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TAP A350 Order Update.  
User currently offlineWINGS From Portugal, joined May 2005, 2831 posts, RR: 68
Posted (8 years 8 months 7 hours ago) and read 7309 times:

According to Diario Economico a Portuguese newspaper. Tap had placed an original order with Airbus for the acquasiton of 10x A350 + 5 options.
Its is now confirming that Tap has decided to exercise 2 of those options taking its order up to 12x A350 + 3 options.

It is also reporting that Tap as a launch customer has been abel to acquire the frames for a very reasonable price. It is believed that Tap acquired the A350 between 80-90 Million dollars. The catalogue price of the A350 is between 150-170 Million dollars.

http://www.diarioeconomico.com/edici...empresas/pt/desarrollo/595620.html

So now we have the following orders for the A350.

Qatar Airways 60
Tap Portugal 12
Tam 8
Air Europa 10
Eurofly 3
Kingfisher 5
US Airways 20
Gecas 10
CIT 5
ILFC 12
ALAFCO 12

TOTAL: 157 Order/Commitments

Regards,
Wings


Aviation Is A Passion.
86 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineFlyPEGASUS From Portugal, joined Nov 2005, 72 posts, RR: 0
Reply 1, posted (8 years 8 months 6 hours ago) and read 7161 times:

Hi WINGS,

Thanks for the article!!

About the A350:
On Monday 21st of November, TAP's CEO Mr. Fernando Pinto at an interview while at Toulouse, had already stated that TAP had 10 firm orders for A350 plus 5 options, 2 of which were already in an advanced stage of negotiation, very close to be concluded.

About the A330:
And in the article you mention, I read again about 8 A330 (3 in leasing) and not 7 as stated in Airbus homepage. Do you know why these numbers don't match? From where is that 8th A330 expected to come?

Regards,


User currently offlineCV990 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 2, posted (8 years 8 months 6 hours ago) and read 7153 times:

Hi!

Very nice news, we can clearly understand that TAP having 8 A330-200 and the 4 A340-300 until the arrival of the A350's it will replace all of them in a one-to-one basis leaving TAP with the same number of long-haul airplanes by 2015!!! I was just checking out the history of TAP long-haul fleet since the 70's and what we can see is mainly TAP had from 10 to 14 airplanes in those routes, but the number of seats offered have been increasing, and that's the main point, TAP will keep mainly the same number of airplanes but it will offer almost the double they offer now!!!
Let's take a look:

70's/80's - 12 707-300B/C + 2 747-200
80's/90's - 7 L1011-500 + 5 A310-300
90's/2005 - 6 A310-300's + 4 A340-300
2006/2013 - 8 A330-200 + 4 A340-300
2013/2015 - 12 A350

Any comments?
Regards


User currently offlineN1786b From United States of America, joined Sep 2005, 559 posts, RR: 17
Reply 3, posted (8 years 8 months 6 hours ago) and read 7124 times:

Congrats to AB and TAP.

Interesting how this went completely unnoticed....  duck 

- n1786b


Airbus pode vir a fabricar componentes em Portugal
A Airbus pode vir a fabricar em Portugal alguns dos componentes dos aviões da empresa. O anúncio foi feito pelo administrador-delegado da TAP durante a cerimónia de assinatura do contrato para a compra de aviões para a frota de longo curso da TAP.

http://www.lusomundo.net/online/econ...a/interior.asp?id_artigo=TSF165881


User currently offlinePyrex From Portugal, joined Aug 2005, 3938 posts, RR: 28
Reply 4, posted (8 years 8 months 6 hours ago) and read 7086 times:

Quoting N1786b (Reply 3):
Interesting how this went completely unnoticed....

I wouldn't get my hopes up, although EADS does own 0,65% (as in zero point sixty-five percent) of OGMA.



Read this very carefully, I shall write this only once!
User currently offlineWINGS From Portugal, joined May 2005, 2831 posts, RR: 68
Reply 5, posted (8 years 8 months 5 hours ago) and read 7027 times:

Quoting N1786b (Reply 3):
Interesting how this went completely unnoticed.... duck

- n1786b


Airbus pode vir a fabricar componentes em Portugal
A Airbus pode vir a fabricar em Portugal alguns dos componentes dos aviões da empresa. O anúncio foi feito pelo administrador-delegado da TAP durante a cerimónia de assinatura do contrato para a compra de aviões para a frota de longo curso da TAP.

