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Boeing Officially Launches 747-8 Family  
User currently offlineTrvlr From United States of America, joined Feb 2000, 4430 posts, RR: 21
Posted (8 years 8 months 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 27127 times:

Just saw this on the newswires. Not sure if it has been posted already. Includes launch info for passenger version as well.

Aaron G.

Boeing Launches New 747-8 Family
Tuesday November 15, 2:02 am ET
-- Cargolux and Nippon Cargo to buy up to 34 aircraft
-- 787 technologies to increase passenger and freighter capabilities, improve fuel efficiency, reduce noise and emissions, provide unmatched operating economics

SEATTLE, Nov. 15 /PRNewswire-FirstCall/ -- The Boeing Company (NYSE: BA - News) today officially launched the new Boeing 747-8 program, which includes the 747-8 Intercontinental passenger airplane and the 747-8 Freighter airplane.

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Cargolux, based in Luxembourg, has ordered 10 747-8 Freighters and will take delivery of the first 747-8F in third-quarter 2009. It also holds purchase rights for 10 additional airplanes. Cargolux currently operates an all-Boeing fleet of 13 747-400 freighters.

Nippon Cargo Airlines, based in Japan, has ordered eight 747-8 Freighters and will receive its first airplane in fourth-quarter 2009. The airline also acquired options for six additional airplanes. Nippon Cargo currently operates 13 747 freighters and has six more 747-400Fs on order.

Firm orders from the two launch customers are valued at approximately $5 billion at list prices.

"We are thrilled to have Cargolux and Nippon Cargo choose the new 747-8 and become the launch customers for this next generation of the proud and valuable 747 airplane family," said Alan Mulally, president and chief executive officer, Boeing Commercial Airplanes. "The 747-8 will use the technologies of the 787 Dreamliner to significantly increase the passenger and freighter capabilities of the 747 and offer greater fuel efficiency, improved operating economics, and be more friendly to the environment with reduced noise and emissions."

Both versions of the new 747 will feature GE's 787-technology GEnx engines, meet Stage 4 and QC2 noise requirements, have reduced emissions, offer lower trip costs and have an upgraded flight deck and an improved wing.

"The 747-8 Freighter will be very important in allowing Nippon Cargo to take advantage of the high expected cargo market growth in Asia," said Takuro Uchiyama, president and CEO, Nippon Cargo Airlines. "In addition, the 747-8 Freighter will be the world's most efficient cargo airplane, which is a key attribute with today's high cost of fuel."

Ulrich Ogiermann, president and CEO, Cargolux Airlines, said, "The Boeing 747-400 Freighter has been a cornerstone of our success, and I have high expectations that the 747-8 Freighter will build on that success and expand our capabilities worldwide. The increased payload capacity and much improved efficiency will allow us to continue our expansion and maximize our profitability. Equally important to us and the communities where we operate is the new standard the 747-8 Freighter will set in noise reduction."

The 747-8 Intercontinental passenger airplane will be stretched 3.6 m (11.7 ft) compared to the 747-400 to accommodate 34 additional seats in a typical three-class configuration. The only jetliner in the 400- to 500-seat category, it will have a range of 14,815 km (8,000 nmi) and will feature the new Boeing Signature Interior.

The Intercontinental will be quieter, produce fewer emissions, and achieve better fuel economy than any competing jetliner. It will offer 21 percent more lower-hold revenue cargo volume than the 747-400 and cost about 8 percent less per seat mile to operate. Compared to the A380, it will offer 22 percent lower trip costs.

The 747-8 Freighter will be 5.6 m (18.3 ft) longer than the 747-400 freighter. With a total payload capacity of 140 metric tonnes (154 tons), including tare weight, the 747-8F provides 16 percent more cargo revenue volume than the -400. The additional 117m(3) (4,124 ft(3)) from the longer fuselage offers space for four additional main-deck pallets, two additional lower-hold pallets and two additional lower-hold containers. Cargo can be loaded and unloaded on the 747-8F using both the nose and side doors for maximum speed and efficiency.

Compared to the A380, the 747-8F will offer 20 percent lower trip costs. In addition, the 747-8F will maintain the operational flexibility of today's 747 freighters, with good profit potential at less-than-full loads.

The 747-8 Freighter complements the existing 747-400 freighter family, which is the air-cargo industry's standard. Both models accommodate 3.1-meter (10-foot) high pallets, providing operators with maximum flexibility.

The 747-8 also fits easily in today's aviation infrastructure, flying into more than 210 airports worldwide without additional, expensive infrastructure changes required.

The 747 freighter family currently constitutes more than half of the world's total freighter capacity. Boeing freighters of all models comprise more than 90 percent of the total worldwide freighter lift.

Boeing forecasts the need for about 900 airplanes -- passengers and freighters -- in the 400-plus-seat segment over the next 20 years. Boeing also forecasts that large widebody freighters (65 metric tons and above in capacity) will comprise 34 percent of the freighter market by 2024.

218 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offline707lvr From United States of America, joined Jun 2004, 582 posts, RR: 2
Reply 1, posted (8 years 8 months 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 27108 times:

It's on their site now. Heckuva time to announce it.

