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Would An Airline Fly An RJ Over 4 Hours?  
User currently offlineLUV4JFK From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 462 posts, RR: 0
Posted (8 years 11 months 6 days 9 hours ago) and read 9010 times:

I recently went to Embraer's website and until recently, they never put up the range of the ERJ-145XR. To my surprise, it is 2000nm. The same range as their E70's. I was wondering, would an airline put a regional on such a long flight? For example, would Continental Express, (seeing they are the only airline with the aircraft), fly a route such as EWR-COS, or even EWR-BOI and would these routes be profitable? Would passengers be comfortable on such a long flight on an RJ? I know people on this forum love to complain about RJ's and long flights, but they do exist. I believe the longest route for Continental Express is IAH-BFL at 1240nm, still air distance is 1348nm and a flight time of over 3.5 hours. What are your thoughts?

LUV4JFK
 yes 


John F. Kennedy International Airport: Where America Greets The World.
53 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineTornado82 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 1, posted (8 years 11 months 6 days 8 hours ago) and read 8958 times:

Quoting LUV4JFK (Thread starter):
IAH-BFL at 1240nm

EWR-OKC is 1300+, not to be picky. I'm pretty sure that's already over 4 hours of block time because of the Newark taxiing issues build into the schedule, and while flight time is what matters to the aircraft... block time is what matters to the pax in the aircraft. Personally, I'll take an ERJ over a 737 any day, I'm not a people person and that A seat suits me perfect. The seat pitch is the same too, so the only issue is head room, but how often are you actually standing upright on the aircraft anyways? Not to mention I'm only 5'8" so ERJ's are fine for me as well.


User currently onlineMAH4546 From Sweden, joined Jan 2001, 32620 posts, RR: 72
Reply 2, posted (8 years 11 months 6 days 8 hours ago) and read 8942 times:

Air Canada has flown the CRJ-700 over 4 hours on Toronto-Phoenix. To be fair, though, Air Canada's CRJ-700 have 34" pitch in coach, a first class cabin, and are in the process of getting PTVs installed in every seat.


a.
User currently offlineBostonGuy From United States of America, joined Jul 2000, 514 posts, RR: 8
Reply 3, posted (8 years 11 months 6 days 8 hours ago) and read 8923 times:

Quoting LUV4JFK (Thread starter):
I believe the longest route for Continental Express is IAH-BFL at 1240nm, still air distance is 1348nm and a flight time of over 3.5 hours. What are your thoughts?

I've flown Canadair RJ MCO - BOS via DCA. Seat pitch was the same, seat size was the same. Just less people with smaller carry-on in the cabin.

Was as pleasant, and in some respects pleasanter, than a Song 757 nonstop.

Don't forget that these RJ's also have corporate uses, as well. The long range is an advantage in getting corporate customers. Plus, many an aircraft has found its market opportunity shrink due to unexpected demand for the aircraft on routes far longer than what the manufacturer expected.


User currently offlineYULMRS From France, joined Mar 2005, 195 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (8 years 11 months 6 days 8 hours ago) and read 8922 times:

Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 2):
Air Canada has flown the CRJ-700 over 4 hours on Toronto-Phoenix. To be fair, though, Air Canada's CRJ-700 have 34" pitch in coach, a first class cabin, and are in the process of getting PTVs installed in every seat.

These are not 700s, AC Jazz got 705s ... Meaning this is the 900 tube with only 75 seats ... Instead of 86 (correct me if I'm wrong) for America West's 900s.



To any North American carrier, send us a regular flight in MRS !!!!!
User currently offlineLUV4JFK From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 462 posts, RR: 0
Reply 5, posted (8 years 11 months 6 days 8 hours ago) and read 8845 times:

Quoting Tornado82 (Reply 1):
Quoting LUV4JFK (Thread starter):
IAH-BFL at 1240nm

EWR-OKC is 1300+, not to be picky.

I was using nautical miles, not statute miles.

Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 2):
Air Canada has flown the CRJ-700 over 4 hours on Toronto-Phoenix.

Well at least someone is flying for 4 hours on an RJ.

And just to edit my original post, I see that EWR-BOI is over 2000nm, so that flight was not possible.

LUV4JFK
 yes 



John F. Kennedy International Airport: Where America Greets The World.
User currently offlineBostonGuy From United States of America, joined Jul 2000, 514 posts, RR: 8
Reply 6, posted (8 years 11 months 6 days 7 hours ago) and read 8753 times:

Having extra range sure comes in handy, too, when circling Atlanta for hours on end due to thunderstorms.

