expected by us at XJ).

First revenue flights will be MSP-ABR on October 13-15 3 x daily. Then from Oct 16-29 one turn in the middle of the day to ABR. Then starting October 30 with two planes in the fleet there will be flights to DFW, LIT, MLI, CWA, BIS and ALO. It is anticipated that in November frequencies to ATW and DSM will occur. Remember DSM and CWA were designated as mx facilities. Mesaba currently has night mx in CWA and DSM, in addition to CVG, MSP and DTW as well as contract mx overnight in OMA.

Before anyone gets all balled up because they can't see it in the system, it is likely that midnight Sunday this will all be loaded into the system. Right now you can see the ABR flights in the downloadable desktop timetable.


AZJ

[Edited 2005-08-07 01:46:21]

13 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlinePSU.DTW.SCE From United States of America, joined Jan 2002, 7768 posts, RR: 27
Reply 1, posted (9 years 4 months 2 weeks 1 day 21 hours ago) and read 2132 times:

Thanks for the heads up. Good to see things are moving along as planned.
Its assumed that the Mesaba CRJ flying will displace some Pinnacle CRJ flying from MSP, but that will be swapped with increased PCL flying out of DTW, MEM & IND.

ABR is traditionally an all-Saab market. I assume that ABR was just choosen for training/route proving reasons, and that will only be temporary as the Saab can easily sub in case of delays, mechanicals, etc. You can't run a true schedule with only 1 aircraft. I assume ABR will revert back to all-Saab then.


User currently offlineAzjubilee From United States of America, joined Apr 2000, 4021 posts, RR: 27
Reply 2, posted (9 years 4 months 2 weeks 1 day 20 hours ago) and read 2087 times:

I think ABR sees increased service in the fall for hunting season... so this works out perfectly. These 3 daily flights are in addition to the saab flights. It still remains to be sen exactly how these CRJ will fit into the route network. It may not displace PNCL at all, but instead displace saabs or avro flying.


AZJ


User currently offlineCactus739 From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 2450 posts, RR: 30
Reply 3, posted (9 years 4 months 2 weeks 1 day 19 hours ago) and read 2028 times:

So what's it doing in Tuscon getting painted? Is it a new build plane or coming from a different owner?


You can't fix stupid.... - Ron White
User currently offlineDsuairptman From United States of America, joined Jul 2003, 904 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (9 years 4 months 2 weeks 1 day 18 hours ago) and read 2014 times:

Thanx for the info. A few of us @ PNCL have been curious to know where the XJ CRJs will be flying.

I suppose the only questions that remain are:

Will XJ replace the write off ARJ, I believe XJ had a contract for 36 but one was written off @ MEM.

Will the leases on the Saabs and ARJs be extended, as they end in 06 and 07 respectively.

Will NW replace the PNCL CRJ lost in a crash in Missouri?

Thanx for any answers.



GEAUX SAINTS!
User currently offlineJBo From Sweden, joined Jan 2005, 2379 posts, RR: 0
Reply 5, posted (9 years 4 months 2 weeks 1 day 18 hours ago) and read 1983 times:

Quoting Azjubilee (Thread starter):
as well as the obvious, "Operated by Mesaba Airlines" on the left side aft.

Why is it that all of the XJ aircraft in the new colors have those titles on the aft as opposed to next to the main door on the nose like the Pinnacle birds?



I'd take the awe of understanding over the awe of ignorance any day.
User currently offlineDsuairptman From United States of America, joined Jul 2003, 904 posts, RR: 0
Reply 6, posted (9 years 4 months 2 weeks 1 day 17 hours ago) and read 1996 times:

Quoting Azjubilee (Thread starter):
Before anyone gets all balled up because they can't see it in the system, it is likely that midnight Sunday this will all be loaded into the system. Right now you can see the ABR flights in the downloadable desktop timetable.

As of 2300 CDT the PDF timetable for 20 Aug 05 - 30 Sept 05 has been uploaded to http://www.nwa.com

Haven't checked out changes to DTW and MSP scheds, but here are some tweaks happening in MEM.

9E add 1x daily CRJ to DTW
XJ add 1x daily SF3 to CHA (Replaces a CRJ)
XJ add 1x daily ARJ to OMA

Some other intresting changes

MEM-PNS-MEM goes completley to 9E CRJ, one CRJ replaces long time daily ARJ on this route.

last flt out of MEM-EVV goes to CRJ form SF3

MEM-XNA goes completly Airlink w/ a combo of ARJ and CRJ replacing current DC9 and ARJ flts.