User currently offlineTrvlr From United States of America, joined Feb 2000, 4430 posts, RR: 21
Reply 2, posted (8 years 8 months 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 27068 times:

Quoting 707lvr (Reply 1):
It's on their site now. Heckuva time to announce it.

Yeah, isn't it like 11pm in Seattle? I'm in Paris and I just got up.

Aaron G.


User currently offlineIwok From Sweden, joined Jan 2005, 1107 posts, RR: 0
Reply 3, posted (8 years 8 months 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 27044 times:

Just saw it too. Great friggin news! I've been waiting for six months now!

iwok


User currently offlineGQfluffy From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 4, posted (8 years 8 months 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 27036 times:

Wow. That is really something. Congrats to Boeing and the aviation industry and enthusiasts. Here's to a bunch of threads picking that poor plane and it's operators apart...  champagne 

User currently offlineIwok From Sweden, joined Jan 2005, 1107 posts, RR: 0
Reply 5, posted (8 years 8 months 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 27005 times:

Yep, its official.



http://747.newairplane.com/

-iwok


User currently offlineSA7700 From South Africa, joined Dec 2003, 3431 posts, RR: 26
Reply 6, posted (8 years 8 months 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 26994 times:
AIRLINERS.NET CREW
HEAD MODERATOR

Wonderful news! Congratulations Boeing!  bouncy 


Rgds

SA7700



When you are doing stuff that nobody has done before, there is no manual – Kevin McCloud (Grand Designs)
User currently offlineCrazyHorse From Austria, joined Nov 2005, 328 posts, RR: 0
Reply 7, posted (8 years 8 months 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 26994 times:

Great news, I hope the 747-800 Family will become many order in the near future.
When the first pax airline will order this aircraft?
Manuel


User currently offlineScotron11 From United Kingdom, joined Feb 2004, 1178 posts, RR: 3
Reply 8, posted (8 years 8 months 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 26983 times:

Quoting Iwok (Reply 3):

I've been waiting 6 years! Way to go Boeing!


User currently offlineMexicana757 From United States of America, joined Apr 2001, 3028 posts, RR: 29
Reply 9, posted (8 years 8 months 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 26922 times:

Congrats to Boeing and the cargo airlines buying the 747-8. Now to see which commercial airlines will jump and buy the passenger version, maybe ANA, JAL, UA....

Once again way to go Boeing.  spin 


User currently offline707lvr From United States of America, joined Jun 2004, 582 posts, RR: 2
Reply 10, posted (8 years 8 months 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 26919 times:

There must be some good reason for the bizarre timing, but I'll bet the local media is ticked off. Our papers will get scooped by the whole world on this one. Television doesn't really matter since Seattle TV doesn't pay much attention to Boeing, but I'm sure the papers had in-depth stories ready to go.

User currently offlineIkramerica From United States of America, joined May 2005, 21458 posts, RR: 60
Reply 11, posted (8 years 8 months 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 26893 times:

I like this line from the Press Release:

"The 747-8 also fits easily in today's aviation infrastructure, flying into more than 210 airports worldwide without additional, expensive infrastructure changes required."

Ouch.



Of all the things to worry about... the Wookie has no pants.
User currently offlineNZAA From New Zealand, joined Jul 2005, 163 posts, RR: 0
Reply 12, posted (8 years 8 months 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 26835 times:

http://www.boeing.com/news/releases/2005/q4/nr_051114h.html

Travis



Planes Piloted Tecnam P2002 JF, Cessna 172R, Cessna 152, Airbus A320
User currently offlineRedChili From Norway, joined Jul 2005, 2208 posts, RR: 4
Reply 13, posted (8 years 8 months 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 26799 times:

Wow! I'm already looking forward to flying in this plane.

Great to see that Boeing has finally realized that there is a market for two airplanes in the VLA sector!  Wink

I hope we will see many orders for pax versions of A380s and B748s in the future. I can't wait to fly them.



Top 10 airplanes: B737, T154, B747, IL96, T134, IL62, A320, MD80, B757, DC10
User currently offlineDLKAPA From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 14, posted (8 years 8 months 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 26738 times:

Quoting Trvlr (Reply 2):

Yeah, isn't it like 11pm in Seattle? I'm in Paris and I just got up.

And I'll bet you awoke to 2 headlines: "A380 wake turb far greater than expected" and "Boeing officially launches 747-8"  Wink


User currently offlineRedChili From Norway, joined Jul 2005, 2208 posts, RR: 4
Reply 15, posted (8 years 8 months 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 26716 times:

By the way, with the A380 showing signs of not being willing to cooperate with the wake turbulence, does anobody think/guess whether the 748 will have the same problems?


Top 10 airplanes: B737, T154, B747, IL96, T134, IL62, A320, MD80, B757, DC10
User currently offlineLehpron From United States of America, joined Jul 2001, 7028 posts, RR: 21
Reply 16, posted (8 years 8 months 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 26697 times:

Bad timing in the aviation industry? Never  Wink I'm guessing that this product is being aimed at people who will wake up this morning (as I am about to go to sleep).

What the media will do it compare and contrast as to why this 747 has an 800 in it and conclude in their minds: direct competitor to A388.

Looking back, I was wishing Boeing made 745x and 746x when they started them more than 10 years ago; this satisfies that wish in a way.

