Sponsor Message:
Civil Aviation Forum
My Starred Topics | Profile | New Topic | Forum Index | Help | Search 
SYD-LHR 26 Stop To Non Stop  
User currently offlineGemuser From Australia, joined Nov 2003, 5552 posts, RR: 6
Posted (8 years 4 months 2 weeks 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 10207 times:

With the disscussion flowing here about the QF order and the possiability & desirability on SYD-LHR non stop and the fact that I have finally settled into a decent flat and unpacked my books (Yea!!) I thought I would share with you the August 1939 timetable of the Qantas/Imperial Airways SYD-LHR service. (For the history challegened that is immediately before the outbreak of World War 2)

Sydney Tue, Thur, Sat
Brisbane
Gladstone
Townsville
Townsville Wed, Fri, Mon
Darwin
Koepang
Sourabaya
Sourabaya Fri, Sun, Tue
Batavia
Singapore
Penang
Penang Sat, Mon, Wed
Bangkok
Rangoon
Calcutta
Calcutta Sun, Tue, Thrs
Allahabad
Gwalior
Karachi
Karachi Mon, Wed, Fri
Jiwani
Dabai
Baherin
Basra
Basra Tue, Thrs, Sat
Habbaniyeb (for Baghdah)
Tiberias
Alexandria
Alexandria Wed, Fri, Sun
Athens
Brindisi
Rome
Marseilles
Marseilles Thrs, Sat, Mon
Southampton Water Arrive Thrs, Sat, Mon
Aircraft Shorts S23 C class flying boat
Connecting service offerred Bangkok - Hong Kong twice weekly
Intermediate Service Southampton Water - Calcutta on Wed & Fri returning on Wed & Sat
-------------

9 days, 26 stops compare that to 20 hours(more or less) and no stops!

Also includes are details of services Southampton Water - Durban, KLMs service Amsterdam - Bativia, the Zeppelin service Frtiedrichshafen - Rio and services Paris - Hanoi and African ports. I would be happy to post details if people are intrested.

Gemuser


DC23468910;B72172273373G73873H74374475275376377L77W;A319 320321332333343;BAe146;C402;DHC6;F27;L188;MD80MD85
28 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineFelixZRH From Switzerland, joined May 2005, 226 posts, RR: 17
Reply 1, posted (8 years 4 months 2 weeks 4 days ago) and read 10096 times:

Thanks for this route.
I like such routings and I like the Great Circle Mapper.
So I tried to visualize this route:



Route

Some Cities don't have airports nowadays (e.g. Tabiris), so I looked for the next current airport. But you see the point  Wink .

 wave  Felix


User currently offlineBestWestern From Hong Kong, joined Sep 2000, 6953 posts, RR: 57
Reply 2, posted (8 years 4 months 2 weeks 4 days ago) and read 10084 times:

One stops will never catch on!  Smile

Interesting, well researched and original posting. Thanks!



The world is really getting smaller these days
User currently offlineANother From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 3, posted (8 years 4 months 2 weeks 4 days ago) and read 10083 times:

Quoting FelixZRH (Reply 1):
Some Cities don't have airports nowadays (e.g. Tabiris), so I looked for the next current airport. But you see the point

Indeed, thanks for this. As this was a flying boat, they didn't need an airport - just water!


User currently offlineJush From Germany, joined Apr 2005, 1636 posts, RR: 3
Reply 4, posted (8 years 4 months 2 weeks 3 days 23 hours ago) and read 10035 times:

Thanks for the graphic.
Amazing that we're so close to one stop (if desireable is questionable) but from 28 to 2 stops in under 100 years is amazing, isn't it?

The world has gotten so much smaller in the last century.

Regds
jush



There is one problem with airbus. Though their products are engineering marvels they lack passion, completely.
User currently offlineGemuser From Australia, joined Nov 2003, 5552 posts, RR: 6
Reply 5, posted (8 years 4 months 2 weeks 3 days 22 hours ago) and read 9905 times:

Felix

Thank you very much for plotting the route. It looks fantastic!

