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YYZ's T1 - Too Big?  
User currently offlineVingt20cent From Canada, joined Apr 2004, 88 posts, RR: 0
Posted (8 years 11 months 2 weeks 1 day 23 hours ago) and read 3633 times:

Hi!

I was at YYZ today and had some time to kill. I headed over to the new T1. It's a huge facility. I understand that it's not completed and won't be done for another couple of years.

I noticed that AC's domestic and international flights are serviced at T1. In addition, the STAR Alliance flights are stationed there as well, except UA. On the other hand, all of AC's US flights take off from T2.

Question #1: Once T1 is completely done, will there be enough "operations" to use all of T1? The terminal goes from Aisles A - Q (except I and O). . . is there enough business to use all the space?

Question #2: Will do they plan AC's US flight to move over to T1?

Question #3: Why did Westjet leave T2?

Oh by the way, I went to the infamous Wendy's parking lot on Airport Rd. Had a great time having my Frosty and watching planes hover over my head!

Thanks for the info!

V.

24 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineYYZatcboy From Canada, joined Apr 2005, 1070 posts, RR: 0
Reply 1, posted (8 years 11 months 2 weeks 1 day 23 hours ago) and read 3606 times:
AIRLINERS.NET CREW
CUSTOMER SERVICE & SUPPORT

AFIK alot of T2 will be demolished when T1 is done so there will be lots of operations to move over. I think WJ will be moving to T1 soon. ( in fact i thought the plan was to move in may)

Joe



DHC1/3/4 MD11/88 L1011 A319/20/21/30 B727 735/6/7/8/9 762/3 E175/90 CRJ/700/705 CC150. J/S DH8D 736/7/8
User currently offlineJean Leloup From Canada, joined Apr 2001, 2116 posts, RR: 19
Reply 2, posted (8 years 11 months 2 weeks 1 day 22 hours ago) and read 3570 times:

All of T2 will be going down, but that still will not 'fill up' T1 once everything is moved over, not even close. Of course, it makes sense that the GTAA would want to have extra space -room to grow- as it were, but I would agree with your implication that T1 may be too big (and too expensive) all the same.

I don't have the numbers offhand, so I hope someone will correct me here, but I think I've read that T1 when fully complete should be able to handle something like 40-45 million passengers per year, whereas the TOTAL traffic at YYZ is more around 30 million - and let's not forget that T3 is still active. Again, I may be way off, but I believe it's in that ballpark. So when will T1 really be full? Who knows, but I woudl say there's no rush to get the last sections completed.

By the way, yes, all AC flights will eventually be in T1 - the sooner the better, as T2 is not much of a terminal right now - already partly closed. You can see part of the transborder area of the new terminal which appears (At least) to be almost complete, alongside one of the sections already in use.

As for why WS left T2 - see above, it's not much of a terminal at the moment, and the demise of SG left a lot of vacancy over at the much newer and nicer T3. I'm not sure when WS hopes to move to T1, or even if they are hoping to do so at all at this point. I'm sure someone more knowledgeable will have some info on the matter, though.

Jean Leloup



Next flight.... who knows.
User currently offlineCslusarc From Canada, joined May 2005, 838 posts, RR: 0
Reply 3, posted (8 years 11 months 2 weeks 1 day 22 hours ago) and read 3550 times:

YYZ's Terminal 1 will become a "mega-terminal" and eventually YYZ's only terminal.


--cslusarc from YWG
User currently offlineYYZatcboy From Canada, joined Apr 2005, 1070 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (8 years 11 months 2 weeks 1 day 22 hours ago) and read 3541 times:
AIRLINERS.NET CREW
CUSTOMER SERVICE & SUPPORT

I am in no hurry to see it full. It is nice and spacious. Not a Full and horrible atomsphere like T2 and Rushhour at T3. I expect to see T3 around for a while yet.


DHC1/3/4 MD11/88 L1011 A319/20/21/30 B727 735/6/7/8/9 762/3 E175/90 CRJ/700/705 CC150. J/S DH8D 736/7/8
User currently offlineVingt20cent From Canada, joined Apr 2004, 88 posts, RR: 0
Reply 5, posted (8 years 11 months 2 weeks 1 day 22 hours ago) and read 3539 times:

Quoting Cslusarc (Reply 3):
YYZ's Terminal 1 will become a "mega-terminal" and eventually YYZ's only terminal.

Really? I didn't realize that they were considering shutting down T3. I thought that T3 was privately owned and operated.


User currently offlineOlympus69 From Canada, joined Jun 2002, 1737 posts, RR: 7
Reply 6, posted (8 years 11 months 2 weeks 1 day 21 hours ago) and read 3460 times:

Quoting Vingt20cent (Reply 5):
Really? I didn't realize that they were considering shutting down T3. I thought that T3 was privately owned and operated

If they are it's the first I've heard about it, and I'm fairly knowledgable about goings on at YYZ.