I think however, if this plane sells beyond anything expected, A380's market also grows but at a slower pace because of its size. Airbus is somewhat to blame for the creation of 748 by not making a A387, i.e. opening a niche in the first place. Big grin

Still, I find it odd why Boeing chose to pursue another 747; sales of which have been dropping over the years and they claim the future is in aircraft like their 787. In fact, I see an overlap in the use for both planes, so why waste the money?



The meaning of life is curiosity; we were put on this planet to explore opportunities.
User currently offlineAtmx2000 From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 4576 posts, RR: 38
Reply 17, posted (8 years 8 months 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 26633 times:

Quoting Lehpron (Reply 16):
Still, I find it odd why Boeing chose to pursue another 747; sales of which have been dropping over the years and they claim the future is in aircraft like their 787. In fact, I see an overlap in the use for both planes, so why waste the money?

Well, the freighter orders are one reason. The 787 isn't competing in that space.



ConcordeBoy is a twin supremacist!! He supports quadicide!!
User currently offlineMikkel777 From Norway, joined Oct 2002, 370 posts, RR: 1
Reply 18, posted (8 years 8 months 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 26540 times:

Quoting RedChili (Reply 15):
does anobody think/guess whether the 748 will have the same problems?

No, it will not have greater wake than a regular 744. Why? Not much heavier than 744, and more effective winglets - raked wingtips. A388 on the other hand, has winglets that does not reduce induced drag by very much. Wingtip vortices, or wake turbulence, is a byproduct of lift and spillage.


User currently offlineDLKAPA From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 19, posted (8 years 8 months 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 26517 times:

Quoting RedChili (Reply 15):
By the way, with the A380 showing signs of not being willing to cooperate with the wake turbulence, does anobody think/guess whether the 748 will have the same problems?

My guess is no. Airbus started the wing of the A380 from scratch, with no real "in the field" data to go by, just wind tunnel testing. As extensive as that can be, it still isn't the real world. Boeing on the other hand already has a wing for a plane of that size and profile, thus they already have some field data with which to analyze and improve upon.


User currently offlineAdipasqu From United States of America, joined Apr 2004, 238 posts, RR: 0
Reply 20, posted (8 years 8 months 2 days 19 hours ago) and read 26417 times:

Quoting 707lvr (Reply 10):
There must be some good reason for the bizarre timing, but I'll bet the local media is ticked off. Our papers will get scooped by the whole world on this one. Television doesn't really matter since Seattle TV doesn't pay much attention to Boeing, but I'm sure the papers had in-depth stories ready to go.

Damn it! I'm so excited that I can't go to sleep now.  bouncy  Thanks a lot Boeing!  zzz 



707 722 732 733 734 735 73G 738 739 741 742 752 753 762 763 764 D9S D10 319 320 321 M80 M82 M83 M87 M88 M90 SF3 ERJ CRJ
User currently offlineIkramerica From United States of America, joined May 2005, 21458 posts, RR: 60
Reply 21, posted (8 years 8 months 2 days 19 hours ago) and read 26354 times:

Quoting DLKAPA (Reply 19):
Boeing on the other hand already has a wing for a plane of that size and profile, thus they already have some field data with which to analyze and improve upon.

Not to mention the span has been increased by 13 feet and they are using more advanced wingtip devices on the 748 compared to the 744. The wake would hopefully be roughly the same, if not actually slightly less on the 748 vs. the 744.



Of all the things to worry about... the Wookie has no pants.
User currently offlineCarpethead From Japan, joined Aug 2004, 2939 posts, RR: 3
Reply 22, posted (8 years 8 months 2 days 19 hours ago) and read 26278 times:

This was unexpected, to say the least.
This must be the minimum number of committments before such a launch for such a large aircraft. Let see if JL will order some, as they have a requirement to phase out its 747 classic fleet.

NH will not be going for the 747-8 because they have 10 773ER on order.

Hopefully, CX and other 744 operators will follow suit.

I wonder if the entire 747 airframe will be revolutionized rather a simple re-engine and fuselage stretch. Also with a wider diameter fan engine being used, is the main landing gear going to be slightly stretched? Is the fuselage going to be made of composite like the 787?
I and everybody else will definitely be interested in the new technologies being applied from the 787 R&D.


User currently offlineKeesje From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 23, posted (8 years 8 months 2 days 19 hours ago) and read 26246 times:

Congratulations to Boeing.

Hopefully w'll see 747's around for another 35 years because of this.

Hopefully some passenger announcements soon.

Will the chevrons we see at the ANC aircraft also feature the other Gen-X powered aircraft?

No winglets, no 777-300Er like wing stretch but something inbetween it seems.



