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Russian Airlines To Buy 527 Aircraft Before 2010  
User currently offlineKeesje From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Posted (9 years 3 months 4 weeks 22 hours ago) and read 11882 times:

Aeroflot Russian Airlines says it is plannning to buy 527 aircraft. These should in in their possesion before 2010. This was told by the head of the Federal air transport agency Alexander Yurchik thursday (august 25) to Moskounews

The plan is to buy 308 passager aircraft, 42 cargo aircraft and 177 helikocopters. According to Yurchik this wil result in an increase of 60% in passenger capasity.

source: http://www.luchtvaartnieuws.nl/news/?ID=9919 (dutch)

Valery Okulov says Aeroflot is to purchase newest long-range foreign-made aircraft. Aeroflot will be choosing between two likely options - Boeing’s 787 model dubbed Dreamliner and A-350.

The Airbus consortium unveiled at the latest Moskow air show cooperation with Irkut Corp to build parts of the A350.



They need widebodies urgently after the Il96-300 was grounded this week & will probably lease some.

Seems the "heritage" fleet of Aeroflot is starting to age..

42 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineSashA From Russia, joined May 1999, 861 posts, RR: 0
Reply 1, posted (9 years 3 months 4 weeks 22 hours ago) and read 11790 times:

Quite obvious choices for long-range capacity aircraft there. Gee, it does seem like the IL-96-300 has been grounded for prolonged time. Sad.

And what are the 177 helos for? Does Aeroflot operate such routes at all?



An2/24/28,Yak42,Tu154/134,IL18/62/96,B737/757/767,A310/320/319,F100,BAe146,EMB-145,CRJ,A340-600,B747-400,A-330-300,A-340
User currently onlineRedChili From Norway, joined Jul 2005, 2304 posts, RR: 5
Reply 2, posted (9 years 3 months 4 weeks 22 hours ago) and read 11794 times:

Aeroflot has 90 airplanes and no helicopters today. For them to buy 308 pax planes, 42 cargo planes, and 177 helicopters during the coming five years sounds totally ridiculous. And the A350 is included among the airplanes they consider acquiring before 2010! I don't believe in this source at all.


Top 10 airplanes: B737, T154, B747, IL96, T134, IL62, A320, MD80, B757, DC10
User currently offlineGlareskin From Netherlands, joined Jun 2005, 1308 posts, RR: 1
Reply 3, posted (9 years 3 months 4 weeks 22 hours ago) and read 11766 times:

Thanks Keesje,

But I don't read all this info in the linked article. Not a word about 787 or A350. Where did you see this?

What I did read is that Moscownews says that 60 - 70% of Aeroflot's fleet is ready for replacements. That will certainly be a tough fight between Airbus and Boeing!



There's still a long way to go before all the alliances deserve a star...
User currently offlineKeesje From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 4, posted (9 years 3 months 4 weeks 21 hours ago) and read 11733 times:

Quoting Glareskin (Reply 3):
But I don't read all this info in the linked article. Not a word about 787 or A350. Where did you see this?

excuse me..
http://www.itar-tass.com/eng/level2.html?NewsID=2351874&PageNum=0

on Irkut A350:
http://www.forbes.com/markets/feeds/afx/2005/08/17/afx2183457.html


User currently onlineRedChili From Norway, joined Jul 2005, 2304 posts, RR: 5
Reply 5, posted (9 years 3 months 4 weeks 21 hours ago) and read 11716 times:

Quoting Glareskin (Reply 3):
What I did read is that Moscownews says that 60 - 70% of Aeroflot's fleet is ready for replacements. That will certainly be a tough fight between Airbus and Boeing!

They really need to replace their T134 and T154, and in my opinion also the IL-96. Since they have recently acquired a lot of A32X planes, it would be reasonable to assume that they will replace the Tupolev's with those planes, although the A319 is a little bit too big as a T134 replacement, which has 68 seats. For replacement of the IL-96, it would make sense to lease a few 767s until they can get brand new 787 or A350.



Top 10 airplanes: B737, T154, B747, IL96, T134, IL62, A320, MD80, B757, DC10
User currently offlineGARPD From UK - Scotland, joined Aug 2005, 2716 posts, RR: 4
Reply 6, posted (9 years 3 months 4 weeks 21 hours ago) and read 11702 times:

This should prove very interesting.

