Sponsor Message:
Civil Aviation Forum
My Starred Topics | Profile | New Topic | Forum Index | Help | Search 
AA Announces Love  
User currently offlineBigGSFO From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 2951 posts, RR: 6
Posted (9 years 2 weeks 5 days 13 hours ago) and read 17072 times:

http://biz.yahoo.com/prnews/051130/daw061.html?.v=16

No schedule announced but they are securing facilites. Good for AA.

202 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlinePiercey From Sweden, joined Nov 2005, 2233 posts, RR: 1
Reply 1, posted (9 years 2 weeks 5 days 13 hours ago) and read 17043 times:

A sign? Could Wright be through the shreder?  stirthepot 


Well I believe it all is coming to an end. Oh well, I guess we are gonna pretend.
User currently offlineBrokenrecord From United States of America, joined Jul 2005, 772 posts, RR: 0
Reply 2, posted (9 years 2 weeks 5 days 13 hours ago) and read 17030 times:

Whiskey Tango Foxtrot? Over.

User currently offlineKahala777 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 3, posted (9 years 2 weeks 5 days 12 hours ago) and read 16994 times:

Quoting Brokenrecord (Reply 2):
Whiskey Tango Foxtrot? Over.

Good One!  yes 


KAHALA777


User currently offlineBrokenrecord From United States of America, joined Jul 2005, 772 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (9 years 2 weeks 5 days 12 hours ago) and read 16957 times:

Quoting Kahala777 (Reply 3):

HEHE!! The phonetic alphabet is good for something... lol


User currently offlineLuv2fly From United States of America, joined May 2003, 12150 posts, RR: 49
Reply 5, posted (9 years 2 weeks 5 days 12 hours ago) and read 16951 times:

Well this is not Legend they are fighting with this time.


You can cut the irony with a knife
User currently offlineSonOfACaptain From United States of America, joined May 2004, 1747 posts, RR: 6
Reply 6, posted (9 years 2 weeks 5 days 12 hours ago) and read 16933 times:

Quoting Brokenrecord (Reply 2):
Whiskey Tango Foxtrot?

Well, AA isn't going to hand the market over to WN on a silver platter.

-SOAC



Non Illegitimi Carborundum
User currently offlineThomasphoto60 From United States of America, joined Jan 2000, 4020 posts, RR: 26
Reply 7, posted (9 years 2 weeks 5 days 12 hours ago) and read 16895 times:

The gloves will soon come off  box .....clip the wing's of those eagles and show them no LUV!

Thomas



"Show me the Braniffs"
User currently offlineKahala777 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 8, posted (9 years 2 weeks 5 days 12 hours ago) and read 16888 times:

Perhaps AA will center routes at times that arent strong for connections at DFW such as:

DAL-Austin
DAL-Houston
DAL-Oklahoma City
DAL-New Orleans
DAL-San Antonio
DAL-Tulsa

KAHALA777


User currently offlineJr From United States of America, joined May 1999, 970 posts, RR: 6
Reply 9, posted (9 years 2 weeks 5 days 12 hours ago) and read 16861 times:

Quoting SonOfACaptain (Reply 6):
Well, AA isn't going to hand the market over to WN on a silver platter.

Nope... they are not. They are just going to get their butts handed down to them... **again**

Hey, we do need some entertainment on the aviation news waves.



I've flown on 9V-SPK.
User currently offlineFlyPNS1 From United States of America, joined Nov 1999, 6730 posts, RR: 24
Reply 10, posted (9 years 2 weeks 5 days 12 hours ago) and read 16859 times:

Quoting SonOfACaptain (Reply 6):
Well, AA isn't going to hand the market over to WN on a silver platter.

True. But here's what will likely happen. AA will launch a bunch of flights to go head to head with WN. They'll lose tons of money on these flights. Then AA will realize how stupid these flights were and cut most (if not all) of them.

See AA's reaction to JetBlue in the transcon market from JFK for reference.


User currently offlineKahala777 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 11, posted (9 years 2 weeks 5 days 12 hours ago) and read 16845 times:

Quoting FlyPNS1 (Reply 10):
See AA's reaction to JetBlue in the transcon market from JFK for reference.

Anyone remember JFK to Long Beach, Oakland, San Jose, and Orange County?

KAHALA777


User currently offlineBrokenrecord From United States of America, joined Jul 2005, 772 posts, RR: 0
Reply 12, posted (9 years 2 weeks 5 days 12 hours ago) and read 16830 times:

Quoting SonOfACaptain (Reply 6):
Well, AA isn't going to hand the market over to WN on a silver platter.

Agreed, but Daniel hanging out in the lion's den was a brighter plan than this.

