Dutchjet From Netherlands, joined Oct 2000, 7864 posts, RR: 58 Reply 3, posted (8 years 1 week 3 hours ago) and read 7184 times:
By the way, Pan Am also had a fleet of seven A310-200s - all of the A312s were acquired via Airbus and were second hand aircraft. The A312s were used throughout PanAm's route system and were even assigned to some of the "shorter" transatlantic routes such as JFK-BRU and JFK-AMS which was really pushing the limits of the shorter range A312. All of PanAm's A312s and A313s went to Delta as part of the deal whereby DL took over PanAm's tranatlantic operations.
Also, dont forget that PanAm also had a fleet of A300B4s (also acquired on a second hand basis) that flew caribbean and shorter latin american routes out of both JFK and MIA.
TOLtommy From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 3246 posts, RR: 4 Reply 4, posted (8 years 1 week 3 hours ago) and read 7133 times:
The PA 310's were comfortable aircraft to ride in, much better than the DL 767-300ER, IMO. Only thing bad was that they obviously had not been well cared for at the end. By the time they came to DL, the wear had taken their toll in the cabins. DL replaced the planes with new 310's, they were a marked improvement.
USADreamliner From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 6, posted (8 years 1 week 2 hours ago) and read 7021 times:
Thanks guys for all the info.
My question was because in 1987 (July 5th) I travel from MIA to JFK on a PA 310.
And I always had the doubt of the model, if it was a 200 or 300.
I guess it was a 200! Cool, awesome.
RDYNYC From United States of America, joined Sep 2005, 65 posts, RR: 1 Reply 11, posted (8 years 6 days 21 hours ago) and read 6685 times:
I flew as a flight attendant working the 310 out of LHR. I remember we had several that were suppose to go to Kuwait Airways. They had the Kuwait Airways seat upholstery in coach. I liked the a/c. Take-off was fun sitting in the swivel jumpseat at door 2. That baby shot off like a rocket!
Quoting Dutchjet (Reply 3): By the way, Pan Am also had a fleet of seven A310-200s - all of the A312s were acquired via Airbus and were second hand aircraft.
Not really. They were effectively ordered by VASP (N801/802/803/804PA) and by KU (N805/806/807PA) but cancelled by those airlines. So they were white tails. The three that KU should have got were in fact delivered to Boeing and stored in Germany before delivery to Pan Am, as this manufacturer delivered three new B762ER to KU.
Magyarorszag From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 16, posted (8 years 6 days 6 hours ago) and read 4858 times:
Quoting Levg79 (Reply 15): It's ironic that PN, who was the launch customer of B747, would name one of their Airbus aircraft like that....
Its probably because it represented the new generation, the next "Queen of the Skies", as there certainly was a B707 named as such before the B747. Remember that two of the A313 PA had on order were cancelled, and went to Ecuatoriana in 1991. As most other airlines, PA tried to have a fleet of smaller jets that would fit better its needs, since it was not anymore just Pan Am & TWA that crossed the pond from the "New World".
Solnabo From Sweden, joined Jan 2008, 834 posts, RR: 2 Reply 17, posted (8 years 6 days 6 hours ago) and read 4845 times:
Damn, can´t find the info from September 1990 w PNs 310-300 ARN-JFK. If I only could remember the Clipper name of this white n blue "piglet"! The flight was smooth as silk, good food, beer or wine for free (no kidding), was pretty drunk arriving JFK.....*burp*
Breiz From France, joined Mar 2005, 1859 posts, RR: 2 Reply 19, posted (8 years 6 days 5 hours ago) and read 4660 times:
There was a time I was flying often between Stavanger (Norway) and Nice (France). As I am an Airbus freak and I was bored by the regular routes, I once asked the travel officer to check if Berlin was within my reach, ticket mileage wise. And it was!
I therefore flew Stavanger-Kristiansand-Hamburg-Berlin-Frankfurt-Geneva-Zurich-Nice. Back and forth Berlin on the Pan Am A310! Almost empty.
I'll remember for ever the comment of the otherwise nice young lady at the check-in desk at Tempelhof: "What the hell are you doing here?"
I was riding the Pan Am A310, Lady.
Panamair From United States of America, joined Oct 2001, 4713 posts, RR: 26 Reply 20, posted (8 years 6 days 5 hours ago) and read 4643 times:
Sorry guys but have to step in here and correct one small point. The late great Pan Am I used the code PA, not PN. PN was the code adopted by Pan Am III or IV or whatever when Guilford bought the name from the estate of Pan Am II.
Quoting Levg79 (Reply 15): What would be the final destination of that flight? Wouldn't it make more sense to schedule a stop at JFK, that way it opens few other possibilites for connecting flights.