User currently offlineTornado82 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 7, posted (8 years 11 months 6 days 7 hours ago) and read 8705 times:

Quoting LUV4JFK (Reply 5):
I was using nautical miles, not statute miles.

I see my error, I was under the assumption OnePass miles are nm's not sm's.. and having flown that route quite a few times i knew it was 1300


User currently offlineAC787 From Canada, joined Mar 2005, 337 posts, RR: 1
Reply 8, posted (8 years 11 months 6 days 5 hours ago) and read 8545 times:

Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 2):
Air Canada has flown the CRJ-700 over 4 hours on Toronto-Phoenix. To be fair, though, Air Canada's CRJ-700 have 34" pitch in coach, a first class cabin, and are in the process of getting PTVs installed in every seat.

sounds better then flying international with some american carriers  Smile


User currently offlineTOLtommy From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 3288 posts, RR: 4
Reply 9, posted (8 years 11 months 6 days 5 hours ago) and read 8467 times:

I hear CO is working w/ Embraer on a system of drop tanks for their RJ fleet, in order to open up new trans-atlantic service from EWR...  highfive 

User currently offlineACDC8 From Canada, joined Mar 2005, 7642 posts, RR: 36
Reply 10, posted (8 years 11 months 6 days 5 hours ago) and read 8426 times:

AC will also be flying the Embraer 190 from YYZ-YLW non-stop in the coming months, I believe thats about 1910nm and has a scheduled flight time of 4 hours and 40 minutes.


A Grumpy German Is A Sauerkraut
User currently offlineORDagent From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 823 posts, RR: 1
Reply 11, posted (8 years 11 months 6 days 4 hours ago) and read 8343 times:

I really don't consider the 170/190 range of aircraft as regional aircraft per se. The cabins appear to be just as un/cramped as most other narrow body aircraft with the exception of no middle seats.

User currently offline717-200 From United States of America, joined Oct 2000, 601 posts, RR: 2
Reply 12, posted (8 years 11 months 6 days 3 hours ago) and read 8197 times:

The 170/190 series are like the first genaration of small mainline jets
like the DC9-10's BAC 1-11's and the F28's but with a lot more range.
I would have preferred to be on USEx 170 versus the A319 this past
March when I flew on a full SEA-PHL redeye in a middle seat in the
back of the bus.



72S 733 734 735 73G 738 742 752 763 E190 M82 M83
User currently offlineJorge1812 From Germany, joined Apr 2004, 3149 posts, RR: 8
Reply 13, posted (8 years 11 months 6 days 3 hours ago) and read 8151 times:

Lufthansa to Iceland IIRC with the CRJ.

Georg.


User currently offlineWhiteHatter From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 14, posted (8 years 11 months 6 days 3 hours ago) and read 8147 times:

Get your head out of the North American aviation map and look at routes within regions like China and Asia in general. A couple of thousand miles is essential to operate some inter-city thin services within China or around that region.

That is the region where sales and growth are exploding. That's where the E-jets and others will be selling extended range versions.


User currently offlineORDagent From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 823 posts, RR: 1
Reply 15, posted (8 years 11 months 6 days 1 hour ago) and read 8010 times:

Quoting WhiteHatter (Reply 14):
Get your head out of the North American aviation map

Excuse me. Most of the replies are from people that live in N. America.

Okay...so do you want to fly a regional from NGB to KIX? It is within the range of most regionals and is a whole lot easier than taking the train to PVG or you could take an MU 320 from NGB to PVG for a 20 min flight and connect on to KIX.


User currently offlineMozart From Luxembourg, joined Aug 2003, 2167 posts, RR: 13
Reply 16, posted (8 years 11 months 6 days 1 hour ago) and read 7960 times:

Slightly off topic: Air Tahiti flies PPT/Tahiti to Gambier on an ATR, flight time around 3.5 hours. The world's longest scheduled turboprop service

User currently offlineAisak From Spain, joined Aug 2005, 762 posts, RR: 10
Reply 17, posted (8 years 11 months 6 days ago) and read 7916 times:

Air Nostrum flies quite long routes with CRJ under the IB code

PMO & NAP are the longest routes from the MAD hub
HAJ & BRI from BCN

But the longest route YW actually flies is SDR-LPA covering 1250 milles in 3 scheduled hours. Nice to see SDR airport traffic nowadays  

Awnsering your question...
Would An Airline Fly An RJ Over 4 Hours?
Yes, if there's money but not enough PAX to fill a mainline a/c

[Edited 2005-08-30 00:28:41]

User currently offlineMymiles2go From United States of America, joined Nov 2003, 207 posts, RR: 0
Reply 18, posted (8 years 11 months 5 days 23 hours ago) and read 7551 times:

The reason RJ's are deployed on longer routes is simple:

The airline could not otherwise profitably serve the route with mainline aircraft. RJ's help grow (or maintain) routes that otherwise may not be possible with a 737/A319. That's generally good for passengers as well as airlines.

