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Lufthansa PTVs?  
User currently offlineGVWOW From United States of America, joined Nov 2005, 168 posts, RR: 2
Posted (9 years 1 month 1 week 21 hours ago) and read 3873 times:

Lufty has not installed PTVs in Y-class of any of their aircraft, even the A346, though they are competitive airline in all other areas. Their only planes that have them are a couple old A330s bought from SWISS. Does anyone know why this is? Are they strapped for cash or do they plan to install a super-modern system superior to all other airlines' systems?. I haven't been able to find much information on this.

Thank you

36 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineSabena332 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 1, posted (9 years 1 month 1 week 21 hours ago) and read 3861 times:

Quoting GVWOW (Thread starter):
Does anyone know why this is?

Probably because they are a lame retarded airline which doesn't give a rat's ass about Economy Class passengers... just a guess.

Uh oh, the carpet is on fire, I have to go.  

Patrick

[Edited 2005-11-12 23:31:12]

User currently offlineRoseFlyer From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 9810 posts, RR: 52
Reply 2, posted (9 years 1 month 1 week 21 hours ago) and read 3837 times:

Quoting GVWOW (Thread starter):
Does anyone know why this is? Are they strapped for cash or do they plan to install a super-modern system superior to all other airlines' systems?.

I think the real reason is that they don't feel the need to offer a good economy product. LH beyond any other airline seems to have a lot of contracts to fill up their planes. I don't know if they just do a lot of corporate contracts or what, but I rarely see LH offer those deep discounted economy tickets like many other airlines. LH simply doesn't need PTVs to get a full economy cabin. PTV entertainment systems are heavy and expensive. It is not just a one time expenditure in order to get them; an airline has to maintain them and slug all that extra weight around (a few hundred pounds usually) that could be used for more valuable cargo.



If you have never designed an airplane part before, let the real designers do the work!
User currently offlineLHUSA From United States of America, joined Aug 2005, 573 posts, RR: 2
Reply 3, posted (9 years 1 month 1 week 20 hours ago) and read 3782 times:

Quoting Sabena332 (Reply 1):
Probably because they are a lame retarded airline which doesn't give a rat's ass about Economy Class passengers... just a guess.

This coming from a "Forum Moderator"... How exactly does a statement like this constitute moderating? Very mature.

RoseFlyer hit it right on the nose. It's a huge expense and our planes are already packed in Y, even with limited low-bucket fares available. Thus, it's difficult to warrant the huge expense of retrofitting the older planes with PTVs.

LH has chosen in the last couple of years to focus its service improvements on the premium traveler. We've implemented innovations (First Class Terminal, Private Jet, Executive Business Jet, new business seat, FlyNet etc..) and the fanfare has been amazing. That doesn't mean however that we don't care about the economy passenger. As a business, you have to make investments that will yield the highest gains. To spend huge amounts of money on PTVs for economy class is a huge undertaking in expense and effort.

However, PTVs will be included in economy on the A380 (this is confirmed, not hearsay) and the plan right now is install PTVs on the existing A340-600 and A333 fleet after the re-fit for the new business class in completed on the rest of the fleet.



[Edited 2005-11-13 00:22:34]

User currently offlineLeonB1985 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 4, posted (9 years 1 month 1 week 20 hours ago) and read 3747 times:

Quoting LHUSA (Reply 3):
However, PTVs will be included in economy on the A380 (this is confirmed, not hearsay) and the plan right now is install PTVs on the existing A340-600 and A333 fleet after the re-fit for the new business class in completed on the rest of the fleet.

Any ideas when this is likely to be?


User currently offlineWdleiser From United States of America, joined Apr 2004, 962 posts, RR: 3
Reply 5, posted (9 years 1 month 1 week 20 hours ago) and read 3729 times:

Quoting Sabena332 (Reply 1):

Probably because they are a lame retarded airline which doesn't give a rat's ass about Economy Class passengers... just a guess.

Ya huh, lame retarded airline that always seems to fill Eco  Wink
You are correct in a way, they do care for their premium passengers much better than those of cattle class.

Quoting Sabena332 (Reply 1):
Uh oh, the carpet is on fire, I have to go.