Final destination was JFK; point was that the 310 did not have the capability to reach JFK with a full payload when there were strong headwinds...
And as an FYI, PA used their A310s in the '80s and early '90s regularly on routes such as:
JFK-ARN-HEL (and JFK-HEL later also)
JFK-FBU (in '91)
JFK-AMS (in '91)
JFK-FRA (supplemental flight to the 747s)
JFK-LHR (supplemental flight to the 747s)
JFK-CDG (supplemental flight to the 747s)
JFK-ZAG (in '91)
JFK-LIS (in '91)
JFK-BCN (in '91)
JFK-ZRH (in '91)
JFK-MEX (alternating with the A300)
MIA-REC (in '91)
Domestically, they were often also used on:
Magyarorszag From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 21, posted (8 years 6 days 4 hours ago) and read 4390 times:
Quoting JFKLGANYC (Reply 18): Was Pan Am going to retire the 747 fleet for the smaller, newer airbuses? Was that their intention?
I remember that I've read somewhere something going this way. I'll try to find it and let you know.
I was in fact searching for it, when I came across Pan Am 1989 annual report that I have. I know that with what I'm going to say I'll get a bit away from the original topic, but I read through Thomas Plaskett (Chairman & CEO) message to the shareholders and was quit astounded to read that Pan Am tried to acquire NWA Inc in the second quarter of 1989.
All this "was a bold attempt to link two routes systems that would fit end-to-end and forge a new global competitor. We were able to mount a bid, substantially backed by outside investors, but we could not match a competing bid!", says Plaskett. Who knows what would have emerged from this attempt? Would have the new company centered around the A310 for some types of routes ?
Panamair From United States of America, joined Oct 2001, 4713 posts, RR: 26 Reply 22, posted (8 years 6 days 4 hours ago) and read 4217 times:
Quoting Magyarorszag (Reply 21): I was in fact searching for it, when I came across Pan Am 1989 annual report that I have. I know that with what I'm going to say I'll get a bit away from the original topic, but I read through Thomas Plaskett (Chairman & CEO) message to the shareholders and was quit astounded to read that Pan Am tried to acquire NWA Inc in the second quarter of 1989.
Yes, I remember that well. PA actually stood a good chance of merging with NW; their proposed bid of about $3.6billion was backed by some very credible investors and banks and the proposed network would have made a truly global US airline (NW strong in the Pacific which PA had sold to UA while PA strong in the transatlantic and Latin American markets) with a strong domestic system. Unfortunately, I think the NW folks looked at PA as a basket case and went with the Al Checchi bid instead. Who knows, if the merger had gone through, Pan Am might still be flying today....
F27XXX From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 23, posted (8 years 6 days 3 hours ago) and read 4153 times:
For those of you incorrectly using 'PN' as the two-letter code for Pan Am, it was 'PA', as the A310s were operated by the original Pan Am and not one of the later incarnations.
Sad to think it's been 14 years already -- seems like just yesterday I was able to park my car on the rooftop at the JFK Worldport and stand just a few feet from the PA 74's and Airbii and watch (and hear!!) all the others taxiing and taking off right in front of me. God what a great spot that was -- and what a great airline that was.
Levg79 From United States of America, joined Sep 2003, 993 posts, RR: 0 Reply 24, posted (8 years 6 days 2 hours ago) and read 4080 times:
Quoting Panamair (Reply 20): Final destination was JFK; point was that the 310 did not have the capability to reach JFK with a full payload when there were strong headwinds...
Personally, I have a problem believing this remark. The distance between ISP and JFK is only 37 miles. Would the fuel situation had to be THAT bad for them to make the technical stop? It's would be similar situation if the trans-Atlantic flight to LHR would make a fuel stop at LGW. Does anybody have more information on why would that flight stop at ISP?
A mile of runway takes you to the world. A mile of highway takes you a mile.
25 N1120A: This happens sometimes when an aircraft may end up in a holding pattern at an airport (JFK definately gets them) and will go into a much less congest
26 CB777: Does anybody know if the pax loads were good on the JFK-ZAG CB777
27 GroundStop: While I'm not aware of the weather at JFK that night, one has to take into account that it could've been marginal. That being the case, an alternate
28 Ikramerica: Why did DL retired their 310s, especially the ones so young? Anyone know the thought process there?
29 A999: The DL 310`s were sold off because they did not fit in with the 763`s which were the long haul workhorses. The 312/313`s of PA were meant as fuel effi
30 DETA737: I'm not sure I remember reading in a magazine from 1989 or 1990 about the possibility of Pan Am acquiring the A340/A330 to replace the 747 classics i