I don't like WN, but there is no denying their power in certain markets.


User currently offlineDfwRevolution From United States of America, joined Jan 2010, 1001 posts, RR: 51
Reply 13, posted (9 years 2 weeks 5 days 12 hours ago) and read 16796 times:

Quoting Kahala777 (Reply 8):
Perhaps AA will center routes at times that arent strong for connections at DFW such as:

AA has tried to compete with WN on intra-Texas before, and they had their behind's handed to them. AA would be hard pressed to opperate any sort of mainline or regional equippment on these routes and stay competitive with WN.

I would commend them for trying again, but I doubt they will waste much of their resources on these routes.

Quoting SonOfACaptain (Reply 6):
Well, AA isn't going to hand the market over to WN on a silver platter.

A fate worse than death, no doubt...


User currently onlineN1120A From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 26790 posts, RR: 75
Reply 14, posted (9 years 2 weeks 5 days 12 hours ago) and read 16779 times:

Quoting Kahala777 (Reply 11):
Anyone remember JFK to Long Beach, Oakland, San Jose, and Orange County?

Actually, I think SJC-JFK was operated by AA before jetBlue entered the market. Still, they are no longer on the route.



Mangeons les French fries, mais surtout pratiquons avec fierte le French kiss
User currently offlineLuv2fly From United States of America, joined May 2003, 12150 posts, RR: 49
Reply 15, posted (9 years 2 weeks 5 days 12 hours ago) and read 16771 times:

AA and there stupid market share wars, will they ever learn, most likely NO!


You can cut the irony with a knife
User currently offlineCadet57 From United States of America, joined Jul 2005, 9085 posts, RR: 30
Reply 16, posted (9 years 2 weeks 5 days 12 hours ago) and read 16771 times:

This will not work, WN will destroy them. What type of A/C will AA be using? if its md's, ok maybe, but WN is going to be brigin 737's with more comfortable seating and leg room. And if there are ERJ's here, Forget about it. AA's done.

Cheers,
Justin



Doors open, right hand side, next stop is Springfield.
User currently offlineEA CO AS From United States of America, joined Nov 2001, 13743 posts, RR: 61
Reply 17, posted (9 years 2 weeks 5 days 12 hours ago) and read 16744 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

Quoting Luv2fly (Reply 15):
AA and there stupid market share wars, will they ever learn

Actually, that argument can be applied to every carrier...including WN, for that matter.

They're all market share whores.



"In this present crisis, government is not the solution to our problem - government IS the problem." - Ronald Reagan
User currently offlineAA737-823 From United States of America, joined Mar 2000, 5944 posts, RR: 11
Reply 18, posted (9 years 2 weeks 5 days 12 hours ago) and read 16731 times:

Folks, this'll get real ugly before it gets pretty.
Southwest is not one to lose, and American isn't either.
Buckle up... this could be an all out, ten-year fare war.


User currently offlineSonOfACaptain From United States of America, joined May 2004, 1747 posts, RR: 6
Reply 19, posted (9 years 2 weeks 5 days 12 hours ago) and read 16715 times:

Is AA going to get their asses wiped? Yes. Is WN going to lose money? Yes. Is AA going to pull out? No. Is this a fight between two airlines pride? Yes. Is this the perfect definition of a classic fare-war? You betcha.

...my bold predictions.  wink 

-SOAC



Non Illegitimi Carborundum
User currently offlineLuv2fly From United States of America, joined May 2003, 12150 posts, RR: 49
Reply 20, posted (9 years 2 weeks 5 days 12 hours ago) and read 16699 times:

Quoting EA CO AS (Reply 17):
Actually, that argument can be applied to every carrier...including WN, for that matter.

They're all market share whores.

Could not agree more. Though they should take a strong hard look at how these turn out before they jump in. If I was a share holder of AA I would not be happy to have them picking this fight.



You can cut the irony with a knife
User currently offlineKahala777 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 21, posted (9 years 2 weeks 5 days 12 hours ago) and read 16699 times:

Quoting N1120A (Reply 14):
Actually, I think SJC-JFK was operated by AA before jetBlue entered the market.

American pulls out, as JetBlue enters, what does that tell you?

KAHALA777


User currently offlineBrokenrecord From United States of America, joined Jul 2005, 772 posts, RR: 0
Reply 22, posted (9 years 2 weeks 5 days 12 hours ago) and read 16689 times:

Quoting SonOfACaptain (Reply 19):
Is AA going to get their asses wiped? Yes. Is WN going to lose money? Yes. Is AA going to pull out? No. Is this a fight between two airlines pride? Yes. Is this the perfect definition of a classic fare-war? You betcha.

...my bold predictions.