Actually it didnt. I posted this article last monday.

Sorry folks only in Portuguese:
http://www.diarioeconomico.com/edici...economia/pt/desarrollo/593080.html

Regards,
Wings



Aviation Is A Passion.
User currently offlineWINGS From Portugal, joined May 2005, 2831 posts, RR: 68
Reply 6, posted (8 years 8 months 5 hours ago) and read 7015 times:

Quoting FlyPEGASUS (Reply 1):
About the A330:
And in the article you mention, I read again about 8 A330 (3 in leasing) and not 7 as stated in Airbus homepage. Do you know why these numbers don't match? From where is that 8th A330 expected to come?

Hi FlyPEGASUS,

As I understand it, Taps original order was for 10x A350 + 5 options and 7x A330 + 1 option.

I would believe that Tap has indeed excercised 2x A350 options and 1X A330.

The only confusion this whole order is giving me is the fact of those 3 leased A330. Are they going to be new build or are they going to be the (3 Ex Bluewings)

Regards,
Wings



Aviation Is A Passion.
User currently offlineA360 From Portugal, joined Jun 2005, 434 posts, RR: 8
Reply 7, posted (8 years 8 months 4 hours ago) and read 6933 times:

This is great news! Big grin

User currently offlineCV990 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 8, posted (8 years 8 months 2 hours ago) and read 6843 times:

Hi!

I noticed that if TAP get's those 3 leased A330-200's, and if those ones are the BlueWings, it will be quite disturbing for me seeing TAP flying A330-200's with TWO DIFFERENT kinds of engines (P&W and GE)... I can't believe that and I don't think Mr. Fernando Pinto who is "an aviation guy" would stand for that!!! I say this because TAP will certainly choose the GE engines for both A330-200/A350's!
Regards


User currently offlineFlyPEGASUS From Portugal, joined Nov 2005, 72 posts, RR: 0
Reply 9, posted (8 years 8 months ago) and read 6719 times:

Hi,



Quoting WINGS (Reply 6):
The only confusion this whole order is giving me is the fact of those 3 leased A330. Are they going to be new build or are they going to be the (3 Ex Bluewings)


Thanks WINGS, about the 7+1 A330 explanation!! This (+1) was new to me. About your question and has I see it is: The 7+1 A330 will be new built from wich 3 of them will be in Leasing. These ones are schedulet to arrive starting on 2007.

So what are the PW powered 3 Ex Blue Wings doing in here.
1- If I'm not mistaken one A310 (CS-TEZ) will leave TAP's fleet this december followed by two others A310 in the 1st semester of 2006 (CS-TEX and CS-TEW, please someone correct me on this).
2- At the same time we have heard that TAP needs not only more seat capacity, but also more planes, to be able to increase it's long haul flights already for 2006 (since the current fleet is already "over used");
3- And also I know TAP is recruiting new pilots and cabin crew, meaning a possible increase in flights (only possible with a bigger fleet);

So in the short term (meaning 2006) TAP will need at least 3 A330 to replace those A310 leaving the fleet, and if they whant to increase the fleet they will need further one or two more A330 (that could possibly be those already referred from Lufthansa also available). All these are PW powered, so I think these 3 or 5 A330 (2nd hand) will come has an interim solution until the arrival of those 7+1 new Built from Airbus.

Quoting CV990 (Reply 8):
it will be quite disturbing for me seeing TAP flying A330-200's with TWO DIFFERENT kinds of engines (P&W and GE)...

Yes but that will be a temporary situation since TAP desperatly need new planes and there aren't much available in the market. I think this is what will happen until these PW A330 start to be replaced by the new built ones (GE powered)

Quoting CV990 (Reply 8):
I say this because TAP will certainly choose the GE engines for both A330-200/A350's!

I Agree with you!!


One question I still have (if this scenario is true) is which planes will first leave the fleet in 2007 with the arrival of the new GE powered A330: The last 3 remaining A310 or the PW A330?

Best Regards

[Edited 2005-11-29 17:46:59]

User currently offlineCV990 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 10, posted (8 years 7 months 4 weeks 1 day 8 hours ago) and read 6527 times:

Hi!

