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Mesaba Gets Shaft From NW--Again  
User currently offlineLUVRSW From United States of America, joined Aug 2005, 498 posts, RR: 1
Posted (8 years 11 months 3 weeks 5 days 9 hours ago) and read 3518 times:

Form 8-K for MAIR HOLDINGS INC


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

28-Sep-2005

Other Events



Item 8.01. Other Events.
On Monday, September 26, 2005, Northwest Airlines, Inc. ("Northwest") made a payment of approximately $1.6 million to Mesaba Aviation, Inc. ("Mesaba"), a wholly owned subsidiary of MAIR Holdings, Inc. (the "Company"). The payment due was for services provided by Mesaba to Northwest from September 1 through September 15. However, due to Northwest's bankruptcy petition filed on September 14, 2005, Northwest paid only that portion of the payment attributable to services provided post-petition. Mesaba estimates the total amount of its prepetition claim with Northwest to be approximately $28 million.

Although Northwest's most recent payment indicates its intent to pay Mesaba for services provided following the date of Northwest's bankruptcy filing, Northwest has also significantly reduced the number of flights Mesaba will operate for Northwest. Specifically, Northwest will remove nine Avro Regional Jets ("Avros") from service effective October 31, 2005, and Northwest provided Mesaba with notice of its intent to terminate the leases for all 35 of the Avros effective December 20, 2005. The aggregate effect of these actions will significantly reduce Mesaba's revenue and will lead to losses in the Company's third and fourth fiscal quarters. Mesaba continues to assess all available alternatives, and the Company, as the sole shareholder of Mesaba, continues to separately assess the impact of the various alternatives available to Mesaba.

20 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineNkops From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 2665 posts, RR: 6
Reply 1, posted (8 years 11 months 3 weeks 5 days 5 hours ago) and read 3401 times:

WOW... your not kidding that Mesaba got the shaft....

Will NW be closing some cities after getting rid of 35 ARJ's??? If I was Mesaba I might start looking for other code-share opps.



I have no association with Spirit Airlines
User currently offlineBurnsie28 From United States of America, joined Aug 2004, 7545 posts, RR: 8
Reply 2, posted (8 years 11 months 3 weeks 5 days 5 hours ago) and read 3349 times:

Well since NW basically runs Mesaba, others are not going to happen, secondly the threat of the ARJ's is mainly to get lower lease rates.

In the end, the NW management sucks, fortunately and unfortunately the average consumer doenst see that.



"Some People Just Know How To Fly"- Best slogan ever, RIP NW 1926-2009
User currently offlineDLKAPA From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 3, posted (8 years 11 months 3 weeks 5 days 5 hours ago) and read 3352 times:

Quoting Nkops (Reply 1):
Will NW be closing some cities after getting rid of 35 ARJ's??? If I was Mesaba I might start looking for other code-share opps.

If I were XJ there would be no "might" about it. I'd be scrambling to put jets back in the air with anybody who will take them. Unfortunately for XJ, there's probably nobody around that will take them. AA: No. UA: Possibly but more likely No. CO: Definetly not. DL: Haha that's funny. US: Definetly not. Any LCC's anybody?


User currently offlineLUVRSW From United States of America, joined Aug 2005, 498 posts, RR: 1
Reply 4, posted (8 years 11 months 3 weeks 4 days 22 hours ago) and read 3209 times:

Quoting DLKAPA (Reply 3):
If I were XJ there would be no "might" about it. I'd be scrambling to put jets back in the air with anybody who will take them.

One problem...XJ doesn't own any jets, they are basicly a subcontractor for NW, with labor only being contracted...NW leases/owns the jets. XJ could approach UAL and say "We have 3500 people for you....do you have any planes for us?"

LOL


User currently offlineLUVRSW From United States of America, joined Aug 2005, 498 posts, RR: 1
Reply 5, posted (8 years 11 months 3 weeks 13 hours ago) and read 3050 times:

http://www.amtonline.com/article/article.jsp?siteSection=1&id=1854

User currently offlineMcdu From United States of America, joined Apr 2005, 1466 posts, RR: 17
Reply 6, posted (8 years 11 months 3 weeks 13 hours ago) and read 3050 times:

I heard a rumor UAL is considering trying to get MAIR to fly the Aspen and other old ARW 146 flying. The airplane availability is the problem since NWA has the leases and MAIR has the crews. Not sure what is in the works but it might be ex ARW 146's being sent to MAIR for the flying as UAX.

Hope the best for the MAIR folks.


User currently offlineLUVRSW From United States of America, joined Aug 2005, 498 posts, RR: 1
Reply 7, posted (8 years 11 months 3 weeks 13 hours ago) and read 3021 times:

Any chance MAIR could be picked up by WN or B6, or is that outlandish?

User currently offlineEMBQA From United States of America, joined Oct 2003, 9364 posts, RR: 11
Reply 8, posted (8 years 11 months 3 weeks 12 hours ago) and read 2998 times:

Quoting LUVRSW (Reply 4):
One problem...XJ doesn't own any jets, they are basicly a subcontractor for NW, with labor only being contracted...NW leases/owns the jets. XJ could approach UAL and say "We have 3500 people for you....do you have any planes for us?"

Your only talking about a small percentage of the Mesaba fleet when you talk about the Avro's. Mesaba also have a very large number of Saab 340's which are not owned by Northwest.... and with Northwest defaulting on these payments it will make it harder for Mesaba to pay their bills.