Should be interesting. Too bad I don't live down there... Oh wait, it wouldn't matter. I fly US! :p


User currently offlineCadet57 From United States of America, joined Jul 2005, 9085 posts, RR: 30
Reply 23, posted (9 years 2 weeks 5 days 12 hours ago) and read 16678 times:

Quoting AA737-823 (Reply 18):
Folks, this'll get real ugly before it gets pretty.
Southwest is not one to lose, and American isn't either.
Buckle up... this could be an all out, ten-year fare war.

 checkmark 

Quoting SonOfACaptain (Reply 19):
Is AA going to get their asses wiped? Yes. Is WN going to lose money? Yes. Is AA going to pull out? No. Is this a fight between two airlines pride? Yes. Is this the perfect definition of a classic fare-war? You betcha.

 checkmark  checkmark 


Agreed, This is going to be a long, bloody battle. Heads will roll and so will fares. "You are now free to fight a Legacy Airline!" Also folks, welcome to my ru list.

GO WN!
Justin



Doors open, right hand side, next stop is Springfield.
User currently offlineGigneil From United States of America, joined Nov 2002, 16347 posts, RR: 85
Reply 24, posted (9 years 2 weeks 5 days 12 hours ago) and read 16648 times:

AA has pulled out of Love on several occasions. No reason to believe they won't this time.