I would expect TAP to replace the older A310-300's first and of course CS-TEZ. I think maybe TAP will keep the 2 A310-300 they painted with the new livery a bit longer just to keep the image going! That's my feeling! Regarding the arrival of the brand new A330-200 I think TAP will finnish the widrawn of the A310-300 has fast has they can and then the first ex: A330-200's will leave according to the arrival of the brand new ones!!!
Regards


User currently offlineFlyAUA From Austria, joined May 2005, 4604 posts, RR: 56
Reply 11, posted (8 years 7 months 4 weeks 1 day ago) and read 6405 times:

Quoting WINGS (Thread starter):

That's great news to hear it's finally "firm". Thanks for sharing!

That's one hell of a discount... (if my maths are not cheating me in the range of 40-53%) If I ever buy an aircraft I'll make sure I'm a launch customer Big grin



Not drinking, also isn't a solution!
User currently offlineYyz717 From Canada, joined Sep 2001, 16245 posts, RR: 56
Reply 12, posted (8 years 7 months 3 weeks 2 days 14 hours ago) and read 6223 times:

aerotransport database reports the 10x A350 order as:
6x 358
4x 359



Panam, TWA, Ansett, Eastern.......AC next? Might be good for Canada.
User currently offlineBoeingBus From United States of America, joined May 2004, 1596 posts, RR: 18
Reply 13, posted (8 years 7 months 3 weeks 2 days 13 hours ago) and read 6211 times:

Quoting Yyz717 (Reply 12):
4x 359

If this is the case, TP may very well be the launch customer. That is the first, right?



Airbus or Boeing - it's all good to me!
User currently offlineFlyPEGASUS From Portugal, joined Nov 2005, 72 posts, RR: 0
Reply 14, posted (8 years 7 months 3 weeks 2 days 5 hours ago) and read 6048 times:

Hi,

Quoting Yyz717 (Reply 12):
aerotransport database reports the 10x A350 order as:
6x 358
4x 359

Thanks for the info!

That is for the original order of 10 A350, but TAP has already decided to exercise two extra options taking the order up to 12 A350.

Does anyone knows if those 2 extra A350 will be A358 or A359?

Regards.


User currently offlineArt From United Kingdom, joined Feb 2005, 3380 posts, RR: 0
Reply 15, posted (8 years 7 months 3 weeks 2 days 4 hours ago) and read 5952 times:

Quoting N1786b (Reply 3):
A Airbus pode vir a fabricar em Portugal alguns dos componentes dos aviões da empresa. O anúncio foi feito pelo administrador-delegado da TAP durante a cerimónia de assinatura do contrato para a compra de aviões para a frota de longo curso da TAP.

OK, my Portuguese is not brilliant but something interests me here:

"Airbus could be manufacturing some of the components of the company's aircraft in Portugal. The announcement was made by the administrative delegate of TAP during the contract signing ceremony for the purchase of aircraft for TAP's long haul fleet."

Does it mean components for all A350's would be manufactured in Portugal or just components for TAP's A350's?


User currently offlineFlyPEGASUS From Portugal, joined Nov 2005, 72 posts, RR: 0
Reply 16, posted (8 years 7 months 3 weeks 2 days 3 hours ago) and read 5854 times:

Hi Art,

Your translation was very accurate.

It is not a matter of translation because in Portuguese this sentence it is not clear either.
The way it's written "...componente dos aviões da empresa (components of the company's aircraft )" can mean both Airbus or TAP.

I'll try to check this article with other source to see if we can clear this out. But for what its worth, I think it means Airbus.

Regards,


User currently offlineBoeingBus From United States of America, joined May 2004, 1596 posts, RR: 18
Reply 17, posted (8 years 7 months 3 weeks 2 days 2 hours ago) and read 5828 times:

Quoting Art (Reply 15):
Does it mean components for all A350's would be manufactured in Portugal or just components for TAP's A350's?

I bet this is the main reason why this government owned airline is buying Airbus A350. The 787 would have been a better fit for TP as a A310 replacement.

I guess you can't blame TP/government as this will create aerospace industry jobs that Portugal needs. I would have probably done the same...

The only issue is that TP may have too much 'plane' with the A350??? I guess time will tell whether they can fit 20% more seats on the A332/358 compared to the A310... I hope they don't go back to the days of over capacity with the L1011. Good luck!

Cheers,

Ric



Airbus or Boeing - it's all good to me!
User currently offlineFCKC From France, joined Nov 2004, 2348 posts, RR: 4
Reply 18, posted (8 years 7 months 3 weeks 2 days 1 hour ago) and read 5760 times:

Congratulations for TAP.

