MikeM2648 From United States of America, joined Mar 2004, 102 posts, RR: 0 Posted (8 years 4 months 6 days 10 hours ago) and read 7468 times:
Lookup Flight 1983 DTW - LAN:
Departs: Detroit-Wayne County Int'l, MI (DTW) Arrives: Lansing, MI ( LAN )
Scheduled: 5:23PM Scheduled: 6:03PM
Actual: Cancelled Actual: Cancelled
Aircraft: Weather: LAN
Note: Passengers re-accommodated on Champion Air.
Looks like this was more than just a rumor?? I thought this was only for a potential mechanic strike. Why would Champion be covering flights today?...has this ever happened before? This flight is still in the future..they seem to have made this decision well in advance,
Currently our airline operates a fleet of sixteen Boeing 727-200 aircraft and serves a wide variety of customers that include major tour wholesalers, professional and college sports teams, the Department of Defense, and corporate incentive groups.
MikeM2648 From United States of America, joined Mar 2004, 102 posts, RR: 0 Reply 6, posted (8 years 4 months 6 days 10 hours ago) and read 7275 times:
Departs: Dallas/Fort Worth-Int'l, TX ( DFW ) Arrives: Detroit-Wayne County Int'l, MI (DTW)
Gate: E6 Gate: A10
Scheduled: 12:25PM Scheduled: 4:04PM
Estimated: 12:25PM Estimated: 4:06PM
Aircraft: Weather: DTW
Note: Passengers re-accommodated on Champion Air.
Do these flights violate any sort of contract NWA has with its unions ...or is this an OK thing to do? I just dont recall ever seeing them (or anyone else) use a charter carrier before. How many flights are cancelled today?
Atrude777 From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 5672 posts, RR: 53 Reply 8, posted (8 years 4 months 6 days 9 hours ago) and read 7101 times:
How did they get the 727's to the airports? Did they call them or did they happen to be at these airports? Because Champion Air flies to some airports but what if they dont fly to an airport that the passenger is stranded in from NWA?
Good things come to those who wait, better things come to those who go AFTER it!
Okie From United States of America, joined Jul 2003, 2719 posts, RR: 3 Reply 13, posted (8 years 4 months 6 days 8 hours ago) and read 6964 times:
I think Champion only has 10 planes configured for passenger/charter operations the other 6 are configured for executive type accommodations.
Champion does flights for several vacation operations but I am not sure how many planes are tied up with those tasks and for how much of each day. I was on a DFW-CUN-DFW trip recently through MLT vacations. I believe the same plane did an DFW-LAS-DFW trip as well. That give you a DFW-CUN-DFW-LAS-DFW for one day. I am not sure of how many extra crews or excess equipment that CA has on hand.
If you do a little research you will find that Champion Air is more than loosely affiliated with NWA.
I am sure this is part of the ongoing saga at NW. Looks like it is going to get
Skibum9 From United States of America, joined Nov 2001, 1229 posts, RR: 0 Reply 17, posted (8 years 4 months 6 days 6 hours ago) and read 6632 times:
In 1987, MGM Grand Air, a charter airline owned by the casino, with a focus of operating VIP charters with luxurious aircraft, took flight. Operating Douglas DC-8 and Boeing 727 aircraft in lavish configurations, MGM Air was one of the most comfortable and expensive flights money could buy. However, by 1994, with business jets being the latest fad for celebrities and business leaders, MGM Grand Air was no longer profitable, and the company sought to sell it off. The buyer was Front Page Tours, a small tour operator based in Salt Lake City, UT dedicated to providing airlift to sports teams and their fans to major sporting events. The name was changed to "Champion Air" and the fleet was standardized on the Boeing 727. However, success never came to this airline, and in 1997, Minnesota Twins owner Carl Pohlad and Northwest Airlines acquired the company. The airline packed up and moved to Minneapolis, where it shared facilities and resources with Northwest, and replaced Sun Country Airlines as the leading charter operator for Northwest-owned MLT Vacations. The airline continues to operate both VIP and general charters for MLT and other operators to this day.
From NW's Annual Report.....
MLT Inc. MLT Inc. (ï¿½MLTï¿½), an indirect wholly-owned subsidiary of NWA Corp., is among the largest vacation wholesale companies in the United States. MLT develops and markets Worry-Free Vacations that include air transportation, hotel accommodations and car rentals. In addition to its Worry-Free Vacations charter programs, MLT markets and supports Northwestï¿½s WorldVacations travel packages to destinations throughout the U.S., Canada, Mexico, the Caribbean, Europe and Asia, primarily on Northwest. These vacation programs, in addition to providing a competitive and quality tour product, increase the sale of Northwest services and promote and support new and existing Northwest destinations. In 2004, MLT had $469 million in revenues.
Ejmmsu From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 1692 posts, RR: 0 Reply 20, posted (8 years 4 months 6 days 3 hours ago) and read 6222 times:
Quoting B744F (Reply 19): But it shows weather as the reasons they were out of service? Isn't that an obvious lie?
No, it wasn't weather.