N


25 AAgent : Where's the beer and hot wings? This fight is going to be good! Best Regards, AAgent
26 DALNeighbor : I love it! Fare wars are good for the flying public. It's nice to finally have some competition in the Dallas - Ft. Worth market.
27 TWAMD-80 : Exactly what I was thinking. It looks like this is gonna get nasty. TW
28 AirCop : Let see here; AA won't go head to head with WN in Chicago, so why can't they just live with the fact that WN will rule Love and they will control DFW,
29 Post contains images BigGSFO : I assume you mean MDW. AA has one or two flights at ORD. [Edited 2005-12-01 03:17:11]
30 AAgent : I certainly don't have any inside info, but I'm guessing MD80's and/or perhaps 737's. Does anyone else have any specific information about what aircr
31 AirCop : Yes, I meant ORD vs. MDW.
32 FlyCMH : I fear this attempt by AA to stifle WN's potential growth in the Dallas/Ft. Worth market will come at the expense of several other markets that depend
33 MAH4546 : I wonder if they'll go and try Eagle service to Miami and O'Hare. Has potential, although past attempts (COEx to Cleveland and DLC to Atlanta) haven't
34 BigGSFO : IIRC there are still some MD's sitting in he desert, isn't there?
35 DLKAPA : This one is going to be interesting. We've already seen a similar situation as this in DEN, whereby UA thought they could tear down F9 but F9 ended up
36 ETStar : Wright wright buh buy... this definitely sounds like something to that effect. AA has not flown out of LUV specifically to battle against WN, and now
37 Commavia : If AA is smart, they won't completely rip apart the phenomenally powerful D/FW hub (as they are threatening). I could envision from Love: . 5x daily D
38 Cjpark : AA could start out with RJ's to long haul markets to establish the routes and if and when the WA is repealed then switch to main line aircraft before
39 Tismfu : Are you sure you don't mean it's nice to finally have competition on the non-stop Metroplex-STL/MCI routes?
40 SunValley : May the better airline win!
41 DeltaGator : I can go with this logic to some degree but what about all the other pax on the plane who aren't business? It doesn't make sense to me for AA to put
42 DALNeighbor : Yes. I thought all you pro-Wright people said it was bad for the neighborhood, blah blah blah to have additional A/C in and out of DAL. Now your chee
43 Post contains images AsstChiefMark : Still ain't going to help me until WN starts servicing MSP. Mark
44 Okie : I doubt you will see DAL-OKC the route has dwindled to only connections to other destinations as you can drive the distance faster than going through
45 WDBRR : Southwest and Continental both compete in Houston. You don't see Continental cry babying about Hobby Airport. They both seem to do just fine, why shou
46 Post contains images Texan : Back when Legend started service, AA also decided to make a preemptive strike against a Wright Amendment repeal and started DAL-AUS service somewhere
47 Highliner2 : Well, I sure hope that the folks at Southwest HQ don't have the level of arrogance that many of the people on this forum do. This is not the American
48 Post contains images DfwRevolution : Because that would make sense, and there's no place for that here... Everyone is naturally adverse to change, and it's AA/DFW's right to put some sor
49 BigGSFO : I agree. Both airlines have huge FF base in Dallas too however AA will seeking the higher yielding crowd. They can offer the competitive fares out of
50 AA737-823 : Uh, AA's service at Love was DAL-ORD with Fokker 100s. I think they also did DCA or a couple of others. It was all first class, though, and did NOT in
51 Incitatus : Southwest would be crazy to give up suckling the tits of Dallas where it enjoys landing fees that are 1/15 of those at DFW, right? What company would
52 DCA-ROCguy : This would serve the most important O&D markets, but preserve the integrity of the connections over D/FW. That's about what I think will happen. At a
53 USFlyer MSP : I think we are reading too much into this press release. I think all AA is going to is to do is launch DAL-STL and maybe DAL-ORD, DAL-MIA, and DAL-LGA
54 FCYTravis : DAL-ORD I can see. But DAL-LGA on an RJ... is insane. The airlines are going away from stupidly long RJ stages like that, not adding them.
55 TxAgKuwait : >> Uh, AA's service at Love was DAL-ORD with Fokker 100s. I think they also did DCA or a couple of others. It was all first class, though, and did NOT
56 Wjcandee : Uh, whoa. Right now the only modification to Wright is the addition of STL. Are they really that threatened by flights to a "third hub" that they've
57 OPNLguy : Let's be fair--it's around 840-850. still a ways from 1,000. That would be pretty stupid of them, and siphon of traffic from DFW that they don't need
58 Post contains images Lightsaber : I have no doubt! And this is with Wright still in place, just *barely* cracked open. Imagine if one could hub from Love? Imagine if Wn was allowed to
59 TxAgKuwait : Before everyone gets too enamored of spouting "WN's AAdvantage is down to 0.8 cents, their folks need to take pay cuts" let me suggest a couple of thi
60 ScottB : Actually, back before Legend started operations, AA tried matching WN's DAL-AUS schedule, first with MD-80's and then with ERJ's. I'm thinking it was
61 Legend500 : True, roughly. There is no huge expansion slated for DAL service by AA, I'm sure. They may beat around the bush a little bit, but AA's shareholders (
62 Cjpark : But you forget one important thing if this is actually an AA strategy. You can all ready fly anywhere in the country from DAL now if you use aircraft