User currently offlineHAWK21M From India, joined Jan 2001, 31660 posts, RR: 56
Reply 24, posted (8 years 8 months 2 days 19 hours ago) and read 26119 times:

Great news.Nice Link.
regds
MEL



Think of the brighter side!
25 Manni : This has to be the first time that an aircraft is launched with only orders for freighters. Not a very good timing, adding a customer for the passenge
26 NA : Wonderful. I can´t say more. This is the most anticipated lauch since the A380 for me.
27 UncGSO : Absolutely AWESOME!!! I knew they could do it...
28 Atmx2000 : Isn't it better that Boeing launch the program as they said they would if they received two orders from reputable airlines, regardless of whether the
29 Raggi : Good news, although I wonder why they decided to stretch the pax version by 3.6m and the freight version by 5.6m. Why the difference? anyone know? rag
30 Manni : Spare yourself, trying to give me advice. I've taken note of the situation now, and the information that is known to the general public. What happens
31 Acidradio : Look folks, I've had a lot of beers tonight, but is this really happening? I love Boeing and I love the 747, but is this really going to work? How man
32 Ikramerica : You and A380900 should get together and order some champagne since you both seem to be celebrating the demise of an aircraft launched a few hours ago
33 Stuarts8 : What about the possibility of Air New Zealand Ordering this aircraft? I would have thought this would have suited them down to the Ground!(pardon the
34 Shamrock350 : Boeing and Airbus both say they want the A380 and 7478 to work together not against, so maybe we can hope to see both aircraft in our skys with lots o
35 Jet-lagged : Huh. I'm surprised. But happy. Congrats to Boeing and the Queen of the Skies!
36 EI321 : great news, worth the wait.
37 WINGS : I could not have not started the day better. At last the good old B747 has been given another breath of life into it. This is indeed a great day for a
38 Atmx2000 : They are just projecting, as our Belgian and French friends must be despondent about the apparent wake turbulence problems of the A380. I wonder what
39 Post contains images Ikramerica : And from EIS to EIS, it will only have taken 39 years or so to finally get a 747 stretch!
40 Manni : Ikramerica, You clearly are reading a lot more in my post than I've been writing. Answer the next 2 questions for yourself. 1. Did Boeing launch the
41 Astuteman : FWIW Baseler did state that he would "like" to see a pax customer for launch, but was honest enough to say it was unlikely. Congratulations to Boeing
42 Shenzhen : Wow... what a turn of events the last 24 months have brought. Over 40 orders this year for the 747, in addition to the 300 plus total for the 787. You
43 Post contains images VivaGunners : Yes! That was the news I was really waiting for... Thanks Boeing, long life the 747! This made my day! yep!!
44 NZ107 : Let's just hope that Air NZ will order some next month..
45 UA772IAD : Wow! Great news, and she is a sleek beauty too. You can't predict that. Boeing is probably going on the mentality that customers with large 747-400 fl
46 Post contains images Leelaw : Perhaps Queen Mother would be more tactful.
47 Post contains images Manni : I dont need to predict that. It already is a fact. The 748 was launched without a customer for the pax version.
48 Jet-lagged : What is the SkyLoft they mentioned on their site? It says it "gives airlines the option to add additional main-deck seats".
49 Danny : Even Boeing officially admits that pax version will not sell in huge numbers. For a passenger airlines the costs advantages of the A380 are to obviou
50 UA772IAD : Manni, Let me clarify, you cannot say that an aircraft's sucess is based on what market they are building for (unless that is your personal opinion).
51 Danny : Sorry to disappoint you but UA would need a bankruptcy court approval to buy new plane. Therefore it would be known already.
52 Post contains images Keesje : What are you referring to?
53 Startknob : To Boeing & our beloved 747: That's the way - aha, aha - I like it ,-)
54 Manni : UA772IAD, I'd be very very surprised if there would not be a launch customer for the passenger version in the future, I doubt it will be UA, but perha
55 Post contains links Sq212 : Don't worry Boeing is negotiating with several Asian airlines to take the new 748 passenger model. SQ is considering buying 9 CX may take 6 CI may bu
56 Art : 900 in the next 20 years according to the press release. Breakeven at < 100? That's possible if dev costs are kept down. Big day for Boeing! Annoying
57 UA772IAD : I'm not disappointed. In fact, I'm glad that its being built to begin with. However, neither Boeing nor any of the airlines have announced customers
58 Sllevin : If anything, it hints that Boeing has other orders in the pipeline and wants to give those customers the confidence to close the deals -- that the ai
59 Astuteman : I was with you completely throughout your post, until I got to this line. Don't agree at all. In fact I think the two aircraft could well be compleme
60 ClassicLover : I really hope they call it the 747-500. It annoys me with all these -8, -9, -10 versions of aircraft. Seeing them deviate from a tried and true (and l
61 Glom : Okay, here's the deal. On the 747.newairplane site, they say that seat-mile costs will be 6% lower than the A380. However, it only has 7% lower costs
62 Cricket : So, will this have a fully new wing and will it also be a composite aircraft like the 787? I assume many of the carriers which hedged their bets on la
63 Art : No. An "improved wing" is mentioned in the press release.
64 Thorben : Yes, add to that: The A380 is far better than just 8% compared to the 744. Something is wrong here, Boeing confuses efficiency numbers again. Besides
