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Apparently SU Went For The A350  
User currently offlineKevin From Canada, joined Dec 2000, 1140 posts, RR: 0
Posted (8 years 9 months 3 hours ago) and read 11377 times:

According to some sources from the www.avia.ru (they have some Aeroflot insiders posting on their forum) , although not yet officially announced Aerolfot did sign an agreement for the A350s.

Nothing against Airbus, but I was really hoping they would go for the 787. I mean A350 is too big for Aeroflot. Although may be until the aircraft will be delivered, Russian air travel will pick up.

This info is not official so don't quote me on this one.

48 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineBlueSky1976 From Poland, joined Jul 2004, 1871 posts, RR: 4
Reply 1, posted (8 years 9 months 3 hours ago) and read 11272 times:

Let's wait for the official press release then...
If it is A350 indeed, then that's a surprise move... I thought they wanted new planes in 2009?



STOP TERRORRUSSIA!!!
User currently offlineScorpio From Belgium, joined Oct 2001, 5018 posts, RR: 44
Reply 2, posted (8 years 9 months 3 hours ago) and read 11225 times:

I'll believe it when I see it.

Quoting Kevin (Thread starter):
I mean A350 is too big for Aeroflot.

Let's not forget they're supposed to replace among others planes like the IL-86 and IL-96s, which aren't exactly small planes either. Plus, if they go for the -800, it's not that big...

Quoting Kevin (Thread starter):
Although may be until the aircraft will be delivered, Russian air travel will pick up.

I believe Russian air travel IS already picking up quite a bit.


User currently offlineAtmx2000 From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 4576 posts, RR: 38
Reply 3, posted (8 years 9 months 2 hours ago) and read 11082 times:

Quoting Kevin (Thread starter):
Nothing against Airbus, but I was really hoping they would go for the 787. I mean A350 is too big for Aeroflot. Although may be until the aircraft will be delivered, Russian air travel will pick up.

I would be surprised if they ordered A359s, but an A358 is a modest increase in size over the 767. I am sure Airbus would be willing to offer a sweet deal to win a 767 customer over after the loss of AC, including offering greater industrial offsets.



ConcordeBoy is a twin supremacist!! He supports quadicide!!
User currently offlineScbriml From United Kingdom, joined Jul 2003, 12394 posts, RR: 46
Reply 4, posted (8 years 9 months 2 hours ago) and read 11021 times:
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Bit of a coup for Airbus if it's true. The A350 in SU's colours will look pretty nice!  bouncy 


Time flies like an arrow, but fruit flies like a banana!
User currently offlineLumberton From United States of America, joined Jul 2005, 4708 posts, RR: 20
Reply 5, posted (8 years 9 months 2 hours ago) and read 10985 times:

Quoting Scbriml (Reply 4):
Bit of a coup for Airbus if it's true. The A350 in SU's colours will look pretty nice!

Why would this be a "coup"? Wasn't Airbus the favorite to win?



"When all is said and done, more will be said than done".
User currently offlineLeelaw From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 6, posted (8 years 9 months 2 hours ago) and read 10950 times:

Too bad I don't know Russian, I'd love to read what Russians are saying about this particular 787/A350 competition.

User currently offlineScbriml From United Kingdom, joined Jul 2003, 12394 posts, RR: 46
Reply 7, posted (8 years 9 months 2 hours ago) and read 10877 times:
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Quoting Lumberton (Reply 5):
Why would this be a "coup"? Wasn't Airbus the favorite to win?

Not according to the Boeing cheerleaders here.  wink 



Time flies like an arrow, but fruit flies like a banana!
User currently offlineRedFlyer From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 4315 posts, RR: 28
Reply 8, posted (8 years 9 months 2 hours ago) and read 10872 times:

Leahy was bragging in a press release that they expect to announce new orders for the 350 at Dubai the week of November 14 and that the orders will be from several customers. It sounds like he was counting on the SU order to go in their favor and perhaps it did.

http://www.aviationnow.com/avnow/new...ly_story.jsp?id=news/AIRB11045.xml



I'm not a racist...I hate Biden, too.
User currently offlineJet-lagged From United States of America, joined Mar 2002, 872 posts, RR: 0
Reply 9, posted (8 years 9 months 1 hour ago) and read 10788 times:

Quoting Leelaw (Reply 6):
Too bad I don't know Russian, I'd love to read what Russians are saying about this particular 787/A350 competition

Try this:
http://www.worldlingo.com/wl/service...5232451130510278%26topiccount%3D22


User currently offlineRedAirForce From Ukraine, joined Aug 1999, 197 posts, RR: 0
Reply 10, posted (8 years 9 months 1 hour ago) and read 10762 times:

The IL 86 and 96 are big, but when i fly on them ( maybe 2 times a year) they tend to be 50% filled at best.

