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Jetstar To The USA Imminently  
User currently offlineAussie_ From Australia, joined Dec 2000, 1766 posts, RR: 5
Posted (8 years 11 months 2 weeks 4 days 8 hours ago) and read 5265 times:

Sydney Morning Herald article

25 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineRichardJF From New Zealand, joined Mar 2001, 792 posts, RR: 0
Reply 1, posted (8 years 11 months 2 weeks 4 days 8 hours ago) and read 5221 times:

On the surface it's trying to see off competition but in reality Qantas workers are going have to accept Jetstar wages and conditions. Nobody should think this is about expanding the Jetstar brand.
Unfortunately Dixon looks at Air Canada which is the closest comparision to Qantas and thinks I've got to get the wages down here.


User currently offlineKahala777 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 2, posted (8 years 11 months 2 weeks 4 days 8 hours ago) and read 5192 times:

Have a hunch that we will be seeing JetStar and the likes of:

BNE-LAX
CNS-LAX
SYD-HNL
SYD-LAS
MEL-HNL

KAHALA777

[Edited 2005-12-14 23:03:05]

User currently offlineOnedude From United States of America, joined Apr 2005, 214 posts, RR: 0
Reply 3, posted (8 years 11 months 2 weeks 4 days 8 hours ago) and read 5127 times:

Hi Kahala777,

Quoting Kahala777 (Reply 2):
Have a hunch that we will be seeing JetStar and the likes of:

BNE-LAX
CNS-LAX
SYD-HNL
SYD-LAS
MEL-HNL

The premium cabins on BNE/LAX derive a pretty good yield for QF - there is no way they would have increased these services recently just for leisure traffic and the leisure airfares paid. I also don't think there is enough O&D market for Jetstar into Vegas. But I agree with you that HNL will see increased traffic, and could even become a hub for Jetstar offering one stop services to North America as not to cannibalise the QF premium nonstop services.


User currently offlineGemuser From Australia, joined Nov 2003, 5762 posts, RR: 6
Reply 4, posted (8 years 11 months 2 weeks 4 days 7 hours ago) and read 5027 times:

Quoting Kahala777 (Reply 2):
Have a hunch that we will be seeing JetStar and the likes of:

BNE-LAX
CNS-LAX
SYD-HNL
SYD-LAS
MEL-HNL



Quoting Onedude (Reply 3):
But I agree with you that HNL will see increased traffic, and could even become a hub for Jetstar offering one stop services to North America as not to cannibalise the QF premium nonstop services.

Definitely NOT BNE-LAX, that will stay mainline.
CNS-LAX seems unlikley, but BNE/CNS/SYD/MEL-HNL-US West Coast, NOTLAX seems very doable. SYD-LAS seems unlikley but again HNL-LAS has possiabilities.

A HNL hub for JQ seems like a very good idea, sort of a leisure counterpart to SIN. Could even see ADL/PER - HNL on the west and SEA/SFO/PHX/LAS/SAN/ PDX/YVR/Banff on the east, eventually.

Maybe even SIN-HNL!!!

Gemuser



DC23468910;B72172273373G73873H74374475275376377L77W;A319 320321332333343;BAe146;C402;DHC6;F27;L188;MD80MD85
User currently offlineSFORunner From United States of America, joined Jul 2004, 325 posts, RR: 0
Reply 5, posted (8 years 11 months 2 weeks 4 days 6 hours ago) and read 4990 times:

Qantas chief executive Geoff Dixon said Jetstar would line up against its parent airline on US routes "in the immediate future " � well before the introduction of the new planes. The 787s will revolutionise the economics of the airline, allowing it to operate more direct services to Asia and North America.

Your typical A330 can't make SYD - LAX/SFO, so perhaps is talking SYD - HNL.

Alternatively, some 747s will be making their way down to Jetstar.


User currently offlineGemuser From Australia, joined Nov 2003, 5762 posts, RR: 6
Reply 6, posted (8 years 11 months 2 weeks 4 days 6 hours ago) and read 4910 times:

Quoting SFORunner (Reply 5):
Qantas chief executive Geoff Dixon said Jetstar would line up against its parent airline on US routes "in the immediate future " � well before the introduction of the new planes. The 787s will revolutionise the economics of the airline, allowing it to operate more direct services to Asia and North America.