63 Wjcandee : Query: Where would one connect to on AA through STL that one wouldn't be able to fly nonstop from DFW? Why would one do that except for AAdvantage mi
64 FCYTravis : But why in the world would anyone do that when they can fly from DFW on real jets with all the advantages of a legacy mainline jet - First Class, rea
65 FlyingTexan : Like Texas Airline Laureate TxAg mentioned, AA had that route due to winning a state government bid – first Stupid 80 service then downgraded to Am
66 Atrude777 : All the EAS cities flown to N/S from STL on American Connection, that cannot be reached by DFW or ORD, such as CGI, MWA, PAH, IRK, etc etc. Alex
67 JFKLGANYC : This is a stupid move. AA has a fortress hub at DFW...they should keep their egss in that basket! If AA is so inclined to compete out of WN, they shou
68 Post contains images Incitatus : Let me suggest a couple of more things. 1. Southwest's costs are on the rise. American's are going lower. So the 0.8 cents advantage will only get sm
69 Remymartin11 : Legend was a great carrier, great service, nice clean DC-9. AA countered with F100 all leather seating service to compete. When Legend went belly up,
70 Goingboeing : I wouldn't expect them to. But they could save a ton of money by competing on something called "price" into an airport called "DFW". People in KC who
71 FlyingTexan : And blamed it on 9/11.
72 Cltguy : This is a stupid move by AA...just offer the same fares as SWA from DFW.
73 DALNeighbor : 1. You are wrong. WN's non-fuel CASM has decreased the last 3 or 4 quarters in a row. In addtion, it's RASM increased 5.9% last quarter alone. Hence
74 LY4XELD : I would imagine that AA is restricted from providing connecting service from DAL, just as WN is right now (i.e. you can't buy a ticket that continues
75 Wjcandee : LY: Here's what people are talking about: (1) Wright is still in place, but if you send a 50-seater to STL, you should be able to offer connections th
76 Post contains images Thegooddoctor : Gentlemen, open your wallets! It's time for $59 one ways between DAL and Chicago! Someone used the word "entertaining" - I agree! I further predict t
77 ScottB : With Wright in place, most or all EAS markets in Missouri; without it, others in KY, IL, or IA as well. You might pick up some people that would have
78 Luisca : AA is going to beat the crap out of white trash air, sorry WN Whay cant WN just move to DFW? Now lets see how AA defends its own turf. WN should be ca
79 Goingboeing : YOu do realize that you just insulted a very large number of professional business people...doctors, lawyers, lawmakers, corporate executives and the
80 StuckinMAF : Every thread needs a little humor mixed in to it. Every thread also needs a reality check, thanks to Goingboeing for posting it!
81 TxAgKuwait : >>I suppose it's all robbing Peter to pay Paul, but if AA is dead-set on throwing capacity into DAL-STL, they sure would be better off using planes th
82 Contrails : IMO, this is not good for AA. I'd like to think that this is just a bluff, but I doubt it. I wish they would reconsider. Nobody's going to win anythin
83 ScottB : I'm about 120% in agreement. Aside from some bizarre need to make good on a threat to "compete" at DAL, it makes absolutely no sense for AA to throw
84 Luisca : Maybe the people around DAL will complain about the problems the increased number of passengers are causing and will demand DAL to be closed to passen
85 Ckfred : For those of you who think AA will lose a lot of money, remember that AA's costs have been decreasing, while WN's have been increasing. WN is going to
86 TxAgKuwait : Luis, Luis, Luis...what are we going to do with you? >> just dont get WN and why they insist on fliying to DAL when DFW is much much better.
87 DALNeighbor : DAL - STL 12/2/05 - 12/3/05 WN $258 One stop AA $506 Non Stop AA $416 One stop
88 Post contains images KELPkid : I wouldn't put it past AA to do something kinda back handed here...like put so many Super 80's into DAL that would give the anti-Love field crowd some
89 Post contains images Milemaster : I sincerely doubt it. [Edited 2005-12-01 19:21:10]
90 Goingboeing : It's more than landing fees - as Tex said...you ever see an AA jet taxi when the WEREN'T trying to slow the other guy down? Planes on the ground, eve
91 Iowaman : I just flew WN OMA-LAS last night, witnessing a OMA-STL flight board, where I would say 3/4 of the people were in Suit and Ties. I also didn't see an
92 Ctbarnes : Dumb, dumb, dumb! Why is AA wasting money they don't have on this?! Hasn't past experience taught them anything?? When are airline execs going to wake
93 Goingboeing : Minor correction - MOST of the complainers have likely never flown WN.
94 BigGSFO : In which case AA will be competitive. Most likely a lot of those business travelers wrestling for A boarding groups also have AAdvantage miles and if
95 Junction : You can beat WN with RJs at DAL. Don't forget about CO. CO started DAL-IAH with fewer flights then WN. CO now has at least 14 flights daily and WN ha
96 Post contains links Texan : Here's Mike Boyd's comment on AA's planned new service: "It's the first time we've gotten early notice of a suicide," Boyd said. "If they're talking a
97 Sllevin : A more modern explanation is the AA 'micro shuttle' out of LGA. Everyone talked about how foolish that was, how they would lose tons of money, etc etc
98 Post contains links Texan : Here's the official story from Southwest DAL-STL 0810-0945 1230-1405 1645-1820 2100-2235 STL-DAL 0600-0750 1015-1205 1425-1615 1845-2035 DAL-MCI 0850-
99 FCYTravis : And WN has umpteen zillion flights daily to HOU. Your answer may be true for connecting traffic loyal to CO - but why on Earth would any American Air