No clear winner here. A and B have equal opportunities here.



arpdesign.wordpress.com
User currently offlineGlareskin From Netherlands, joined Jun 2005, 1308 posts, RR: 1
Reply 7, posted (9 years 3 months 4 weeks 21 hours ago) and read 11685 times:

Quoting Keesje (Reply 4):
excuse me..

No problem!



There's still a long way to go before all the alliances deserve a star...
User currently offlineEI321 From Iraq, joined Jul 2009, 0 posts, RR: 0
Reply 8, posted (9 years 3 months 4 weeks 21 hours ago) and read 11611 times:

Quoting RedChili (Reply 5):
although the A319 is a little bit too big as a T134 replacement, which has 68 seats

Some A318s maybe?!


User currently offlineL410Turbolet From Czech Republic, joined May 2004, 5743 posts, RR: 19
Reply 9, posted (9 years 3 months 4 weeks 21 hours ago) and read 11586 times:

Quoting RedChili (Reply 2):
For them to buy 308 pax planes, 42 cargo planes, and 177 helicopters during the coming five years sounds totally ridiculous.

That's what I thought too. Besides, with 787's first test flight being anticipated in 2007-8(?) and production being sold out for the first two years and the A350 still on the drawing board it is virtually impossible to place orders with delivery dates before 2010 anyway.


User currently offlineAeroflot777 From Russia, joined Mar 2004, 3015 posts, RR: 26
Reply 10, posted (9 years 3 months 4 weeks 21 hours ago) and read 11558 times:

This does not seem realistic at all.....

Aeroflot777


User currently offlineKeesje From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 11, posted (9 years 3 months 4 weeks 20 hours ago) and read 11472 times:

Quoting Aeroflot777 (Reply 10):
This does not seem realistic at all.....

Agree, however it shows some opportunities for aircraft OEM's. Especially if import restrictions are softened, environmental restrictions sharpened & oil prices stay high.

Also opportunities for Russian OEM's and leasing companies stuck with 737-3/4/500, 767, MD80/B717, A300/310 and F100/Bea146 aircraft.


User currently offlineSoyuzavia From Australia, joined Jun 2005, 606 posts, RR: 0
Reply 12, posted (9 years 3 months 4 weeks 19 hours ago) and read 11227 times:
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The projected 527 figure is for all Russian airlines. Not just SU.

Quoting Keesje (Reply 11):
Also opportunities for Russian OEM's and leasing companies stuck with 737-3/4/500, 767, MD80/B717, A300/310 and F100/Bea146 aircraft.

Which is exactly why import duties should never, and probably will not in the near future, be lifted. They should continue to be taxed at 40%. Russia has enough aircraft which are at the end of their useful lives, without becoming a dumping ground for the buckets of junk no longer wanted in the US and Europe. Not to mention that most of these aircraft are not certified in Russia, and also that most are not suited to operations in the country.


User currently offlineEI321 From Iraq, joined Jul 2009, 0 posts, RR: 0
Reply 13, posted (9 years 3 months 4 weeks 19 hours ago) and read 11201 times:

What sort of financial state is SU in?

Is'nt there still a limit to the amount of forien ac that SU are allowed to operate?

Could somebody please list SUs entire fleet details inc all soviet types...

[Edited 2005-08-26 14:19:18]

User currently offlineGLAGAZ From UK - Scotland, joined Feb 2004, 1983 posts, RR: 11
Reply 14, posted (9 years 3 months 4 weeks 18 hours ago) and read 11104 times:

Anyone smell an SU LCC? :P I echo the thoughts above about this seeming ridiculous.

Gaz



Neutrality means that u don't really care cos the struggle goes on even when ur not there, blind and unaware
User currently offlineGARPD From UK - Scotland, joined Aug 2005, 2716 posts, RR: 4
Reply 15, posted (9 years 3 months 4 weeks 18 hours ago) and read 11092 times:

Quoting GLAGAZ (Reply 14):
Anyone smell an SU LCC? :P I echo the thoughts above about this seeming ridiculous.

