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Airlines And Their Order Mistakes!  
User currently offlineIrishpower From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 385 posts, RR: 0
Posted (8 years 7 months 2 weeks 3 days 10 hours ago) and read 14265 times:

First off this is NOT to turn into an A vs. B thread.

I was just wondering what some off the biggest mistakes have been by airlines and the different types of aircraft they have ordered? What should they have done?

For example did PA order too many 747's back in the day (they had a hard time staying profitable during the oil crisis of the 1970's).
Should they have ordered the 767 or 757 back when they had a chance?

What are some other historical errors????

129 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineEHHO From Bulgaria, joined Dec 2005, 815 posts, RR: 7
Reply 1, posted (8 years 7 months 2 weeks 3 days 9 hours ago) and read 14198 times:

Quoting Irishpower (Thread starter):
First off this is NOT to turn into an A vs. B thread.

Yeah right.

Well, few other suggestions: SU 772s, KL 763s (should've gone for A330 straight away).. LOT should have got themselves a few 772s.. would be making good profit out of ORD and JFK

 twocents 



"Get your facts first. Then you may distort them as much as you please" -- Mark Twain
User currently offlineVegasplanes From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 778 posts, RR: 2
Reply 2, posted (8 years 7 months 2 weeks 3 days 9 hours ago) and read 14186 times:

AA retiring it's 717's and F100's, no 100 seaters for AA or Eagle.

CO, EA, AA, DL, National ordering 747's in the early 70's.

AA and DL with the MD-11

DL and the MD-90

HP picking up used 747's

WN and the 727

Hind-sight is normally pretty accurate  Wink


User currently offlineLindy Field From United States of America, joined Mar 2001, 3116 posts, RR: 14
Reply 3, posted (8 years 7 months 2 weeks 3 days 9 hours ago) and read 14183 times:
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Delta certainly blew it when they replaced Pan Am's A310s with factory-new A310s, only to replace them a few years later with 767-300ERs.

National, Delta, and Continental didn't do too well with their original orders for 747-100s, nor did PSA with its L-1011s.


User currently offlineUpperDeck79 From Finland, joined Feb 2005, 1139 posts, RR: 2
Reply 4, posted (8 years 7 months 2 weeks 3 days 8 hours ago) and read 14172 times:

Quoting Vegasplanes (Reply 2):
CO, EA, AA, DL, National ordering 747's in the early 70's.

Add SAS to that. Although I'm not sure when they acually ordered them - a long time ago anyway.



AY and ANA rock!
User currently offlineDean From Hungary, joined Apr 2005, 216 posts, RR: 1
Reply 5, posted (8 years 7 months 2 weeks 3 days 8 hours ago) and read 14091 times:

MA (Malev) ordered 4 CRJ200s couple of years ago. Embraer gave a better deal, but they ordered the CRJs, nobody konows why. Nowadays those jets are few years old and they want to sell them due to high costs of operation.
Also I think the 762 was a bad choice, 763 would be more efficent!

OS with their A340s.

AC A345s.


User currently offline777ER From New Zealand, joined Dec 2003, 12082 posts, RR: 18
Reply 6, posted (8 years 7 months 2 weeks 3 days 7 hours ago) and read 14063 times:
AIRLINERS.NET CREW
FORUM MODERATOR

QF and their A330s, mostly cause of the A332s on domestic

User currently offlineDoona From Sweden, joined Feb 2005, 3764 posts, RR: 13
Reply 7, posted (8 years 7 months 2 weeks 3 days 7 hours ago) and read 14044 times:

Quoting UpperDeck79 (Reply 4):
Add SAS to that. Although I'm not sure when they acually ordered them - a long time ago anyway.

SAS has a few more mistakes, IMO. Trying to replace their MD-80s with lots of 737NGs. Still, lots of MDs are still in service, along with A321s. And AFAIK, there are A319s on the way as well... Looks to me as if they should have gone with the A320 family from the beginning...

Cheers
Mats



Sure, we're concerned for our lives. Just not as concerned as saving 9 bucks on a roundtrip to Ft. Myers.
User currently offlineMX757 From United States of America, joined Aug 2005, 628 posts, RR: 12
Reply 8, posted (8 years 7 months 2 weeks 3 days 6 hours ago) and read 13948 times:

CO taking EA's A300's after the latter folded in the early 90's.


Is it broke...? Yeah I'll fix it.
User currently offlineManni From South Korea, joined Nov 2001, 4221 posts, RR: 23
Reply 9, posted (8 years 7 months 2 weeks 3 days 5 hours ago) and read 13909 times:

South African ordering the 737NG, only to replace them with the A320 before they're all delivered.