MEM-LIT-MEM A320 goes to A319

MEM-OMA-MEM gets daily A319

Other notes, reading the MEM schedule can give you a headache... During one of the first weekends on this schedule a lot of unusual flt happenings will take place. You will see flights that are scheduled daily to op except SAT. have a flight with the same flt time, equip and flt number to op that one Sat, the next day it returns to its regular daily schedule for the duration, no change to time,equip or flt #, eveidence of this abounds in the Dis./Beg. notes underneath flts.

There are some more complicated ones to explain. For expamle NW flt 1800, a D9S running MEM-GPT, for one Sat only is flown by a CRJ (This is not a usual CRJ route) to be followed that Sun only by an ARJ and return to the regualr D9S that Mon for the duration... you see it all over the schedule, what is up w/these strange flt listings?



GEAUX SAINTS!
User currently offlineFlyinryan99 From United States of America, joined Feb 2001, 2030 posts, RR: 13
Reply 7, posted (9 years 4 months 2 weeks 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 1939 times:

Maybe they could replace PNCL on the TOL-DTW route. They have canceled the flight for the past 2 weeks straight, and for the next two weeks straight because they can't get a stand up crew. IMO that's just the most ridiculous reason to cancel flights...because they couldn't schedule crews...why not just tell NW no and let XJ run the darn Saabs...I'd rather see flights run then a cancellation because they can't schedule a crew....just ridiculous.

User currently offlineDsuairptman From United States of America, joined Jul 2003, 904 posts, RR: 0
Reply 8, posted (9 years 4 months 2 weeks 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 1917 times:

Quoting Flyinryan99 (Reply 7):
I'd rather see flights run then a cancellation because they can't schedule a crew....just ridiculous.

If you knew the massive growth and how many phone calls a day PNCL schedulers make trying to keep crews togther than I think you'd have a different PoV. PNCL is wersteling w/ some of the problems growth brings, and right know we've got our crews pretty maxed. New pilot and upgrade classes have been starting every few weeks to get more guys on the line to meet our demand, but it takes time to train folks.

If the TOL-DTW is being xcled to the extent you say it is, it probably due to the fact that TOL is a short hop from DTW and 9E could use that plane and crew to run a logner, more justified route (By leg length concerns).

I don't think TOL is hurting so bad,that as a whole those 50 seats are needed everyday. Obviously XJ must be meeting the demand to TOL for NW allright, otherwise NW would have had PNCL reinstate that flt.



GEAUX SAINTS!
User currently offlinePSU.DTW.SCE From United States of America, joined Jan 2002, 7768 posts, RR: 27
Reply 9, posted (9 years 4 months 2 weeks 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 1834 times:

Quoting Dsuairptman (Reply 4):
Will XJ replace the write off ARJ, I believe XJ had a contract for 36 but one was written off @ MEM.

No, it will not be replaced.

Quoting Dsuairptman (Reply 4):
Will the leases on the Saabs and ARJs be extended, as they end in 06 and 07 respectively.

No, the Saab's & Avro's are not going away. 15 CRJ's do not replace 35 ARJ's and 63 Saabs. NW maintains the leases on 25 of the Avro's and 49 Saabs (B+'s). NW owns 10 of the Avro's outright. Those aircraft are subleased to XJ. The remaining 14 Saabs (A & B's) are leased directly by XJ from other 3rd party leasing companies. These 14 (3 A models & 11 B models N3xxPX) have leases that expire in the next 3-5 years. Leases run through 2007+ for the Avro's, and the B+ Saabs (49) are on lease through 2010-2012. All indications are that the Avros will remain in the fleet for the next decade. These leases can all easily be extended, as there is virtually no second-hand market for any of these aircraft. So going forward, Mesaba will be 3-aircraft type airline.

Quoting Dsuairptman (Reply 4):
Will NW replace the PNCL CRJ lost in a crash in Missouri?

No, it will not be replaced, PNCL will operate a fleet of 138 CRJ's. The remaining few will be delivered in the next 2 months.

Quoting Cactus739 (Reply 3):
So what's it doing in Tuscon getting painted? Is it a new build plane or coming from a different owner?

It is a new-build CRJ. That is where NW & Mesaba have the painting performed by a 3rd party.

See this thread from the orginal announcement http://www.airliners.net/discussions...eral_aviation/read.main/2067863/4/

Quoting Dsuairptman (Reply 6):
There are some more complicated ones to explain. For expamle NW flt 1800, a D9S running MEM-GPT, for one Sat only is flown by a CRJ (This is not a usual CRJ route) to be followed that Sun only by an ARJ and return to the regualr D9S that Mon for the duration... you see it all over the schedule, what is up w/these strange flt listings?