Your typical A330 can't make SYD - LAX/SFO, so perhaps is talking SYD - HNL.

Alternatively, some 747s will be making their way down to Jetstar.

Initial JQ routes are up to 10 hrs, so no LAX, but HNL fits right in!

Very, very seriously doubt that JQ will operate ANY new type before the 787. The A332 will be operated by QF on behalf of JQ, so dont expect them to last very long once the 787 arrive.

Gemuser



DC23468910;B72172273373G73873H74374475275376377L77W;A319 320321332333343;BAe146;C402;DHC6;F27;L188;MD80MD85
User currently offlineHKGKaiTak From Australia, joined Jun 2005, 1050 posts, RR: 0
Reply 7, posted (8 years 11 months 2 weeks 4 days 4 hours ago) and read 4777 times:

Quoting Gemuser (Reply 4):
A HNL hub for JQ seems like a very good idea, sort of a leisure counterpart to SIN. Could even see ADL/PER - HNL on the west and SEA/SFO/PHX/LAS/SAN/ PDX/YVR/Banff on the east, eventually.

An HNL hub does sound good ...

I would however love to see JQ land in Banff ... maybe it is possible on the Trans-Canada Highway but certainly not on the short grass airstrip in the town! Are you thinking about YYC?

(As a one-time Alberta Rockies resident I would love to see an Australian airline flying to YYC)

Btw has anybody noticed on the Boeing Media site there is a 787 computer image for Jetstar, and a slightly different image for Jetstar International?

Hmmmmmmm ...



4 Engines 4 LongHaul
User currently offlineRoseFlyer From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 9697 posts, RR: 52
Reply 8, posted (8 years 11 months 2 weeks 4 days 3 hours ago) and read 4707 times:

Quoting Gemuser (Reply 4):
A HNL hub for JQ seems like a very good idea, sort of a leisure counterpart to SIN. Could even see ADL/PER - HNL on the west and SEA/SFO/PHX/LAS/SAN/ PDX/YVR/Banff on the east, eventually.

I struggle to think that they could ever make a hub out of HNL since there are no rights to traffic between the Hawaii and the mainland meaning that they would have to connect everyone. That seems a little difficult. But service to HNL as a destination makes some sense especially if there was a codeshare on HA for continuing services to other US destinations.



If you have never designed an airplane part before, let the real designers do the work!
User currently offlineIkramerica From United States of America, joined May 2005, 21562 posts, RR: 59
Reply 9, posted (8 years 11 months 2 weeks 4 days 3 hours ago) and read 4683 times:

Quoting Onedude (Reply 3):
I also don't think there is enough O&D market for Jetstar into Vegas

You are kidding, right?

Quoting RoseFlyer (Reply 8):
I struggle to think that they could ever make a hub out of HNL since there are no rights to traffic between the Hawaii and the mainland meaning that they would have to connect everyone.

Plus it makes absolutely no sense for CO to do this, so it makes less sense for JQ since they can't do US domestic...  Wink



Of all the things to worry about... the Wookie has no pants.
User currently offlineOnedude From United States of America, joined Apr 2005, 214 posts, RR: 0
Reply 10, posted (8 years 11 months 2 weeks 4 days 3 hours ago) and read 4683 times:

Quoting RoseFlyer (Reply 8):
I struggle to think that they could ever make a hub out of HNL since there are no rights to traffic between the Hawaii and the mainland

Can someone clarify this? I would find it unusual seeing QF were always able to pickup and dropoff pax when they flew to the US via HNL only not that long ago?


User currently offlineAussie_ From Australia, joined Dec 2000, 1766 posts, RR: 5
Reply 11, posted (8 years 11 months 2 weeks 4 days 3 hours ago) and read 4647 times:

Quoting RoseFlyer (Reply 8):
I struggle to think that they could ever make a hub out of HNL since there are no rights to traffic between the Hawaii and the mainland meaning that they would have to connect everyone. That seems a little difficult. But service to HNL as a destination makes some sense especially if there was a codeshare on HA for continuing services to other US destinations.

Qantas has already operated a HNL hub in the past, albeit smaller than suggested here. Their 747s and 767s would meet at HNL exchange pax and continue to LAX and SFO. I experienced this around 1990 when flying on a SYD-NAN-HNL-LAX flight on a 747-200Combi... At HNL was a 767-300 going to SFO. Those were the days...