User currently offlineMotorHussy From New Zealand, joined Mar 2000, 3139 posts, RR: 9
Reply 11, posted (8 years 9 months ago) and read 10629 times:

And yet Aeroflot have just confirmed new orders for Il-96's according to Janes and that's a fairly reliable source.

4 November 2005

TRANSPORT www.janes.com/transport

Aeroflot signs for new aircraft
Aeroflot - Russian Airlines has signed a contract for the purchase of seven Airbus A321 aircraft. The airline already operates three of the type and will begin taking delivery of the new aircraft from the fourth quarter of 2006. In September 2005, the airline ordered six Ilyushin 96-300 aircraft, to be leased from Ilyushin Finance.
[Jane's World Airlines - http://jwa.janes.com - 2 November 2005]



come visit the south pacific
User currently offlineTheSonntag From Germany, joined Jun 2005, 3521 posts, RR: 29
Reply 12, posted (8 years 9 months ago) and read 10587 times:

While I hate to talk about politics, I guess this is a highly political decision. When Gerhard Schr�der talked at the A380 reveal, he expressed his hope that EADS would open their view towards Russia, involving them in future projects.

So maybe there are some kind of deals between the EU and Russia on this. Don't get me wrong, I usually don't want to involve politics in aircraft deals, but this time I think this is not unlikely.

Anyway, its so boring that Aeroflot is buying Boeing and Airbus. It would be so cool if they flew modern russian jets. I know that they have a lot of russian airliners and that they also consider buying new ones, but I really hope the russian aviation industry will survive.


User currently offlineMarshalN From Hong Kong, joined Sep 2005, 1521 posts, RR: 0
Reply 13, posted (8 years 9 months ago) and read 10546 times:

Quoting TheSonntag (Reply 12):
While I hate to talk about politics, I guess this is a highly political decision. When Gerhard Schr�der talked at the A380 reveal, he expressed his hope that EADS would open their view towards Russia, involving them in future projects.

So maybe there are some kind of deals between the EU and Russia on this. Don't get me wrong, I usually don't want to involve politics in aircraft deals, but this time I think this is not unlikely.

Well, according to the Boeing cheerleaders here, they said politics will play in Boeing's favour since SU ordered a bunch of A320s. So to balance that order out, they'll go after the 787.


User currently offlineLumberton From United States of America, joined Jul 2005, 4708 posts, RR: 20
Reply 14, posted (8 years 8 months 4 weeks 1 day 23 hours ago) and read 10446 times:

Quoting Scbriml (Reply 7):
Quoting Lumberton (Reply 5):
Why would this be a "coup"? Wasn't Airbus the favorite to win?

Not according to the Boeing cheerleaders here

Well, here's the thread from a few days back. It's a slow night so why don't you review. A lot of these folks who opined that Boeing was going to win are not Boeing "cheerleaders". I've always felt that Putin would swing this Airbus' way.

Aeroflot To Choose Between A350 And 787 Next Week



"When all is said and done, more will be said than done".
User currently offlineNAV20 From Australia, joined Nov 2003, 9909 posts, RR: 36
Reply 15, posted (8 years 8 months 4 weeks 1 day 23 hours ago) and read 10441 times:

Russia is signing up for a 3% share in the A350 project. So an order from Russia was predictable. Same as Japanese orders for 787s (and 747ADVs?).

http://www.themoscowtimes.com/stories/2005/10/10/044.html

[Edited 2005-11-05 04:00:32]


"Once you have flown, you will walk the earth with your eyes turned skywards.." - Leonardo da Vinci
User currently offlineManni From South Korea, joined Nov 2001, 4221 posts, RR: 23
Reply 16, posted (8 years 8 months 4 weeks 1 day 23 hours ago) and read 10400 times:

That would be a nice boost to the A350 programme if true, as IIRC the order would be for up to 22 aircraft, making SU the second largest customer for the A350 thus far.

With their fleet of new narrowbody Airbus aircraft an soon, new longhaul aircraft, SU can truly start competing with the European carriers flying to the Far East. On every direct flight I've taken out of Europe to either South Korea, Japan or Hong Kong the flightpath on the IFE shows Moskou or St. Petersburg as one of the cities being flown over. Aeroflot has, with Moskou, a geographically positioned ideal hub,to fly passengers from Europe to the Far East and vice versa, time to take advantage of this.



