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Olympic, What Is The Future?  
User currently offlineGeorgiabill From United States of America, joined Mar 2003, 584 posts, RR: 0
Posted (9 years 2 months 2 weeks 4 days 21 hours ago) and read 4126 times:
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I have read several articles over the years about tenders to privatized Olympic. I remember when a British consulting group was brought into manage the company, ultimately left after being unable to get concessions from the unions, creditors ect. Wrong fleet, I think the A332's would better serve Olympic than the under utilized A340's, next generation 737's or A320 family aircraft for European routes and rj's for domestic service. In order to compete the bloated work force must be cut, improved cabin service and take advantage of the new airport to better serve the Balkans. On a side note I have flown on Olympic, service was adequate, flight was within 15 min of schedule and the fa was pleasant. I think at this point the only was Olympic survives is with a merger with another carrier like the Air France-KLM. Had LH not invested in Swiss I would have thought that might have been a good possibility.

27 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineATLFlyer323 From United States of America, joined Jan 2005, 618 posts, RR: 0
Reply 1, posted (9 years 2 months 2 weeks 4 days 21 hours ago) and read 4111 times:

I really hope they can survive, I love there color scheme (and seeing my parents are from Greece). Just asking but why is there an extra olympic ring on there color scheme? Are they not allowed to use only the 5 Olympic Rings?
~Brandon



Everyday, the fluffy temptation of wheat!
User currently offlineDeltaWings From Switzerland, joined Aug 2004, 1294 posts, RR: 17
Reply 2, posted (9 years 2 months 2 weeks 4 days 21 hours ago) and read 4102 times:

I have read that OA might liquidate by November if things don't change drastically. Lets hope they survive somehow.

Maybe they should merge with Alitalia. no, just joking



Homer: Marge, it takes two to lie. One to lie and one to listen.
User currently offlineATLFlyer323 From United States of America, joined Jan 2005, 618 posts, RR: 0
Reply 3, posted (9 years 2 months 2 weeks 4 days 21 hours ago) and read 4088 times:

Quoting DeltaWings:
Maybe they should merge with Alitalia. no, just joking


Lol....good one.  rotfl 
~Brandon



Everyday, the fluffy temptation of wheat!
User currently offlineEgmcman From United Kingdom, joined Jun 2005, 898 posts, RR: 8
Reply 4, posted (9 years 2 months 2 weeks 4 days 20 hours ago) and read 4028 times:

If British Airways couldn't fix OA's problems in 1999 then sadly I think writing is on wall as it last made a profit in 1971 according to the book No Frills by Simon Calder.

cheers

egmcman


User currently offlineAvianca From Venezuela, joined Jan 2005, 5934 posts, RR: 40
Reply 5, posted (9 years 2 months 2 weeks 4 days 20 hours ago) and read 4016 times:

well I didn´t see a big future for Olympic.... They should reconsider all routes that they are serving and get a little smaller than they are now...

The problem that I do not understand, there are many Greek people all over the world and Olympic can not establish any route that makes profit...?

regards
Avianca



Colombia es el Mundo Y el Mundo es Colombia
User currently offlineDETA737 From Portugal, joined Oct 2000, 612 posts, RR: 0
Reply 6, posted (9 years 2 months 2 weeks 4 days 20 hours ago) and read 4012 times:

I'm surprised they've actually lasted this long. I'm not aware of their current situation, but I know they've been close to the brink for quite some time. Perhaps some of our Greek friends could shed some light on the current situation. BTW what are their current longhaul destinations? JFK, YYZ, JNB, is that about right? I know they gave up on Australia some years ago.

User currently onlinePe@rson From United Kingdom, joined Jan 2001, 19245 posts, RR: 52
Reply 7, posted (9 years 2 months 2 weeks 4 days 20 hours ago) and read 4007 times:

The problem with OA are the trade unions: if the airline wishes to make changes to its organisation, the unions oppose them, hence they are never made. If positive change is to be made, then something must be done to counter the trade unions. If not, OA will remain as it is or fail.


"Everyone writing for the Telegraph knows that the way to grab eyeballs is with Ryanair and/or sex."
User currently offlineFLYYUL From Italy, joined Jun 2000, 4999 posts, RR: 51
Reply 8, posted (9 years 2 months 2 weeks 4 days 18 hours ago) and read 3936 times:

DETA737,

Im not sure if you conveniently dropped YUL from that list.


User currently onlineA342 From Germany, joined Jul 2005, 4690 posts, RR: 3
Reply 9, posted (9 years 2 months 2 weeks 4 days 18 hours ago) and read 3918 times:

Quoting Georgiabill (Thread starter):
and rj's for domestic service.

This would only increase operating and aquisition costs. Greece is a rather small contry, turboprop aircraft are enough for domestic flying.