User currently offlinePlanemanofnz From New Zealand, joined Sep 2005, 1676 posts, RR: 0
Reply 12, posted (8 years 11 months 2 weeks 4 days 3 hours ago) and read 4621 times:

What about the AKL-LAX route. Jetstar could even operate AKL-HNL as there is talk NZ will pull out of the route and instead fly to Vancouver.

User currently offlineIkramerica From United States of America, joined May 2005, 21562 posts, RR: 59
Reply 13, posted (8 years 11 months 2 weeks 4 days 3 hours ago) and read 4620 times:

Quoting Onedude (Reply 10):
Can someone clarify this? I would find it unusual seeing QF were always able to pickup and dropoff pax when they flew to the US via HNL only not that long ago?

The rules, as I understand them are that you can transfer pax from one flight to the other, and that AUSTRALIA originating pax can "stopover" in HNL or LAX without being considered domestic pax. So you can go MEL-LAX, then later LAX-JFK on QF metal, then return JFK-LAX-MEL, changing QF planes in LAX, and never be considered a domestic passenger nor being required to fly on AA for any segment.

I could be wrong, but that's how I understand it from an Australian friend of mine who flies that way sometimes.

A US citizen originating in the New York can not do this, however. They must fly AA on the domestic leg if they don't continue on to/from Oz immediately, but can fly QF JFK-SYD if they only connect in LAX and don't stay in the city for more than 4 hours (excluding delays).



Of all the things to worry about... the Wookie has no pants.
User currently offlinePlanemanofnz From New Zealand, joined Sep 2005, 1676 posts, RR: 0
Reply 14, posted (8 years 11 months 2 weeks 4 days 3 hours ago) and read 4601 times:

Quoting Ikramerica (Reply 13):
A US citizen originating in the New York can not do this, however. They must fly AA on the domestic leg if they don't continue on to/from Oz immediately

How about connecting on the LAX-AKL flight?


User currently offlineQF108 From New Zealand, joined Oct 2005, 335 posts, RR: 1
Reply 15, posted (8 years 11 months 2 weeks 4 days 3 hours ago) and read 4587 times:

Is this announcement by QF/Jetstar International going to affect the QF/AA codeshare especially if Jetstar starts Australia-HNL-LAS (for example) , as it is now unless you are flying to JFK all Australian connecting passengers arrive into LAX and 'most' that are connecting use AA, I was just curious to know if you believe that this news is going to affect that alliance somewhat ? I am totally unsure how much revenue QF connecting passengers bring to AA and vice versa ?


Blessed are the Cheesemakers !
User currently offlineOnedude From United States of America, joined Apr 2005, 214 posts, RR: 0
Reply 16, posted (8 years 11 months 2 weeks 4 days 2 hours ago) and read 4559 times:

Quoting QF108 (Reply 15):
I am totally unsure how much revenue QF connecting passengers bring to AA and vice versa ?

Based on data from 2002, AA provides QF with 1 in 3 pax transferring AA/QF at LAX. So it is significant.


User currently offlineGemuser From Australia, joined Nov 2003, 5762 posts, RR: 6
Reply 17, posted (8 years 11 months 2 weeks 4 days 2 hours ago) and read 4482 times:

Quoting Ikramerica (Reply 13):
A US citizen originating in the New York can not do this, however. They must fly AA on the domestic leg if they don't continue on to/from Oz immediately, but can fly QF JFK-SYD if they only connect in LAX and don't stay in the city for more than 4 hours (excluding delays).

Doubt this, unless its a post 9/11 thing.

Orginating in NY, reguardless of citizenship, you can travel JFK-LAX with QF, and stop over in LAX within the validity of the ticket, provided you hold & have paid for a ticket continuing on from LAX with QF to another country. Have never heard of a stop over time limit at LAX.

In the seventies a very common routing was SYD-LAX (BA) stopover 1 week, LAX-JFK (BA), end point, JFK-SFO (QF) stopover 1 week, SFO-HNL (QF) stop over 4 days HNL-SYD (QF) or in the reverse direction. Booked it many times, for pax orginating in SYD, NYC & LON.