Well they've been assessing the possibility for a year now.



arpdesign.wordpress.com
User currently offlineAeroflot777 From Russia, joined Mar 2004, 3015 posts, RR: 26
Reply 16, posted (9 years 3 months 4 weeks 18 hours ago) and read 11064 times:

Aeroflot states they have 90 aircraft right now. They used to have a "fleet info" section in their website, but I can't find it.

Aeroflot777


User currently offlineDAYflyer From United States of America, joined Sep 2004, 3807 posts, RR: 3
Reply 17, posted (9 years 3 months 4 weeks 18 hours ago) and read 11046 times:

Quoting RedChili (Reply 2):
Aeroflot has 90 airplanes and no helicopters today. For them to buy 308 pax planes, 42 cargo planes, and 177 helicopters during the coming five years sounds totally ridiculous. And the A350 is included among the airplanes they consider acquiring before 2010! I don't believe in this source at all.

I agree. How would they get the production slots anyway? The 787 is booked solid until 2010 and the A-350 cannot produce a single plane before 2010, not to mention the 737 and A-319/320 slots are all gone until that time frame too. It would appear that the goal cannot be met based on this fact alone. And who would finance such a plan for them??



One Nation Under God
User currently offlineEI321 From Iraq, joined Jul 2009, 0 posts, RR: 0
Reply 18, posted (9 years 3 months 4 weeks 18 hours ago) and read 10952 times:

Current SU fleet details here:

http://www.answers.com/topic/aeroflot

[Edited 2005-08-26 15:29:48]

User currently offlineAeroflot777 From Russia, joined Mar 2004, 3015 posts, RR: 26
Reply 19, posted (9 years 3 months 4 weeks 17 hours ago) and read 10871 times:

8 Airbus A319-100
7 Airbus A320-200
3 Airbus A321-200
6 Boeing 767-300
2 Ilyushin Il-76TD
8 Ilyushin Il-86
6 Ilyushin Il-96-300 (further 6 on order)
4 McDonnell Douglas DC-10-40
12 Tupolev Tu-134A
1 Tupolev Tu-134B
20 Tupolev Tu-154M


This is not the current entire fleet, as Aeroflot has 90 aircraft, and only 77 are stated here.

Aeroflot777


User currently offlineEI321 From Iraq, joined Jul 2009, 0 posts, RR: 0
Reply 20, posted (9 years 3 months 4 weeks 17 hours ago) and read 10731 times:

Are some aircraft inactive or stored? (not inc Il-96)

[Edited 2005-08-26 16:23:57]

User currently offlineAmerican 767 From United States of America, joined May 1999, 3996 posts, RR: 12
Reply 21, posted (9 years 3 months 4 weeks 16 hours ago) and read 10650 times:
AIRLINERS.NET CREW
FORUM MODERATOR

Quoting EI321 (Reply 20):

Yes, there must be quite a few. I know 1 B777 is stored, and probably the few B737-400's they had. I'm not sure about the TU-204, Aeroflot hasn't flown it for years but they may still have a few of them stored. I think that when they say 90 aircraft, it includes the ones I'm talking about in addition to what Aeroflot777 said.

Too bad the IL-96-300 is grounded. It is Aeroflot's flagship aircraft, and like some people said Russia's biggest achievement in the airliner business.

Quoting RedChili (Reply 5):
They really need to replace their T134 and T154, and in my opinion also the IL-96.

The 134, yes, that one is getting very old. It dates from the 60's. But the 154 can still fly for a few more years, maybe not on mainline flights but they can at least serve as charters. And some of them can be stored and serve as back up aircraft, should an aircraft be grounded for technical reasons.

I don't agree that the IL-96 should be replaced. It's not because they are grounded that they should be replaced for good. They are grounded but they will return to service once the braking problems are solved, parts have to be redesigned to meed ICAO safety standards according to what I have understood.
In 1979, the FAA grounded all DC-10's for a few weeks following the Chicago disaster. The DC-10 was still young at that time, once the cause of the disaster was investigated it returned to service. Those contunued to fly until the mid 90's when they were due for replacements.

Quoting EI321 (Reply 8):
Quoting RedChili (Reply 5):
although the A319 is a little bit too big as a T134 replacement, which has 68 seats

Some A318s maybe?!

That's excactly what I have been thinking. I wrote this in a post a while ago, people responded to me that even the A318 was too large for a TU-134 replacement.
Air France replaced its Caravelles with B727 and B737 aircraft. Now at Air France the A318/19/20/21 do what the Caravelles used to do 30 years ago: fly pax on mainline flights in Europe. I mention this because, for me, the TU-134 is the Russian Caravelle.

