Northwestair From Poland, joined Jul 2001, 648 posts, RR: 4 Posted (8 years 11 months 3 weeks 18 hours ago) and read 4609 times:
How many Employees are thinking about Jumping Ship from NWA. I'm one. I just submitted my Application to CO. I don't know if you feel the same way I do, but NW and the IAM has lied to us, and it seems that our company isn't getting any better but going further and further down hill. I realize that I will have to start all over as in pay and everything, but NW wants to get rid of my job anyways so I would rather make something instead of nothing.
Ejmmsu From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 1692 posts, RR: 0
Reply 1, posted (8 years 11 months 3 weeks 18 hours ago) and read 4566 times:
I think sending
out applications elswhere is a good
idea. Maybe NWA can get its house in
order eventually, but why chance it if
you don't have to.
I'm continuing to fly NWA for the time
being, mainly because I'll be able to
get elite status with you guys this
year. I'm going on a milage run today,
Sat Nov 5th on flights
Being a saturday, I imagine these
flights aren't too full.
"If the facts do not conform to the theory, they will have to be disposed of"
AS739X From United States of America, joined Apr 2003, 6161 posts, RR: 24
Reply 2, posted (8 years 11 months 3 weeks 18 hours ago) and read 4563 times:
I have 2 friends that just interviewed w/ Alaska from NW, though they were furloughed and didn't have much of a choice of jumping ship. One of them was highered, the other wasn't. I'm sure they were not the only ones though in the in-flight interviews.
"Some pilots avoid storm cells and some play connect the dots!"
CALPilot From United States of America, joined Oct 1999, 999 posts, RR: 14
Reply 6, posted (8 years 11 months 3 weeks 3 hours ago) and read 4154 times:
I have got to laugh at this, "not at you Northwestair"
I was flying the right seat of the B727 back in 1995, the S/O sitting behind me was the biggest "jerk" I have ever flown with. All he could do was bad mouth CO and everyone that worked here.
Get this he was rubbing it in the face of the Capt. and myself that he was going to work for NW the following month. Life was going to be "Great!" and he would be flying wide-bodies before I ever got the left seat of anything, "Blah, Blah, blah". You can guess where he is in the seniority list flow now. At CO he would be a middle road B737 Capt./ Jr B767 Capt.
Someone else might give me a '95 hire standing at NW, but my guess, middle/Jr F/O narrow-body somewhere cold.
Moral of the story, Grass is Not always greener on the other side, and remember those you step on climbing up, are more than happy to laugh when you fall past them.
Northwestair, yes if your unhappy, or job elimination is coming then CO is an option; "welcome." However, don't think that CO is the end-all. We have our problems to, a large dollar loss on Oct. and more cuts to come. If you feel aviation/ airlines are in your blood, that makes you happy, then by all means go for it, don't look back. Just remeber what I said above about grass greener stuff.
I also have learned from others in this industry that, you have to make decisions based on the best information that you have at the moment, and we can only guess what that info will look like a few years, a few wars, a few recessions down the road from now. Good luck...
TPAnx From United States of America, joined Aug 2005, 1021 posts, RR: 0
Reply 10, posted (8 years 11 months 3 weeks 1 hour ago) and read 3946 times:
So how is life in the trenches these days at NW? A writer in another thread mentioned doctor's notes for sick days and monitored travel. How's morale?
How are the various employee groups getting along? Has management managed to bring about a feeling of unity, or is it "us vs. them?"
TOLtommy From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 3297 posts, RR: 4
Reply 11, posted (8 years 11 months 3 weeks ago) and read 3936 times:
Things were a lot different at both CO and NW in 1995. At the time, what that "jerk" has to say was true. He might not have been tactful, but he was correct. There was a time that I wouldn't be caught dead on a CO airplane, and then Bethune came in and changed the culture. I spent a lot of time on CO in the late 90's, until a 737 became a rare sighting in CLE. Plat Elite status does no good on a JungleJet! I came back to NW.
Crownvic From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 1933 posts, RR: 5
Reply 15, posted (8 years 11 months 2 weeks 6 days 20 hours ago) and read 3445 times:
Not in the same context, but I am jumping ship too! I fly several Transpacs a year and for the last 7 years, NWA has had my business. Since they treat their premium customers like dirt, effective with my next trip in January, Korean Air, here I come!