Quoting Ikramerica (Reply 9):
Plus it makes absolutely no sense for CO to do this, so it makes less sense for JQ since they can't do US domestic

It could make sence for JQ, without domestic feed and for YVR they would have US/Canada feed. A plausable hub is say 3 787 arrive from Oz at a common time, say one from SYD, MEL and somewhere else (choice of BNE,CNS, ADL, PER, & AKL if NZ pull out) Then 2 or 3 of them fly on to a choice of YVR, whatever the airport is for Banff, SEA, PDX, some where in Idaho/Montana, Reno, LAS, or SAN, all very popular tourist desternations for Ozzies. Services NOT daily and very seasonal

Obviously will not develope over night and has some problems matching deman on each sector and from season to season, but at LCC fare levels that increase demad a lot, NOT impossible.


Gemuser



DC23468910;B72172273373G73873H74374475275376377L77W;A319 320321332333343;BAe146;C402;DHC6;F27;L188;MD80MD85
User currently offlineRoseFlyer From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 9697 posts, RR: 52
Reply 18, posted (8 years 11 months 2 weeks 3 days 17 hours ago) and read 4260 times:

Quoting Aussie_ (Reply 11):
Qantas has already operated a HNL hub in the past, albeit smaller than suggested here. Their 747s and 767s would meet at HNL exchange pax and continue to LAX and SFO. I experienced this around 1990 when flying on a SYD-NAN-HNL-LAX flight on a 747-200Combi... At HNL was a 767-300 going to SFO. Those were the days...

Those were the days when jets could not operate nonstop between the US mainland and Australia. Since the planes did not have the range, they would stopover in places like Hawaii, Tahiti or Fiji. With longer range planes stopovers in HNL serve no purpose and passengers don't like them.

Quoting Planemanofnz (Reply 14):
How about connecting on the LAX-AKL flight?

To clearly answer your question yes you can connect onwards to any QF international flight. If QF were to start LAX-YVR then you could fly them JFK-LAX-YVR. They just can't take passengers originating in the US and destined for the US.

Quoting Gemuser (Reply 17):
It could make sence for JQ, without domestic feed and for YVR they would have US/Canada feed. A plausable hub is say 3 787 arrive from Oz at a common time, say one from SYD, MEL and somewhere else (choice of BNE,CNS, ADL, PER, & AKL if NZ pull out) Then 2 or 3 of them fly on to a choice of YVR, whatever the airport is for Banff, SEA, PDX, some where in Idaho/Montana, Reno, LAS, or SAN, all very popular tourist desternations for Ozzies. Services NOT daily and very seasonal

Why on earth would they do that? If they really want to get into those smaller markets, they don't need to fly to all of them. If they had local traffic rights, then sure it could be a great move, but unless Australia or some other country does a hostile takeover of Hawaii, then it isn't happening.

In the days of codeshares all they have to do is run a couple widebodies to HNL and then place their code on HA or AQ flights to all of those cities. HA or AQ is much better suited because I seriously doubt you can get enough passengers to fly via HNL to fill up connecting flights. It would be an expensive operation. Passengers going to SEA/RNO/PDX/YVR etc can all fly on QF (or UA) to SYD and then connect onwards to those cities on AA or AS from LAX.



If you have never designed an airplane part before, let the real designers do the work!
User currently offlineGemuser From Australia, joined Nov 2003, 5762 posts, RR: 6
Reply 19, posted (8 years 11 months 2 weeks 3 days 1 hour ago) and read 3227 times:

Quoting RoseFlyer (Reply 18):
n the days of codeshares all they have to do is run a couple widebodies to HNL and then place their code on HA or AQ flights to all of those cities. HA or AQ is much better suited because I seriously doubt you can get enough passengers to fly via HNL to fill up connecting flights. It would be an expensive operation. Passengers going to SEA/RNO/PDX/YVR etc can all fly on QF (or UA) to SYD and then connect onwards to those cities on AA or AS from LAX.

Code share are a good possiability I forgot.

Pax flying with JQ WILL NOT have the option of flying the non stops to LAX/SFO, thats the point. This is new pax traffic at LCC fare levels, at ordinary QF fare levels these people are not travelling trans pacific, trans tasman maybe, trans pacific NO.

Gemuser



DC23468910;B72172273373G73873H74374475275376377L77W;A319 320321332333343;BAe146;C402;DHC6;F27;L188;MD80MD85
User currently offlineB787 From Australia, joined May 2005, 155 posts, RR: 0
Reply 20, posted (8 years 11 months 2 weeks 3 days 1 hour ago) and read 3212 times:

How about JQ SYD/MEL - HNL - YVR. QF are only operating into YVR for a short time, as an extension of their new SFO service.