Ben Soriano
Brussels Belgium



Ben Soriano
User currently offlineScbriml From United Kingdom, joined Jul 2003, 12885 posts, RR: 46
Reply 22, posted (9 years 3 months 4 weeks 16 hours ago) and read 10630 times:
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Quoting EI321 (Reply 20):
Are some aircraft inactive or stored? (not inc Il-96)

SU has a number of Il-86s at SVO that don't seem to have been in active service for some time. I suspect that if these can be put back in service at a reasonable cost, they might be, but this won't really help SU's requirements for long-haul planes to fly to Europe and US.



Time flies like an arrow, but fruit flies like a banana! #44cHAMpion
User currently offlineGalapagapop From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 910 posts, RR: 4
Reply 23, posted (9 years 3 months 4 weeks 16 hours ago) and read 10611 times:

Quoting EI321 (Reply 8):
Some A318s maybe?!

Still to big. For a Tu-134 seater I could possible see ERJ170's and possible some other E-jets


User currently offlineWorldliner From United Kingdom, joined Aug 2005, 275 posts, RR: 0
Reply 24, posted (9 years 3 months 4 weeks 15 hours ago) and read 9993 times:

well the frieghters will all be il96-400t. its been construsted as we speak

worldliner



@777Worldliner
25 A999 : Aeroflot777 According to JP airline-fleets SU is listed with another 4 TU154Ms, plus 3 stored IL86s plus an additional 763 for delivery 2005. Otherwis
26 KULATICT : well, they said they planned to BUY by 2010, not OPERATE by 2010, so there's no big issue regarding slots for 787 & A350 delivery date. So, why is the
27 Post contains links RedChili : I believe that Aeroflot also has some IL-62 planes stored. Aeroflot says on its web site: "Aeroflot air fleet consists of 90 planes... By 2005 73 pla
28 EI321 : A while back there were roumers of SU going for austrian 340s to replace the 777s. With the IL 96S out of the picture for an uncertain time , is it ti
29 Stirling : 2 things stick out in my brain.... 1. Given Russia's (Soviet Union's) rich aviation heritage, it is a shame to think the country cannot support it's o
30 Starrion : As I recall the TU-204 is a fairly modern narrowbody similar to the 757. Is there any reason Aeroflot would not consider a significant number of those
31 Justman : Can someone tell me, why Aeroflot has stored their Tu-204´s after the end of the soviet union and never used them again? Or are thay maybe with other
32 EI321 : As with most of SUs fleet I think they were dished out to the post soviet era airlines. SU had well over 1000 aircraft during that time.
33 Scbriml : There were two major factors in that scenario: 1) Captive audience (Aeroflot). 2) Endless supply of money. In the cold-war era, the Soviets wanted to
34 Donder10 : Hardly the case though seeing as Aeroflot's 'Western' fleet is relatively young although not the case with some others eg VIM,Transaero. How does reg
35 RedChili : Several of the planes metioned here are certified in Russia, at least the 737, 767, and A310. It's certainly not good for Russia to become a dumping
36 EI321 : Thats why I think they could replace the 767s with 332s (a bit bigger I know) and maybe adopt some 340s if the IL86 or 777s need a successor soon. Th
37 Afay1 : Quoting Justman (Reply 31): Can someone tell me, why Aeroflot has stored their Tu-204´s after the end of the soviet union and never used them again?
38 IRelayer : Very interesting and informative breakdown...kudos. What is sad about this is that the Russian Aviation industry has had almost 15 years to get their
39 Post contains images HighFlyer9790 : WOW...complete incompetence...do you believe it? ive never heard of an airline ordering a total of 527 aircraft...thats crazy
40 Afay1 : HighFlyer- if you read the thread you would have realized that it is a mistake. All the Russian airlines together will order 527 by 2010, not just Aer
41 RedChili : Replace the 767? They just acquired them last year! I believe they have a lease on those planes for X number of years, so they cannot get rid of them
42 Post contains links MX757 : Check out this news release, it's from Boeing's website. http://www.boeing.com/news/releases/2005/q3/nr_050817g.html
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