N593HA From Germany, joined Oct 2004, 90 posts, RR: 0 Posted (3 years 2 months 3 weeks 2 days 21 hours ago) and read 4399 times:
Hey,
I live in Germany and have flown a couple of times already from my hometown to Hawaii. Although I love flying it's always a very long journey. Although there many connections where you depart in Europe and arrive the same still at HNL, I prefer to split the trip and at least for this the most comfortable way to do it:
Day 1: CGN-KL1804-AMS-KL605-SFO
Day 2: SFO-HA11-HNL
There is no way, even not cheaper fares to get me flying via LHR and/or LAX. I just hate those two airports.
So now here my question:
Would there be enough demand for a daily Europe to HNL non-stop service?
Off course range is big issue on that route, which means from what I know only A345, 772LR and one the up-coming 787 versions would be suitable to fly non-stop across the 1,5 oceans!
To increase demand, any airline would need to code-share with a European airline to fill that flight. So may it would easier for a European airline to start those flights!
The only thing that I'm absolutely certain about is that the HNL spotters would love to see a European airline on regular basis at their hometown airport!
Now you may write down your thoughts about this topic
Regards from Germany
N593HA
"Nene" is a great looking girl! When can I fly with her?
L410Turbolet From Czech Republic, joined May 2004, 4133 posts, RR: 15 Reply 2, posted (3 years 2 months 3 weeks 2 days 21 hours ago) and read 4366 times:
Quoting N593HA (Thread starter): Would there be enough demand for a daily Europe to HNL non-stop service?
I doubt it since it would most likely mean same two-class arrangement SQ has for its SIN-EWR/LAX service. Besides, Hawaii is moreless holiday destination (am I right?), therefore I'm not sure you'd find enough people willing to pay full-fare business/first class for a daily service.
It also means no more than ONE destination in Europe, which means connecting anyway. Let's say AMS-LAX-HNL, FRA-SFO-HNL, LHR-LAX-HNL, VIE-SFO-HNL still seems like more bearable - at least psychologically - than connecting within Europe to a hub and then this 14, 15, 16? hours of non-stop ordeal accross half of the globe.
I've done this trip only once, HNL-LAX-FRA-PRG on UA/LH with an overnight stay in LAX and it was bad enough - especially the eastbound part.
Leskova From Germany, joined Oct 2003, 5964 posts, RR: 73 Reply 3, posted (3 years 2 months 3 weeks 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 4265 times:
I agree that the eastbound flight is annoying, but the westbound is ok - the fastest connection is probably taking UA and flying FRA-SFO-HNL (and, yes, there are some quite good fares for that route).
As for nonstops - putting expensive longhaul equipment on relatively low yield routes isn't really a good choice for airlines so, no, I do not expect to see any European airlines operating nonstops to Hawai'i anytime soon... for that much, I also don't expect to see any US carrier operating Hawai'i to Europe nonstops either.
Last time I flew the route, I flew HAJ-LHR-IAD-DEN, stayed the night there, continued DEN-SFO-LAX-LIH (well, I like flying, and I got lots of miles for that routing), while on the way back, I took the LIH-SFO afternoon flight that got me into SFO around midnight, stayed at a hotel and continued on LH's nonstop to FRA, from where I connected on to HAJ. There's the option of taking a redeye (departing just before midnight) and arriving at SFO or LAX in the morning, but the flight's just too darn short for a night flight (at least for me), so I'd never take that option.
LordHowe From Finland, joined Jan 2003, 723 posts, RR: 2 Reply 4, posted (3 years 2 months 3 weeks 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 4269 times:
I have been thinking about this same question.
According to Great Circle Mapper the distance is not so impossible - check these out:
FRA-HNL 11990 km
LHR-HNL 11647 km
AMS-HNL 11677 km
For example SYD-LAX is 12051 km and has been flown nonstop for years.
The ultra long SIN-EWR is 15345 km.
But the shortest way also to HNL is from Northern Europe. We have good connections from allover Europe to HEL and HEL-HNL is "only" 10952 km. But we do not have the equipment - almost 11000 km is too much for MD11s, isn't it?
Jacobin777 From United States, joined Sep 2004, 12780 posts, RR: 57 Reply 6, posted (3 years 2 months 3 weeks 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 4218 times:
Quoting N593HA (Thread starter): Off course range is big issue on that route, which means from what I know only A345, 772LR and one the up-coming 787 versions would be suitable to fly non-stop across the 1,5 oceans!
from LHR/CDG, the 777-200ER can easily do the trick...but the yields would be crappy, so thats why its easier to send a one world/star alliance parter via SFO/LAX
BCAL From United Kingdom, joined Jun 2004, 3141 posts, RR: 19 Reply 11, posted (3 years 2 months 3 weeks 2 days 19 hours ago) and read 4132 times:
Western Airlines operated a direct service at one time from LGW to HNL. A refueling stop en route (Anchorage I think) was necessary. Unfortunately they operated the route with the DC10-10 and consequently there were restrictions on the load. The service was stopped after just one season. Perhaps it they used the DC10-30, without the load restrictions, it might have been more successful.
I love talking about nothing. It's the only thing I know anything about. Oscar Wilde
The 777-200 can do it so range is not an issue but keep in mind that various other enroute variables could reduce the total payload. Now you just have to find enought people willing to fly)
Planespotting From United States, joined Apr 2004, 2706 posts, RR: 5 Reply 15, posted (3 years 2 months 3 weeks 2 days 19 hours ago) and read 4063 times:
yeah, Hawaii is predominantly an American Tourism destination, as Europe has many places that are closer and equally tropical.
1MillionFlyer From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 16, posted (3 years 2 months 3 weeks 2 days 19 hours ago) and read 4045 times:
Quoting Orion737 (Reply 10): many of those who visit Hawaii can afford high fares and C class. Most of those flying tenerife want a cheapo week in the sun with lots of lager!
Trust me , you can have a high-end Holiday in TFS if you want.
Orion737 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 17, posted (3 years 2 months 3 weeks 2 days 19 hours ago) and read 4027 times:
I dont doubt it, there are several very good 5 star hotels, particularly in the Northern resort of Puerto De La Cruz and the island is served by scheduled flights. However, Tenerife is largely a 'cheap and cheerful' year round destination for the British.
TFS is particular is served by hundreds of charter flights and is home to British pubs, bars, grotty apartment blocks and I think it fair to say that TFS does attract a fair amount of lower end holidaymakers. Im talking Aspro and Thomson square deal holidays in 2 star apartment blocks on charter flights leaving in the middle of the night.
Sponsor Message: 
From Germany, joined Oct 2004, 90 posts, 
From United Kingdom, joined May 2001, 2882 posts, 
From Czech Republic, joined May 2004, 4133 posts, 
From Finland, joined Jan 2003, 723 posts, 
From Ghana, joined Jun 2004, 3317 posts, 
From United States, joined Sep 2004, 12780 posts, 
From , joined Dec 1969, posts,