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Copa Proposed Routes With New EMB Jets  
User currently offlinePRGLY From Czech Republic, joined Dec 2004, 494 posts, RR: 0
Posted (8 years 10 months 2 weeks 3 days 1 hour ago) and read 5054 times:

Just checking DCS and found foll routes of COPA their plan to operate with their new EMB jets
PTY-CTG
PTY-BAQ
PTY-SJO-SAP
PTY-MGA-GUA
PTY-SAL and
PTY-GYE
can somebody confirm these plans and give more routes planned
P.S. - what routes TAME is going to use EMB 170 recently delivered
thanks


just fly - it is nice
62 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offline2travel2know From Panama, joined Apr 2005, 3580 posts, RR: 4
Reply 1, posted (8 years 10 months 2 weeks 3 days ago) and read 5027 times:

I'm sure they'll use the E190 for CTG and ADZ.
I guess that:
the SJO-SAP-SJO may be an evenning flight;
their MGA-GUA-MGA has very good yields so I don't think they downgrade it from B737-700/800 (unless they add another PTY-GUA flight evennings);
PTY-SAL-PTY seem to be the new evenning flight;
PTY-GYE-PTY may be a morning flight (then one plane would fly UIO another GYE);
POS flights next year (don't know if w/BGI or via CSS) will sure be with E190; and
by word in Brazil - they'll fly MAO with E190 2-3 times per week (the aircraft has aslo range for PTY-BEL-PTY).
I'm still waiting for those extra PAP/KIN flights (either together or sepatated) -I can't belive they still operate twice weekly!!
Would like to see CM E190/170 someday in CUR, AUA, STI (or PAP), PUJ, BZE, GCM, MAR, PMV, VLN, PZO, IQT, AQP, VVI, LPB (!), FLL, TPA, PBI, JAX, MSY, MTY, GDL, TLC...



I don't work for COPA Airlines!
User currently offlineN77014 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 2, posted (8 years 10 months 2 weeks 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 4878 times:

What the E-jet allows is the possibility of serving markets with more frequency than currently possible on the B737. That, in turn should create the basis for multiple banks from PTY, with the E-jets feeding long haul destinations like LAX, MIA, EZE, etc.

User currently offlineJuventus From United States of America, joined Dec 2004, 2835 posts, RR: 2
Reply 3, posted (8 years 10 months 2 weeks 2 days 19 hours ago) and read 4825 times:

Do they have the range to operate to Guadalajara or Monterrey? I would like to Copa expand a bit in Mexico.

User currently offlinePRGLY From Czech Republic, joined Dec 2004, 494 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (8 years 10 months 2 weeks 2 days 19 hours ago) and read 4812 times:

Thanks for replies, I only forgot to mention PTY-ADZ which is already in GDS


just fly - it is nice
User currently offlineAvianca From Venezuela, joined Jan 2005, 5922 posts, RR: 40
Reply 5, posted (8 years 10 months 2 weeks 2 days 18 hours ago) and read 4780 times:

what about splitting the daily MDE and the daily CLO flight into two daily each destination with the EMB?

Or isnt it possible due restrictions? (bileteral between panama and colombia)?

regards
Avianca



Colombia es el Mundo Y el Mundo es Colombia
User currently offlineSOUTHAMERICA From Colombia, joined Dec 2003, 2497 posts, RR: 10
Reply 6, posted (8 years 10 months 2 weeks 2 days 18 hours ago) and read 4766 times:

Quoting Avianca (Reply 5):
what about splitting the daily MDE and the daily CLO flight into two daily each destination with the EMB?

You answered your own question, the current Colombia-Panama bilateral does not allow it.

Still PTY-CLO and especially PTY-MDE are two routes for which 2 daily E-190s are simply not enough. The demand on both routes, especially the latter, is simply outstanding year-round.




SOUTHAMERICA


User currently offlineAvianca From Venezuela, joined Jan 2005, 5922 posts, RR: 40
Reply 7, posted (8 years 10 months 2 weeks 2 days 18 hours ago) and read 4753 times:

Quoting SOUTHAMERICA (Reply 6):
The demand on both routes, especially the latter, is simply outstanding year-round.

yeah I noticed that, international travellers to and from medellin uses a lot Copa to avoid BOG. I compared the last days the fares, I noticed that the fares from MDE are much higher than the inbound fares to MDE...

regards
Avianca



Colombia es el Mundo Y el Mundo es Colombia
User currently offline2travel2know From Panama, joined Apr 2005, 3580 posts, RR: 4
Reply 8, posted (8 years 10 months 2 weeks 2 days 13 hours ago) and read 4637 times:

Quoting Avianca (Reply 5):
what about splitting the daily MDE and the daily CLO flight into two daily each destination with the EMB?
Or isnt it possible due restrictions? (bileteral between panama and colombia)?

