TOLtommy From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 3220 posts, RR: 4 Reply 1, posted (7 years 5 months 3 weeks 23 hours ago) and read 3019 times:
Wow, what a lousy article. Get this quote:
"Before the September bankruptcy filing, Delta had 305 regional jets. That number has fallen to 174, Black said. Delta cut some of those out by selling a subsidiary, Atlantic Southeast."
- Um, most if not all of those RJ's still fly Delta routes.....
"Delta has to protect its customer base, said Michael Walley, development director for Sarasota-Bradenton International Airport.
"I'd say they're doing it for defensive reasons," he said."
- Yep they are, Mister Airport Development Director. And they'll pull off the route as soon as AirTran withdraws, leaving your airport with nothing again. While you couldn't stop DL from doing, you could have made it very clear that you were going to support the AirTran service more. An advertising campaign, and some "Use it or lose it" talk would've been a better way to go, instead of allowing the service to wither. It'll be gone within 6 months.
BNAflyer78 From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 258 posts, RR: 0 Reply 2, posted (7 years 5 months 3 weeks 23 hours ago) and read 3006 times:
Quoting TOLtommy (Reply 1): "Before the September bankruptcy filing, Delta had 305 regional jets. That number has fallen to 174, Black said. Delta cut some of those out by selling a subsidiary, Atlantic Southeast."
- Um, most if not all of those RJ's still fly Delta routes.....
Yes they do, but I suspect this number is reflecting only RJs DL owns which are now only at Comair due to the sale of EV to OO. Just a thought...
Agreed. They might have pointed out that Airtran was flying real airliners, while Delta was flying tinkertoy airplanes that would likely scare the bejezus out of the blue-haired retirees. OTOH, one part of the article relates to a once-weekly flight to BOS. Once-a-week flights aren't even worth talking about.
Not always true. The Saturday trip will most likely be flown with a Shuttle airplane that might otherwise be sitting on the ground. Delta has often used Boston shuttle planes during the winter to boost Saturday frequencies to Florida destinations. If the flight will generate some additional seasonal revenue, that's certainly the company's prerogative.
My definition of cool ? Not trying so hard to be cool.
DCA-ROCguy From United States of America, joined Apr 2000, 4402 posts, RR: 37 Reply 6, posted (7 years 5 months 3 weeks 20 hours ago) and read 2790 times:
I'd look for both airlines to continue in this market. The Sarasota-Bradenton MSA has been growing sharply (from 489k in 1990 to 620 in 2002) and IIRC from our other threads, the year-round population is growing. I'd bet this is a market ripe for strong ongoing FL and DL stations. Remember too that Delta tried a few years ago to drive AirTran out of CAK with MD-88's and that didn't work.
Don't assume that because the reporter didn't mention the airport spokesman saying anything about encouraging people to fly AirTran, that he necessarily didn't. Reporters and editors can leave out a lot of interview notes.
Jamake1 From United States of America, joined May 2004, 894 posts, RR: 2 Reply 7, posted (7 years 5 months 3 weeks 20 hours ago) and read 2758 times:
Let Delta crumble by its own desperation. They did the same thing by saturating the westcoast trans-con market with a bunch of Song frequencies to SFO/LAX from JFK/BOS. Markets that are AA and UA (as well as B6/JB) strongholds. Delta will continue to lose because they would rather protect market share at the expense profitability. I'll just sit back and watch them crumble by their own demons as their losses continue to mount. At one point, prior to them throwing in the towel at DFW, they were running 50-seat CRJ's on OAK-DFW runs...sad.
JetBluefan1 From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 2785 posts, RR: 15 Reply 9, posted (7 years 5 months 3 weeks 14 hours ago) and read 2584 times:
I'm not at all surprised to hear FL isn't doing so hotly on SRQ-BOS/LGA. BOS is certainly an odd market when it comes to Florida flying (depending on the time of the year, some Florida markets are busier than others).
I really don't understand why FL launched SRQ-LGA. AirTran's presence in the New York City aviation market is minimal and they launched service to a new market out of the blue. Speaking of blue, I think an SRQ-New York City route would be successful for B6.
In any case, I don't think either FL or DL will remain on the route for too long. If FL is already saying that the routes are weak and DL is flying small, expensive planes, there isn't any real winning factor. Perhaps there isn't enough demand for the route?
Most people on a.net hate JetBlue. Get used to it.
Zippyjet From United States of America, joined Sep 2001, 4724 posts, RR: 13 Reply 11, posted (7 years 5 months 3 weeks 14 hours ago) and read 2550 times:
FL has a significant advantage over DL in this market: DL will be using smaller RJ's; SRQ like RSW has a very large population of disabled/Wheel Chair passengers. The RJ's aren't bad if you are able bodied and under 5'7".
So imagine accomodating large amounts of wheelchair bound older passengers on a RJ. Besides comfort and accesibility, consider the time constraints. It's much easier to load and deplane 17 Wheelchair passengers from a Boeing 717 vs. your RJ. FL's fleet are all 717's and 737-700 NG's.
LGA777 From United States of America, joined Jul 2003, 1101 posts, RR: 22 Reply 12, posted (7 years 5 months 3 weeks 12 hours ago) and read 2488 times:
US flew LGA-SRQ Daily Nonstop for about a year sometime around the mid 90's. While I don't have stats to back this up the load factor was strong, and I believe the fares while low where considerably higher than say LGA to FLL-PBI-MCO-TPA. The route was flown with a seasonal mix of 733's and F-100's.
And I agree with Zippyjet about all the wheelchair passengers making even a large RJ undesirable.
