Sponsor Message:
Civil Aviation Forum
My Starred Topics | Profile | New Topic | Forum Index | Help | Search 
If Lockheed Was Still In The Airliner Business!  
User currently offlineZippyjet From United States of America, joined Sep 2001, 5478 posts, RR: 12
Posted (8 years 10 months 1 week 21 hours ago) and read 4865 times:

If this has been covered sorry, please don't flame me out!

RoseFlyer excellent thread on the L-1011 at 35 got me to thinking...
What if Lockheed was still in the commercial airliner business? Some of my thoughts though they may be way off course:


  • Of course, there would be like a 4th. Or 5th. Generation L-1011 probably with engines from another vendor. And, the latest version would expand on the originals lower level concept (galley) and have of course food and beverage facilities, seating, crew rest, showers, and whatever else you can imagine for a jumbo uber bird. Of course to go head on with the 380 and the
    747-8.
  • HSCT would be closer to reality than with no Lockheed (commercial aviation)
  • Of course Lockheed would come out with the obligatory twin engine 120
    seater to go mano omato with the A-320 and venerable 727.
  • An intermediate sized plane to compete with the 757.
  • Depending on market needs, Lockheed may have developed a wide body
    ETOPS twin.
Would have pursued the UDF/propfan. Originally, back in the 70's
I first read about the UDF concept being developed by Lockheed. I can't cite the source but I explicit remember:
"This airliner could efficiently fly the busy New York-Miami route in the same 2 to 2.5 hour time frame as a conventional jet with a miniscule amount of added noise.


I'm Zippyjet & I approve of this message!
12 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineOPNLguy From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 1, posted (8 years 10 months 1 week 21 hours ago) and read 4842 times:

>>>If Lockheed Was Still In The Airliner Business!

If they were, I think you could be absolutely assured of two things:

- They'd make one hell of an advanced aircraft,

- The number of threads on airliners.net would increase, since you'd then have the usual A vs. B, and then A vs. L, and B vs. L.


User currently offlineColumba From Germany, joined Dec 2004, 7063 posts, RR: 4
Reply 2, posted (8 years 10 months 1 week 20 hours ago) and read 4816 times:

If Lockheed would have survived McDonnel Douglas would have left the scene much earlier.
I could also imagine a twin engined L1011 as a 767/777 counterpart and a smaller A320/737 sized aircraft. Maybe they would have turned the C 5 Galaxy into a civillian plane as they planned.
How are the chances that they will produce a civialian aircraft again, maybe a regional aircraft ?



It will forever be a McDonnell Douglas MD 80 , Boeing MD 80 sounds so wrong
User currently offlineGreasespot From Canada, joined Apr 2004, 3084 posts, RR: 20
Reply 3, posted (8 years 10 months 1 week 19 hours ago) and read 4712 times:

Then the boards would be full of A VS B vs L threads instead of just A vs B... Smile

GS



Sometimes all you can do is look them in the eye and ask " how much did your mom drink when she was pregnant with you?"
User currently offlineBeechNut From Canada, joined Apr 2004, 726 posts, RR: 10
Reply 4, posted (8 years 10 months 1 week 17 hours ago) and read 4604 times:

How about dreaming: an SR-71 based airliner...

Eat dust Concorde!

Mike


User currently offline474218 From United States of America, joined Oct 2005, 6340 posts, RR: 9
Reply 5, posted (8 years 10 months 1 week 17 hours ago) and read 4559 times:

I would still have a job!

Quoting Columba (Reply 2):
If Lockheed would have survived McDonnel Douglas would have left the scene much earlier.
I could also imagine a twin engined L1011 as a 767/777 counterpart and a smaller A320/737 sized aircraft. Maybe they would have turned the C 5 Galaxy into a civillian plane as they planned.
How are the chances that they will produce a civialian aircraft again, maybe a regional aircraft ?

Lockheed had a family of airplanes with the L-1011-1 as the base. There was a longer fuselage version L-1011-300, a two engine design L-1011-600 a shortened fuselage L-1011-400 with de-rated RB-22-524 engines and a pure freighter. But when Rolls Royce went bankrupt, the Cheyenne was cancelled and there were cost over runs on the C-5 program, they just did not have the money to produce them. After there was a little cash flow they were able to build the L-1011-500 but it was too little too late.

Lockheed will has no plans to re-enter the commercial market. It takes billions of dollars design and build an airliner and billions more to establish the support functions required to market a commercial aircraft, and Lockheed no longer has these in place. They are satisfied to sell as many F-22's and F-35's as they can and let A and B fight it out for the civilian market.

But if and when they do decide to re-enter the commercial market it will be with the most technologically advanced airliner you will have ever seen.