It has been mentioned a lot in this forum that CM wants more frecuencies and destinations in Colombia.
The current bilateral only allow CM to fly 5 daily to Colombian cities - and it doesn't apply to ADZ, CTG and - if they ever feel like it - SMR.
That's the reason you don't see PTY > MDE, CLO, BAQ twice daily and no PTY >BGA, PEI.



I don't work for COPA Airlines!
User currently offlineLuisca From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 9, posted (8 years 10 months 2 weeks 2 days 12 hours ago) and read 4620 times:

Quoting SOUTHAMERICA (Reply 6):
You answered your own question, the current Colombia-Panama bilateral does not allow it.

Still PTY-CLO and especially PTY-MDE are two routes for which 2 daily E-190s are simply not enough. The demand on both routes, especially the latter, is simply outstanding year-round.

you would probably need 2 daily with the 800 and posibly a third daily with the EMB, its amaizing that these flights do better than the PTY-BOG route!


User currently offlineRCS763AV From Colombia, joined Jun 2004, 4394 posts, RR: 12
Reply 10, posted (8 years 10 months 2 weeks 2 days 12 hours ago) and read 4620 times:

Quoting Luisca (Reply 9):
you would probably need 2 daily with the 800 and posibly a third daily with the EMB, its amaizing that these flights do better than the PTY-BOG route!

No. Not that much. And they do better b/c they are only 1 flight and dont have 2 AV flights competing.

Anyway, what about PEI are they still planning/rumouring the route or what?
EMB190 3x a week would be awesome.



Les escribo desde el frío de mi verde altiplano.
User currently offlineSOUTHAMERICA From Colombia, joined Dec 2003, 2497 posts, RR: 10
Reply 11, posted (8 years 10 months 2 weeks 2 days 12 hours ago) and read 4609 times:

Quoting RCS763AV (Reply 10):
No. Not that much.

Yes, they do, on a per-flight basis.

Obviously the PTY-BOG route, as a whole, is more profitable than PTY-MDE and PTY-CLO because they fly 2 times a day to BOG and only 1 to MDE/CLO.

But take only 1 of the flights to BOG, and compare it with the flight to MDE, and indeed, as I said, on a per-flight basis, PTY-MDE is more profitable than PTY-BOG for CM.



SOUTHAMERICA


User currently offline2travel2know From Panama, joined Apr 2005, 3580 posts, RR: 4
Reply 12, posted (8 years 10 months 2 weeks 2 days 12 hours ago) and read 4601 times:

Quoting Juventus (Reply 3):
Do they have the range to operate to Guadalajara or Monterrey? I would like to Copa expand a bit in Mexico.

Both may be within the range, GDL might have problems with the altitude when flying to PTY, MTY (around 4h10m) with the distance, it could be really pushing the range. Also if ever considered TLC as a back-up E190 flight to the Mexico DF area would have problems with the TLC-PTY because of the altitude.
I'll be amazed if CM would ever fly VVI in Bolivia (around 4h40m) with E190.



I don't work for COPA Airlines!
User currently offlineMasseyBrown From United States of America, joined Dec 2002, 5376 posts, RR: 7
Reply 13, posted (8 years 10 months 2 weeks 2 days 11 hours ago) and read 4568 times:

I believe the E190AR has a range of 2300nm. This range would allow flights from Panama to places such as Chicago, Washington, Manaus, Belem, Arequippa, Santa Cruz (Bo), almost all of Mexico, and everything in between. Phoenix and Brasilia are just outside the range from PTY.

I can't believe Copa ordered the AR model just to increase frequencies on short-haul routes.



I love long German words like 'Freundschaftsbezeigungen'.
User currently offlinePRGLY From Czech Republic, joined Dec 2004, 494 posts, RR: 0
Reply 14, posted (8 years 10 months 2 weeks 2 days 9 hours ago) and read 4518 times:

To cfy their schedule more below some details
EFF 15DEC CM803/804 PTY-BAQ-PTY 1140-1250/1640-1755
CM740/741 PTY-SAL-PTY1945-2049/0640-0933
EFF 20DEC CM202/203 PTY-ADZ-PTY 1053-1200/1235-1338
CM415/416 PTY-CTG-PTY 1433-1538/1640-1745
CM300/301 PTY-GYE-PTY 2000-2159/0710-0911
EFF 15MAY CM711/710 PTY-MGA-GUA-MGA-PTY 1932-2147/0600-1005
EFF 15JUN CM866/865 PTY-SJO-SAP-SJO-PTY 1954-2205/0622-1021
P.S. I ve checked all destinations that all of you proposed and found nothing else, but there must be some other flights (most probably not finalized yet) that will fill up 9 hours gap for airframes starting eff 15MAY and 15JUN.
Also ground time in BAQ of 3 hours and 50 minutes seems to be too long.