65 NA : The new 747-8 is in the middle between A380 and 773ER, a market niche sizable enough to justify it. If any such statement as above from Sq212 can be d
66 SparkingWave : I'd like to respectfully disagree. By not announcing passenger orders, there are a few objectives that can be accomplished: 1) Focus on the launch of
67 Keesje : It if you compare a 500 seat 747-8 to a 500 seat A380 the numbers will look even better for the 747-8. These numbers are not for the airlines but for
68 A319114 : Though I'm not the biggest Boeing fan, I must say I'm excited to see the 747Adv launched! More aircraft is always a good thing! And it's a beauty too,
69 Thorben : And the public/press is often dumb enough to believe it, see 777NG vs A340NG.
70 Intothinair : Great news indeed! I have one question, will the seat mile costs of the 747-800 be lower than the 777-300ER, the same or higher? After all the 777-300
71 Jet-lagged : Well, they obviously won't be selling any more planes then. Might as well close up shop and liquidate.
72 RootsAir : too bad...i preferred the name ADV oh wait and uh.... I love boeing , the 747 rockes but wait.... i really ink its bisaed when they say seat cost is 2
73 Aloges : Yay! Go 747, princess of the skies! In case you wonder, Concorde is the Queen for me.
74 Col : I wished they'd offered it with RR engines also. Only one engine supplier always makes me nervous, especially when you are trying to pick up a lot of
75 FlyingDove : Beautiful new website from Boeing... I just hope the plane looks as cool as the artists make it look in the publicity pictures! I'll bet LY will purch
76 Cascade07 : Awesome News!!! Good to see the Queen of the skies will be putting up a challenge to the A380...
77 Trex8 : wonderful news. the 747 has always been my favorite but I can't understand this -8 designation, also why not wait till Dubai and steal some of the lim
78 Ultrapig : Previous publicity indicates that the Pax version would have an extended upper deck any info on this possiblity?
79 Post contains images Emrecan : GREAT NEWS 747 will always be the queen of the skies...
80 Leelaw : Perhaps this is a prelude to further announcements at Dubai and a way to steal some of the thunder away from the A380's current Asian/Australian Tour
81 FlySSC : Forget about AF. AF will not buy any more B744, of any kind.
82 Post contains images Vfw614 : It is fascinating to see how Boeing, by constant improvements of the initial design, is able to keep aicraft designs like the B737 and B747 alive - de
83 LTBEWR : There was another thread questioning the possibiltity of the 747Advanced. Guess we have the answer now! Still, will there be enough orders to cover th
84 Brentnal : Been a member for awhile but this is defianly worth a first post. Congrats. to Boeing on new 747 "official" plans!
85 Post contains images A350 : Congratulations to Boeing! It's no coincidence that the two orders are for freighters. The 747 offers nose door loading what the A380 doesn't offer. F
86 Leelaw : What has been the negative impact?
87 TR : I wonder the same. My best guess is that the 5.6m freighter stretch is adjusted to be in line with cargo pallet dimensions. Since the passenger versi
88 Kappel : Maybe because of the 8000 nm range? Has been done before. (b788)
89 Revelation : Great list, and I'll add that the B747-8 can use existing airport taxiway and loading infrastructure, whereas its larger competitor has some (solvabl
90 ChrisM001 : I understand that it is to do with making sure the 747-8 pax version is efficient on the pacific routes where a lot of the potential customers are, t
91 USAF336TFS : The 747 will always be the Queen of the Skies, IMHO. Congradualations to Boeing and the Launch Customers. So, who's going to order next people? I thin
92 NA : This new freighter 747 might well see production until 2020 and beyond. That sounds like a new world record in production time for a certain aircraft
93 CM767 : No they have not, Boeing said from the beginning that the market was too small to justify investment in a new plane, being a derivative the 747-8 wil
94 Longhaulheavy : She's looks beautiful. Great news from Boeing! Oooh...ouch.
95 Post contains images BoogyJay : Boeing came out with these streches probably because they were the most suitable ones when increasing the efficiency. A smaller strech would have bee
96 RJ111 : It'll be good to see the old girl in the skies for years to come.[Edited 2005-11-15 14:54:10]
97 Mikefly562 : Way to go Boeing...congratulations! The 747 has always been my favorite aircraft since I was very young. I still remember how excited I got at a young
98 Columbia107 : Great news! Long live the Queen of the Skies. Wow those wing tips. Mind you I question whether the end product will be the same.
99 Post contains images Mark_D. : Yay, it looks like Boeing's reconsidered, all things considered Although from that (Eurorave-music-highlighted) 747.newairplane.com site it seems it'l
100 Post contains links MauriceB : check out http://747.newairplane.com/ and then go to versatility, they are really comparing it to the A380... and what a painfull picture that is... s
101 BoogyJay : Of course they are. The B747-8 and the A388 are competing, whatever people say here. Although there are not exactly similar (what would be the point
102 RayChuang : I think the reason why Cargolux and Nippon Cargo Airlines chose the 747-8F is simple: it can handle lengthwise outsized cargo that cannot be handled b
103 Trent900 : Thats because its not much bigger then a 744. All the changes for this sized aircraft where made in the 60's. It'll be nice to see both the 748 and 3
104 N79969 : No they are not truly competing. The A380 offers a capability that it alone can offer. There is overlap but it is relatively small. Apparently you ca
105 Manni : That's indeed a very interesting comparison, but does not reflect the reality. Just a few observations. SIN and BKK are on the A380 map, KUL is not,