100 Ken777 : From what I have seen it's all about location. I fly through DFW (and ORD) on AA as all my flights are connecting flights and I don't care where the a
101 Post contains images FCYTravis : What do upgrade stickers get you on an ERJ? The baggage compartment?
102 Post contains images Mirrodie : well, WNs fuel hedge days are soon coming to a close, right? thats really been the only secret to their success here. And that is coming straight from
103 Goingboeing : How do you explain them failing miserably when they had the state contract between Dallas and Austin?
104 Texan : WN actually has partial hedges through 2009. Texan
105 Junction : Curious to know how AA failed. Did they lose the contract? In Nevada HP lost the state contract to WN between LAS-RNO due to a lower bid, but it wasn
106 Goingboeing : No, they didn't. Apparently there wasn't enough government demand between DAL-AUS to fill an MD-80 consistently, and passengers who weren't on govern
107 Wjcandee : From today's AP article: "American leases three gates at Love Field but has never used them. Its American Eagle division, however, operated flights at
108 Iowaman : As said above, WN has partial fuel hedges through 2009, and even without fuel hedges they still would be in a great shape. I find it hard to believe
109 Cjpark : All it takes is an act of Congress.
110 EnviroTO : AA should get a bunch of Q400s and run them out of Love. WN's primary customer base isn't too picky on anything except price so throwing props on the
111 Goingboeing : Again, if that's the case, why didn't AA's DAL-AUS service work?
112 FlyingTexan : Safety Reliability No BS Customer Service FFP – RapidRewards – the most loyal in the industry
113 Post contains images Electech6299 : Wow, am I scared- and I don't even live there. "made the bed" "idle threat" "flood gates" "what are you going to do" "crows are coming to roost" "I h
114 Post contains images Incitatus : 1. The only way for Southwest to decrease their costs per mile is to add more longhaul service, which is something they have been doing frantically.
115 Texan : Same to close DFW, TUL, whatever else. Congress also would rather not meddle any more in local politics. They don't want to be involved in it now. Yo
116 Rage323machine : YOU DO IT AA... KINDA LIKE USC VS UCLA (BUT USC IS AA...AND UCLA WN) GO USC!!!!!!!!!!!! GO AA!!!!!!!!!!!!!
117 Cjpark : Nope just pointing out that the move by AA is the start of a long a dirty fight to eliminate all the advantages held by WN at DAL by AA and any other
118 DALNeighbor : 1.Southwest has been decreasing thier cost and adding long haul flights profitably. That's the end game here sonny boy, profits and WN is el numero u
119 FCYTravis : Cjpark, if you really think Congress is going to pass a law closing the headquarters airport of the most profitable airline in the country, which also
120 Post contains images Electech6299 : You might just as well say revoking WN's certificate would end the controversy. I dunno, maybe revoking AA's would work? Nope? but closing DFW would
121 Cjpark : Congress will do what is best for thier own districts. As to whether DAL will be closed by Congress who knows. But based on the actions of our Govt i
122 FCYTravis : Yep, and for the vast majority of Congress, the best thing for their districts is to promote airline competition, offer lower fares for air travelers
123 Post contains images Thegooddoctor : ...uhhh, OK! Ok, here are some free associations from my childhood: A toy, a block, a poodle, a noodle, a doodle... I have an affection for aviation
124 Post contains images JerseyGuy : It tells us that we'll never know who the father is
125 Cjpark : That would depend on if the Congresspersons local market would be affected by said competition and in which way that competition affected their distr
126 Socalfive : Point is, WN had a business plan back in 1971 that they're still using today, almost without any modification. Everyone else is playing catch-up. Sou
127 TxAgKuwait : Don't hold back, Socal...tell us how you REALLY feel....
128 Stirling : But he said it oh so well! American Airlines reminds me of the old fable of the dog with a bone in his mouth that sees his own reflection in a pond;
129 Cjpark : Whether or not AA can be successful at DAL is not that important. What is important is whether or not AA can stir up enough trouble for WN on their h
130 Post contains images Texan : If you mean they have been artificially lowering landing fees to give WN a competitive advantage while enforcing higher landing fees on someone like
131 Cjpark : What I mean is that they have not raised landing fees in years inspite of deficits being run up for airport operations. That in itself is suspicious.
132 Post contains images Ctbarnes : True, but Bob Crandall was once quoted as saying the airline industry is the modern equivelent to the old game of Christians and lions. Charles, SJ
133 ORD : If AA follows your line of thinking then this shows what a total joke of a company they are. Their mission should not be to stir up trouble for the c
134 STL30L : I just got an email from AA ... Save 15% Between DFW And St. Louis/Kansas City It says the discounts applies to all fares for travel between 12/13/05
135 Electech6299 : Hmmm... How many predominantly GA airports saddle their commercial business with landing fees to try to make up their costs? Sounds like suicide to m
136 Cjpark : Very few of us own private planes and fly General aviation to begin with. Why should the public have to pay for your hobby? GA should be charged the
137 Stl1326 : Any rumors going around AA as to how many flights and what type of aircraft they will be using to STL/MCI from DAL?