User currently offlineZippyjet From United States of America, joined Sep 2001, 5478 posts, RR: 12
Reply 6, posted (8 years 10 months 1 week 16 hours ago) and read 4518 times:

Quoting 474218 (Reply 5):
There was a longer fuselage version L-1011-300, a two engine design L-1011-600 a shortened fuselage L-1011-400 with de-rated RB-22-524 engines and a pure freighter.

Any pictures of prototypes/artist's renderings on the Internet?



I'm Zippyjet & I approve of this message!
User currently offlineEGNR From United Kingdom, joined Feb 2004, 509 posts, RR: 0
Reply 7, posted (8 years 10 months 1 week 16 hours ago) and read 4489 times:

Quoting Zippyjet (Reply 6):
Any pictures of prototypes/artist's renderings on the Internet?

This ARTICLE (in German) has a couple of pics in it showing the L-1011-400 and L-1011-600. I also found a pic of an L-1011-600 display model opn the web as well:
http://aviationmodels-online.com/for_sale/page_9/L1011-600.jpg



7late7, A3latey, Sukhoi Superlate... what's going on?
User currently offlineZippyjet From United States of America, joined Sep 2001, 5478 posts, RR: 12
Reply 8, posted (8 years 10 months 1 week 16 hours ago) and read 4437 times:

Quoting EGNR (Reply 7):
This ARTICLE (in German) has a couple of pics in it showing the L-1011-400 and L-1011-600. I also found a pic of an L-1011-600 display model opn the web as well:

Thank You!


The black and white bird looks tubby and strange with the tail farther away from the tail cone then on other aircraft. The model in color looks like a cool design.



I'm Zippyjet & I approve of this message!
User currently offlineMalaysia From United States of America, joined Nov 1999, 3352 posts, RR: 0
Reply 9, posted (8 years 10 months 1 week 13 hours ago) and read 4338 times:

Quoting 474218 (Reply 5):
Lockheed will has no plans to re-enter the commercial market.

They would do it again if some idiot airline tycoon comes up to the office with loads of cash and requests a new commercial aircraft design or even better an L-1011 NG with Trent engines and winglets. I once played around making a super L-1011 with a 3-3-3-3 config 777 fuselage and 3 GE90 engines.



There Are Those Who Believe That There May Yet Be Other Airlines Who Even Now Fight To Survive Beyond The Heavens
User currently offline474218 From United States of America, joined Oct 2005, 6340 posts, RR: 9
Reply 10, posted (8 years 10 months 1 week 13 hours ago) and read 4321 times:

Quoting Malaysia (Reply 9):
idiot airline tycoon comes up to the office with loads of cash

I don't think there are any of those left?


User currently offlineN328KF From United States of America, joined May 2004, 6485 posts, RR: 3
Reply 11, posted (8 years 10 months 1 week 12 hours ago) and read 4297 times:

Quoting 474218 (Reply 10):
I don't think there are any of those left?

Oh, there's plenty of them, but they usually go to B or A. The last one was named Kerry Sheen.



When they call the roll in the Senate, the Senators do not know whether to answer 'Present' or 'Not guilty.' T.Roosevelt
User currently offlineMax Q From United States of America, joined May 2001, 4524 posts, RR: 18
Reply 12, posted (8 years 10 months 1 week 12 hours ago) and read 4271 times:

An L1011 stretch would have been a beautiful aircraft.


The best contribution to safety is a competent Pilot.
Top Of Page
Forum Index

This topic is archived and can not be replied to any more.

Printer friendly format

Similar topics:More similar topics...
ORD Back In The Slot Business posted Fri Aug 25 2006 07:25:23 by MasseyBrown
What If DFW Was Still A DL Hub posted Mon Jul 24 2006 21:19:34 by Belizexp
If It Was'nt For The A320 Where Would Airbus Be posted Tue Jun 27 2006 14:32:01 by Malb777
Media Errors In The Aviation Business... posted Sun Nov 13 2005 08:18:06 by KhenleyDIA
2003 Annual Report: Boeing Still In The Black! posted Sun Apr 4 2004 05:51:04 by BCAInfoSys
Now That Westjet Is In The Acmi Business? posted Mon Sep 1 2003 05:08:49 by Alohaguy
If Lockheed Built A Competitor To The 777 posted Fri Aug 29 2003 15:40:01 by 747400sp
Classics Still In The Air posted Thu Aug 21 2003 05:02:24 by VS340
GE90-110B1 Still In The Plans? posted Sat Apr 12 2003 18:01:29 by ConcordeBoy
TWA 717's Still In The Desert? posted Mon Oct 14 2002 15:54:10 by 717fan