Also, remember - not all RJ's are created equal. United for instance is putting F and E+ on many of thier 70 seaters and Embraer's (via thier Express Partners of course). Honestly, if I have F and E+ on an RJ it really doesn't matter that much. Sure your not going to get a hot meal, but it's better than connecting through otherwise undesirable hubs/routes.

It's all about economics.


User currently offlineJetter2 From United States of America, joined Jul 2005, 138 posts, RR: 0
Reply 19, posted (8 years 11 months 5 days 23 hours ago) and read 7491 times:

Jazz rides a RJ daily down here to dallas from toronto. That is the smallest aircraft other than a Md80 that flew that route..I didn't think that was possible for that little bird.

User currently offlineTornado82 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 20, posted (8 years 11 months 5 days 23 hours ago) and read 7454 times:

Quoting Mymiles2go (Reply 18):
Sure your not going to get a hot meal,

Like you would anywhere else either in this day and age.


User currently offlineTWA902fly From United States of America, joined Dec 1999, 3122 posts, RR: 4
Reply 21, posted (8 years 11 months 5 days 23 hours ago) and read 7418 times:

Lufthansa does or did i am not sure, fly a CRJ-700 on FRA-KEF, 1300nm exactly. I think those are about 3:30 - 3:40 in each direction.

United Express flies a CR7 on ORD-SLC, 1086nm, They still do or used to, i am not sure, fly SFO-AUS 1307 nm CR7, HP flies PHX-YEG CRJ-900, which is 1374nm, about 3:30 as well each way.

'902



life wasn't worth the balance, or the crumpled paper it was written on
User currently offlinePeachAir From United States of America, joined Dec 2000, 365 posts, RR: 3
Reply 22, posted (8 years 11 months 5 days 21 hours ago) and read 6771 times:

Quoting LUV4JFK (Thread starter):
Would passengers be comfortable on such a long flight on an RJ?

After seeing the inside of the EMB170 on Friday, I would say this aircraft BLOWS AWAY all other RJ's with respect to comfort and space. The Shuttle America N358RW had 6F/64Y with plenty of leg rooms and very comfortable leather seats. If I had to fly JFK-IAH or ATL-CUN on this flight I wouldn't complain. I founf the legroom and width to be just as good (actually better) than most narrowbodies (B737/MD80) that I have flown on.

Peachair


User currently offlineFlybyguy From United States of America, joined Jun 2004, 1801 posts, RR: 1
Reply 23, posted (8 years 11 months 5 days 21 hours ago) and read 6635 times:

Quoting AC787 (Reply 8):
sounds better then flying international with some american carriers

Try better than most US carriers...

Would An Airline Fly An RJ Over 4 Hours?

I would have to say, nowadays in the U.S. YES, and they will cram as many seats as they can put in the damn plane to boot. I feel under the money crunch airlines would rather be guaranteed a full a 70 seat CRJ than risk flying larger aircraft and be only 80% full most of the time. I guess "low fares" or rather much higher operating costs bar airlines from flying those types of routes anymore.

I would have to say if there was a regional jet that could fly for 6-7 hours U.S. carriers would ETOPS certify it and use them on low yield overseas markets. Comfort is never a primary concern nowadays in America, only profitability, because the antiquated cost structure of American Legacy carriers are causing them to hemorrhage cash in a deluge. Offering "low fares" isn't the way to go when per mile costs of each legacy flight is exorbitant, especially due to the much, much higher pay scales and rampant inefficiencies that Legacies have to deal with as opposed to low-cost-carriers which, unlike the Legacies mis-understanding of the term, offer low airfares AND have more efficient low cost corporate structures.



"Are you a pretender... or a thoroughbred?!" - Professor Matt Miller
User currently offlineSspontak From United States of America, joined Aug 2004, 475 posts, RR: 2
Reply 24, posted (8 years 11 months 5 days 20 hours ago) and read 6440 times:

Delta use to do JFK - DFW in a CR7. That was most likely very close to the 4 hour range.


