Cltguy From United States of America, joined Sep 2004, 596 posts, RR: 0 Posted (7 years 9 months 4 days 12 hours ago) and read 2834 times:
Mike Boyd has started up the SWA coming to CLT rumor mill again. This time he speculates that they will use their excess MSY capacity to start service from CLT to PHX and LAS among other cities. This all sounds great and dandy, but my question is where would SWA go in CLT? Concourse A is full, Concourse B is full, Concourse C is full, Concourse E is full. That leaves the international Concourse D...which has a few available gates. Would SWA operate out of D?
Aggieflyboi04 From United States of America, joined Jul 2005, 207 posts, RR: 0 Reply 2, posted (7 years 9 months 4 days 12 hours ago) and read 2776 times:
Aren't all the gates in CLT still occupied? The last open gate I heard about wask taken up by airtran.
Luv2fly From United States of America, joined May 2003, 11957 posts, RR: 51 Reply 3, posted (7 years 9 months 4 days 12 hours ago) and read 2769 times:
ChrisNH From United States of America, joined Jun 1999, 3819 posts, RR: 2 Reply 4, posted (7 years 9 months 4 days 12 hours ago) and read 2765 times:
I dunno. Coming on the heels of start-ups at PHL and PIT--USAirways' strongholds--one could reasonably conclude that CLT is coming soon, if not next. I don't know about ATL, CVG and MEM, except to say that the first two are obviously aimed at toppling a weakened DL, while MEM is designed to topple a weakened NW.
Southwest's fortunes grow in lockstep with vanquishing their competition. That's why they went to PHL and PIT, and why I agree that CLT is in the mix. Indeed, Southwest has had a tough road to hoe at PHL, with delays et al. So would they go to another incumbent fortress like ATL...which would yield delays much like PHL has? I'm not too keen on that one. I could see DL defenders at ATL making things REAL difficult for Southwest. Like making a Southwest jet wait on a taxiway while a parade of Delta jets are allowed to pass. Stuff like that.
Quickmover From United States of America, joined Mar 2004, 2464 posts, RR: 0 Reply 5, posted (7 years 9 months 4 days 12 hours ago) and read 2736 times:
They might have excess planes now because of MSY, but the Boeing strike has stopped all 737 deliverys for now. I think they will wait until deliveries resume.
SHUPirate1 From United States of America, joined Sep 2003, 3661 posts, RR: 18 Reply 6, posted (7 years 9 months 4 days 11 hours ago) and read 2664 times:
Concourse E is entirely common-use. However, the lack of jetways and parking areas than can handle a 737 is likely an issue.
Quoting Cltguy (Thread starter): That leaves the international Concourse D...which has a few available gates.
Most of the concourse is common-use. However, with those gates being international gates, I find it difficult to believe that Southwest would be willing to pay the higher fees that come with that real estate.
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SHUPirate1 From United States of America, joined Sep 2003, 3661 posts, RR: 18 Reply 8, posted (7 years 9 months 4 days 11 hours ago) and read 2632 times:
PHLBOS From United States of America, joined Mar 2004, 7264 posts, RR: 24 Reply 10, posted (7 years 9 months 4 days 10 hours ago) and read 2547 times:
FL already started serving CLT with non-stop routes to ATL, BWI, & MCO right around the same time WN started PIT service as a means to beat them to the punch at CLT so to speak.
Hmmmm, if there's any truth to WN coming to CLT; this could prove interesting.
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Luv2fly From United States of America, joined May 2003, 11957 posts, RR: 51 Reply 11, posted (7 years 9 months 4 days 10 hours ago) and read 2485 times:
When WN announced PIT as a new destination it was already down sized by US at that point. I really think CVG will be the next city that gets WN. DL is weaker right now then NW, and if WN would go into either MSP or MEM, MSP would be the first choice.
OPNLguy From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 12, posted (7 years 9 months 4 days 10 hours ago) and read 2431 times:
Quoting Quickmover (Reply 5): They might have excess planes now because of MSY, but the Boeing strike has stopped all 737 deliverys for now. I think they will wait until deliveries resume.