Usdcaguy From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 977 posts, RR: 2
Reply 16, posted (8 years 11 months 2 weeks 6 days 19 hours ago) and read 3233 times:
Actually, NW is not as bad off as you think. Just because they're in bankruptcy doesn't mean they won't bounce back in a year or two. The main problem now is creating a sustainable image and product, which you can't have without people, the company's most important asset. The challenge now is figuring out how to keep the company's people happy and upbeat while shoving them out onto the street. Regardless, pay at NW is still much higher in many areas than at other airlines, which is something to consider even if the company's future is not yet guaranteed.
Co757 From United States of America, joined Apr 2005, 94 posts, RR: 0
Reply 17, posted (8 years 11 months 2 weeks 6 days 19 hours ago) and read 3227 times:
Quoting AA737-823 (Reply 4): Uh, you turned your application in to CO?
Are they even hiring? What positions?
Continental is Hiring. Especially Flight Attendants (Newark based only). And Just talked to one of the Flight Attendants who Came in From Seattle to Houston, Going to Las Vegas then The Red-Eye to Newark. And I asked her if they were flying the 83 Hours Guaranteed by the Company And She said She has Flown at least 115 a month since getting hired in May. So If you dont have a problem with being in Newark for a while, Go for It. And now's the Time, They are growing and have quite a few aircraft on order. It might suck to start over in pay and seniority but I think CAL will be around and is the only Major to recall and hire pilots and Flight Attendants since 9/11.
Co757 From United States of America, joined Apr 2005, 94 posts, RR: 0
Reply 18, posted (8 years 11 months 2 weeks 6 days 19 hours ago) and read 3141 times:
Quoting TOLtommy (Reply 11): I spent a lot of time on CO in the late 90's, until a 737 became a rare sighting in CLE. Plat Elite status does no good on a JungleJet! I came back to NW.
Yeah well stick it where the sun Dont shine! If you want a 737 fly Southwest. They and other No Frill Carriers are the reason for the Turmoil, Paycuts and Bancruptcys from the Big Boys. You elite Members Expect something for free i.e, Upgrades, you are so nice when you walk up and say " The Girls In the Club told me to check with you for an Upgrade" And when your told its full, You turn from "Nice Passenger" to " A..hole" How do you think that makes the agent feel? Did You ever think About that?. Thats why You are now treated like a piece of s.it! Would love to come to your job and Throw it back at you! So just keep in mind the flight you do get Upgraded on and Coach people are walking past you while you have your nose in the air (When they Probabaly paid more than you) remember if the big boys are gone, your butt would have to free for all on Swa for a decent seat.....Jerk!
FlyCaledonian From United Kingdom, joined Dec 2003, 2093 posts, RR: 3
Reply 19, posted (8 years 11 months 2 weeks 6 days 13 hours ago) and read 2940 times:
Co757, whatever TOLtommy is, when he flies CO the only thing that should concern you is that he is a fare paying passenger. He, like everyone else, has choice and badmouthing someone who has obviously flown a lot to get Plat elite status maybe suggests being in a customer service orientated industry is not the place for you?
AS for those thinking of jumping ship at NW - ask yourself which you'll kick yourself more for. Staying put, or moving on. Don't just do it because they're in Chp 11.
Northwestair From Poland, joined Jul 2001, 648 posts, RR: 4
Reply 20, posted (8 years 11 months 2 weeks 6 days 9 hours ago) and read 2858 times:
Quoting FlyCaledonian (Reply 19): AS for those thinking of jumping ship at NW - ask yourself which you'll kick yourself more for. Staying put, or moving on. Don't just do it because they're in Chp 11.
I'm thinking of Jumping Ship now, cause the IAM has a report on the Web Page that all jobs will be outsourced for the Customer Service and Equipment Service except if you work in the HUBs (DTW/MSP). So if I can get a job at CO then that will be great. I know that I will have to start all over on my pay, but a little paycheck is better than no paycheck. I keep hearing that 16Nov is D-Day. That's what is on the Claendars at work.
BBJII From United Kingdom, joined Jul 2005, 850 posts, RR: 4
Reply 21, posted (8 years 11 months 2 weeks 6 days 6 hours ago) and read 2767 times:
Not wanting to see any airline go bust: seeing hundreds of thousand of dedicated professionals loose there jobs, (pros being the REAL workers, not management), I feel for any one who's in your position.
If you feel you have to JUMP ship, do so.
Remember: The Bird Hit You, You Didn't Hit The Bird.....