CMHSRQ From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 985 posts, RR: 4 Reply 13, posted (7 years 5 months 3 weeks 9 hours ago) and read 2410 times:
This is old news, this was announced 6 weeks ago. The Sat Delta flight to BOS is on a 737-200, the daily LGA flights on CRJ700's of couse Airtran has 737G and 717's. Considering a year ago is when Airtran started SRQ service with 3 daily flights to 2 destinations and now they operate 8 daily to 5 destinations with DTW coming on line Feb 15th. Not to bad, give them a few months to build the LGA flights they will fill up. USAirways had daily LGA flights in the 90's that were packed. Man I hated cleaning those planes, they were disasters. Anyway, I hope they all work out.
OttoPylit From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 16, posted (7 years 5 months 2 weeks 6 days 23 hours ago) and read 2297 times:
Quoting TOLtommy (Reply 1): While you couldn't stop DL from doing, you could have made it very clear that you were going to support the AirTran service more.
Don't blame the airport director for FL's poor choice of planning, its not his fault, its Healy's. And why support the FL service, when the article made it clear that DL was the bigger, better known choice and had a much superior FF program. The difference in fares is only $30, thats not much for people to jump on. Besides, his job as airport director is to help increase competition at the airport, which is exactly what he did. Now stop whining like a crybaby just because DL is fighting back.
Quoting Surfdog75 (Reply 8): Nice of you to wish this on Delta when your company, UA, has been in endless bankruptcy and decimated it's employee groups.
Not to mention the fact that his ESOP ownership papers can be used as a real nice alternative to Charmin Extra-Soft.
Quoting Zippyjet (Reply 11): It's much easier to load and deplane 17 Wheelchair passengers from a Boeing 717 vs. your RJ. FL's fleet are all 717's and 737-700 NG's.
As it it just as easy to board them on an RJ. Since your not very knowledgable of RJ ops, I'll clue you in. Most likely, DL will be using jetways, which will pull right up to the RJ once the rails are let down and aislechairs can be rolled right onboard, just as in a 717. But, if they were to board via the ramp, there is something called a wheelchair lift, which is simply a supporting, self contained, enclosed elevator that lifts right up to the airplane and the wheelchair is rolled on. Pretty smart device actually. So the difference in time when boarding RJ's to a mainline aircraft? Nil, with the exception you have to wait for everyone to deplane if sitting in the back of a 717, which everyone hates. So the advantage is that DL can make money off only having to fill 50 seats, as compared to 117.
Quoting 727LOVER (Reply 15): They were re-routed, and got upgrades....AND THEY'RE STILL BITCHIN' !!!!!!
They were re-routed(through a hub instead of nonstop and screwed up hotel accomodations), and got upgrades(which is nothng more than a slightly bigger seat and not worth the money, since anyone can pay $35 and get it)....AND THEY'RE STILL BITCHIN(yea, these people are SOOOO inconsiderate for their $200 bucks).
Ejmmsu From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 1692 posts, RR: 0 Reply 18, posted (7 years 5 months 2 weeks 6 days 7 hours ago) and read 2150 times:
Quoting MD90fan (Reply 10): Quoting Jamake1 (Reply 7):
they were running 50-seat CRJ's on OAK-DFW runs...sad.
Weren't they operated by CRJ-700's? And the JFK-DFW runs also had CRJ's too IIRC
At the end of the DFW hub, DFW-OAK , DFW-SNA , DFW-ONT , DFW-PHX were operated by CRJ-700's. The CRJ-100/200 doesn't have the range to run those routes. DFW-JFK was also a CRJ-700, operated once daily to connect to the international bank, being to far for a CRJ-100/200. An example of a very long CRJ-100/200 was DFW-RDU/GSO/CHS, which are all around 1000 miles.
"If the facts do not conform to the theory, they will have to be disposed of"
CMHSRQ From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 985 posts, RR: 4 Reply 20, posted (7 years 5 months 2 weeks 6 days 5 hours ago) and read 2127 times:
Continental is bringing in a 757 to SRQ Dec 20th. Not a big deal for most airports but like CMH, SRQ just doesn't see many aircraft larger then a 737NG. Can you get out to the field and spot it? Looks like COA / Express / Cape Air will have 8 flights a day this winter. 3 EWR, 1 CLE, 1 IAH, 3 TPA. USAirways looks like they will have 6 dailies to CLT, two each :737's, CRJ700's and CRJ900's.
727LOVER From United States of America, joined Oct 2001, 5722 posts, RR: 20 Reply 21, posted (7 years 5 months 2 weeks 5 days 15 hours ago) and read 1974 times:
Sorry, can't make it. That's a Tuesday...I'll be at work....in Tampa! DL stopped bringing the 757 about 2 years ago. Yeah, I noticed US was bringing in CRJ-900. Woo-hoo...I wonder if they'll still be in HP colors.
DeltaMIA From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 1672 posts, RR: 19 Reply 22, posted (7 years 5 months 2 weeks 5 days 14 hours ago) and read 1961 times:
Quoting CMHSRQ (Reply 17): They wonder why the flights aren't doing well? Last year they would have been packed, but Jetblue now flys from BOS to TPA non-stop. Match the TPA fares and the flights would have been full.
That eliminates the advantage of servicing SRQ and TPA. The problem with secondary Florida airports is that you are competing with a larger to medium sized hub and there is no advantage to competing with them. Sister pricing with that hub only competes with the airlines operation who services both airports. There needs to be a fare premium for airlines servicing secondary airports unless the secondary airport is your sole airport in that market/region.
It's a big building with patients, but that's not important right now.