After the flight status was cut and pasted into the forum, it becomes a little decieving. The part where it says "weather DTW" is not part of the actual flight status. It is simply a link so you can check out the current weather conditions at DFW (or any other city depending on which flight you are checking the status of).
Its something that could have easily started confusion.
In the link above shows "cancellation due to aircraft maintnence"
"If the facts do not conform to the theory, they will have to be disposed of"
Okie From United States of America, joined Jul 2003, 2719 posts, RR: 3 Reply 21, posted (8 years 4 months 6 days 2 hours ago) and read 6025 times:
Quoting Skibum9 (Reply 17): in 1997, Minnesota Twins owner Carl Pohlad and Northwest Airlines acquired the company. The airline packed up and moved to Minneapolis, where it shared facilities and resources with Northwest
Thanks for looking that up Skibum9. I had to take care of some other duties.
When CA starts replacing their 27's guess where their "Used but Nice" A-320 series aircraft are going to come from.
I am sure between the pilots and MX NWA looking for excuses to change/modify/or dissolve labor contracts including filling bankruptcy before October change in the bankruptcy laws.
I repeat things may get UGLY at NWA.
I hope they do not get so narrow minded that end up stiffing the paying passengers that pay the bills.
TCFC424 From United States of America, joined Nov 2003, 517 posts, RR: 2 Reply 23, posted (8 years 4 months 6 days 2 hours ago) and read 5922 times:
A few questions that come to my mind regarding these incidents.
1) Is the unusually large number of aircraft out of service due to:
a) The abhorrent (LOL) use of 30+ year old DC-9 series aircraft
b) A mandatory update of aircraft that require extensive out of
c) A slowdown by the mechanics of NW
d) Some other factors that have not yet been addressed
2) Are the pilots/staff of Champion Air governed by the NW agreements with
their pilots/staff, or is it a separate agreement
3) Was this an operational test of "If all hell breaks loose?"
It seems this, if any of the above statements are correct, cannot be a good thing for NW. I agree, it does appear that things will get real ugly real fast for this legacy. I'll finish with a list of SPECULATIVE QUESTIONS that I have.
1) How long could NW maintain its current level of sevice if a strike (or multiple strikes) occur at the airline?
2) Could a strike mean the end of NW if it is not mitigated in a timely manner
3) Is the airline doing ANYTHING to prevent a strike or are they simply waiting until it happens and planning for the worst?
In any case, it appears the skies are quickly darkening over NW. Just as I avoided UA prior to their bankruptcy (US doesnt fly to Austin) I will avoid any travel aboard NW.
N2111J From United States of America, joined Nov 2000, 143 posts, RR: 1 Reply 24, posted (8 years 4 months 6 days ago) and read 5504 times:
I had intended to start a topic on this, but I see it happened on more than just my flight today. I was booked on NW 698 DFW-DTW, and as I was walking to the gate was surprised to see a Champion Air 727(N683CA) there instead of the scheduled A319. The agent announced that the 727 would be replacing the normal aircraft. I lucked out, as my seat 21C turned out to be an exit row on the 727. I thought it was fantastic, getting to fly on a classic airliner, the number of passenger 727's in the US must be very small. The cabin crew appeared to be Champion, and they gave out free snackboxes to the entire plane, the ones they charge $5 for on regular NW flights. The flight was smooth as silk, with an on time arrival in DTW, thoroughly enjoyable in every aspect. The union vs management tones of the previous posts have definitely tempered the enjoyment of the flight though.
25 Crownvic: Anyone lucky enough to be in N2111J's shoes should thank the airplane God!!! Reminds me of a trip back in the early 1980's Cartagena-JFK that was a sc
26 Hawk44: Pure speculation but if they say the flight change is due to wx they can get away without giving out vouchers and things like that, if they say it's
27 N2111J: I didn't even realize until now, but I did get a $100 voucher along with all the rest of the pax on the Champion DFW-DTW flight, even though the fligh
28 Pilottim747: Pilots dont get paid if they dont fly. With more cancelled flights, pilots will be flying fewer hours. They do have a monthly guarantee of paid hours
29 Jblake1: Here's another question.... Why would Champion be able to complete a flight during bad weather but NWA could not? Is it due to weather at a previous s
30 Trekster: You lucky lucky people I know it might sound bad, but WOW. Northwest planres getting replaced by 727's i wanna get on one of those BADLY Hope the situ
31 Vinceb1117: Yeah no surprise here, there was an article in USA Today last week that Champion Air would be picking up some routes from NWA. As for violating a pilo
32 Lucianflyboy: I am flying NWA tomorrow DFW-DTW. I guess I won't know if they change to champion until maybe I get to the airport. This sucks! This is my first tiem
33 Jetjack74: Block or lineholder Pilots and flight attendants are pay protected if their flight or trip cancels as long as it isn't caused by the crew itself. Sic
34 Cubsrule: Let me paste it again for those of you that missed it the first time around
35 Aviationwiz: All I have to say is that NW can rot in he**.
36 Tjwgrr: Why? I'd rather ride on a nostalgic Champion 727 than a NW A319..... Won't be much longer and the only thing riding 727's will be boxes and envelopes