Jsposaune From United States of America, joined Oct 2005, 294 posts, RR: 0 Posted (10 years 6 months 3 weeks 6 days 7 hours ago) and read 6325 times:
While leaving LAS last night, I noticed all the RON's from WN and it got me thinking...Why are there no redeye trans-cons on WN? With their recent addition of long(er) haul flights, wouldn't this make sense for them? Just curious...
PS: I saw that they do have a couple of flights into BWI that arrive approx 0100-0200, but I don't count those as red-eyes.
There are no stupid questions....only stupid people!!!
RIPCORDD From United States of America, joined Apr 2000, 1326 posts, RR: 1
Reply 6, posted (10 years 6 months 3 weeks 6 days 7 hours ago) and read 6204 times:
OPNL Dude have you ever been on a red-eye from LAX to Chicago The last 4 I have taken this year have been sold out and there is like 2 flights leaving 30 mins apart. I know they use it as time for maintence but the demand is there esp with WN I know they would be able to fill them up
OPNLguy From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 8, posted (10 years 6 months 3 weeks 6 days 6 hours ago) and read 6180 times:
Quoting RIPCORDD (Reply 6): OPNL Dude have you ever been on a red-eye from LAX to Chicago The last 4 I have taken this year have been sold out and there is like 2 flights leaving 30 mins apart. I know they use it as time for maintence but the demand is there esp with WN I know they would be able to fill them up
Perhaps they're not doing as well as the other 361 days of the year. I'll defer to our marketing and MX departments on this one...
Ntspelich From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 764 posts, RR: 0
Reply 13, posted (10 years 6 months 3 weeks 6 days 4 hours ago) and read 5910 times:
I know that our last flight in (1099 from LAS) is rather hit or miss. The pax load will be in the 30s for weeks and then spike up around holidays, major events, etc, which is to be expected. However, it's also used as an east coast freight/mail positioning flight, much like our last flight to the west coast (ok PHX isn't west coast, but it's close enough) is used. Basically, stick around for the last inbound and you get a nice variety of freight/mail that had to be bumped earlier in the day throughout the system. Get it all to LAS by 6pm, throw it on there and plop it down in another mega station four hours later. All that's left is getting it out first thing in the morning.
Long story short, it doesn't take many pax upstairs for those flights to break even or make a profit.
That and, contrary to my recent work schedule, we at WN do like to sleep during the night. Nothing beats being the last one out and calling OPNL and his crew in dispatch to get the all clear for the night.
[Edited 2005-11-03 06:08:45]
United 717 heavy, you're facing the wrong way. Any chance you can powerback to get off of my deice pad?
RDUDDJI From Lesotho, joined Jun 2004, 1864 posts, RR: 2
Reply 14, posted (10 years 6 months 3 weeks 6 days 4 hours ago) and read 5874 times:
Quoting Socalfive (Reply 2): They simply cycle the equipment to where it's needed at the end of flight days. This is another cost savings factor.
Wrong. Higher utilization of your aircraft results in lower CASM. Not every plane needs overnight MX. Airlines that do red-eyes also do overnight work-packs on their RON aircraft. That's what aircraft routers are for (speaking from routing experience). Most carriers use only a small portion of their fleet for domestic red-eyes (10-20%). I am sure many, if not most WN aircraft are not at a MX facility or contract facility for their RON.
The most rational answer offered in this thread is the one about marketing. WN doesn't feel they need the additional revenue (and/or exposure) from red-eyes. WN also schedules some very tight turns and now that they are in some congested markets (see PHL) the lack of red-eyes also give you recovery time (both aicraft and crew) from upline delays.
Quoting FlewGSW (Reply 10): WN does not train their pilots for red eyes, saves $ in training.
Sometimes we don't realize the good times when we're in them
Luvfa From United States of America, joined May 2005, 457 posts, RR: 4
Reply 15, posted (10 years 6 months 3 weeks 6 days 4 hours ago) and read 5854 times:
I had an ATA pilot commuting on my flight this evening and he told me something interesting! Evidently there is some compatability with our Res systems as far as the code-share goes. Apparently our software doesn't recognize an itinerarythat occurs over more than one calender day, (as a red-eye would sugguest).
That being said however, I do believe that you will see red-eyes on WN in the future. Keep in mind trans-cons didn't exist at Southwest prior to 2002.
NYCFlyer From United States of America, joined Jan 2005, 1388 posts, RR: 9
Reply 18, posted (10 years 6 months 3 weeks 4 days 7 hours ago) and read 5402 times:
Quoting OPNLguy (Reply 4): The short answer is that the demand isn't there,
Of course there's a demand. Why else does every other airline, including B6, fly redeyes?
You would think redeyes would fit right into WN's business model, because redeyes are all about getting the maximum utilization from each plane. The more hours per day a plane is in the air, the more profit. Redeyes are one of the keys to B6's success (so said Neeleman himself in a speech I saw him give this week.) It's a very good question why WN doesn't do it. Oh well. At least enough other airlines do.