SUPPORT THE LEBANESE CIVILIANS
User currently offlinePSAjet17 From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 326 posts, RR: 0
Reply 10, posted (8 years 7 months 2 weeks 3 days 5 hours ago) and read 13843 times:

PSA ordering five specially modified L-1011s in the 70s.

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Photo © Steve Williams



User currently offlineRaggi From Norway, joined Oct 2000, 998 posts, RR: 1
Reply 11, posted (8 years 7 months 2 weeks 3 days 4 hours ago) and read 13776 times:

BU ordered a couple of 767s in the 80s I think, they didn't last long.


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Photo © Kjell nilsson



Not the right metal for BU, but they sure looked good!

raggi



Stick & Rudder
User currently offlineBreiz From France, joined Mar 2005, 1915 posts, RR: 2
Reply 12, posted (8 years 7 months 2 weeks 3 days 4 hours ago) and read 13753 times:

Braathens S.A.F.E. and the B767-200 in the '90s,
Air Inter and the A330, in 89 (order),
both too big for the respective networks, and expected passenger loads did not materialize.


User currently offlineDutchjet From Netherlands, joined Oct 2000, 7864 posts, RR: 57
Reply 13, posted (8 years 7 months 2 weeks 3 days 4 hours ago) and read 13732 times:

As pointed out above, in the late 1960s, most US carriers went on a widebody buying spree ordering lots of 747s, L1011s and DC10s that they simply did not need and could not fill......DL, EA, NA, PS, CO, AA and all of the rest come to mind.

DL adding to the A310 fleet that it inherited from Pan Am comes to mind......shortly aftet the new A313s were delivered, DL made the decision to make the 763ER is primarly longhaul airliner.

And, we cant forget the SQ fiasco with the A343......due to a very good offer from Boeing, SQ decided to phase the type out in favor of the 777 before SQ accepted delivery of the last few A343s it had on order.

AerLingus ordered 763ERs and quickly eliminated the type from their fleet.

And, SAS has never been very happy with the 736......although it was the launch customer for the type.


User currently offlineSrbmod From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 14, posted (8 years 7 months 2 weeks 3 days 3 hours ago) and read 13662 times:

Quoting Vegasplanes (Reply 2):

AA and DL with the MD-11

DL and the MD-90

So the MD-11 didn't live up to the range projections MDD have sold them on, you can't blame DL and AA on that. DL used the MD-11 for well over a dozen years, so I wouldn't call that a mistake. As for the MD-90, DL had originally planned on the MD-90 to be their 727 replacement. But it was the teething problems of the a/c (along with some $$$ issues @ DL at the time) that doomed it to becoming a small niche fleet @ DL; so you could really blame MDD on that one as well.

Quoting Vegasplanes (Reply 2):
WN and the 727

The first time WN used them, it was as part of the judgement against Braniff in an anti-trust suit. The second time was on short-term lease (interestingly enough, ex-BN birds) while awaiting the delivery of 737s.


User currently offlineKeesje From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 15, posted (8 years 7 months 2 weeks 3 days 3 hours ago) and read 13653 times:

Quoting Vegasplanes (Reply 2):
Hind-sight is normally pretty accurate

 Smile Agreed, so :


Some major airlines investing in next generation twin aisles.

Those aircraft may be delayed a year or so easily due to all innovative technology combined.

At the time those airlines have introduced significant numbers of these aircraft (& can start to make money) the current rapid economic growth period might well be over.

Airlines expanding at this moment in key markets with modern similar capacity aircraft might already have consolidated a big slice of the cake by that time.

"that time" = 2010-2011

Mark my words..


User currently offlineLTBEWR From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 13040 posts, RR: 12
Reply 16, posted (8 years 7 months 2 weeks 3 days 3 hours ago) and read 13627 times:

I would also add:
Where airlines ordered models that didn't sell well overall like Convair's in the 1960's, Air Inter's Caravelle (? only purchaser of a specific model)

Where ordered highly specific subtypes of aircraft. For example, where had In 'high and hot' ops needs, so ordered limited and unique submodels with a larger wing, larger engines, thus making them difficult for resale


User currently offlineDtwclipper From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 17, posted (8 years 7 months 2 weeks 3 days 2 hours ago) and read 13534 times:

UA and the Caravelle


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Photo © Bob Garrard



BN for not ordering the DC-10 or L1011 for Latin America.


Capital for the Viscount.