just fly - it is nice
User currently offlineJuventus From United States of America, joined Dec 2004, 2835 posts, RR: 2
Reply 15, posted (8 years 10 months 2 weeks 2 days 5 hours ago) and read 4488 times:

Quoting 2travel2know (Reply 12):
Both may be within the range, GDL might have problems with the altitude when flying to PTY, MTY (around 4h10m) with the distance, it could be really pushing the range

Thanx for the info. I think both GDL and MTY would be good additions if they ever take place. MEX is too congested, some passengers hate transitioning through it.


User currently offline2travel2know From Panama, joined Apr 2005, 3580 posts, RR: 4
Reply 16, posted (8 years 10 months 2 weeks 2 days 1 hour ago) and read 4454 times:

Quoting Juventus (Reply 15):
Thanx for the info. I think both GDL and MTY would be good additions if they ever take place. MEX is too congested, some passengers hate transitioning through it.

I fly to GDL via IAH, regardless of all that US inmigration/customs hassle! It feels so good as long I'm not flying thru MEX.
For MTY may proven a better destination to fly first, the MTY - Latinamerica traffic seem to be larger than GLD - Latinamerica.

I would like to know if those E190 do have the range to fly non-stop to PTY from such high altitude airports like TLC, AQP and LPB.



I don't work for COPA Airlines!
User currently offlineLuisca From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 17, posted (8 years 10 months 2 weeks 1 day 22 hours ago) and read 4388 times:

Quoting 2travel2know (Reply 16):
I would like to know if those E190 do have the range to fly non-stop to PTY from such high altitude airports like TLC, AQP and LPB.

LBP will probably be a new 73G route once they get the ones they recently ordered. Altough type has not been specified, even if they are all 738's (as rumored) they can free up some 73G's.

I would think they would want to star fliying to GIG, Brasillia, etc.
I am sure that their es a major expansion coming next year, why else would you buy 16 new airplanes (12 EMBs and 4 737)


User currently offlineLuisde8cd From Pitcairn Islands, joined Aug 2004, 2571 posts, RR: 31
Reply 18, posted (8 years 10 months 2 weeks 1 day 22 hours ago) and read 4370 times:

MAR desperately needs more Intl. flights. Maracaibo is Venezuela's largest city after Caracas and is the oil capital of Venezuela. It is very painful for people flying to Maracaibo to connect in CCS because the international terminal is separated from the domestic terminal, so you have to walk from one terminal to the other alongside the airport road. Imagine the chaos of walking around 500meters with luggage and rain. Also by the time most US flight hts arrive late in the evening (8PM-12AM) there is no chance to connect to any domestic destination. So pax have to either sleep at the airport or find a hotel to spend the night.

I think a E190 or even a 73G service between PTY and MAR will work great.

Saludos desde Caracas,
Luis


User currently offlineMGA From Nicaragua, joined Mar 2005, 726 posts, RR: 3
Reply 19, posted (8 years 10 months 2 weeks 1 day 21 hours ago) and read 4363 times:

They should explore the posablility of extending a small route system from MGA (as continuation flights). They could bring back the PTY-MGA-MEX route and maybe conect Honduras and Nicaraua again (only Atlantic serves the route at the moment with a turbo prop). Anyway, I hope to fly on the E190 soon, I think it is a great choice for their company mentality and direction.

MGA



Que viva el guaro, el dinero y los aviones!!!
User currently offline2travel2know From Panama, joined Apr 2005, 3580 posts, RR: 4
Reply 20, posted (8 years 10 months 2 weeks 1 day 19 hours ago) and read 4330 times:

Quoting Luisde8cd (Reply 18):
MAR desperately needs more Intl. flights.

I Agree.

Quoting Luisde8cd (Reply 18):
I think a E190 or even a 73G service between PTY and MAR will work great.

Mostlikely a E190 first, maybe daily.
Don't know the exact details of the Panama - Venezuela bilateral if CM could fly to unlimited destinations in Venezuela, but sure it'll be great to see them in VLN, BRM, PMV, BLA and PZO.. those destinations don't need daily PTY E190/170 service, but a daily PTY-VLN-BRM-PTY - who knows?.
Any Venezuelan wish to comment?