138 WDBRR : Here is an interesting thought....back in 1997, congress expanded the Wright Agreement to include several other states....AA did not do anything at th
139 Wjcandee : I completely agree, but I'll add another thought: For twenty years, they haven't had any credibility on that argument to anybody who was paying atten
140 Electech6299 : My hobby? I wish.... I just take pictures (and notes...) Oh, and it's too bad that most municipalities - including DAL- don't share your view. Kind o
141 Post contains links Cjpark : Here is some information on the situation at the airport. http://www.dfw.com/mld/dfw/business/13300441.htm
142 Post contains images Hiflyer : The winner in the LUV/AMR fight over Love field will be the other airlines. As these two carriers try to eat each other and tie up aircraft the rest w
143 SCCutler : Nicely said. AA's chest-beating about instituting service at DAL has been based not upon a true competetive intent, but rather, is calculated to give
144 Ckfred : My wife just flew WN for the first time and didn't notice any difference in attitude between WN F/As and AA F/As. Mind you, she flies AA at least twic
145 Cjpark : I sincerely doubt that should WN move to DFW that they would require AA to feed them passengers for them to be profitable. Concerning your perceived
146 SCCutler : Quite right. Nor is the public responsible for predatory pricing policies at mega-hubs which destroy the effects of competition in those markets. But
147 Cjpark : Landing fees that have not been raised in 18 years seem suspiciously like charity to me. But that is only my opinion. Even with the courts gifts to W
148 Texan : Well, the argument many people make is that the money the GA pilots and passengers spend in Dallas makes up for the loss in revenue for the airport;
149 TxAgKuwait : CJ....CJ....CJ...(shaking head sorrowfully)...what are we going to do with you? Disclaimer: It is readily apparent that this CJ is not the same person
150 AA7573E : You, as always, are way over the top...but you are an Aggie, and likely a member of the corp, so I guess we can let it slide.[Edited 2005-12-05 16:36
151 Cjpark : Again the same tired argument. Each of the situations that you reference above meet criteria that DAL and DFW do not. The airports in the LA area are
152 TxAgKuwait : >>Come up with a real reason why we need two PAX airports 8 miles apart other than that is what WN wants.
153 Post contains images Kahala777 : Yes, and they will to a city called Chicago.. Dallas, and the Chamber of Commerce has a choice. The choice is open up Love Field, or be without a ten
154 DALNeighbor : I'll tell you why we need an airport 8 mile away. Because it makes it very hard for AA to drive airlines out of business when they are at a different
155 ScottB : Different cities = different governmental entities, just as the City of Dallas and DFW Airport Board are different governmental entities. The courts
156 Crjflyer35 : Aside from connections...let WN have MDW, and AA can try battling UA for control of ORD. That's another can of worms in itself.
157 OPNLguy : TxAg, if you're not careful, CJ is going to accuse you of being a SWA employee. I mean, anyone who brings up what he calls "the same tired argument"
158 Bninmsy : I'll tell you why we need an airport 8 mile away. 8 miles apart doesn't necessarily mean its a breeze to get to DFW -but the traffic in Dallas can be
159 Cjpark : So what you all are telling me and the rest of the world is that we need two airports so close together in North Texas is so WN can have its own airpo
160 FCYTravis : Given that WN carries more domestic passengers than any other airline, I'd say that people are voting with their feet. What's good for WN is good for
161 Post contains images Electech6299 : Cj, I asked for an independant financial assessment, and you give me a news release on the DFW website. Now do you call that a leg or a tail? So even
162 Kahala777 : From your statements the rest of the World seems to have paid attention to what Love and its tenant means to the Greater Dallas Chamber of Commerce..
163 OPNLguy : With repeal, SWA's share of Love is estimated at 55%-65%, so how do you conclude SWA wants/expects "its own" airport? Stuck on that "97% monopoly" cr
164 2H4 : Seemingly so. The same crap is shoveled over and over and over again. 2H4
165 Cjpark : The city is conducting an internal investigation. When that is finished you can look it up your self. The article was posted to give you an idea of t
166 Cjpark : Can you give us a link to the support for repeal of the WA by the Greater Dallas Chamber of Commerce? That has been my position all along that WN sho
167 SMUDFWflyer : A long time lurker here on A.net, I finally decided to pay up and join the mud slinging that comes with all of the Wright Amendment forums. I have rea
168 DALNeighbor : It's amazing how many of us joined airliners.net because of the Wright Amendment discussion in this forum. I think airliners.net could give AA a run
169 Tismfu : Well said.
170 SCCutler : Ah, but CJ, there's the problem. Locating all the pax service in one location does nothing to benefit the region. AA needs all of ITS air traffic at
171 WDBRR : Congress should take lessons from this thread on ways to solve the problem. My favorite "AA Announcement" was several months ago when they stated that
172 SMUDFWflyer : Good suggestion DALNeighbor - I wonder if those on this forum who don't live in Dallas realize the current situation of the road access to DAL. Seriou
173 Cjpark : The reason to consolidate is to force the carriers to compete. You also save the public the hassle of duplication of services by having to maintain t