User currently offlineYOWza From Canada, joined Jul 2005, 4865 posts, RR: 15
Reply 18, posted (8 years 7 months 2 weeks 3 days 1 hour ago) and read 13406 times:

Quoting Dean (Reply 5):
AC A345s.

Why exactly is this a mistake?

YOWza



12A whenever possible.
User currently offlineBoeingfever777 From United States of America, joined Jul 2009, 409 posts, RR: 54
Reply 19, posted (8 years 7 months 2 weeks 3 days 1 hour ago) and read 13382 times:

Quoting Vegasplanes (Reply 2):
WN and the 727

I don't think they ever placed an order for the 727, they only leased a few.

CO not keeping there MD-11's.



Faire du ciel le plus bel endroit de la terre.
User currently offlineDtwclipper From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 20, posted (8 years 7 months 2 weeks 3 days ago) and read 13312 times:

Quoting Boeingfever777 (Reply 19):
CO not keeping there MD-11's.

Uh, when did CO fly the MD-11?


BTW it's their and not there.

[Edited 2005-12-17 18:14:57]

User currently offlineWhiteHatter From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 21, posted (8 years 7 months 2 weeks 3 days ago) and read 13290 times:

Quoting EHHO (Reply 1):

Well, few other suggestions: SU 772s, KL 763s (should've gone for A330 straight away).. LOT should have got themselves a few 772s.. would be making good profit out of ORD and JFK

Nope. SU liked their 772ER frames, and they were leased not bought. In fact they extended the lease a number of times. They were a little too large for them but at no time did they have problems with them. The 763 was a better fit as a replacement.

KL used the 763 on routes it fitted nicely with, not an issue. The 763 never lost KLM any money...

LO is just plain wrong. If they needed or wanted the 772 then they would have ordered them and not the 787. The 772 is too big for LO at the moment, and obviously will be for their immediate future.


User currently offlineSA7700 From South Africa, joined Dec 2003, 3431 posts, RR: 26
Reply 22, posted (8 years 7 months 2 weeks 3 days ago) and read 13229 times:
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HEAD MODERATOR

Quoting Manni (Reply 9):
South African ordering the 737NG, only to replace them with the A320 before they're all delivered.

Although an order for 15x A320's was placed, it was cancelled. All of the SA 738's are flying around in all their glory.


Rgds

SA7700



When you are doing stuff that nobody has done before, there is no manual – Kevin McCloud (Grand Designs)
User currently offlinePennPal From United States of America, joined May 2004, 170 posts, RR: 0
Reply 23, posted (8 years 7 months 2 weeks 3 days ago) and read 13191 times:

American and the CV990???

Air Inter with the Dassault Mercure??

Cimber Air with the DFW 614???


User currently offlineN1120A From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 26376 posts, RR: 76
Reply 24, posted (8 years 7 months 2 weeks 2 days 23 hours ago) and read 13188 times:

Quoting Vegasplanes (Reply 2):
WN and the 727

They were leased in for expansion and quickly phased out.

Quoting Vegasplanes (Reply 2):
AA and DL with the MD-11

DL and the MD-90

Both of those require hindsight. The MD-11 was outselling both the 777 and the A340 at one point.

Quoting 777ER (Reply 6):
QF and their A330s, mostly cause of the A332s on domestic

Operationally, those A330s have been a nightmare because of their inability to do quick turns off short hauls without suffering major reliability issues. Financially, QF got them basically for free in exchange for an A380 launch order.

Quoting MX757 (Reply 8):
CO taking EA's A300's after the latter folded in the early 90's.

EA was folded into CO for all intents and purposes. Both airlines were owned by Frank "The Devil" Lorenzo's Texas Air at the time. CO's main problem with the A300s was their idiotic MX planning.

Quoting Dutchjet (Reply 13):
And, we cant forget the SQ fiasco with the A343......due to a very good offer from Boeing, SQ decided to phase the type out in favor of the 777 before SQ accepted delivery of the last few A343s it had on order.

The 772ER was a superior plane to the A343, which SQ was having problems with.

Quoting Dutchjet (Reply 13):
And, SAS has never been very happy with the 736......although it was the launch customer for the type.

Well, that is their fault for buying a plane with nearly identical operating costs to, but not as many seats as the 73G

Quoting Dtwclipper (Reply 17):
UA and the Caravelle

How was that a mistake?