A lot of these exceptions, Sat-only, one-time flights are over the Labor Day weekend. NW operates a significantly reduced schedule over that weekend and adjusts it so they are not flying around a ton of empty aircraft. Basically Labor Day Monday is operating more of a typical Sunday schedule instead of the usual business Monday. A lot of flights will not operate that Sunday, since every is off enjoying their long weekend.


User currently offlinePSU.DTW.SCE From United States of America, joined Jan 2002, 7768 posts, RR: 27
Reply 10, posted (9 years 4 months 2 weeks 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 1788 times:

As AZJ, said they are now loaded in the system:

To distigush between operators & Aircraft types, its interesting what the code is on the online reservations system

Saab flights: "operated by MESABA AVIATION/NW AIRLINK"
Mesaba CRJ flights: "operated by MESABA AVIATION/NW AIRLINK"
Pinnacle CRJ flights: "operated by PINNACLE AIRLINES JET SERV/NW AIRLINK"
Mesaba Avro flights: "operated by MESABA AVIATION JET SERV/NW AIRLINK"

Thus, its easy to tell just by looking the difference between the Mesaba Avro flights, but the Saabs & CRJ's are given the same title. However, Mesaba's CRJ's are given the aircraft code "CXJ" on the online booking. The key is 33xx are the CRJ (CXJ) flights, while 34xx-36xx are the Avro's.

First Mesaba CRJ revenue flight: Thursday October 13th:

Schedule 10/13-10/15:
NW 3321 MSP-ABR 11:15am-12:45pm
NW 3322 ABR-MSP 01:05pm-02:35pm
NW 3323 MSP-ABR 03:15pm-04:45pm
NW 3324 ABR-MSP 05:05pm-06:35pm
NW 3325 MSP-ABR 07:00pm-08:30pm
NW 3326 ABR-MSP 08:50pm-10:20pm

Beyond that, nothing else is loaded yet.

(Note these 3 CRJ flights are in addition to 4 daily Saab flights from MSP)


User currently offlineAcidradio From United States of America, joined Mar 2001, 1875 posts, RR: 10
Reply 11, posted (9 years 4 months 2 weeks 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 1768 times:
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FORUM MODERATOR

With the CRJ's coming into the fleet, how many pilots will be trained for it? Did they hire more pilots?

Also, kind of related - when an airline picks up a new type of aircraft, do they hire a pilot from somewhere else who has flown that type? Or is it just foreign to everyone and they "learn as they go"?



Ich haben zwei Platzspielen und ein Microphone
User currently offlinePSU.DTW.SCE From United States of America, joined Jan 2002, 7768 posts, RR: 27
Reply 12, posted (9 years 4 months 2 weeks 1 day 4 hours ago) and read 1720 times:

Mesaba has been rapidly hiring pilots over the past 6 months or so, both for attrition and for the new aircraft. In fact hiring started even before the CRJ announcement was made public. Roughly an additional 150 pilots will be needed for these 15 CRJ's. This is the approximate of about 5 crews per aircraft. Not to mention, additional pilots are needed to backfill those who quit, resign, terminated, look another job, moved up to a major, etc on the Saab & Avro.

Since everything is senority based, what happens is that the CRJ CA's will come from either captains already on the Saab, Avro, or upgraded FO's. There is little incentive for an Avro CA to switch to the CRJ though, as it would be a reduction in pay, since Captains are paid differently on each aircraft.

The FO's are another story. Since all FO's are paid the same regardless of aircraft, there may be some switching between aircraft. However, XJ's rule is that when you switch aircraft, you are locked into that position for at least 2 years. Thus, many FO's wouldn't switch aircraft since they would miss out of the chance to upgrade to Captain. Remember up until recently, no pilots were hired in nearly 4 years. So, most CRJ FO's will be new hires, with other new hire FO's going to the Saab & Avro. As current Captains on the Saab may switch to the CRJ, current FO's will have the ability to upgrade in Saab Captain positions. So, no matter how you look at it, there will be a lot of position swapping & movement in the future.

In terms of new hires, it certainly can be an advantage if you have CRJ experience, but there are a lot of factors that contribute to whether they will take you, and even if they are hired, they may not necessarily end up on the CRJ as there are needs for the other 2 aircraft types too.


User currently offlineAkjetBlue From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 790 posts, RR: 5
Reply 13, posted (9 years 4 months 2 weeks 12 hours ago) and read 1538 times:

Any chance that CHO will see the Mesaba CRJ? Its a long 2 hour flight on a S340...

How are the DTW-CHO loads ? I heard they're doing pretty well...

Will Mesaba keep the CHO route from DTW, last time around they kept it a few months then 9/11 happened and they axed it.



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