A little bit out of this topic , as mentionned above the number of A350 (firm + commiments) is 157 , and Airbus saying they will sell 200 before yearend (still 25 days) , thus 43 are still missing.
Surely Airbus when they declared that , was aware , Emirates will NOT order the plane this year.Even if EI place their order before Dec31st and perhaps SU , the right number will not be reached , so perhaps............Qantas.......
Anyway the answer will come tomorrow , when the Australian airline will say what they have chosen.



.


User currently offlineCV990 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 19, posted (8 years 7 months 3 weeks 2 days ago) and read 5689 times:

Hi!

Well, it is my understanding that TAP is receiving 8 A330-200's, so it would be quite normal that TAP would get those extra 2 A350 the model 800!!!
regards


User currently offlinePM From Germany, joined Feb 2005, 6868 posts, RR: 63
Reply 20, posted (8 years 7 months 3 weeks 1 day 23 hours ago) and read 5624 times:

Quoting BoeingBus (Reply 17):
The 787 would have been a better fit for TP as a A310 replacement.

Don't make the mistake of assuming that airlines will always replace one model with a similarly sized alternative. Airlines fly planes for many years. They buy them for one market but end up using them on others. The market changes. When they come to replace planes they have the opportunity to resize. Airlines fly seats, not aeroplanes; they measure yield, not raw capacilty.

EI replaced 747s on their transatlantic routes with A333s. SR replaced A310s on the ZRH-LHR route with A321s. SR used to fly an A310 daily to MAN from ZRH. Now LX fly three RJ100s daily. I used to fly on an SR MD81 from ZRH to BHX. Latterly, the same service has been on an ERJ-145.

When TAP (or anyone else) replace A310s they don't necessarily want or need an alternative of the same size. It might work out that way but it's also an opportunity to resize the operation to increase profitability.


User currently offlineBoomBoom From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 21, posted (8 years 7 months 3 weeks 1 day 22 hours ago) and read 5592 times:

Quoting WINGS (Thread starter):
So now we have the following orders for the A350.

Qatar Airways 60
Tap Portugal 12
Tam 8
Air Europa 10
Eurofly 3
Kingfisher 5
US Airways 20
Gecas 10
CIT 5
ILFC 12
ALAFCO 12

Why do you keep posting this list? Other than Qatar, that's a pretty sorry looking list of customers, in my opinion.


User currently offlineAmy From United Kingdom, joined Feb 2005, 1150 posts, RR: 7
Reply 22, posted (8 years 7 months 3 weeks 1 day 22 hours ago) and read 5573 times:

Quoting BoomBoom (Reply 21):

Why do you keep posting this list? Other than Qatar, that's a pretty sorry looking list of customers, in my opinion.

Why's that?

Quoting BoomBoom (Reply 21):
From United States

Oh, ok. Question answered.

157 orders/commitments for an aircraft that won't even fly for another four years or so is pretty good.



A340-300 - slow, but awesome!
User currently offlineBoomBoom From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 23, posted (8 years 7 months 3 weeks 1 day 22 hours ago) and read 5546 times:

Quoting Amy (Reply 22):
Why's that?

Where are the high profile customers?

Air Europa 10
Eurofly 3
Kingfisher 5

Sorry, I'm not impressed.

Other than Qatar, the biggest order is from US Airways and Airbus had to bribe them to take those.


User currently offlinePM From Germany, joined Feb 2005, 6868 posts, RR: 63
Reply 24, posted (8 years 7 months 3 weeks 1 day 22 hours ago) and read 5537 times:

Quoting BoomBoom (Reply 21):
Why do you keep posting this list? Other than Qatar, that's a pretty sorry looking list of customers, in my opinion.

What a bizarre thing to say. Four leasing companies - including the two big ones - is a pretty fair start. TAM is a robustly healthy airline on the up (as Varig declines). Kingfdisher is quite an unknown quantity but wh's to say it won't do what Emirates / Qatar / Etihad have done? TAP is a credible European flag carrier. Air Europa is profitable.

Is USAir a bit fragile? OK, so is NW and their order for 787s.
Air Europa? Read Blue Panorama or First Choice and the 787.
TAP is just a minor flag carrier? Read LOT and Ethiopian with the 787.