Gemuser



DC23468910;B72172273373G73873H74374475275376377L77W;A319 320321332333343;BAe146;C402;DHC6;F27;L188;MD80MD85
User currently offlineMatt27 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 6, posted (8 years 4 months 2 weeks 3 days 22 hours ago) and read 9897 times:

Quoting FelixZRH (Reply 1):
So I tried to visualize this route:

Thank's Felix  bigthumbsup  it looks great.


User currently offlineCricket From India, joined Aug 2005, 2964 posts, RR: 7
Reply 7, posted (8 years 4 months 2 weeks 3 days 22 hours ago) and read 9860 times:

Imagine, sixty five years ago we spoke of range in hundreds of KM, now range is dealt in tens of thousands of KM. Wow! I'm amazed, but I wonder where the plane landed in Gwalior, there are no major lakes/rivers around the fort city, or it might have landed somewhere close to the city. Anyway, did the plane also fly through the night, or did it halt the night at a city?


A300B2/B4/6R, A313, A319/320/321, A333, A343, A388, 737-2/3/4/7/8/9, 747-3/4, 772/2E/2L/3, E170/190, F70, CR2/7, 146-3,
User currently offlineA319XFW From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 8, posted (8 years 4 months 2 weeks 3 days 22 hours ago) and read 9842 times:

But probably the people who could afford to even fly that trip would be the people who would afford to fly it non stop now  Smile
The poor would have had to go by boat, just like now they would have to stop on the way somewhere  Smile


User currently offlineRP TPA From United States of America, joined Oct 1999, 852 posts, RR: 0
Reply 9, posted (8 years 4 months 2 weeks 3 days 21 hours ago) and read 9744 times:

If Southwest were to ever fly SYD-LHR, the 26-stop itinerary would sound just about right!!  Smile

User currently offlineKen777 From United States of America, joined Mar 2004, 8045 posts, RR: 8
Reply 10, posted (8 years 4 months 2 weeks 3 days 15 hours ago) and read 9436 times:

I moved to RTW flights several years ago over TUL-SYD-TUL so I would have a chance to see the world instead of just water. What I get these days is nothing like the 26 stops on a SYD-LHR in 1939. I would love to know what those flights cost in today's dollars.

User currently offlineCalvin99 From Hong Kong, joined Sep 2001, 224 posts, RR: 0
Reply 11, posted (8 years 4 months 2 weeks 3 days 14 hours ago) and read 9370 times:

Wow, thanks for posting the routing. It is very informative and interesting!!

User currently offlineMorvious From Netherlands, joined Feb 2005, 705 posts, RR: 1
Reply 12, posted (8 years 4 months 2 weeks 3 days 14 hours ago) and read 9236 times:

I would not be so happy about non stop flight this long, but this is just a personal feeling.

But 26 stops for a route like that is just a little to much  Smile

Thanks for posting, its hard to beleve nowadays things were that different only a "few" years back!



have a good day, Stefan van Hierden
User currently offlineTimz From United States of America, joined Sep 1999, 6708 posts, RR: 7
Reply 13, posted (8 years 4 months 2 weeks 3 days 14 hours ago) and read 9093 times:

Quoting Cricket (Reply 7):
Anyway, did the plane also fly through the night, or did it halt the night at a city?

That's why it took nine days, because they stayed in hotels (?) overnight.


User currently offlineTinkerBelle From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 14, posted (8 years 4 months 2 weeks 3 days 13 hours ago) and read 8778 times:

Woow! Quite interesting.. It's amazing what new technology has brought us in this day and age.

User currently offlineGemuser From Australia, joined Nov 2003, 5552 posts, RR: 6
Reply 15, posted (8 years 4 months 2 weeks 3 days 12 hours ago) and read 8179 times:

Quoting Timz (Reply 13):
Quoting Cricket (Reply 7):
Anyway, did the plane also fly through the night, or did it halt the night at a city?