User currently offlineOlympus69 From Canada, joined Jun 2002, 1737 posts, RR: 7
Reply 7, posted (8 years 11 months 2 weeks 1 day 20 hours ago) and read 3426 times:

Quoting Vingt20cent (Thread starter):
Question #1: Once T1 is completely done, will there be enough "operations" to use all of T1? The terminal goes from Aisles A - Q (except I and O). . . is there enough business to use all the space?

I certainly hope not. You don't build a terminal to meet current demand. You build it large enough to be able to handle the traffic for the next 40 years or so.


User currently offlineLH477 From Canada, joined Jan 2004, 584 posts, RR: 5
Reply 8, posted (8 years 11 months 2 weeks 1 day 20 hours ago) and read 3385 times:

T1 is being built to handle growth of the Airport for the next 50years. Eventually, I believe they will join the two builds, in essence becoming 1 termial....This again is another 5-10 years away...


Come on you gunners......!!!!!
User currently offlineDiscoPete From Canada, joined Aug 2005, 9 posts, RR: 0
Reply 9, posted (8 years 11 months 2 weeks 1 day 19 hours ago) and read 3365 times:

Der Master Plan

And they are still making noises about a new airport in Pickering and there is great pressure to close city center airport. Meanwhile the GTA is experiencing steady growth.


User currently offlineYYZAeroEng From Canada, joined Jun 2005, 165 posts, RR: 1
Reply 10, posted (8 years 11 months 2 weeks 1 day 19 hours ago) and read 3362 times:

There was an article in ROB magazine. I don't have it with me, but I'll look it up when I get home.

The ultimate plan, is at some point after 2014 to demolish T3 (which was bought by the GTAA just after it's creation I think), and expand T1.



Rohan



Mind that Bus! What bus? *Splat!*
User currently offlineRobsawatsky From Canada, joined Dec 2003, 597 posts, RR: 0
Reply 11, posted (8 years 11 months 2 weeks 1 day 18 hours ago) and read 3330 times:

The long term goal is to have one larger terminal building at YYZ. T3 will be expanded and improved until the older part of it have reached the end of useful life. When T3 is expected to be "done for" is not stated, although it is sometime after 2015 and probably after 2020 if the charts that show T3 capacity through 2020 are to be believed.

You can read all about it at:

http://www.gtaa.com/Index.aspx?Sid=Node7/Node7.3/Node7.3.5&Tpl=1


User currently offlineBa777-236 From Canada, joined Oct 2001, 673 posts, RR: 4
Reply 12, posted (8 years 11 months 2 weeks 1 day 18 hours ago) and read 3306 times:

Quoting Cslusarc (Reply 3):
YYZ's Terminal 1 will become a "mega-terminal" and eventually YYZ's only terminal.

Umm.. I hope your "eventually" is reffering to 20 years or more...

I have never heard a thing about T3 being shut-down.. Infact they have recently expanded the parking lot over there, and are currently building a transit-train between T3 and T-New!



I like British Airways! I'm not sure why, but I do! ;-)
User currently offlineAirbusfanYYZ From Canada, joined Oct 2002, 1433 posts, RR: 25
Reply 13, posted (8 years 11 months 2 weeks 1 day 17 hours ago) and read 3275 times:

Quoting Vingt20cent (Thread starter):
I went to the infamous Wendy's parking lot on Airport Rd.

I knew it was famous. Why exactly is it infamous?

Quoting Olympus69 (Reply 6):
Quoting Vingt20cent (Reply 5):
Really? I didn't realize that they were considering shutting down T3. I thought that T3 was privately owned and operated

If they are it's the first I've heard about it, and I'm fairly knowledgable about goings on at YYZ.

John, the final design calls for mega-terminal with 7 piers which will eventually replace the current T3. This will not be happening for at least another 15 years however.

Cheers,
Kaz



t.dot photography
User currently offlineOlympus69 From Canada, joined Jun 2002, 1737 posts, RR: 7
Reply 14, posted (8 years 11 months 2 weeks 1 day 1 hour ago) and read 3074 times:

Quoting AirbusfanYYZ (Reply 13):
John, the final design calls for mega-terminal with 7 piers which will eventually replace the current T3. This will not be happening for at least another 15 years however.

15 years you say? I doubt if I'll be around that long so I won't worry about it Smile


User currently offlineLnglive1011yyz From Canada, joined Oct 2003, 1608 posts, RR: 15
Reply 15, posted (8 years 11 months 2 weeks 7 hours ago) and read 2885 times:

Don't forget -- T1 AND T2 were built by the Government, and the day each of them opened respectively, they were already too small, and at a disadvantage technologically (advent of 747 / Jets for T1, etc).

The GTAA has built the terminal with the FUTURE in mind. Regardless of whether they hit the target dead on, and surpass it in terms of traffic growth, the GTAA will have a formidable option in the new T1 to keep things moving along.

People in general always have this "is it too big? Have we spent too much money?" attitude, with the lack of foresight being a major downfall.

Just look at the city of Toronto for a second:

For such a large city, our mass-transportation system is completely and utterly archaic. There should be subway lines *everywhere*.