[Edited 2005-10-03 14:33:39]


"It's not the size of the dog in the fight, but the size of the fight in the dog"
User currently offlineBobnwa From United States of America, joined Dec 2000, 6471 posts, RR: 9
Reply 9, posted (8 years 11 months 3 weeks 12 hours ago) and read 2996 times:

Quoting Mcdu (Reply 6):
heard a rumor UAL is considering trying to get MAIR to fly the Aspen and other old ARW 146 flying.

Source of this rumor!!!


User currently offlineLCH From Norway, joined Sep 2004, 47 posts, RR: 0
Reply 10, posted (8 years 11 months 3 weeks 11 hours ago) and read 2953 times:

Quoting LUVRSW (Reply 7):

Highly doubtfu, I fail to see any commonality between XJ and WN/B6, and besides, WN and B6 probably won't expand by mergersn and aqusitions, but rather natural growth. Keep in mind thath the only company WN ever bought was Morris Air, because David Neeleman had modelled Morris Air on WN, so there were few differences in corporat culture and they operated the same aircraft.


User currently offlineTOLtommy From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 3292 posts, RR: 4
Reply 11, posted (8 years 11 months 3 weeks 10 hours ago) and read 2863 times:

Quoting EMBQA (Reply 8):
Mesaba also have a very large number of Saab 340's which are not owned by Northwest.... and with Northwest defaulting on these payments it will make it harder for Mesaba to pay their bills.

All of Mesaba's aircraft are leased from NW. NW owns or leases all of the Airlink aircraft. Pinnacle and Mesaba sublease all of their fleet from NW.


User currently offlineOuboy79 From United States of America, joined Nov 2001, 4599 posts, RR: 22
Reply 12, posted (8 years 11 months 3 weeks 9 hours ago) and read 2804 times:

Quoting LCH (Reply 10):
Keep in mind thath the only company WN ever bought was Morris Air,

You may want to research a company named TranStar, aka Muse Air. Competitor to Southwest...bought, abused, and shut down. Situation was much better than the Morris Air merger, as you could probably compare it to AA buying RenoAir.


User currently offlineEMBQA From United States of America, joined Oct 2003, 9364 posts, RR: 11
Reply 13, posted (8 years 11 months 3 weeks 8 hours ago) and read 2755 times:

Quoting TOLtommy (Reply 11):
All of Mesaba's aircraft are leased from NW.

Incorrect... The B+ Saab 340's (XJ) are owned by Saab Aircraft Leasing (dba: Lambert Leasing or Fairbrook Leasing), most if not all the B's are owned by Wells Fargo Bank and Trust...(PX)

[Edited 2005-10-03 18:36:36]


"It's not the size of the dog in the fight, but the size of the fight in the dog"
User currently offlineTOLtommy From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 3292 posts, RR: 4
Reply 14, posted (8 years 11 months 3 weeks 6 hours ago) and read 2711 times:

EMBQA

Those aircraft may be owned by other groups, but they do NOT directly lease the planes to Mesaba. The planes are leased to NW, who subleases them to Mesaba.


User currently offlineEMBQA From United States of America, joined Oct 2003, 9364 posts, RR: 11
Reply 15, posted (8 years 11 months 3 weeks 6 hours ago) and read 2694 times:

Quoting TOLtommy (Reply 14):
Those aircraft may be owned by other groups, but they do NOT directly lease the planes to Mesaba. The planes are leased to NW, who subleases them to Mesaba.

Ah, trust me..your wrong. That is what I do for a living and certainly know who my clients are.



"It's not the size of the dog in the fight, but the size of the fight in the dog"
User currently offlineNLINK From United States of America, joined Nov 2003, 313 posts, RR: 0
Reply 16, posted (8 years 11 months 3 weeks 1 hour ago) and read 2609 times:

The B+ planes are leased by NWA then subleased to XJ. The PX planes 360-370 are leased by 9E then subleased to XJ. The PX airplanes are old, they are the old Express I birds. The 3 A models left I think are leased directly by XJ.

User currently offlineLUVRSW From United States of America, joined Aug 2005, 498 posts, RR: 1
Reply 17, posted (8 years 11 months 2 weeks 6 days 20 hours ago) and read 2501 times:

Swwweeeet...maybe Spanjers can hop on one of his remaining A models and fly it to NYC to declare bankruptcy!

User currently offlineCa2ohHP From United States of America, joined Sep 2005, 955 posts, RR: 1
Reply 18, posted (8 years 11 months 2 weeks 6 days 10 hours ago) and read 2430 times:

Mesaba management should have seen this coming and prepared their company for what it is now facing. They put all their eggs in one basket - a huge risk. To top it off, they sue NW days after NW files bankruptcy.....talk about biting the hand that (has fed) feeds you.

User currently offlineLUVRSW From United States of America, joined Aug 2005, 498 posts, RR: 1
Reply 19, posted (8 years 11 months 2 weeks 6 days 6 hours ago) and read 2348 times:

They sued NW? I hadn't heard that one. Could you see XJ and Comair merging?

User currently offlineDerik737 From United States of America, joined Dec 2004, 333 posts, RR: 3
Reply 20, posted (8 years 11 months 2 weeks 3 days 11 hours ago) and read 2237 times:

More bad news for Mesaba:

Quoted from http://yahoo.reuters.com/financeQuot...2005-10-07_13-09-05_wen0643_newsml


Northwest Airlines will remove 10 Saab B+ aircraft from Mesaba's schedule as of Jan. 4.

Mair also said in a government filing that Northwest has advised Mair that it likely will be unable to meet the delivery schedule for the remaining 13 Canadair Regional Jet Aircraft that are to be delivered according to a previous agreement.


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