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Swiss European Airlines Take Off The 1st Nov  
User currently offlineLsgg From Switzerland, joined Mar 2005, 577 posts, RR: 8
Posted (8 years 10 months 10 hours ago) and read 3478 times:

Hi there !


Swiss European finally has the clearance of the OFAC (Federal Office of Civil Aviation) to take off next Thursday.

LX decided to create an all new regional airline (his own Crossair Big grin) to cut down his regional flight cost...

Fleet planned : 24 AVRO


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Swissair forever !
18 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineHAJFlyer From Switzerland, joined Sep 2005, 1473 posts, RR: 9
Reply 1, posted (8 years 10 months 8 hours ago) and read 3371 times:

Well lets hope this new resurrected Crossair will have a better safety record than its predecessor which ruined its reputation by cutting too many corners and killing lots of people as a result. At the moment Swiss prosecutors are still investigating the old management which stands accused of manslaughter.

I am quite certain that the focus on one aircraft type and the fleet harmonisation with LH City line will enable them to significantly reduce their operating costs on the highly competitive European routes.

In the end the success of this operation will depend once again on whether the new LX management will be able to successfully resolve the labor issues that have so far hampered their efforts to restructure the carrier.


User currently offlineAmy From United Kingdom, joined Feb 2005, 1150 posts, RR: 7
Reply 2, posted (8 years 10 months 8 hours ago) and read 3321 times:

Good for Swiss!

I hope the new airline works well and it's good to see airlines relying on BAe's product. The old girl is far from dead yet!



A340-300 - slow, but awesome!
User currently offlineHAJFlyer From Switzerland, joined Sep 2005, 1473 posts, RR: 9
Reply 3, posted (8 years 10 months 7 hours ago) and read 3290 times:

Quoting Amy (Reply 2):
it's good to see airlines relying on BAe's product. The old girl is far from dead yet!

If it weren't so cheap to lease, the type would probably be gone by now as a result of rather high MX costs and a reliability track record that is not exactly stellar (remember the engine explosion next AMS not so long ago ?).


User currently offlineCV990 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 4, posted (8 years 10 months 6 hours ago) and read 3202 times:

Hi!

Regarding Crossair, did they actually "killed lot's of people"? I think they had two unfortune accidents, one with a SAAB 340 and one with a RJ85/RJ100 but that killed maybe 30 people! Am I missing any other Crossair big accident?
I think for SWISS this will infact be good! I think SWISS main quality products ( intercontinental ) are excelent and I always think SWISS is so global like LH, KL, BA etc. etc! That means that if I need to fly anywhere in the world and SWISS have a great offer I'll be pleased to fly with them!!!
Regards


User currently offlineHAJFlyer From Switzerland, joined Sep 2005, 1473 posts, RR: 9
Reply 5, posted (8 years 10 months 6 hours ago) and read 3181 times:

Quoting CV990 (Reply 4):
Regarding Crossair, did they actually "killed lot's of people"? I think they had two unfortune accidents, one with a SAAB 340 and one with a RJ85/RJ100 but that killed maybe 30 people!

Well, ever single death is one too many especially considering that many other regional operators have never had a crash resulting in casualties. Besides two crashes within a rather short period of time is nothing to brag about especially when you look at the circumstances of these accidents.

The report by federal investigators on the Saab accident was scathing to say the very least.


User currently offlineSQ7345 From Switzerland, joined Feb 2004, 78 posts, RR: 2
Reply 6, posted (8 years 10 months 5 hours ago) and read 3136 times:

Although beeing a supporter of Crossair from the very beginning I also think that these 2 accidents very 2 too many.
Despite all the good things they have done, their spirit, their youth, accidents always have a bad taste. Unfortunately the second happend when Swissair was to be merged into Crossair under a Plan called Phönix+! What happened then - you all know.


User currently offlineCV990 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 7, posted (8 years 10 months 5 hours ago) and read 3108 times:

Hi!