That's why it took nine days, because they stayed in hotels (?) overnight.

AFAIK there are no routine night landings in flying boats, because it is just about impossiable for the pilot to actually see the surface of the water and so flare the aircraft.

Night take offs on the other hand were routine, I have had the JOY of flying a Shorts S25 with Ansett Flying Boat Services SWA - LHI (Sydney Water Airport(Rose Bay) - Lord Howe Island) and we left SWA at 2:00am (to catch the tide at the island) Without a doubt my most increadable flying exprience.
The QF wartime service PER-CMB also used night take offs to avoid day time heat.

On the QF/IA service the pax stayed at hotels overnight where they existed, in a few locations the airlines actually built guest houses because suitable accommodations were not available. Sourabaya rings a bell and I am sure there was at least one in India and some in the Midle East.


Gemuser



DC23468910;B72172273373G73873H74374475275376377L77W;A319 320321332333343;BAe146;C402;DHC6;F27;L188;MD80MD85
User currently offlineAircellist From Canada, joined Oct 2004, 1630 posts, RR: 8
Reply 16, posted (8 years 4 months 2 weeks 3 days 8 hours ago) and read 6523 times:

Thanks Gmuser, for that thread.

Yes, please, show us the other routes... Do you have AF's South American routes as well, and PanAm's first transatlantic service?


User currently offlinePzurita1 From Greenland, joined Sep 2002, 1386 posts, RR: 14
Reply 17, posted (8 years 4 months 2 weeks 2 days 18 hours ago) and read 4655 times:

Gmuser,
Some times those timetables also included tickets costs. could you post them in case they were included? If in Sterlings I could post them in current terms.
I am quite very sure that ticket would cost much more than a first class tickets on the some route nowadas.

PZ



Next flight: IAH-DBX-MRU-ANT
User currently offlineTimz From United States of America, joined Sep 1999, 6708 posts, RR: 7
Reply 18, posted (8 years 4 months 2 weeks 1 day 15 hours ago) and read 4444 times:

In 1939 KLM/KNILM charged 160 pounds London to Sydney; likely Imperial was the same. The DC-3s got there a bit faster than the Shorts.

User currently offlineRichierich From United States of America, joined Nov 2000, 4199 posts, RR: 6
Reply 19, posted (8 years 4 months 2 weeks 1 day 12 hours ago) and read 4359 times:

How long would LHR-SYD have taken in Concorde, and how many stops would it have taken?

I know I am ignoring little things like noise pollution and sonic booms, etc. but just curious.



None shall pass!!!!
User currently offlineGemuser From Australia, joined Nov 2003, 5552 posts, RR: 6
Reply 20, posted (8 years 4 months 2 weeks 1 day 12 hours ago) and read 4348 times:

Quoting Aircellist (Reply 16):
Yes, please, show us the other routes... Do you have AF's South American routes as well, and PanAm's first transatlantic service?

Sorry nothing for the North Atlantic and the only South American service is :

"Timetable of the "Zeppelin" Airships"
South America:

Friedrichshafen/Frankfort Dep Wednesday evening
Pernambuco/Recife Arr Saturday evening
Rio de Janerio Arr Sunday evening
Buenos Aires Arr Tuesday [via aeroplane connection of Syndicato Condor Ltda from Pernambuco.]

Return
Buenos Aires Dep Tuesday [via aeroplane connection of Syndicato Condor Ltda to Pernambuco.]
Rio Dep Wednesday evening
Pernambuco/Recife Dep Thursday evening
Frankfort Arr Monday evening

North American Service (Lakehurst)
Suspended until further notice

I will post the KLM/KNILM service to Batavia/Sydney and the Air France service to Saigon etc in seperate messages shortly.

Pzurita1 - Sorry there is no fare info included.

I should have mentioned it before, all timetables are from faxsimile reprint of the August 1939 edition of Cooks Continental Timetable published in 1987 by David & Charles Publishers plc.

