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Aircraft "cn" - Simple Question.  
User currently offlineCX777FAN From Australia, joined Feb 2005, 294 posts, RR: 1
Posted (8 years 11 months 3 weeks 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 7664 times:

Forgive such a simple question, but I often see reference to the cn of an aircraft. It obviously differs from the rego number painted on the side.

Is the cn flight-specific, or does a particular ac always have this second id number too?

12 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineBaylorAirBear From United States of America, joined Jan 2005, 2913 posts, RR: 50
Reply 1, posted (8 years 11 months 3 weeks 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 7654 times:

A particular a/c does always have that particular c/n. It is the construction number given by manufacturers so that the plane's entire history can be traced in the event that the registration is changed, which isn't uncommon.

BaylorAirBear



I'm just skipping stones...
User currently offlineCX777FAN From Australia, joined Feb 2005, 294 posts, RR: 1
Reply 2, posted (8 years 11 months 3 weeks 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 7648 times:

Thank you, BaylorAirBear!!!

(it's refreshing to ask a simple question on a.net and not get shot down in flames for being and ignorant fool!)


User currently offlineYOWza From Canada, joined exactly 9 years ago today! , 4865 posts, RR: 15
Reply 3, posted (8 years 11 months 3 weeks 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 7647 times:

BaylorAirBear beat me to it but it's basically like a VIN number on a car. It is put on by the manufacturer and never changes regardless of how many different registrations it takes on it its working life.

YOWza



12A whenever possible.
User currently offlineCX777FAN From Australia, joined Feb 2005, 294 posts, RR: 1
Reply 4, posted (8 years 11 months 3 weeks 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 7643 times:

Does the cn then distinguish ac type? Or does the manuf. simply put them on in numerical order as aircraft come off the production line?

eg do all A320s start with a particular digit while A330s may have another first digit? (Obviously same question applies over at B and all the smaller makers).


User currently offlineYOWza From Canada, joined exactly 9 years ago today! , 4865 posts, RR: 15
Reply 5, posted (8 years 11 months 3 weeks 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 7640 times:

Quoting CX777FAN (Reply 4):
Does the cn then distinguish ac type? Or does the manuf. simply put them on in numerical order as aircraft come off the production line?

That I couldn't tell you for sure CX. I would imagine that varies from one manufacturer to another. I know in the auto industry some do it by production location, others by type, other by both and some just by date.

Anyone know the answer? Friends in Toulouse perhaps?

YOWza



12A whenever possible.
User currently offlineRobK From United Kingdom, joined Sep 2004, 3946 posts, RR: 18
Reply 6, posted (8 years 11 months 3 weeks 1 day 5 hours ago) and read 7640 times:

Airbus aircraft start at cn 1 and go up in sequence.

There are 4 families of Airbus aircraft :

A300/A310 currently up to cn 863
A318/A319/A320/A321 currently up to cn 2550(ish)
A330/A340 currently up to cn 700(ish)
A380 not yet in service obviously

Boeing aircraft work differently. They have block numbers, line numbers and construction numbers. The block numbers are for Boeing maintenance record keeping and they comprise of two letters and three numbers, eg. YM522 will be B737-700 VH-VBZ for Virgin Blue.

I'm not sure how the letters or numbers are allocated but basically all the Yx series belong to the 73NG's, Vx to the 767's, Nx to the 757's, Rx to the 747's, Wx to the 777's. The second letter seems to have something to do with the customer but several customers use the same letter. For example YJ is Continental, Ryanair, Qantas, COPA, Futura and some leasing companies. YK belongs to another group and so it goes on.

The numbers following them tend to go up in sequence for each new aircraft. For example, Ryanair's EI-DHA was YJ842, DHB YJ843, DHC YJ843, DHD YJ844 etc.

The line number is the sequence they come off the production line. Currently the 737's are at line 1780 (N222WN for Southwest). The 747's are at line 1363 (JA02KZ for Nippon Cargo). The 767's are at line 935 (JA613J for JAL). The 777's are at line 530 (F-GSQK for Air France).

The constructor number is different again and I have to admit this is where my knowledge ends as I don't understand the sequencing. I suspect it could be that when an airline places an order with Boeing they are immediately allocated the next number in the order book but I'm only guessing. This is a 5 digit number, for example B737-700 VH-VBZ is block number YM522, line number 1777, construction number 34322.

Hope that gives some insight  yes .