SWA has 7 more 737-700 deliveries in the 2005 pipeline, about half of the 14-16 aircraft that Boyd's article suggests have been freed-up by the pulldown in MSY services.
While I don't pesonally doubt that CLT will become an -eventual- SWA destination, I'm not sure about Boyd's timing. Yes, the addition of CLT wouldn't be especially great for HP/US, but "what if" the Boeing strike drags on into 2006 -and- demand at MSY picks up much sooner than anticipated? If CLT has already been started, the potential for then being a tad short on resources is certainly there.
My guess? SWA will keep its finger firmly on the pulse on what's going on at Boeing, and take any action on a new city when it feels it appropriate.
A330323X From United States of America, joined Oct 2003, 3039 posts, RR: 47 Reply 13, posted (7 years 9 months 4 days 10 hours ago) and read 2409 times:
Quoting OPNLguy (Reply 12): I'm not sure about Boyd's timing.
His idea is that if he repeats it every two months, eventually he'll be right.
I'm the expert on here on two things, neither of which I care about much anymore.
FlyPIJets From United States of America, joined Oct 2003, 823 posts, RR: 2 Reply 16, posted (7 years 9 months 4 days 9 hours ago) and read 2302 times:
I don't see CLT in the mix either right now.
Seems like to me that with the combined US/HP, US assets are less attractive to WN.
For example, east bound LAS/PHX to CLT. WN won't be able to penetrate US's higher yield small and mid-size destinations like ROA, CHS or AVL. So US/HP will always have a slight yield advantage.
As far as CLT O&D, well, CLT is a banking town, US serves LGA, DCA and SFO (B of A's other HQ). WN doesn't. That doesn't rule out CLTas a good money maker for SWA, they carry their own inertia where ever they go. But the MSY factor is just temporary.
FLAIRPORT From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 17, posted (7 years 9 months 4 days 8 hours ago) and read 2228 times:
Quoting Quickmover (Reply 5): They might have excess planes now because of MSY, but the Boeing strike has stopped all 737 deliverys for now. I think they will wait until deliveries resume.
I do personally believe that WN is focused on restarting MSY and, afterwards, and after the Boeing strike, will continue to grow and start cities like CLT.
Tornado82 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 18, posted (7 years 9 months 4 days 6 hours ago) and read 2125 times:
Quoting ChrisNH (Reply 4): Southwest's fortunes grow in lockstep with vanquishing their competition. That's why they went to PHL and PIT, and why I agree that CLT is in the mix.
Quoting Luv2fly (Reply 11): When WN announced PIT as a new destination it was already down sized by US at that point
WN was going after what at the time (even at the time of PIT announcement) was viewed industry-wide as a weak and vulnerable US. People were filling this board with posts about how many flights WN would run out of both PHL and PIT when US died. Well, US is probably one of the better-off legacies now and aren't going anywhere... I doubt WN wants to bang heads with them in what amounts to their fortress when WN won't be able to do any of that Caribbean stuff that US already does.
ScottB From United States of America, joined Jul 2000, 6373 posts, RR: 34 Reply 20, posted (7 years 9 months 4 days 3 hours ago) and read 1947 times:
Quoting Tornado82 (Reply 18): Well, US is probably one of the better-off legacies now and aren't going anywhere... I doubt WN wants to bang heads with them in what amounts to their fortress when WN won't be able to do any of that Caribbean stuff that US already does.
I'm not sure I'd go so far as to say that US is one of the "better-off" legacies. While the merger will bring in desperately-needed liquidity for both carriers (America West faced a liquidity crunch of its own had the merger not happened), the combined airline will also be sitting on roughly $8 billion in debt and liabilities. The outstanding ATSB-backed loans are not going away, and the "new" US Airways will be more dependent than ever on high-cost RJ feed.