Gemuser



DC23468910;B72172273373G73873H74374475275376377L77W;A319 320321332333343;BAe146;C402;DHC6;F27;L188;MD80MD85
User currently offlineBabybus From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 21, posted (8 years 4 months 2 weeks 1 day 12 hours ago) and read 4340 times:

This information is really interesting.

Don't suppose you have a timetable for UK-OZ in the 1970's as I think even then they had several interesting stops en route.

Cheers


User currently offlinePe@rson From United Kingdom, joined Jan 2001, 19097 posts, RR: 53
Reply 22, posted (8 years 4 months 2 weeks 20 hours ago) and read 4186 times:

Thanks for that; I found it informative and fascinating.

Do you know the actual routing(s) for UK-South Africa?

Wouldn't it be fabulous if a one-off spotters' flight restepping the 26 stops from the UK to Australia existed using an old aircraft?



"Everyone writing for the Telegraph knows that the way to grab eyeballs is with Ryanair and/or sex."
User currently offlinePzurita1 From Greenland, joined Sep 2002, 1386 posts, RR: 14
Reply 23, posted (8 years 4 months 2 weeks 15 hours ago) and read 4064 times:

Quoting Timz (Reply 18):
In 1939 KLM/KNILM charged 160 pounds London to Sydney;

if that price is correct, then in current terms that tix would cost 6,615 sterling, or US$11,578 . Not bad considering that you can get a First Class ticket flyign CX for less than US$9,500.

Here a good link if you want to know how much is worth anything in current terms since 13th century: http://eh.net/hmit/ppowerbp/

PZ



Next flight: IAH-DBX-MRU-ANT
User currently offlineTimz From United States of America, joined Sep 1999, 6708 posts, RR: 7
Reply 24, posted (8 years 4 months 2 weeks 14 hours ago) and read 4025 times:

In 1947 London-Sydney fare was 260 pounds on the flying boats, or 300 pounds on the converted Lancasters, which took something less than half the time. (London-Singapore was a 2-stop for them.)

25 RichardJF : Not far off the fare's EK is talking about now
26 Pzurita1 : Or 6,598 pounds of 2004.... Which seems rather consistent with 1939 KL services from London-Sydney.
27 Gemuser : Guy I have moved all non Oz-UK timetables to a more appriprately titled thread "Long Haul Timetables In August 1939" Pe@rson I'll be posting Southampt
28 Gemuser : The plan was LHR-BAH-CMB-SIN-MEL and about 12 hours, BUT I can not remember if that was total or flight time. A special SuperSonic Flight corridor wa
Top Of Page
Forum Index

This topic is archived and can not be replied to any more.

Printer friendly format

Similar topics:More similar topics...
BA LHR-PHL Stop In YQX posted Sat Aug 12 2006 03:25:43 by YULYMX
LHR - SYD February 2006: When To Book? posted Wed Dec 14 2005 11:23:53 by Joshdean
QF187, SYD - HKG, Why Did It Stop In Darwin? posted Sun May 26 2002 06:14:11 by Hkgspotter1
Advice - Transfer At LHR From CX To BA posted Sun Sep 24 2006 13:16:20 by DernierVirage
AA109 (LHR-BOS) Returns To LHR (security Reason) posted Mon Aug 7 2006 21:03:14 by BMIFlyer
BA LHR-PEK Diverted To DME. Why? posted Sun May 21 2006 14:05:02 by Summa767
When Will LHR Open Up To DL/NW/US Etc posted Fri May 19 2006 11:17:55 by BHXDTW
Comparative Costs Operating 744 And 772ER SYD-LHR posted Mon Apr 10 2006 06:56:43 by KiwiinOz
LHR: Oneworld Carriers To Be In T3 & T5 posted Tue Mar 14 2006 09:26:36 by Scotron11
SYD-LHR Eastbound? posted Mon Dec 26 2005 05:22:56 by Max Q