I don't work for COPA Airlines!
User currently offlineLipeGIG From Brazil, joined May 2005, 11421 posts, RR: 58
Reply 21, posted (8 years 10 months 2 weeks 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 4290 times:
AIRLINERS.NET CREW
FORUM MODERATOR

Quoting Luisca (Reply 17):
I would think they would want to star fliying to GIG, Brasillia, etc.
I am sure that their es a major expansion coming next year, why else would you buy 16 new airplanes (12 EMBs and 4 737)

Probably MAO (inside E190 range) as Copa could offer connections even to the US (and LAB nowadays do not run a daily MAO-MIA). I think that, to fly PTY-GIG, Copa will wait for the development on the agreement between Gol, AF, DL and CO. If they can use this agreement, and some 737NG could be released from the routes where the E-jets replaces them, so Copa will be in a strong condition to fly to Rio de Janeiro.
BSB could be an extension of MAO flight, or with Gol code-share MAO-BSB.

Rgds,
Felipe



New York + Rio de Janeiro = One of the best combinations !
User currently offlineRCS763AV From Colombia, joined Jun 2004, 4394 posts, RR: 12
Reply 22, posted (8 years 10 months 2 weeks 1 day 15 hours ago) and read 4267 times:

Quoting SOUTHAMERICA (Reply 11):

I meant that those markets dont need so much flights.

Quoting Luisde8cd (Reply 18):
MAR desperately needs more Intl. flights.

Agree.

They should also start AUA and CUR...theyre a popular destination for travellers around the world.



Les escribo desde el frío de mi verde altiplano.
User currently offline2travel2know From Panama, joined Apr 2005, 3580 posts, RR: 4
Reply 23, posted (8 years 10 months 2 weeks 1 day 14 hours ago) and read 4240 times:

Quoting LipeGIG (Reply 21):
BSB could be an extension of MAO flight, or with Gol code-share MAO-BSB.

Given the kind of market BSB is, I doubt those ambassadors, ministers, senators, foreign and brazilian officials travelling on missions to/from BSB would appreciate a MAO stop.
Weird as it may sound, BSB would be better served wth B737-700 from the evenning hub hour (1930h departure) which means a 0330h BSB arrival.
I guess for BSB, CM would require a B737-700 with 20 bussines seats !
If CM was to fly MAO - BSB they could use the E190, but that plane is better used flying PTY - MAO - PTY from the morning hub departures (1000h) just like they do with their daytime LIM.



I don't work for COPA Airlines!
User currently offlineLuisca From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 24, posted (8 years 10 months 2 weeks 1 day 14 hours ago) and read 4214 times:

Quoting 2travel2know (Reply 23):
Given the kind of market BSB is, I doubt those ambassadors, ministers, senators, foreign and brazilian officials travelling on missions to/from BSB would appreciate a MAO stop.
Weird as it may sound, BSB would be better served wth B737-700 from the evenning hub hour (1930h departure) which means a 0330h BSB arrival.
I guess for BSB, CM would require a B737-700 with 20 bussines seats !
If CM was to fly MAO - BSB they could use the E190, but that plane is better used flying PTY - MAO - PTY from the morning hub departures (1000h) just like they do with their daytime LIM.

I understand that Panama has to first resolve a bilateral with Brazil, because it is currently restricted to MAO and GUR?

Im sure with te recent bilateral between Brazil and Colombia, a bilateral between Panama and Brazil and Panama and Colombia should be coming soon