Exceptions confirm the rule.
User currently offlineDETA737 From Portugal, joined Oct 2000, 612 posts, RR: 0
Reply 10, posted (9 years 2 months 2 weeks 4 days 18 hours ago) and read 3898 times:

I didn't even realise they still served YUL. I would have thought that OA would have dropped that route to concentrate on YYZ. It seems that their 4 longhauls are primarily focused on VFR traffic. I was just reading that there is an EU inquiry about the state aid given to the airline and that a report should come out on September 14. Things don't look good and apparently OA will be expected to repay any illegal subsidies.

User currently offlineGeorgiabill From United States of America, joined Mar 2003, 584 posts, RR: 0
Reply 11, posted (9 years 2 months 2 weeks 3 days 22 hours ago) and read 3731 times:
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Obviously the future is bleak! Hopefully Aegean or another company will step up and attempt to do what SN has done since the collapse of Sabena

User currently offlineOrion737 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 12, posted (9 years 2 months 2 weeks 3 days 21 hours ago) and read 3724 times:

I rather think Olympic do have a need for a jet aircraft for domestic flights, particualrly for summer routes between Athens and the larger islands like Rhodos, Corfu and Heraklion (Crete).

Also some of the lengths of these inter-island sectors can be quite lengthy. Although Greece has a relativley small population as a whole, the disperal of its population and the topography of the country means that air travel is extremley important to the Greek economy and way of life.

Prior to the 717s, the 732 was used for many years for busy domestic routes even supported by the A300 during busy summer months. An all turboprop fleet for domestic flights would be inadequate.


User currently offlineOlympus69 From Canada, joined Jun 2002, 1737 posts, RR: 7
Reply 13, posted (9 years 2 months 2 weeks 3 days 19 hours ago) and read 3672 times:

Quoting DETA737 (Reply 10):
I didn't even realise they still served YUL. I would have thought that OA would have dropped that route to concentrate on YYZ.

Olympic 423 operates ATH-YUL-YYZ


User currently offlineHighFlyer9790 From United States of America, joined Jul 2005, 1241 posts, RR: 0
Reply 14, posted (9 years 2 months 2 weeks 3 days 11 hours ago) and read 3577 times:

Quoting Georgiabill (Thread starter):
Wrong fleet, I think the A332's would better serve Olympic than the under utilized A340's, next generation 737's or A320 family aircraft for European routes and rj's for domestic service.

I see where you are coming from for the long haul fleet, but RJs??? the ATR is the perfect aircraft for those small runways in the greek islands, landing in a crosswind, and passenger load.



121
User currently offlineScotron11 From United Kingdom, joined Feb 2004, 1178 posts, RR: 3
Reply 15, posted (9 years 2 months 2 weeks 3 days 9 hours ago) and read 3533 times:

The Greek government has been trying for quite a while to get Olympic off their hands. There is a deal for an Greek-American investment company to take over the carrier but it is not clear if it will go ahead because of the European Union. The EU ruled that subsidies Olympic Airlines received, when it was born out of the "old" Olympic Airways, amounted to illegal state aid and the carrier was ordered to repay 160M euros. It never did. The EU is due to rule tomorrow that the carrier received additional "illegal" state aid in the form of leased aircraft which the government purchased and will demand the carrier repay an additional 150M euros.

Also, unions are threatening to shut down all airports if the government shuts down the airline. Perfect Catch22 situation!


User currently offline6thfreedom From Bermuda, joined Sep 2004, 3335 posts, RR: 20
Reply 16, posted (9 years 2 months 2 weeks 3 days 8 hours ago) and read 3529 times:

Quoting Avianca (Reply 5):
The problem that I do not understand, there are many Greek people all over the world and Olympic can not establish any route that makes profit...?

It's because OA traditional served it's key markets with low frequency and it's service was inconsistent. Why would I fly OA from MEL or SYD to ATH when they operated 2 or 3pw, when I can fly EK 5pw, TG 3pw, SQ 3pw or GF daily?
These Greeks all round the world are no longer the migrants of the 50's and 60's. They now have a grasp of English, are travel savvy and don't need to language comforts of the flag carrier...

Quoting DETA737 (Reply 6):
Perhaps some of our Greek friends could shed some light on the current situation. BTW what are their current longhaul destinations? JFK, YYZ, JNB, is that about right? I know they gave up on Australia some years ago.

Yes, the suspension of Australian services was under the direction of the BA consultants. Obviously they couldn't get it right either.
First they suspended Australian ops, and then resumed some months later with SYD only services. Wrong strategy AFAIK.
They should have upped flights with the A343 to 5 or daily, made more of an effort to sell the stopover point in the off season (bangkok), and should have been more aggresive in promoting it's European network in both directions.