OK, Airbus still lack more than one big blue chip airline (of which Boeing now have a fair few on board the 787) but the A350 hasn't been around as long.

I'm not denigrating the 787's masterful launch and dramatic sales success any more than I'm serving as an A350 apologist. (There's no need to.) But the list is only "sorry" if that's the mind-set you bring to the debate.


25 A319XFW : High-profile nowadays doesn't matter as much as it used to.... FR wasn't high-profile when they started off, look at them now. And there are still som
26 BoomBoom : Unfortunately those big leasing companies placed little orders. When I see Wings constantly boasting with this list, I just have to smile.[Edited 200
27 Pdpsol : There is one more POTENTIAL A350 client that has not been mentioned yet: Air Madrid [IATA:NM]. Two weeks ago, a Spanish business paper, 'Gaceta Mercan
28 Post contains images PM : You mean like the 4 (count them - FOUR) 777s that ILFC ordered in the five years after the programme was launched? They've now ordered 75 777s over t
29 AirPortugal310 : Another one to jump on the US Airways bribery bandwagon....with no proof or fact to back it up.
30 Dhefty : ILFC pretty much signs up to everything Airbus offers (except for the A340-500). They are by far the largest customer for Airbus, and have been instru
31 BoomBoom : The definition of bribe from dictionary.com 1. Something, such as money or a favor, offered or given to a person in a position of trust to influence
32 A319XFW : The complicated matter is, do the 260 of US Airways/America West all belong to them, or are some leased.... Then you could probably reduce some of tha
33 BoomBoom : What do you mean by "give in"? Swap Boeing's 787 order book for Airbus' A350 order book? No way, dude!
34 PM : What I mean is, retract your silly comment about leasing companies ordering "little numbers" of the A350. As I think I've demonstrated, leasing compa
35 BoomBoom : Well as you say: Pleasant dreams...
36 Art : ILFC is in the list. What magnitude do you have to be to avoid being "a pretty sorry" customer?
37 BoomBoom : Does an ILFC order for 12 A350s have the same magnitude as an ANA 787 order for 50? Or a JAL order for 50? Or an AC order for 60?
38 CV990 : Hi! Bombom, at least TAP has not filled Chap. 11 like UA, DL, NW and US!!!! TAP might be small but our history can tell a lot about us!!! Maybe you do
39 BoomBoom : I'm sure TAP is a very nice little airline.
40 BoeingBus : 787-8 is larger than the A310, so it would have been a modest capacity increase where the 350 is a substantial increase in passengers. Not sure the c
41 CV990 : Hi! Yeah, you're right, very nice little airline that have been is the business since 1945, but I've nice big US airlines beeing down over the "sewer
42 Pyrex : No, it has a higher magnitude, as a Japanese airline ordering the 787 is pretty much granted (for reasons better left out of thsi thread about TAP).
43 Post contains images WINGS : Well BoomBoom, am contributing to the forum. I placed a list so that all members can get a better understanding into the A350 and its oders up to now
44 FlyPEGASUS : Hi! I would like to make a remark: The subject of this discussion forum was "TAP A350 ORDER UPDATE"!!!! Why, there are always some elements that "hija
45 Post contains images PM : Is Finnair another "sorry" customer?
46 BoomBoom : Finnair is a nice little airline.
47 PM : So that makes, let me see, two "nice little airlines". Gosh, if I didn't know better the word 'patronising' would come to mind.
48 CV990 : Hi! BoomBoom, you should "light a candle and worship" that little airline called TAP! Do you know why??? You look like a guy that likes Boeing, well l
49 BoomBoom : Neil, your post wasn't nice.
50 Scbriml : Yes. In the long run ILFC could easily order more than those airlines combined. ILFC is already Airbus's biggest customer.
51 Neilking : It wasn't intended to be nice. N
52 Post contains images FlyPEGASUS : Hi, WINGS, Thanks! And keep on with your contributions please!! that's what I call a classy answer to one unclassy comment!! CV990: Great post!! Being
53 PanAm_DC10 : Exactly and I for one, appreciate it. Over the past few months there have been quite a few threads, exactly like this, which have been dedicated to T
54 CV990 : Hi! I think taking in mind that TAP is going to operate 8 A330-200's until the arrival of the A350's the 2 extra ones should be also 800 version, but
55 Sebolino : I guess ILFC is a nice little company. What do you say BoomBoom ?
56 BoomBoom : I say that you're trying to bait me...