106 Thorben : Yes derivatives are cheaper to develop than completely new planes. But the new ones often perform better. An intelligent discussion on this site? Tha
107 N79969 : Thorben, Got it...I did not realize that you were kidding...nice to see a sense of humor.
108 A342 : You are right. This means that Boeing forecasts a 1% advatage in seat-mile-costs for the A380 over the 744. If it really was so low, I´m quite sure
109 TinkerBelle : Great freakin' news.. Couldn't sleep last night just coz of the news.
110 Post contains images Boeing Nut : YES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! KL911, Where ever you are, remember making this post?? All I got to say is......... nya, nya, nya, nya, nya!!!!!!!
111 N328KF : Unless you are Gustav Humbert, this is abnormal.
112 Post contains images BoogyJay : depends on what you mean by "truly". As only these two airframes are available for flying 450+ "manufacturer-wise" passengers, if one needs these cap
113 GeorgiaAME : Weird looking wings! But considering that the initial 787 illustrations look nothing like the modified 767 profile Boeing is building, we can only won
114 N79969 : BoogyJay, Thank you for the thoughtful reply. I certainly agree that for some carriers- there will be overlap between the 748 and 380 as you define th
115 Post contains images BoogyJay : Wait a minute, I don't want to go too much off-topic, but you don't seriously think what you wrote, do you? Spot on! As the Singaporian saying says:
116 PHXinterrupted : Why don't you also mention the people here (primarily europeans) who also said the 747ADV would never get launched. It's a two-way street, pal.
117 N328KF : 25 × $125mil = $3,125mil (A350, and yes, I know the A359 is more) 18 × $200mil = $3,600mil (747-8)
118 DAYflyer : I can hear the Airbus pundits now: "There are no passenger orders for this airplane." Just wait and see....... Congrats, Boeing. There will be pax ord
119 Post contains images MIAMIx707 : I was wondering the same thing lol ..and if it wasnt' for Airbus, it's very possible 3 or 4 other companies might still be around making and selling
120 ODwyerPW : the -8 is a clever designation. A -9 is always a possibility. Let the speculation begin. All kidding aside. It's good news. Surely there are some 743
121 Post contains images BoogyJay : First, Vfw614 made a totally valid point stating two VERY comparable situations. The believes of some A.netters seems to be biased, as they state a c
122 FlyingRPh : Even if there is only a 6% cost savings over the 744, wouldn't the need not to have a separate type rating, commonality with the 744's and engines si
123 Zvezda : Sorry, we just don't know that yet. There may be as yet unannounced launch orders for the passenger variant. Breakeven is expected to be fewer than 5
124 BlueSky1976 : Congratulations to Boeing. I have to be honest - I never liked the looks of 747, except for 747-500X/-600X, but I'm quite impressed with what Boeing h
125 Brilondon : You think that it was not done intentionally. Paris? France? Where they build the A380?
126 Post contains images AA777 : WOO HOO!!! CONGRATS TO BOEING, CARGOLUX, AND ANA. I hope to see some more orders for it soon, Esp the Pax version.... BA -AA777
127 747LUVR : This is just great news....VERY VERY happy today! Thanks Boeing. Like they say....If it ain't Boeing, I ain't Going!
128 JBirdAV8r : Not to get off topic, is there maybe a slight avionics upgrade in store? On the ND, I see what appears to be some sort of profile view of the planned
129 N328KF : Interesting that ANA/NCA have been launch customers of Boeing's last two aircraft. Those two related companies in particular, and Japan, Inc., as a wh
130 Post contains images BoogyJay : Well spotted! Yup Looks cool. It would be nice to change the colour now: while I find the Airbus blue a bit too unprofessional, this baby poo brown i
131 B2707SST : By my count, this is the fourth time Boeing has tried to launch an "Advanced" 747 (747-500/600X, 747X/Stretch, 747-400XQLR, 747-800), not to mention
132 N79969 : This is not accurate. NCA and ANA are no longer affiliated at the corporate level. ANA sold its stake of NCA to a company called NYK.
133 Post contains images Slarty : Which old queen? Queen Elizabeth or Elton John?
134 PHLBOS : In short, the 747-8 will still be a Group V aircraft (which most major airports are designed for in terms of taxiway/runway spacings, etc.) as oppose
135 Jaysit : Where is the 11.5 foot plug? Aft of the wing box?
136 Post contains images BoogyJay : Good point B2707SST. Could you please read my thoughts and tell me your opinion on these: - Some of the programs you mentionned were expensive (right
137 United787 : Awesome news! But why the 747-8. Can't they stick to tradition and go with the 747-500? I can't believe the entire aviation industry is naming its pla
138 Spacecadet : I'm sure we'll see some orders from Asian airlines pretty soon - it's been painfully obvious that some of the larger Asian airlines operating high den
139 Tod : New wing according to the boys and girls designing it in Everett. Yeah! Not necessarily. With both a nose and aft side cargo door, the 748F will faci
140 Glom : That'll be expensive.
141 Ken777 : It's a good day for Boeing and all that love the 747. I'm not worried about the pax version - Boeing said it would go with the 747ADV when it had 2 or
142 Post contains images AmericanB763ER : Couldn't agree more... I remember stories about Boeing predicting the same thing for the 747's future somewhere in the 60's. Back then it wasn't supp
143 Aerobalance : Says who?
144 IRelayer : Great news! The Queen of the Skies is reborn! -IR
145 Post contains images Ikramerica : I think so. It has a low break even. It is mainly intended as a LONG TERM freight platform, but will offer 400-500 seat capacity for a few years at a