Wobbles From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 149 posts, RR: 0
Reply 23, posted (8 years 11 months 2 weeks 5 days 21 hours ago) and read 2577 times:
The IAM is really something else. NWA is trying to, if you ask me, bust all the unions. How would you feel if you as a member of any of these unions, were asked to vote on contracts where 33 to 50 percent of your membership could be eliminated? If it was just one or the other, paycuts or downsizing, the issue would not be as sticky. Having Elaine Chao as the Secretary of Labor (ex NW management employee) helps these losers like Steenland union bust.
Even though other airlines may be hiring, it is too bad that you cannot take your worth and your pay (not your seniority) with you.
Legacy airlines should outsource more
By Isabelle Francis
Legacy airlines should outsource more to weather the challenges posed by low-cost model airlines, said business process and IT outsourcing provider Affiliated Computer Services, Inc (ACS) regional vice president of transportation Steve Reynolds.
“In the airline industry, you can outsource every aspect of your company and the winner is the one that puts together a combination of in-sourcing and outsourcing to provide the most value of the lowest cost to the customers.
“The low-cost airlines are pretty much outsourcing 80% to 90% of their works. They have a group of executives that manage vendors’ relationships.
“Most companies in Europe and US that outsource tend to save 25%-40% in cost savings. And for the airline industry, it (outsourcing) is absolutely necessary for them to survive,” he told FinancialDaily recently.
“As the (airline) industry grows, their vendors grow; when it shrinks, the vendors have to shrink. All that risk going up and down from a volume perspective is handled by the vendors and not by the airlines. They still could make money even during down market.
“For example, financing and accounting is the same in all companies. So, why do you need to own it? Your customers are not going to benefit because you have a better accounting system, not necessarily.
“Information technology (IT) was outsourced 10 years ago. Now, anything could be outsourced, it doesn’t matter. There’s no such thing core or strategic for you to own,” added Reynolds.
On Malaysian legacy airlines, Malaysia Airlines (MAS), he said: “I don’t know specifically what MAS outsources, but I think they have a tough year and tough history financially.
“They’ve got a lot of practices that are legacy. Also they have some union issues to overcome. If they do that, one of the ways to is to outsource more.
“They got large call-centre of individuals, and if they use multiple vendors to provide that, they would get a lot more compatible prices, better management of volume, and they can shrink the staff.
“I can’t tell for Malaysia what they should outsource more because I don’t know what they outsource today. But if I own an airline, and I’m looking to save money, I would look at outsourcing at an aggressive way.”
Reynolds added that it may take time for Malaysian companies to be receptive to aggressive outsourcing.
“It depends on the market. I think the Malaysian market is getting more attractive to outsourcing. It takes a while for a company to appreciate outsourcing and the expertise.
“Outsourcing offers huge amount of value-cost savings, reengineering processes and breaking legacy practices they had in the pass,” he explained.
Reynolds said, ACS, a fortune 500 company with a US$5 billion (RM18.78 billion) annual revenue employing over 50,000 in over 100 countries, was still looking to expand its services here in Malaysia.
“We are doing (outsourcing) for other industries here (but not for the airlines industry).
“Customers hire us to take work to a low-cost market. Malaysia already has a low-cost market. Secondly, there not many airlines as compared to the (United) States,” he explained.
Meanwhile, on the local front, MAS officials agreed that outsourcing would only be efficient when the the services were promising.
“If there’s outsource, there are questions of control. This control is different from (the) kind of control over your own company. If there’s no such control the airline’s interest could be compromised when the outsource service is not of a certain standard.” said MAS’ chairman Datuk Mohamad Munir Abdul Majid.
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[Edited 2005-11-07 06:12:16]
Tired of airline bankruptcies....EA/PA/TW and finally DL.
: We are definitely hiring. We are finalizing the training procedures. There should be info on open houses any time soon I would imagine. The rumor is
: Am I the only one whose noticed that Northwestair and CO757 have the same bizarre tendency to capitalize words that don't need to be capitalized?
: You must be kidding! You are either a 12yr old kid at home trying to play big boy or a completely stupid person. (For the rest of this post I will as
: Maybe someday UAL will grow "tired" of you and decide to take back the company from the likes of you as well.
: That might just be indigestion there.
: Actually I do have an Education, and yes I do work for an airline and spent money to go to school to get that job, but that was back when it was a fu