Go Delta!
25 LHMark : American Eagle is now running ERJs ROC-DFW. I like the ERJ, but that's a long time to be within one. Still, with those huge windows...
26 YYZYUL : Hey Jetter2 The Jazz RJ's are now 705's and will soon become mainline EMB175's I believe at the end of Sept or early Oct..I do not know if this is per
27 Post contains images Sllevin : I have to say, I flew IAD-IAH just last week on the 145XR. It really bad at all -- certainly not worse than CO mainline in coach -- and, in my opinion
28 SHUPirate1 : Lufthansa no longer serves KEF. In fact, no Star Alliance carrier does.
29 FlyXJT : The longest CoEx flight is IAH-BOI at 1495 miles, blocking at a whopping 3 hours and 58 minutes some of the other longer ones... IAH-BFL is 1438 mile
30 Paddy78 : EWR-COS would be a goldmine trip; when I used to work the curb back in the WP days, we had to beat people away with a stick from both the CO and the
31 MAH4546 : DFW-ROC is blocked longer than that.. LGA-XNA is blocked at 3:19/XNA-LGA at 3:02 LAX-XNA is blocked at 3:08/XNA-LAX at 3:26 DFW-NAS is blocked at 3:0
32 SHUPirate1 : MAH-LGA-XNA is not an CRJ-700...in fact, LGA-XNA is an ERJ-135.
33 KBGRbillT : WhiteHatter pull your head out of your world atlas!! Asia isn't a region, it's a continent, a very large one I might add which is comprised of severa
34 SHUPirate1 : The travel market in Eastern Asia is so large that their are entire countries (South Korea for example) that have never had a regional jet fly into t
35 Post contains images 777WT : I would limit myself to 2 hours tops on a RJ. I was on AA's EMB-145 from LGA to PTL (Portland, Maine) and noticed the plane was rather small inside. H
36 SHUPirate1 : I suppose you mean PWM. For what it is worth, American Airlines/Eagle no longer serves PWM at all...
37 MAH4546 : Correct, forgot about that. All three flights are ERJ-135s.
38 ORDflier : How about Air Canada's flights from Houston to Calgary? CRJ700 approximately 4 hours and 14 minutes! Just a short hop... 1,747 Miles!
39 Skyexramper : MKE to BDL..skyway 328Jet....It'll feel like 4hrs especially going west to Milwaukee. 328J pilots go crazy when they hit the magic ground speed of 400
40 DFW13L : Here are some details on Eagle, with some point-to-point that isn't very obvious. ERJ 135 flying: RDU-AUS (2 rts daily) 1161 miles 3hr 10min Frequent
41 AirWillie6475 : RJ flying is fine, you get the same amount of room as the big jets as long as you are not flying the CRJ200.
42 DFW13L : I can't stand the CRJ200 either. The windows are so low that the cabin is dark and I get a crick in my neck, since the top of the window is below my
43 AirWillie6475 : I agree, Skywest especially has a dark cabin because of their dark leather seats. This doesn't help the atmosphere look spacious in the cabin at all.
44 777WT : My bad, it's PWM. It was close to $400 one way, and that was in 2003.
45 Carpethead : There's a whopping total of ten RJs in Japan (increases to 12 by end of this year). Zero in South Korea, Taiwan, Philippines, Malaysia, Singapore & In
46 SHUPirate1 : Not to split hairs, but Raleigh-Austin is actually run with the ERJ-140, not the ERJ-135.
47 LACA773 : Does AC's Jazz have inflight service like meals or snacks? It sounds like it can work from the routes everyone has mentioned but I feel they need to u
48 MD90fan : What about UAX LAX-SAT and used to be SFO-AUS?
49 COERJ145 : DL does a DTW-SLC flight on a E70, 4hrs each way I think. I wanted to go from MHT-DTW-SLC-ONT, but the price was a bit over my budget, so i'm probably
50 Njintern : AC IAHYYC is the longest block out there on a regional jet, 4:14 as ORDFlier stated above. Other flights close to four hours... CO IAHBOI 3:58 CO CLEA
51 Usair320 : Ive only flown on the ERJ 145 once on CO EWR-PHL which was like 20 mins @ 6,000 ft. But I flew way back in 01 befor the attacks on a CRJ 200 PHL-IAD-M
52 Post contains links Boeing nut : I recently flew an E145 from STL-EWR. I'm 6'3" and I have to say it was one of the most uncomfortable flights I have ever been on. Ironically though,
53 Boeing744 : Wow, I really want to fly that route now... I belive AC also operates CRJ's YYC-IAH.
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