Well I truly undertand and I agree with you in all. But because you said "lot's of people" I was thinking maybe there was another big accident with Crossair that I didn't knew, just that!
Those two accidents were bad, but did that affect badly Crossair reputation in the end?
Regards


User currently offlineSaab2000 From Switzerland, joined Jun 2001, 1610 posts, RR: 11
Reply 8, posted (8 years 10 months 1 hour ago) and read 2993 times:

I used to fly for Crossair. There is no doubt that those two accidents had a terrible impact on the reputation of the company. The problem in SWISS and their relationship with the Crossair pilots was that the reputation was bad based on truly just a handful of pilots. The overwhelming majority of the pilots I flew with were very safety-oriented and followed procedures strictly. But it only takes one accident to ruin the reputation. Additionally, there were a number of incidents which should not have happened.

Am I turning my back on my former colleagues from Crossair? No. The majority would agree with this. Safety was concern nr. 1 for everyone, but there were a few pilots who should not have been there.



smrtrthnu
User currently offlineCV990 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 9, posted (8 years 9 months 4 weeks 1 day 10 hours ago) and read 2837 times:

Hi Saab2000!

Wise words man, wise words!!! If we look to our lives we will find out that in any business we worked for..... people that "will wear the t-shirt" and do everything on behalf of the company, and others that what only matters is their selfish dreams. But I still consider Crossair has a great airline and even with those two accidents I wouldn't mind to fly with them!!!!
Regards


User currently offlineHS748 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 10, posted (8 years 9 months 4 weeks 1 day 9 hours ago) and read 2820 times:

Quoting HAJFlyer (Reply 3):
If it weren't so cheap to lease, the type would probably be gone by now as a result of rather high MX costs and a reliability track record that is not exactly stellar

Absolutely! I've just read a book by the founder of CityJet and he slates the 146's engines for appalling reliability and Saab for appalling customer support.


User currently offlineBennett123 From United Kingdom, joined Aug 2004, 7527 posts, RR: 3
Reply 11, posted (8 years 9 months 4 weeks 1 day 9 hours ago) and read 2815 times:

Concerning the BAE 146, I recall that at least 3 BAE146 and 2RJ have had lengthy grounding due to wing/fuel tank corrosion in the last few years.

Given that few seem to have more than 30,000 Hours on the clock and less than 400 were built, this does not bode well. These are NOT old aircraft.


User currently offlineRootsAir From Costa Rica, joined Feb 2005, 4186 posts, RR: 40
Reply 12, posted (8 years 9 months 4 weeks 1 day 9 hours ago) and read 2790 times:

Will there be a different livery for the airline? I hope so, Swiss livery is sooo simple and lame


A man without the knowledge of his past history,culture and origins is like a tree without roots
User currently onlineZRH From Switzerland, joined Nov 1999, 5566 posts, RR: 36
Reply 13, posted (8 years 9 months 4 weeks 1 day 8 hours ago) and read 2747 times:

Quoting RootsAir (Reply 12):
Will there be a different livery for the airline? I hope so, Swiss livery is sooo simple and lame

No there won't be. They only will have an inscription under the cockpit window. BTW I like the Swiss livery because it is classy, clean and elegant (specifically on the former MD 11 and the A 332). It is not so terribly kitschy like many paintings with way too much color.


User currently offlineRootsAir From Costa Rica, joined Feb 2005, 4186 posts, RR: 40
Reply 14, posted (8 years 9 months 4 weeks 1 day 8 hours ago) and read 2743 times:

Quoting ZRH (Reply 13):
BTW I like the Swiss livery because it is classy, clean and elegant (specifically on the former MD 11 and the A 332). It is not so terribly kitschy like many paintings with way too much color.

Everyone one has their own taste..



A man without the knowledge of his past history,culture and origins is like a tree without roots
User currently offlineCV990 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 15, posted (8 years 9 months 4 weeks 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 2682 times:

Hi!