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User currently offlineMIAMIx707 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 17, posted (8 years 8 months 4 weeks 1 day 23 hours ago) and read 10339 times:

Too bad Russia isn't making new airliners anymore like it used to. Now Aeroflot not only has adopted a mundane western looking paintscheme but the planes they'll be flying will be something as boring/ugly as the A350. The engines look too oversized on that A330 airframe, yuck.

The Airline with the most variety of airliners is becoming as boring as the rest. I guess it's a sign of the times.


User currently offlineWedgetail737 From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 5890 posts, RR: 6
Reply 18, posted (8 years 8 months 4 weeks 1 day 22 hours ago) and read 10312 times:
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It floors me to read about Aeroflot buying Airbus airplanes as Boeing constantly pours tons of money to keep the Boeing Design Center in Moscow. The BDC was Boeing's attempt to sway Aeroflot to buy Boeing products in return trying to rejuvenate Russia's diving aerospace industry. Apparently, this hasn't worked.

Why sacrifice American jobs for a customer that has NO intentions on buying Boeing airplanes and that is replacing their fleet with Airbus airplanes??? I believe Boeing execs need to get back into reality and perhaps either bring Boeing jobs back or move outsourced work to those countries that more loyal to the Boeing Co., such as Australia, Japan or India.


User currently offlineMarshalN From Hong Kong, joined Sep 2005, 1521 posts, RR: 0
Reply 19, posted (8 years 8 months 4 weeks 1 day 22 hours ago) and read 10284 times:

Quoting Wedgetail737 (Reply 18):
Why sacrifice American jobs for a customer that has NO intentions on buying Boeing airplanes and that is replacing their fleet with Airbus airplanes??? I believe Boeing execs need to get back into reality and perhaps either bring Boeing jobs back or move outsourced work to those countries that more loyal to the Boeing Co., such as Australia, Japan or India.

I think that could also be a strategic move in the sense that you don't want these guys with aerospace expertise being hired by Chinese or anyone else to make new jet fighters. I don't think it's really just about the orders from SU


User currently offlineCanadianPylon From Canada, joined May 2003, 307 posts, RR: 0
Reply 20, posted (8 years 8 months 4 weeks 1 day 22 hours ago) and read 10278 times:

Quoting Wedgetail737 (Reply 18):
Why sacrifice American jobs for a customer that has NO intentions on buying Boeing airplanes and that is replacing their fleet with Airbus airplanes??? I believe Boeing execs need to get back into reality and perhaps either bring Boeing jobs back or move outsourced work to those countries that more loyal to the Boeing Co., such as Australia, Japan or India.

or Canada? Boeing already has large investment in Canada (Winnipeg, Ottawa?). It would be a nice way of saying thank you to AC...  Smile

CanadianPylon



Always looking for the longest route with the most transfers.
User currently offlineAtmx2000 From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 4576 posts, RR: 38
Reply 21, posted (8 years 8 months 4 weeks 1 day 22 hours ago) and read 10193 times:

Quoting Wedgetail737 (Reply 18):
Why sacrifice American jobs for a customer that has NO intentions on buying Boeing airplanes and that is replacing their fleet with Airbus airplanes??? I believe Boeing execs need to get back into reality and perhaps either bring Boeing jobs back or move outsourced work to those countries that more loyal to the Boeing Co., such as Australia, Japan or India.

It's partly for them to take advantage of an existing talent pool and resources. Weren't they doing some wind tunnel testing in Russia as well? It's not all for offset reasons. But if Boeing purchases are being blocked for political reasons by the Russian government, Boeing should carefully consider its position. Anyway, what other airlines are there in Russia, and are any Boeing customers or likely candidates?

Quoting MarshalN (Reply 19):
I think that could also be a strategic move in the sense that you don't want these guys with aerospace expertise being hired by Chinese or anyone else to make new jet fighters. I don't think it's really just about the orders from SU

That's a major reason for it.



ConcordeBoy is a twin supremacist!! He supports quadicide!!
User currently offlineStuckInCA From United States of America, joined Oct 2005, 1951 posts, RR: 0
Reply 22, posted (8 years 8 months 4 weeks 1 day 21 hours ago) and read 10136 times:

Quoting Wedgetail737 (Reply 18):
Why sacrifice American jobs for a customer that has NO intentions on buying Boeing airplanes and that is replacing their fleet with Airbus airplanes??? I believe Boeing execs need to get back into reality and perhaps either bring Boeing jobs back or move outsourced work to those countries that more loyal to the Boeing Co., such as Australia, Japan or India.