Did I mention we no longer have carpet, but rather tile floors.  Wink


User currently offlineSabena332 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 6, posted (9 years 1 month 1 week 20 hours ago) and read 3720 times:

Quoting LHUSA (Reply 3):
This coming from a "Forum Moderator"... How exactly does a statement like this constitute moderating?

Is a forum moderator not allowed to have an opinion about an airline?

Quoting LHUSA (Reply 3):
Very mature.

And the truth.

Quoting LHUSA (Reply 3):
LH has chosen in the last couple of years to focus its service improvements on the premium traveler.

I already wrote that in reply #2, my phrasing was just a bit different:

Quoting Sabena332 (Reply 1):
Probably because they are a lame retarded airline which doesn't give a rat's ass about Economy Class passengers...

Patrick


User currently offlineLHUSA From United States of America, joined Aug 2005, 573 posts, RR: 2
Reply 7, posted (9 years 1 month 1 week 20 hours ago) and read 3718 times:

Quoting LeonB1985 (Reply 4):
Any ideas when this is likely to be?

Unfortunately, I'm not privy to the exact start dates for the PTV re-fit, but I have heard that it will be in line with the introduction of the A380 - so still a couple of years away. PTVs will certainly not be introduced before the new business class project is completed because of fleet demand issues. Unfortunately, the complete date for the new seat is constantly being adjusted because of software problems with systems that run the seat and IFE. While these kinks are being worked out, our planes will continue to have the FlyNet Connexion by Boeing product installed.


User currently offlinePelican From Germany, joined Apr 2004, 2531 posts, RR: 8
Reply 8, posted (9 years 1 month 1 week 20 hours ago) and read 3706 times:

Quoting Sabena332 (Reply 1):
Probably because they are a lame retarded airline which doesn't give a rat's ass about Economy Class passengers... just a guess.



Quoting Sabena332 (Reply 26):
Exactly, so when you see a post which is offensive in your view, then simply suggest deletion instead of replying in the same manner than the user you don't agree with, such a situation will always result in a flamefest!

...just remembering another thread...

 Confused

pelican

BTW Aren't there other ways of expressing your maybe well-reasoned dislike for LH?


User currently offlineLHUSA From United States of America, joined Aug 2005, 573 posts, RR: 2
Reply 9, posted (9 years 1 month 1 week 20 hours ago) and read 3699 times:

Quoting Sabena332 (Reply 6):
Is a forum moderator not allowed to have an opinion about an airline?

Opinions are one thing. A moderator using words like "lame" and "retarded" to explain his point of view is contradictory and hardely exemplifies the intended duties of a moderator.


User currently offlineAvianca From Venezuela, joined Jan 2005, 5934 posts, RR: 40
Reply 10, posted (9 years 1 month 1 week 20 hours ago) and read 3674 times:

well years ago when the first airliners installed PTV´s in ECO, LH justified it with payload restrictions on the longer long-haul routes like to SIN, EZE etc etc... it would be a weight increasing of 5Tons with the effect of nearly 0 payload for cargo on that routes.... but yes its time, LH should install the PTV´s...

regards
Avianca



Colombia es el Mundo Y el Mundo es Colombia
User currently offlineSabena332 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 11, posted (9 years 1 month 1 week 20 hours ago) and read 3669 times:

Quoting Pelican (Reply 8):
BTW Aren't there other ways of expressing your maybe well-reasoned dislike for LH?

No.

Quoting LHUSA (Reply 9):
A moderator using words like "lame" and "retarded" to explain his point of view is contradictory and hardely exemplifies the intended duties of a moderator.

Are "lame" and "retarded" really such bad words? And as ascertained in reply #6, actually do we agree, or not?

Patrick


User currently offlineAeroWesty From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 20822 posts, RR: 62
Reply 12, posted (9 years 1 month 1 week 20 hours ago) and read 3655 times:

Quoting LHUSA (Reply 9):
A moderator using words like "lame" and "retarded" to explain his point of view is contradictory and hardely exemplifies the intended duties of a moderator.

Bollocks, it was delicious.