57 CV990 : Hi! Just to try to understand what's the "common ground" of BoomBoom I wonder what would be for him a "nice big company"??? Maybe them I can make is p
58 Post contains links BoomBoom : BA, LH, AF, QF, SQ... When the A350 wins a big order from one of them it will be something to crow about. BTW, total gross orders for 2005 through No
59 CV990 : Hi! Ok, I got it!!!! Those ones????? Try TAP and the you'll find out that the "nice little airline" would probably have the same type of service or ev
60 Post contains images WINGS : Thank you FlyPEGASUS and PanAm_DC10. I appreciate your kind words. I try to be useful to all members, when ever I can. How very true. We should expec
61 FlyPEGASUS : As far as I know there is no official info on that yet. Yes, by now 2 extra 800 would make sense. But IMO only the response of the market demand to t
62 BoomBoom : "Little" does not refer to the quality of the service, it referes to the size of the fleet. So are you telling us the companies that made up Airbus a
63 BestWestern : For once, I'm agreeing with BoomBoom, and yes - boeing is starting to gain back market share. Why... The 787 is a suberb offering. (Boomboom picks hi
64 Scbriml : In fairness to Airbus, this contest came at the wrong time. Today's A350 is a significantly better plane than the one that was offered to NW. Obvious
65 WINGS : I agree with you BoomBoom, that Boeing has finally woken up to the reality that Airbus was slowly becoming the undisputed leader in Aviation. Fortuna
66 WINGS : I have to disagree with you BestWestern, I believe that in Taps case the B787 would prove to be too small. Tap is becoming a major force in Latin Ame
67 EI321 : Totally agree. With some of the early 350/787 compititions, Airbus were'nt even at the races. Nobody seemed to know exactly what the 350 was going to
68 CV990 : Hi! Answering to BestWestern and using the example of TAP, the portuguese airline didn't opt for the 787 mainly because TAP couldn't wait until 2010 w
69 BoomBoom : Well, I guess the QF order shoots these theories down...
70 LPLAspotter : TAP maintance has experience with GE, RR, and P&W. I don't think it will be a porblem for them. They have an excellent reputation. LPLAspotter
71 Milan320 : I don't think so at all. Both Scbriml and Wings are right, the A350 was a more serious contender for QF - just because QF chose Boeing doesn't necess
72 BoomBoom : "The best wine came from the Airbus side," Dixon joked, "Unfortunately, [the Airbus proposal] never made the grade." How serious a contender could th
73 CV990 : Hi! Yeah, the A350 is not good enough.... so maybe you could explain what is "good enough" for you my friend!!! regards
74 BoomBoom : Good enough to win the QF order.
75 CV990 : Hi! Just that????? I was expecting something a little more heavy than that!!! Well I guess I had bigger expectations from you, I was wrong!!! Maybe on
76 Post contains images PanAm_DC10 : BoomBoom Pot, kettle, black, now what part of that do you not understand? Said it once and I've just said it again. Perhaps you'll get the message thi
77 BoomBoom : Oh yes, you guys are all paragons of virtue: Now, tell me how these comments have elevated the discussion in this thread? You guys can't handle any c
78 AirPortugal310 : PanAm That was a well written post. Very eloquent indeed.
79 CV990 : Hi! I don't know you and I actually don't want to know more than what you say in these forums! One thing I know, you like to play with people and your
80 BoomBoom : The fact of the matter is that the A350 has no BIG orders with blue chip customers yet unless you count Qatar, which is just an announcement that neg
81 CV990 : Hi! I will not lose any more words with someone that not even have a personality! At least I have, and in Portugal we only "call the bull by is name"!
82 Br343 : Hi, Please no more stupid fights, both B787 and A350 are going to be fantastic aircraft. I'm from Portugal, I like Boeing, and Airbus, but to me Embra
83 FlyPEGASUS : BoomBoom, It’s probably a waste of words, but I'll post it nevertheless: In case you haven't noticed, our interest here (of most of us at least) is
84 BoomBoom : Deleted double post. See below[Edited 2005-12-19 21:08:03]
85 BoomBoom : I made my last comment on this subject on Saturday. Now it's Monday. As far as I'm concerned this is done. If you don't want me to post in this threa
86 FlyPEGASUS : Well, If I had known it was your last comment on that, I wouldn't have risked to get back to the same old story again, believe me. Good, then as far
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