Lots of smart engineers there too. Probably lots of reasons to have a Moscow design center other than to sway SU.


User currently offlineCruiser From Canada, joined Apr 2005, 1001 posts, RR: 7
Reply 23, posted (8 years 8 months 4 weeks 1 day 21 hours ago) and read 10101 times:

Reading through the translated page, there were two anonymous comments which were very in explicit other than: They signed for A350's. I personally will wait for the decision to be made official. I feel that it will still go to Boeing, but one has been wrong before!

James



Leahy on Per Seat Costs: "Have you seen the B-2 fly-by at almost US$1bn a copy? It has only 2 seats!"
User currently offlineGlideslope From United States of America, joined May 2004, 1605 posts, RR: 0
Reply 24, posted (8 years 8 months 4 weeks 1 day 14 hours ago) and read 8573 times:

Quoting Scbriml (Reply 4):
Bit of a coup for Airbus if it's true. The A350 in SU's colours will look pretty nice!

Coup? A last minute price cut on the 358 due to the loss of AC is more likely. I'll say around $70 Million USD each. (watching the break even number rise  Smile )

Geo Politics at play here. Russia can't be seen on the home front as being too Pro American. Too many variables with Putin not running for re-election.

These orders are stop gaps anyway. Russia has every intent on becoming an exporter of Commercial Aircraft in the future. As does China.  Smile



To know your Enemy, you must become your Enemy.” Sun Tzu
25 FVTu134 : This is a very onesided look. You could also think that Boeing is trying not to be left out in the cold. Even though there are "only" 145 M people in
26 Post contains images Scorpio : Here we go again... Some of you are truly pathetic, you know. But judging by your other 'predictions', we already know how far you go as far as relia
27 Thorben : Nice comment. Maybe Boeing gave AC a 777 for that price, but I have my doubts about that figure for an A350.
28 Abba : I do not think that Russia works the same way as Japan Inc. You cannot suppose such close relation between SU and a Boeing design center. However, I'
29 MarshalN : If you don't know it for sure, don't say it. I don't think Airbus is desperate enough to give away planes. Other airlines have willingly signed up
30 Post contains images A319XFW : Austrailia more loyal to Boeing? Didn't they order the KC-330 and QF the A380 and A330.... I should hope that if an airliner is right for a company a
31 Post contains images JetMaster : The AC deal wasn't lost recently, and though it was delayed there was no change to expect. Good. Then we can be sure it's definitely different in rea
32 Cruiser : Considering that AC ordered the most expensive 777's possible (ranging from $209Million to $253Million at list price), I highly doubt that that they
33 Gigneil : Why? Airbus has a huge design center in Moscow also. Its not to sell airplanes to Russia, I assure you. Actually you need to get back into reality. A
34 RedChili : Far from it! Aeroflot really needs bigger airplanes for their long haul routes. They're not replacing the IL-96. The ones that they have are only som
35 Post contains links Jacobin777 : maybe SU won't be able to get a hold of MD-11F's so they have decided to go with the A350's.....could be part of the reason..just guessing.. "The plan
36 DistantHorizon : Boring, maybe. But ugly? Well, it will be certainly prettier than the 787... And one of the most elegant bird flying (like the A330 already is). Just
37 FCKC : So when SU will make an announcement about the choice they have done ? DXB Air Show ?
38 A342 : No it´s not. It´s about B763/A300 size. Maximum capacity is, IIRC, 350 seats in all y interior. The A359 could have 440 seats all y.
39 Thorben : Latest news: The latest meeting was just a pre-selection, the real decision won't be until the end of November, maybe even a vote at the shareholder's
40 Gkirk : Agreed.
41 Eha : Perfectly right. Airbus has a design office in Moscow, and even in Wichita...Of course it can always be seen as a move to get something in return (wh
42 Glareskin : So it is correct that Airbus is the favourite?
43 Thorben : I don't know. It was just a selection committee deciding which plane they prefer. They'll show their decision to the board, the board will make a dec
44 Post contains links KL808 : Aha... I told you the underdog will win (i.e. Airbus) Aeroflot to choose between A350 and 787 next week But this great news. Congratulations Airbus is
45 Ivo : The Boeing Team in Moscow is desingning the 747 large freighter to carry the 787 subassembly to the final production line. Ivo
46 Cruiser : No decision has been announced unless you know something that no one else does! James
47 Thorben : Right, there has been no decision, just a pre-selection by a selection committee that will recommend one plane to the board. There is no indication,
48 Post contains images StuckInCA : There goes my image of Airbus and Boeing engineers with beer bongs. A kegerator in every cube!
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