174 Post contains images OPNLguy : You know, I've seen some spin here, but you take the cake with that one...
175 SCCutler : Silly. They can compete from two different airports. There is no reason why WN should abandon its base to do so. Works fine in other markets. You als
176 Wjcandee : I don't think anyone has mentioned Dallas's enormous convention business, and how significant that is to the local economy. Yes, AA offers "conventio
177 Socalfive : NOT the whole point! Competition isn't the whole picture. DFW doesn't fit the "fast turn" business model Southwest lives by. The difference being, LA
178 Cjpark : Regardless of the cap on fares why did they wait so long to suddenly care about the high cost of flying in North Texas?
179 N200WN : But if it makes such good business sense, why haven't AA added service to other Wright Amendment cities, such as ABQ and MSY? As I've said before, I
180 F9fan : AA moving into DAL is one of the stupidest things they could have done. All they are going to get is O/D traffic because of the hastle of changing air
181 SMUDFWflyer : Socalfive - Thanks for your reply. I am well aware of the geographical separation between the four (arguably six if you include LGB and PSP) airports
182 N200WN : This guy is an idiot. AA better be careful...he may also tack on to that same bill a provision that all international flights from DFW stop in TUL fi
183 DALNeighbor : They have always cared about the high cost of flying for erveryone in the Country. They have been bringing the low fare business model to cities acro
184 Post contains links DALNeighbor : OMA airport officials want OMA exempted from Wright Amendment. Full Story (requires free registration): http://www.omaha.com/index.php?u_pg=46&u_sid=2
185 Wjcandee : BY THE WAY, does anybody know how the landing fees at Alliance Fort Worth (AFW) compare with the landing fees at DFW and DAL. Basically, what I'm sayi
186 Thecamel67 : SMU-Welcome to the fray and thanks for some intelligent input. As one of those, I will chose DFW even though I live at Royal and Hillcrest. I can get
187 ScottB : Actually, I don't agree with you on that point -- except that DAL is closer for downtown Dallas travelers and the Park Cities. DFW has far better hig
188 Electech6299 : Whoa! This thread is on AA flights to Missouri, not international service- and I can't think of how AA flying from DAL will "dilute" their internatio
189 MattRB : AMR is holding the gun to their own head on this one. Just out of curiousity CJ, what's forcing AA to move ops to DAL? Could they not compete on the
190 Cjpark : Besides the obvious reason to not surrender pax, they made public statements that they would move some operations to DAL in the event of a WA repeal.
191 Electech6299 : I couldn't have said it better myself. Personally, I hold a person credibile when they act in conformity with what they meant, not any of 100 interpr
192 Cjpark : A smart business prepares for any contingency. The underlying theme of my posts is to point out to the pro repeal WA WN backers to be careful of what
193 SMUDFWflyer : You could argue that any company in a free market economy operates using "anticompetitive behavior." WN doesn't want competition at DAL any more or l
194 N200WN : And the same has been true in Dallas/Ft. Worth to some extent. AA has successfully competed with WN to ABQ, MSY, OKC, and TUL all from the "less conv
195 DTWorBust : Nice post SMU, brings up some new meat for this discussion! I'm on the DFW side of this one, competition between airlines is good, between airports is
196 Post contains links SMUDFWflyer : Thanks DTW - While I am sure many on this forum and elsewhere want to see WN at DFW, it simply will not happen. If the Wright Amendment ever shifts in
197 DTWorBust : Thanks for your post, like I said, it's nice to be in A.net where these things (usually) retail some civility and there are some new ideas brought for
198 Cjpark : I cannot explain the bond issues to you but yes the communities will stand to suffer. But who cares right?
199 DALNeighbor : Do you understand what you are saying with the comment that it would be better to have WN over at DFW? That's like saying it would be better to have
200 Dc10s4ever : From what we are hearing at AA so far. AA will outsource its operations at DAL. One level 5 GM will run the station and be responsible for the contrac
201 Cjpark : Are you seriously suggesting that the public pay for WN to move to DFW? Who cares what it would cost WN to move to DFW. That is not the publics conce
202 DTWorBust : I agree, when you break down the more micro municipal issues there are some rather large ones. In theory, sure it would be great to have Love running
Top Of Page
Forum Index

This topic is archived and can not be replied to any more.

Printer friendly format

Similar topics:More similar topics...
AA In Love posted Thu Dec 1 2005 00:43:44 by Unitedtristar
AA Announces DFW Terminal D Date posted Wed Sep 28 2005 13:19:41 by Utapao
It's Official: AA Announces New Biz Seat posted Mon Aug 15 2005 15:43:48 by BigGSFO
AA Announces Service To DEL posted Tue Jul 12 2005 22:36:00 by CATHAY747
AA Announces More/New Service To 20 Cities posted Fri Oct 29 2004 19:21:21 by Iowaman
AA Announces Over 50 New Flights From It's Hubs posted Fri Jun 11 2004 21:36:10 by Iowaman
AA Announces Peoria To Dallas posted Sat Apr 17 2004 04:01:39 by ZASpringboks
AA Announces Unlimited Free Upgrades! posted Fri Feb 20 2004 00:14:09 by Aa777flyer
AA Announces Nonstop JFK-PHX posted Tue Dec 16 2003 21:34:59 by FoxBravo
Why Did AA Stop Love Field Service? posted Tue Jun 4 2002 01:41:10 by 727LOVER