146 Slider : I for one am very excited that the 747 will be continued and improved upon. I don't think the above point can be stressed enough. Even if you assume
147 N79969 : True...but it will be far cheaper than R&D cost that needs to be amortized across A380 sales.
148 BoomBoom : " target=_blank>http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/htm....html One of the advantages of bleedless engines is you can eliminate a lot of duct work which
149 Post contains images Singaporegirl : the skylite concept sound bloody brilliant! does anyone have photos of it? sq is going to order 15 748s next month, although rumour has it that we're
150 Singel09 : As KLM Needs to replace their 747 fleet, especially the combi's due to new legislation, are they are likely early customer for the passenger version?
151 Post contains images Tod : That not a bad thing if you're on the recieving end of Boeing's spending. Tod
152 Darrenthe747 : what exactly do you do for a living? based on your quote you say you are an aviation enthusiast. Why the hell would you make such a bols statement if
153 Post contains images YULWinterSkies : So we would have airlines operating the Whale and the Queen together. Too nice to be true actually!!!!! Oh, well they are still having in Australia.
154 Vfw614 : It is called monopoly pricing. You charge more for products for which you have a monopoly to be able to sell products for which you have competition
155 Freedom4all : YES!! what great news, i have been waiting so long for this, i can't wait to see that bird fly!. hopefully now that it is offically launched we will s
156 Leelaw : Will the reality of the B748 cause the price/margins of the A380 to decline?
157 Areopagus : What's new is the flaps and wingtip extensions. Boeing had once contemplated relofting the airfoil shape for the 747X, but it's not happening for thi
158 707lvr : Sorry if this came up; I only read 90 entries. PRICE. The A-380 will have to put over $50 million per plane to development costs in order to break eve
159 Areopagus : Note that in Boeing's latest 747-380 comparison (the 747-8 news release), they claim: Compared to the A380, it will offer 22 percent lower trip costs
160 Tockeyhockey : as far as i can tell, there are no pax versions on order yet? i'm sure that this is a bit of a disapointment for boeing. although, my uneducated opini
161 Astuteman : Just an opinion - I think B748 will affect A380 sales more than margin. Operators wanting "big" jets that are more efficient, rather than a jump in c
162 Darrenthe747 : Thorben, you amaze me.
163 Vfw614 : Well, if one believes Boeing, yes, as they are comparing both in every second sentence of their press releases. Boeing talks about a 450+ seats marke
164 Post contains images SthPacific787 : Great news! Like a lot of others, this has made my day too. I now cannot wait for the orders from this part of the world to flow in. Now, let's see...
165 Leelaw : According to the WSJ Alan Mullaly made this statement in London today: "...Mr. Mulally said Boeing is aiming to capture more than 50% of this market,
166 Tod : I can't speak to a complete relofting of the entire wing, but in addition to new flaps and the ends of the wing, I've been told that the structure an
167 Post contains images Korg747 : I'm so happy that the 747s are back! Now things will just get more interesting between the 747s and A380s..lol no more orders with no competition at t
168 FlyingHippo : So that's the rumour? SQ will order 15 748Fs?? Wonder if SQ will exercise their A380 options. Great news for Boeing on the launch, congrats!
169 LFutia : Congrats to Boeing! I like the design of the wing and i'm damn glad to see the 747's come back. Now... i'm really looking forward to seeing who's gonn
170 Stuckinmaf : Truly beautiful, that plane is poetry in motion! Looking at the A380 next to the 747-8 will be like $h1t next to ice cream!
171 Post contains images Glideslope : Outstanding!!! Here we go. The key component of the above quote, " with good profit potential at less than full loads." The 380 will need to be fille
172 DavidT : I haven't read the latter half of this thread, but is it just me is is this ANOTHER aircraft that prominently features '8'? In 10 years time.. "Boeing
173 A342 : Thanks for the extremely friendly answer... When I visited the site, I could only see the pax model range. It is not. But have a look at replies 61,
174 USAF336TFS : I agree with the above posts about this particular 747 being a beautiful aircraft. It sure is. The ranked wingtips really make the Ol' Girl look fabul
175 N60659 : For those of us who remember the original 747-500 proposal, the 747-8 is just better as it provides the aircraft with its own identity. It's been sev
176 RCS763AV : Great news! Many 747-400s will be in need of replacement by 2010 (BA, NW, GA examples) and the plane sure has a big market to conquer...
177 Mymorningsong : From Randy's blog... "So, why call it 747-8 and not 747-500, or -600, or something like that? The simple answer is we decided on -8 because of the co
178 Singaporegirl : yes that's the rumour that's been floating around here. so for pax a/c the a380s will be our new flagship, and the b748s would be for sia cargo.
179 Post contains images Deltaamtrak058 : WOW! Go Boeing! I've been waiting for this day for some time now! Boeing even says that the 748 is 12% in its fuel efficiency than the A380...Oh....ar
180 Ikramerica : It's been 900 for a while. 900 TOTAL large aircraft which include large freighters and 450+ pax planes. THe split is projected to be about 50/50 max
181 Post contains images A388 : Great news!!!! I read the press release at 04:00AM, can you imagine! I'll really happy to see Boeing going forward with a 747NG. When I first read the
182 UALophile : I bet that United, as soon as praticably possible, will order both 748 pax and 787's --- even if it's just a few of each, to show that it has emerged