User currently offlineMiami1 From Australia, joined Feb 2001, 706 posts, RR: 0
Reply 21, posted (8 years 11 months 2 weeks 2 days 22 hours ago) and read 3117 times:

Quoting Gemuser (Reply 6):
Very, very seriously doubt that JQ will operate ANY new type before the 787. The A332 will be operated by QF on behalf of JQ,

That is a pretty bold statement. Got anything to back that up?


User currently offlineBNE From Australia, joined Mar 2000, 3188 posts, RR: 12
Reply 22, posted (8 years 11 months 2 weeks 2 days 19 hours ago) and read 3033 times:

Quoting SFORunner (Reply 5):
Alternatively, some 747s will be making their way down to Jetstar.

Jetstar won't be operating any 747s. A330-200s will be used for flights within 10 hours of Australia. The 787-800 will have 747 range without the capacity that goes with it.

Quoting HKGKaiTak (Reply 7):
An HNL hub does sound good ...

Sounds like a waste of resources. The idea of the 787 is to bypass a hub and go point to point.



Why fly non stop when you can connect
User currently offlineClassicLover From Ireland, joined Mar 2004, 4656 posts, RR: 23
Reply 23, posted (8 years 11 months 2 weeks 2 days 18 hours ago) and read 3004 times:

Quoting BNE (Reply 22):
Jetstar won't be operating any 747s. A330-200s will be used for flights within 10 hours of Australia. The 787-800 will have 747 range without the capacity that goes with it.

Exactly.

JQ will probably take HNL from QF to better compete with HA. I also think they will serve YVR daily once the 787s come in. I don't think you will see much action in North America apart from this.

However -

I am going out on a limb with a total guess, but it might make sense for QF to configure the 380s and 744s with F, J, and Y+ only, and leave the standard Y to Jetstar... always possible!

I expect we'd see more flights to Indian cities, Chinese cities, and other Asian destinations first. We only have to wait 2 or so years before finding out definitively  Smile

Trent.



I do quite enjoy a spot of flying - more so when it's not in Economy!
User currently offlineMiami1 From Australia, joined Feb 2001, 706 posts, RR: 0
Reply 24, posted (8 years 11 months 2 weeks 2 days 16 hours ago) and read 2968 times:

Jetstar International will obviously open up new routes currently not operated by mainline QF then in the next 2 to 4 years take over non trunk routes IE SYD - HNL . Dixon and his predecessor will use JQ to restructure mailine QF operations rather than a distinct over all massive pay cut , remember that QF are incredibly marketeting sensitive and paranoid, dixon has been quoted in the past as saying that he wants to see QF mainline only fly to hub cities ie: LHR , LAX, SIN ETC ETC. JQ is a very clever marketing tool , Dixon isnt going to jeopodise too much with mainline, his politician, lawyer, big business mates stand to lose to much from the kick backs he has obviously promised them.

User currently offlineDon81603 From Canada, joined Jul 2005, 1185 posts, RR: 0
Reply 25, posted (8 years 11 months 2 weeks 2 days 16 hours ago) and read 2953 times:

Quoting Planemanofnz (Reply 12):
What about the AKL-LAX route. Jetstar could even operate AKL-HNL as there is talk NZ will pull out of the route and instead fly to Vancouver.

I would LOVE to see a non-stop Canada-Australia! AC has a pseudo n/s, with a stop in HNL for fuel.

Quoting Gemuser (Reply 17):
A US citizen originating in the New York can not do this, however. They must fly AA on the domestic leg if they don't continue on to/from Oz immediately, but can fly QF JFK-SYD if they only connect in LAX and don't stay in the city for more than 4 hours (excluding delays).

The legal issue with QF hauling pax from JFK to LAX is since they (QF) are a foreign based business, they are legally prohibited from domestic US traffic (IE if you get onboard at JFK, then you can not get off in LAX, you must stay onboard for the duration) even if the pax are eventually continuing internationally. Customs has no problems with it, as they see it as an incidental international flight, but Immigration sees it as a domestic flight. I deal with these types of US Customs VS Immigration issues all the time. One sees international the other only sees the domestic leg. Ah, the joys of government
 banghead 



Eagles may soar, but weasels don't get sucked into jet engines.
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