25 2travel2know : You're right, but forgot to mention GIG too. The bilateral says GRU, GIG and MAO. CM flying to BSB, SSA, BEL, FOR, REC, CNF, CWB, POA, CGB, wherevere
26 PRGLY : One gap seems to be filled. CM will start second daily EMJ flight to GYE as follows: CM273/2 PTY-GYE-PTY 1145-1315/1615-1815 still searching to fill
27 LipeGIG : Please remember that nowadays they accept a stop on south (GRU or GIG), what CM will offer is a much more quickly connection. And if CM use to stop a
28 2travel2know : Even with the kind of BSB Biz passengers, one can't compare the Biz demand for domestic flights to/from BSB with a Biz demand on a international flig
29 Avianca : the CLO-PTY and MDE-PTY are doeing so good due the function of PTY as a hub + they are offering good fares compared to Avianca to some southamerican
30 SOUTHAMERICA : That's only part of the success of the MDE/CLO-PTY routes. There's also quite a considerable amount of O&D traffic between Medellin/Cali and Panama C
31 Avianca : thats true... what is intresting is that the german Airline LTU is coloading also freight on the CLO,MDE flights with origin of germany /europe. They
32 2travel2know : I would think that for sometime now, someone @ CM has been studying if PTY-PUJ-PTY E190/170 service might be profitable. Panama and Dominican Republi
33 Avianca : would say PUJ would be the prefered new Dominican destination.... PUJ had a good cargo baseload + many leisure passengers from north south-america (c
34 Avianca : I forgot, in the past when CM had still the B737 freighter, LTU had an exclusive ( I think weekly) cargo flight from SDQ to PTY and some other destin
35 2travel2know : CM seems to like business destinations better. The PUJ cargo traffic may look attractive and if they could get some PUJ O/D non-leisure traffic they
36 SOUTHAMERICA : Remember that AV already flies BOG-PUJ once a week; just the right amount of flights for the demand. SOUTHAMERICA
37 EddieDude : Does anyone think that maybe OAX, HUX, TGZ and CZM could work?
38 2travel2know : After CM is to fly daily to CUN and if they see a demand, I guess they will study CZM, HUX and MID. Other than MTY and GDL, I would think they would
39 Luisca : From what I understand CM will downgrade the CUN route to an EMB190 that would free up a 73G for new flights, But Panama needs to move fast to secure
40 2travel2know : The new Panama-Argentina bilateral makes room for CM flights to COR, MDZ and ROS; Don't know if they could add SLA and TUC too. There seems to be a d
41 Luisca : It wouldnt be with a EMB but with a 73G, remember once the EMB start serving low yeild markets like CUN, CTG, ADZ a lot of 73Gs will be free, these w
42 EddieDude : Can't believe CM is downgrading CUN. I would have thought that CM was the airline of choice for South Americans who want to fly to CUN because of the
43 Avianca : arent they already selling seats on PTY-MDE ? regarsd Avianca
44 SOUTHAMERICA : They are. The flights were loaded a couple of weeks ago. AeroRepublica will operate a daily MD-8X on a triagle routing CLO-MDE-PTY-CLO as of Nov01. C
45 Avianca : yeah I noticed that some weeks ago, when I checked MDE-PTY-MDE fares... AeroRepublica seems to be the cheapest in the colombia - panama market.
46 2travel2know : The CM CUN route suffers the same problems the flights to CTG, MCO and now ADZ do. Maybe goodloads but with poor yields. Those are leisure markets (e
47 SOUTHAMERICA : That's the price of flying a triangle routing instead of nonstops from each MDE and CLO. But they don't have the aircraft availabiity to do it, and t
48 Luisca : That's not really a problem, getting a mexican visa is the easiest thing to do. I guess these flights will be in the morning bank to PTY, because CM'
49 RCS763AV : Also, at least from Colombia and Venezuela, there are a nice number of charters to CUN which take away a lot of connecting pax.
50 JoFMO : With Copa becoming stronger and stronger is there a change for new US destinations?
51 Avianca : I would say, they should introduce flights to BOS and ORD
52 2travel2know : Out of personal experience, I'd challenge that. True, but usually with charters if those aren't flying weekly, there'll be plenty of empty legs. A da
53 RCS763AV : Nice list...but SAT, MEM, RSW, JAX, BNA, AUS...and others are UNREAL. No one takes a 2 day vacation to CUN. All of this pax go for at least 4 day/3 n
54 2travel2know : There may be talks about IAD or BWI, SFO and YYZ. Maybe ORD and ORD too. About the UNREAL, I didn't say "CM must fly to those destinations" when I wr
55 Avianca : w I see good potential for SAT,MEM and RSW maybe also JAX... and as before mentioned by 2travel2know, ATL is up there... I would say ATL would be the
56 Post contains images RCS763AV : Yes and VH should start flying to MKE, they could take all those transfer pax to MKE via CCS, its the biggest hub in the world....or AR should start
57 Post contains images Avianca : great comment! it seems you are a ... cheers
58 2travel2know : To comment what you wrote: MKE is Chicago 3rd major airport, it has an International Arrival Gate and one day a Mexican and/or Caribbean (Jamaican?)
59 RCS763AV : Your kidding me right??? I was being sarcastic + that wont happen in at least a decade....
60 BHMBAGLOCK : Just guessing, but they'll probably be used a lot like the F28 - most likely a direct replacement as they have/had two F28 as I recall. When I was wo
61 TACAA320 : Trying to be realistic, I don't see TA flying these routes now. Only Toronto. Canada impossed an entry visa to some Central American citizens, and ob
62 Luisca : Copa will probably start Toronto soon (as has been rumored for a long time) I also suppose IAD IAH DAL and ATL, as soon as they get the new 737's they
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