183 Post contains links and images CCA : I've just flown this beast from MAN-BRU-DXB and find out this has happened! View Large View MediumPhoto © Steve Brimley Well if they are calling
184 Aither : LOL The airport comparison 747/A380 They're really not ashamed : Aparently the A380 cannot land in Paris, not in Beijing and so on... While the 747...
185 Lumberton : Also from Mr. Baseler's article: This is pretty unambiguous.... The LOWEST! That's a strong statement to make. And, yes, it includes comparisions with
186 Post contains images RedChili : I think Thai should order some 748s as soon as possible. I think they harbor a dream of having every single widebody in their fleet... More seriously,
187 Post contains links and images Manni : Your faith in United is truly one with pasion. Jal announced yesterday that they will start retiting up to 30 747 and that these beasts wont be repla
188 JetBlue : The new 747-8 looks fantastic! I'm hoping it will have 777-style windows, or better yet (I'm dreaming) windows from the 787. jetBlue
189 EnviroTO : Unless they go 787 style composite it will be harder to sell a passenger variant. The improvements between the 767 and 787 are night and day. The impr
190 BoomBoom : I had read $1.5 billion; I wish I could find the article.
191 Stitch : There are hundreds of 744s, 743s, and 742s that will need replacement down the road. Many of those routes will need more capacity, which bodes well fo
192 Max Q : The best news possible in a world of mostly boring aircraft. The finest subsonic passenger aircraft ever made lives on, just shows how right Boeing go
193 WhiteHatter : are you completely clueless? There's too much numbercrunching by armchair CEOs done here. Southwest have consistently shown that you don't need to ta
194 Post contains images Lumberton : You've opined this on at least two threads. Time will tell.... Another view might be that they are revising their breakeven figures on the A380 progr
195 BG777300ER : It says on the web site that they chose it because of the 748's close connections to the 787's in terms of technology used.
196 Leelaw : Has it hurt them with the 773ER/772LR? Didn't Airbus make the same single engine choice with the A345/A346 (RR Trent), as well as the A342/3 (CFM56)?
197 Post contains images BG777300ER : This isn't that related, but does anyone know what song that is or is it just a mix?
198 Lightsaber : 1st: where is ConcordeBoy? The "hunchback of Pueget sound" has new life! I'm guessing it was the press deadline for the Wall Street Journal and the ea
199 Atmx2000 : Perhaps they should focus on making their JFK route profitable. I suspect that is a rather small gamble for Boeing, one for which they will need well
200 Post contains images Ikramerica : well, it's important for diversions, and with the ETOPS changing to include all jet types for diversion purposes, the 747 still has that edge. but it
201 SunriseValley : Thorben and others, go back to the thread "Boeing nears 747adv launch decision" and read some of Widebodyphotogs postings. I will quote from two of t
202 Post contains links Zeke : In another thread I have discussed the figures he has used in detail, the SFC is not a SFC, it is a TSFC which bears little relevance to the actual.
203 Stitch : WN also relies on quick turns and short-hops, which isn't possible with intercontinental travel. We shall see. They seem to have definitely hurt the
204 787 : Boeing 67.00 up +0.77 (+1.16%) Good companies always survive competition. Another winner for Boeing.
205 PlaneDane : Actually, there's been no change of heart or lost credibility. The 748I will still come up short on seating capacity to qualify for the VLA category.
206 Scarebus03 : Wahey! Congrats to Boeing! I have worked for many years on 747's and truly believe they are the best airliners ever built. I am beginning to think Boe
207 A342 : Again, pronounciation was "when I had a look...". I could not find it, maybe you did later. And why is my whole post negative ? Could you explain ple
208 Numbertwelve : Wow, this painted plane looks great - hopefully it will look so in real. We saw how the 787 changed already and plane isn't in production yet. Anyway:
209 Post contains links Liedetectors : I believe the information about the project's launch was provided by me in August. RE: Is The 747ADV Still Going? (by Liedetectors Aug 12 2005 in Civi
210 Post contains images Astuteman : Sounds like a win-win, doesn't it. SIA must be made of money to want to invest in the "much higher CASM" for the pax planes
211 SunriseValley : To set the record straight; this was not my statement, it was a quote from a posting by Widebodyphotog.
212 BG777300ER : Wow, did you not read the web site or my previous post. It is because it has so much in common with the 787 (emphasis on the 8 in 7 8 7). I'm not try
213 Ozglobal : I've nothing against the introduction of the 747-800 and will happily fly it. 747 is a great aircraft. The passenger capacity of 800 in standard confi
214 Post contains links RedChili : I depends upon what your opinion is of a VLA. Boeing claims that the 747 is a VLA. "Very large airplanes, 747-size and greater, will account for only
215 Post contains links Widebodyphotog : They were my remarks and I will stand by them, extend and clarify... With the exception of the A340-500 and A340-200 the A380 has the highest specifi
216 F14D4ever : Thanks for yet another very nice tabulation ... but there's an error in your conversion of 747-8 fuselage length and cabin width from metric to Engli
217 Trex8 : great they are finally back to the level they were at in 2000!
218 Dougloid : Not to rain on your parade but what you're feeling is your own remorse because you took everyone's propaganda literally-including that emanating from
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