With the US Airways side of the operation shedding roughly 40 mainline jets between the end of August 2005 and February 2006, there is plenty of room for expansion by competitors -- and that doesn't only mean Southwest. I'm not exactly sure I see why people think that Southwest would shy from competition with a "new" US Airways run by AWA's management team; Southwest's two largest cities are AWA's two hubs and WN actually has the largest share of O&D traffic at both PHX and LAS.
Midway2AirTran From United States of America, joined Jul 2003, 864 posts, RR: 2 Reply 21, posted (7 years 9 months 3 days 23 hours ago) and read 1835 times:
I would put my money on CVG or MEM before CLT, there's MSP too. It might be better for WN to put leftover MSY capacity in markets that already exist and demand more capacity such as LAS and continue on their original expansion plans.
Iowaman From United States of America, joined May 2004, 4114 posts, RR: 7 Reply 22, posted (7 years 9 months 3 days 23 hours ago) and read 1825 times:
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Quoting Midway2AirTran (Reply 21): would put my money on CVG or MEM before CLT, there's MSP too.
Most definently, CVG and MEM are both secondary hubs for DL and NW, and both have extremely high fares and not many delays when there is bad weather (ATL).
Cubsrule From United States of America, joined May 2004, 21286 posts, RR: 19 Reply 23, posted (7 years 9 months 3 days 22 hours ago) and read 1810 times:
Quoting Midway2AirTran (Reply 21): I would put my money on CVG or MEM before CLT, there's MSP too.
Does MEM have free gates? Seems like NW has a lot of (unnecessary) real estate tied up, but can the airport get some of it?
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Loisencroach From United States of America, joined Sep 2005, 373 posts, RR: 5 Reply 24, posted (7 years 9 months 3 days 22 hours ago) and read 1792 times:
Speaking of Mike Boyd, does anybody have a link to the article where Mike Boyd said that Hooters Air would never work? I wish I had saved that...he stated something to the effect that the average Hooters Restaurant patron are males 18-35 and aren't travel savvy.
If anybody knows where I can find that article, I'd appreciate it.
25 SHUPirate1: Northwest needs each and every one of the gates they have. They have three "banks" a day, which ejmmsu (and others) often refer to as breakfast, lunc
26 Stirling: I would think WN would bolster existing city frequencies and destinations before undertaking expensive station builds. I was actually thinking they'd
27 Iowaman: Quite honestly how many more flights can PHL handle? The delays are ridiculous. LAS is getting the same way.
28 OPNLguy: Just announced that service additions to PIT and PHL planned for later this fall have been moved up for start on October 2nd. New service PIT-TPA and
29 Tornado82: Depends on the time. If you're taking off out of there around 7pm, just forget about it. But by 9pm it's not too bad. For going to PHX or something t
30 Cubsrule: The point is that their utilization sucks... but banks are a good way to justify leasing a lot of gates. (I'm usually going to or from ORD, so typica
31 Flaps: The cases for both CVG and CLT are well stated several times above. WN has posted many surprises with recent expansions. I suspect that they may want
32 Tornado82: You're kidding, right? CVG is about 3 years behind the situation at PIT before WN's entrance. They've still got widebodies, international, and a ton
33 STLGph: Not exactly, no. More than 3 years at that. If CVG was desperately seeking susan here, then the Vanguard model a few years ago from Cincinnati into C
34 Vegasplanes: LAS is not too bad, pretty steady action throughout the day from 6:30-7:00 am to 10:30-11:00 pm. Most problems at LAS occur do to the monsoon season
35 Vegasplanes: How about WN adding in DTW, new terminal coming to replace Smith, maybe leave the Smith for extra capacity, NW in BK, could fill some leisure flights
36 Flaps: Actually, no, I'm not kidding. CVG suffers from even less competition than PIT had before the US downsizing began. Therefore, imho, it is an even ripe
37 Dolphinflyer: I've often wondered if GSP might be a more interesting market for WN to tap than CLT. However, having said that, GSP doesn't have the large local popu
38 PHLBOS: NK (which also has a hub in DTW) serves many of those destinations you listed. Although being a much smaller carrier than WN, I believe NK will be th
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