International Homo of Mystery
User currently offlineA360 From Portugal, joined Jun 2005, 434 posts, RR: 8
Reply 13, posted (9 years 1 month 1 week 20 hours ago) and read 3644 times:

Quoting LHUSA (Reply 3):
However, PTVs will be included in economy on the A380 (this is confirmed, not hearsay) and the plan right now is install PTVs on the existing A340-600 and A333 fleet after the re-fit for the new business class in completed on the rest of the fleet.

Really?? This is quite big news!

Everybody here is always asking if LH is going to put PTV's on the A380 or not!

Good to hear the 346 and 333 are going to have them too.
But what about the 744's and 343's?...

Regards:
A360


User currently offlineJyatlantic From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 14, posted (9 years 1 month 1 week 19 hours ago) and read 3602 times:

There's just an indent in the seat...quite depressing.

User currently offlinePiercey From Sweden, joined Nov 2005, 2233 posts, RR: 1
Reply 15, posted (9 years 1 month 1 week 18 hours ago) and read 3557 times:

Quoting A360 (Reply 13):
But what about the 744's and 343's?...

You want to bet the 343's are gone withn the next 10 yrs and the 744's 15? Not worth the investment, IMO.



Well I believe it all is coming to an end. Oh well, I guess we are gonna pretend.
User currently offlineAvianca From Venezuela, joined Jan 2005, 5934 posts, RR: 40
Reply 16, posted (9 years 1 month 1 week 18 hours ago) and read 3548 times:

Quoting Piercey (Reply 15):
You want to bet the 343's are gone withn the next 10 yrs and the 744's 15? Not worth the investment, IMO.

isnt 10 and 15 years more than a long time for an aicraft, its the regular half lifetime of an new aircraft.



Colombia es el Mundo Y el Mundo es Colombia
User currently offlineA360 From Portugal, joined Jun 2005, 434 posts, RR: 8
Reply 17, posted (9 years 1 month 1 week 18 hours ago) and read 3513 times:

Quoting Piercey (Reply 15):
You want to bet the 343's are gone withn the next 10 yrs and the 744's 15? Not worth the investment, IMO.

10/15 years is a long time in an aircraft life!


User currently offlineGVWOW From United States of America, joined Nov 2005, 168 posts, RR: 2
Reply 18, posted (9 years 1 month 1 week 17 hours ago) and read 3486 times:

Quoting A360 (Reply 17):
10/15 years is a long time in an aircraft life!

It'll be interesting to see how those planes age. I'd imagine they'll be better than what we now call old.
Thank you for the clarification by the way. It helped immensely.

Quoting Sabena332 (Reply 1):
Uh oh, the carpet is on fire, I have to go.

It's a shame about that mousepad, isn't it! Wink Wink Wink


User currently offlineA350 From Germany, joined Nov 2004, 1101 posts, RR: 22
Reply 19, posted (9 years 1 month 1 week 17 hours ago) and read 3482 times:

Perhaps LH takes their passengers for adult enough to spend a day without TV  confused  confused  confused  confused 

A350



Photography - the art of observing, not the art of arranging
User currently offlineRoseFlyer From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 9810 posts, RR: 52
Reply 20, posted (9 years 1 month 1 week 14 hours ago) and read 3374 times:

Quoting A350 (Reply 19):
Perhaps LH takes their passengers for adult enough to spend a day without TV

Hey there, I consider myself an adult, yet somehow I cannot go through an 8 hour daylight flight doing "adult" activities such as read and whatnot. Movies help pass the time, and it is nice to be able to choose what you want as well as get a good view without straining your neck. From my own experience, I have seen plenty of people from all different demographics use and enjoy PTVs on flights. It isn't a case of whether or not people want the PTVs it is a question of whether or not the cost is worth it and can generate enough extra revenue to cover the cost.

I actually am the type of person that would go for a UA codeshare (on a 767 or 777) rather than fly LH in economy (though it can be a tossup in the premium cabins).



If you have never designed an airplane part before, let the real designers do the work!
User currently offlineDABTH From Germany, joined Aug 2005, 66 posts, RR: 0
Reply 21, posted (9 years 1 month 1 week 10 hours ago) and read 3251 times:

Quoting RoseFlyer (Reply 20):
I actually am the type of person that would go for a UA codeshare (on a 767 or 777) rather than fly LH in economy (though it can be a tossup in the premium cabins).