The 401 was never built with expansion in mind, and look where we are today? Same with the DVP. We have *2* major arteries to get into and out of DT Toronto. That's it, with *no* room for expansion.

The fact that the GTAA has built T1 new with expansion in mind, actually makes me a feel a bit better about the decisions they make regarding the airport.

1011yyz



Pack your bags, we're going on a sympathy trip!
User currently offlineExPedia From Canada, joined Aug 2005, 49 posts, RR: 0
Reply 16, posted (8 years 11 months 2 weeks 6 hours ago) and read 2864 times:

The other thing to remember here is that this construction should bring a lot more international in-bond pax hubbing through YYZ as opposed to US hubs enroute to other countries - compliments of the increasing visa hassle the US is putting in place. (E.G. NRT-YYZ-EZE). This is in addition to domestic hubbing pax, YYZ origin growth etc. In 10 years, I doubt anyone will be saying that Pearson is too big. They might say it is too expensive, but not too big.


-- ExPedia
User currently offlineDonreith From Canada, joined Nov 2000, 29 posts, RR: 0
Reply 17, posted (8 years 11 months 1 week 6 days 12 hours ago) and read 2712 times:

Quoting Jean Leloup (Reply 2):
As for why WS left T2 - see above, it's not much of a terminal at the moment, and the demise of SG left a lot of vacancy over at the much newer and nicer T3.

The domestic gates they were operating from in T2 are being demolished to make room for T1-New. That's what triggered the move back to T3.


User currently offlineExPedia From Canada, joined Aug 2005, 49 posts, RR: 0
Reply 18, posted (8 years 11 months 1 week 3 days 3 hours ago) and read 2535 times:

Another benefit: since all carriers other than AC/UA are operating from T3, people making do-it-yourself connections to/from WS can stay in the same terminal.


-- ExPedia
User currently offlineScarletHarlot From Canada, joined Jul 2003, 4673 posts, RR: 56
Reply 19, posted (8 years 11 months 1 week 2 days 19 hours ago) and read 2416 times:

Quoting Robsawatsky (Reply 11):
You can read all about it at:

http://www.gtaa.com/Index.aspx?Sid=N...Tpl=1

I went to this URL and ended up spending quite a bit of time reading about the airport master plan, then the Pickering project, then the Oak Ridges Moraine, then about the planned but never built expressways of Toronto, and then about GO Transit's proposed route expansions in the future. Thanks!  Yeah sure

Seriously, it really was very interesting.



But that was when I ruled the world
User currently offlineGearup From Canada, joined Dec 2000, 578 posts, RR: 1
Reply 20, posted (8 years 11 months 1 week 2 days 9 hours ago) and read 2326 times:

Quoting Vingt20cent (Thread starter):
Oh by the way, I went to the infamous Wendy's parking lot on Airport Rd. Had a great time having my Frosty and watching planes hover over my head!

I guess the management at Wendy's don't mind spotters in their parking lot or do they? Maybe they are okay with it if you buy a frosty!

 bouncy 



I have no memory of this place.
User currently offlineLHMark From United States of America, joined Jan 2000, 7255 posts, RR: 47
Reply 21, posted (8 years 11 months 1 week 2 days 9 hours ago) and read 2318 times:

How old is T3? I'm surprised it may have a date with the wrecking ball. It's a fantastic terminal, with a good modern design and plenty of space. OK, the Int'l arrivals scheme sucks, but that's pretty common in airports throughout the world.


"Sympathy is something that shouldn't be bestowed on the Yankees. Apparently it angers them." - Bob Feller
User currently offlineVingt20cent From Canada, joined Apr 2004, 88 posts, RR: 0
Reply 22, posted (8 years 11 months 1 week 2 days 9 hours ago) and read 2302 times:

Quoting Gearup (Reply 20):
I guess the management at Wendy's don't mind spotters in their parking lot or do they? Maybe they are okay with it if you buy a frosty!

That's the secret. . . buy a Frosty! lol No seriously, I was actually quite surprised to see so many plane spotters. It was wonderful to have planes hover over your head just as they land.

Since the old T1 is no longer there, plane spotting is difficult. But merci dieu for the Wendy's parking lot!

Cheers!


User currently offlineExPedia From Canada, joined Aug 2005, 49 posts, RR: 0
Reply 23, posted (8 years 11 months 1 week 2 days 6 hours ago) and read 2248 times:

Quoting LHMark (Reply 21):
How old is T3?

T3 opened sometime in the early 90's - like '92 or '93.



-- ExPedia
User currently offlineCruiser From Canada, joined Apr 2005, 1001 posts, RR: 7
Reply 24, posted (8 years 11 months 1 week 1 day 22 hours ago) and read 2163 times:

I thought that Westjet had already moved. I know that they are slowly demolishing sections of T2 already to make more room for T1. As well, the new hammerhead is progressing well, and should be ready next year, or the year after (cannot remember specific timelines).

James



Leahy on Per Seat Costs: "Have you seen the B-2 fly-by at almost US$1bn a copy? It has only 2 seats!"
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