RK  Wink


User currently offlineEZEIZA From Argentina, joined Aug 2004, 4964 posts, RR: 25
Reply 7, posted (8 years 11 months 3 weeks 1 day 3 hours ago) and read 7587 times:

Quoting RobK (Reply 6):
A380 not yet in service obviously

but don't their current cn numbers stick? There are, if i remember correctly, two 380's that already have their cn #'s as cn 01 and cn 02. Will that be changed upon delivery to airlines?

regards



Carp aunque ganes o pierdas ...
User currently offlineRobK From United Kingdom, joined Sep 2004, 3946 posts, RR: 18
Reply 8, posted (8 years 11 months 3 weeks 1 day 3 hours ago) and read 7585 times:

I'm sure they will, but like I said, they're not yet in service.

RK


User currently offlinePhilb From Ireland, joined May 1999, 2915 posts, RR: 13
Reply 9, posted (8 years 11 months 3 weeks 1 day 3 hours ago) and read 7564 times:

A c/n stays with an aircraft throughout its life.

There are exceptions. In the past, certain aircraft have been "rebuilt" from major bits of two or more and either put back into service or exhibited in museums. A number of DC3s, at least one Viscount and numerous smaller aircraft have been treated this way. Normally the c/n retained is that of the fuselage.

If a major upgrade or conversion is done to an airframe by another company and the type is then known by the conversion company's name and their type name, the c/n may be changed.

CV990 c/n 30-10-12 was not completed. Swissair CV990 HB-ICC was due to be c/n 30-10-38 and was sequenced behind 1963 deliveries. Delivered in January 1962 it was then allocated 30-10-12.

As others have stated there are various ways of allocating c/ns. Douglas/MDD civil airliners had a logical sequence of c/ns which were used across the range. However, close examination of the dates of manufacture shows the system often goes walkabout.

The following are DC10 c/ns. Gaps between blocks of numbers were used for DC8 or DC9 production.

46500-46525 were all built between 1970 and 1972 for American
46540-46543, the next DC10 c/ns, were built between 1979 and 1980.
46550-46582 were built 1972-1974
46583-46596 were built in 1979.
46600-46631 were built 1971-1975 for United
46632-46636 were built in 1979 for United
46640 was built in 1977
46645 was built in 1979
46646 was built in 1979
46660 was built in 1975
46661-46662 were built in 1976
46685-46686 were built in 1979
46700-46714 were built 1971-1974 mainly for National

The same situation exists with DC9s and, to a lesser extent with DC8s as the company sought to keep individual airlines' c/ns in some sort of sequence, filling the gaps later with production for other airlines if orders/options were cancelled


User currently offlineTripleDelta From Croatia, joined Jul 2004, 1118 posts, RR: 7
Reply 10, posted (8 years 11 months 3 weeks 1 day 3 hours ago) and read 7561 times:
AIRLINERS.NET CREW
PHOTO SCREENER

Quoting CX777FAN (Reply 4):
Does the cn then distinguish ac type? Or does the manuf. simply put them on in numerical order as aircraft come off the production line?

On some light general aviation aircraft, like Cessnas, the c/n contains the aircraft type and its general characteristics. For example:

172-xxxxx would be a Cessna 172 Skyhawk
P210-xxxxx would be a pressurised (P) Cessna 210 Centurion
F177RG-xxxx would be a Reims-built Cessna (F) 177 Cardinal with retractable gear (RG).

Pipers have a similar system as well:

18-xxxxxxx would be a Piper Super Cub (PA-18-...)
34-xxxxxxx would be a Piper Seneca (PA-34-...)

EDIT: typos

[Edited 2005-08-13 12:02:31]


No plane, no gain.
User currently offlineLH526 From Germany, joined Aug 2000, 2352 posts, RR: 14
Reply 11, posted (8 years 11 months 3 weeks 1 day 3 hours ago) and read 7551 times:
AIRLINERS.NET CREW
FORUM MODERATOR

Don't forget Boeing shabit in designating the first customer in it's Aircraft number, for example a B737-500 delivered to Lufthansa would bear the correct number B737-530 as 30 is the custome code for Lufthansa, B763 delivered to LanChile is called B767-316 (Customer code LanCHile/LAN = 16) Today this habit reached alphanumerical figures such as B737-3E0.

So you can in most cases trace down the first customer by it's exact aircraft designation.

Mario
LH526



Trittst im Morgenrot daher, seh ich dich im Strahlenmeer ...
User currently offlineEMBQA From United States of America, joined Oct 2003, 9364 posts, RR: 11
Reply 12, posted (8 years 11 months 3 weeks 1 day 3 hours ago) and read 7550 times:

You'll see the manufactures serial numbers sometimes in the registration numbers on the regional aircraft. Mesaba and American Eagle Saab 340's all have the manufactures serial number incorporated into their registration.

ie: Mesaba's N456XJ is Saab 340-456



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