The same as I do! Always looking for an opportunity to fly codeshare (e.g in the Star network) to get my miles but not have to sit in the terrible LH eco cabin WITHOUT PTVs. But ok, LT is even worse...


User currently offlineBjornstrom From Australia, joined Jun 2005, 329 posts, RR: 1
Reply 22, posted (9 years 1 month 1 week 9 hours ago) and read 3225 times:

I have flown a lot with LH FRA-MIA, FRA-ATL and FRA-JFK. Economy class provides good basic service on this reliable airline. I does lack those small things that SQ provides for their economy passengers.

Lately I've done SQ25/26 on FRA-JFK to get my own AVOD TV and that extra attention from FA's - pricing is about the same.



Eurobonus Gold | BMI Gold | http://my.flightmemory.com/bjornstrom/
User currently offlineCrazyHorse From Austria, joined Nov 2005, 328 posts, RR: 0
Reply 23, posted (9 years 1 month 1 week 9 hours ago) and read 3200 times:

Quoting A350 (Reply 19):
Perhaps LH takes their passengers for adult enough to spend a day without TV

LH also have children on his flights, what is with this pax?

Not every pax could read 10 hours a book or newspaper, a PTV to pass the time on a long time is a great thing, a LH made a big mistake, when they decide to install no PTV on their long haul fleet.


User currently offlineLcagmdeleven From Germany, joined Dec 2003, 19 posts, RR: 0
Reply 24, posted (9 years 1 month 1 week 9 hours ago) and read 3180 times:

Hello,

this is the 1000th thread about the same topic ! Meanwhile I stopped reading those stupid replies by Sabena332 (what a strange name without connection to aviation) and others (mainly from this country), who have nothing else to do than complain about one of the best and most profitables airlines in the world.

LH is much more innovative than others, please see the BBJ, Internet onboard, 1st Class Terminal in FRA and MUC, etc.

LH is successful, reliable, has a young fleet, well trained and motivated people and is profitable and without debts.

Beside, it's a great place to work at ! Even after 9/11 not thousands of people were layed-off. OK, we stored some aircraft, did not get pay increase for 2 years but everybody was kept onboard. Please look at what happened at i e BA and all North American airlines.

BTW : To my knowledge it's not yet decided wthether the A380 will be equipped with PTV in Eco or not. As stated in an earlier reply, they need maintanance and the weight has to be considered as well. We prefer to transport cargo instead of dead weight.

Regards
Uwe


25 Post contains images NoUFO : Shouldn't come as surprise, premium passengers pay premium fares. True, LH has always been innovative: Car service, check in, Internet, business jet
26 Airevents : I agree in saying that a moderator should moderate himself a bit. It has been so many threads now where I was able to read Sabena332s comments on LH.
27 DABTH : I flew LH many times. There is no doubt it is one of the most profitable airline in the world. I also agree they have an excellent first and business
28 Post contains images Pa101 : Well, do your work for Lufty or how come, you seem to get such a great experience other's obviosly don't??? Oh - yes you do! What a surprise... Well,
29 Jush : Don't they have a right to do that. Business pays around 3 times more and brings the money (+ First if they have it). Economy is no money cow , is it
30 Post contains images Stratofish : The real problem are the stupid German flying public. They fly LH (espc. on long-haul) no matter what, paying high fares and "enjoying" a sub-standard
31 Airbus3801 : I see nothing wrong with Sabena's remarks. Last time I checked, I think a moderator is allowed to join a discussion and voice his opinion whether you
32 JetMaster : How's a username relevant to this thread? People complain about their Eco product and not about profits - and that's absolutely justified. And IMO, "
33 MarshalN : Yeah, they have Private Jets and all that, but I don't care. Does it matter to the average flying public whether LH is innovative in the high end stu
34 Post contains images Sabena332 : Easy solution: Hit the suggest deletion button, mark the "Double / Topic discussed to death" field, type in your username and your password and hit t
35 Post contains images MarshalN : My reaction exactly Someone needs to study up their airline business history
36 SU : Being LH Senator for several years now, always avoided LH metal (although flying out of SVO, LH offers the best connections to anywhere). Flying to US
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