I'm sorry to disagree but SWISS livery reflects really well everything related with Switzerland!!! You don't need anything else rather than the Swiss flag and I tell you everyone in the WORLD will now that we are seeing a swiss airplane arriving! NOT ONLY one airline can be identified like SWISS around the world! I'm talking for example about Portugal, if we had TAP with only the flag in the tail people would probably confuse with any country in Africa/Asia/South America, but when we see that red tail with a white cross we KNOW that it was a swiss aircraft from Switzerland arrived!
In December 2003 I was at LAX waiting for my flight to Europe, and I was flying SWISS from LAX to ZRH. LAX is one of the most buzziest airports in the world, with a lot of airlines, liveries, colours, etc. etc. but I tell you one thing, when the A340-313X from SWISS landed and taxied to our gate at Tom Bradley Terminal I could "ear" words like " It's from Switzerland", " Swiss is arriving".... that livery reflects the way swiss people are, simple, cool, calm!
People can ask why I say all those things about them beeing a portuguese? Well simple because I'm been working and relating with them since many years, and you can only understand swiss people and mentallity when you have been exposed and related after many years!
Regards


User currently offlineBBJII From United Kingdom, joined Jul 2005, 850 posts, RR: 4
Reply 16, posted (8 years 9 months 4 weeks 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 2651 times:

S

Quoting HS748 (Reply 10):



Quoting HS748 (Reply 10):
Quoting HAJFlyer (Reply 3):
If it weren't so cheap to lease, the type would probably be gone by now as a result of rather high MX costs and a reliability track record that is not exactly stellar

Absolutely! I've just read a book by the founder of CityJet and he slates the 146's engines for appalling reliability and Saab for appalling customer support.



Quoting Bennett123 (Reply 11):
Bennett123 From United Kingdom, joined Aug 2004, 1447 posts, RR: 2
Reply 11, posted Sat Oct 29 2005 13:08:30 UTC+2 and read 157 times:


Concerning the BAE 146, I recall that at least 3 BAE146 and 2RJ have had lengthy grounding due to wing/fuel tank corrosion in the last few years.

Given that few seem to have more than 30,000 Hours on the clock and less than 400 were built, this does not bode well. These are NOT old aircraft.

So Cityjet don't like the 146...so why do they keep getting them ?

The problematic fuel corrosion was located on EI-CPY...of ....Cityjet...reason...poor maintainace according to what the Irish Reports said...(No link OLD STORY)....EI cummuter were comissioned by the Irish Goverment to repair the problem and issue a report.

Needless to say that the WX 146 fleet has serviced by EI in Dublin and Former LX teams in ORY.


Crossair relaunch (or whatever the Swiss want to call it), is a welcome move and hopefully the management of Swiss are noe learning the errors of there ways  Smile



Remember: The Bird Hit You, You Didn't Hit The Bird.....
User currently offlineBennett123 From United Kingdom, joined Aug 2004, 7527 posts, RR: 3
Reply 17, posted (8 years 9 months 4 weeks 1 day 4 hours ago) and read 2584 times:

I was not aware of E1003 EI-CPY. I understand that they only had it from 24/07/1998 to 25/10/1998, 04/1999 to 10/1999, 13/10/2000 to early 2001 18/05/2001 to 23/08/2001. This is a period of 3 years, of which they actually operated it for about 14 months. It is not clear when they had the problems, but either it worked OK for the first two periods and then started playing up or it was a pup from the word go, it which case why keep taaking it back.

I was thinking of E2047 G-OZRH 2004, E2066 I-TERK 2003, E1095 A5-RGD 2001, E3264 TC-THM and E3265 TC-THO both in 2004.


User currently offlineHS748 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 18, posted (8 years 9 months 4 weeks 1 day 3 hours ago) and read 2565 times:

Quoting BBJII (Reply 16):
So Cityjet don't like the 146...so why do they keep getting them ?

Relatively cheap lease rates and ability to operate into LCY.


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