User currently offlineMariner From New Zealand, joined Nov 2001, 25566 posts, RR: 86
Reply 17, posted (9 years 2 months 2 weeks 3 days 8 hours ago) and read 3501 times:
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Quoting 6thfreedom (Reply 16):
First they suspended Australian ops, and then resumed some months later with SYD only services. Wrong strategy AFAIK.

I agree. If Melbourne really is the second largest Greek city in the world:

http://www.intown.com.au/locals/melbourne/melbourne-greek-precinct.htm

you'd think Olympic could make a go of it.

cheers

mariner



aeternum nauta
User currently offlineLewis From Greece, joined Jul 1999, 3672 posts, RR: 5
Reply 18, posted (9 years 2 months 2 weeks 3 days 3 hours ago) and read 3427 times:

Just heard on the news about OA that staff morale is very low, they are expecting the company to close soon. 6000 cancellations have been made by passengers. OA says that flights will be OK until tomorrow and a new statement will be issued about the following days on Wednesday.

User currently offline6thfreedom From Bermuda, joined Sep 2004, 3335 posts, RR: 20
Reply 19, posted (9 years 2 months 2 weeks 3 days 1 hour ago) and read 3380 times:

Quoting Lewis (Reply 18):
Just heard on the news about OA that staff morale is very low, they are expecting the company to close soon. 6000 cancellations have been made by passengers. OA says that flights will be OK until tomorrow and a new statement will be issued about the following days on Wednesday.

Having seen the difficulty of an airline ceasing operations (Ansett Australia), I wish OA employees all the best.

However, moving forward, what is the best way forward.

Will it be a new airline, or is Aegean in a position to expand rapidly and become the "flag" carrier for Greece?


User currently offlineLewis From Greece, joined Jul 1999, 3672 posts, RR: 5
Reply 20, posted (9 years 2 months 2 weeks 3 days 1 hour ago) and read 3346 times:

Quoting 6thfreedom (Reply 19):
Will it be a new airline, or is Aegean in a position to expand rapidly and become the "flag" carrier for Greece?

Aegean just ordered 8 A320s with 12 option.


User currently offlineOA269 From Greece, joined Nov 1999, 140 posts, RR: 0
Reply 21, posted (9 years 2 months 2 weeks 2 days 23 hours ago) and read 3291 times:

After the recent order of A320s from Aegean it's for sure that they're not interensted in purchasing any part of Olympic, either Catering or handling, nor mentioning any widebody A340. They clearly target and for me can be adequate for covering the domestic routes (let's not mention competition and prices).

Lewis, the morale of course is very low now. But as typical Greeks they didn't care in the past, when they had their rich salaries and used to suck this company simply because it's a state company and money would come in from taxpayers no matter what. And I'm mainly talking about unions that are the strongest part of labour. Despite PASOK clearly caused this situation, since 1997 (Prime Minster Simitis) they were constantly trying to sell it but always failed due to the unions.

My general opinion for Olympic does not differ from any other state company in Greece. As I mentioned many times already here, it's all about the Greek attitude (nootropia). Very unprofessional,with no vision,sneaky but also very pig-headed. We are far from seeing our job as extension of ourselves and way of improving, we only adopt the "3 hours left till 2 o'clock to go home" attitude.

I personally support the closure and next day reopening with much less staff and much better terms to go on. It could also be a clear message from gonvernment for us to start thinking in more productive private sector terms.


User currently offlineOA269 From Greece, joined Nov 1999, 140 posts, RR: 0
Reply 22, posted (9 years 2 months 2 weeks 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 3233 times:

PS coincidence? I will fly with 269 on Thursday 15th, now it's already Wednesday and in the middle of meetings-government for the future of OA and OA unions for strikes and blocking of AIA. I will let you know what happened whether I finally fly or not.

User currently offlineIakobos From Belgium, joined Aug 2003, 3316 posts, RR: 34
Reply 23, posted (9 years 2 months 2 weeks 1 day 23 hours ago) and read 3094 times:

Here we go...568 times 1 million Euro.

http://news.ert.gr/en/newsDetails.asp?ID=10967


User currently offlineGeorgiabill From United States of America, joined Mar 2003, 584 posts, RR: 0
Reply 24, posted (9 years 2 months 2 weeks 1 day 14 hours ago) and read 2959 times:
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I would say if the EU makes Olympic repay funds to the Greek Government I would assume that would kill any deal to sell the company. So sad another national airline bankrupt and my guess soon to be a memory RIP OLYMPIC!!!!

25 Laxintl : As sad as it seems, the closure of Olympic might finally allow the creating of a strong and viable Greek airline based on commercial realities. Olympi
26 OveLix : The "swiss" model has already been adopted three years ago. "Olympic Airways" bacame "Olympic Airlines" and the fiasco continued for three more years.
27 Olympicbis : One more step further into surrealism : there was a demonstration by some OA staff at Athens airport yesterday, AGAINST privatisation ! Of course, the
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