Mangeons les French fries, mais surtout pratiquons avec fierte le French kiss
25 Jdwfloyd : The reason they ordered the Caravelle was to be the first in the jet age. The Caravelle was up and running first so UA had little choice but to order
26 Coronado : NWA ordering the Avro RJ85 for operation by Mesaba before there was any resolution on the number of seats allowed on it due to scope clauses. Running
27 Post contains images Malmoaviation : Maybe when SK ordered some 747s in the early 80s I think. They almost flew empty, but in those good old fun days you could fly a fueldrinking 747 empt
28 AC787 : my exact thoughts. AC operates a fairly sizeable fleet of 343's and ordered the 345s to operate the yyz-hkg route. Other then the supposed problems A
29 Irishpower : What about DL and the DC-10's they inherited from Western! They seemed a bit out of place.
30 MD90fan : Why were they a mistake, know they are with Vietnam Airlines Why did QF got get 332's for there CityFlyer operation?
31 ACdreamliner : im not sure. AC got them cheap and makes a sweet yield on them from what i can tell...
32 Andersnilsson : SAS four Airbus A300 with P&W engines was a big mistake. Anders
33 EHHO : My dad flew one of them, VP-BAS, SVO-PEK. During the flight he had an exchange with the captain, who complained a lot about lack of maintenance and t
34 FlyCaledonian : SQ and the 757. They only had four before they settled on the A310 for their shorter flights from Singapore. Those four birds are now with DL. BD and
35 RIXrat : As of last summer, SK still had some of its MD-80s in SAS colors parked at RIX. They apparently were going to Snowflake, but I understand that venture
36 Bohica : A lot of airlines inherit A/C through mergers which are not compatable with their fleets and the airlines usually get rid of them in a few years. On
37 777ER : But that order was cancelled and the B738s are still flying for SA Obviously the B772LR is favoured compared to the A345s in this market. Another one
38 WhiteHatter : You could also say any carrier that bought the Avro RJ70 The economics on that aircraft are terrible. We've all heard the rumours but I haven't yet se
39 Letsgetwet : Continental should have ordered more 757's before they were discontinued
40 Post contains images GREATANSETT : Qantas and the 787
41 Jimh615 : Someone elighten me, what's wrong with the MD-90? I love flying in them.
42 Stirling : Southern Airways-Swearingen Metro Eastern-747 Independence-CRJ Laker Airways-A300
43 Post contains images USADreamliner : Aerolineas Argentinas and the 747SP having the 747-200, why order just one SP? USADreamliner
44 Manni : Really? What happened there?
45 WhiteHatter : many techy niggles and hard to get spares due to nonstandard engine type. The V2500 does not sit well on that aircraft. It does not share that much c
46 FlyboyOz : Cathay Pacific and their A346s. They have only two or three A346s because they are not happy with it.
47 Manni : They only have three, because at the time they choose the A340-600 they only needed 3. This to introduce a nonstop HKG-JFK service.
48 777ER : SQ operated both the B757 and A310 at the same time to see which one would remain in their fleet, the A310 was better for SQ so the B757s left the fl
49 Dtwclipper : Ex BN/N604BN They did not order it, they purchased it second hand from Braniff International. LV-OHV (cn 21786/413) Ex BN/N604BN
50 Irishpower : What about the fact that TWA never upgraded their widebody fleet beyond the 747-200. I know they had 767's but they never continued their development
51 Deltaflyertoo : IMO here are some orders in hindsight that were iffy- USAIR and the F-100? Back in the day when they took delivery of their first F-100, they already
52 A330323X : As you said, they had an 11 year run, and would've lasted another year or two if not for 9/11. I don't think you can really blame US/AA for the F100,
53 Post contains images Legacytravel : YX ordering the 717 was a mistake. Now the line is gone. They should have went with the 737, or A320. However it wont take long they will be part of A
54 SA7700 : SAA owned 7x A320's for years, alongside with their A300's and B732's. These birds, especially the A300's were the workhorses of the SA fleet, mainly
55 Hawker : Ansett Australia for buying a bit of everything. Plus having the 767 specially modified for 3 man crew.
56 Post contains images MX757 : No EA was not folded into CO. Both companies were apart of Texas Air Corp. When EA liquidated we took the A300's, 727's and DC-9's. None of EA's empl
57 DYK : PWA and the 762 in the 80, ordered 2 i believe? Think they were boutgh by Air Canada?
58 Carpethead : NH ordering IAE powered A321s. IHI probably pressured NH into selection of IAE when they had a much greater number of CFM powered A320s. Also NH order
59 Steph001 : Don't forget Tarom ordering the A318 (doesn't' fit at all in a fleet of B737-300, B737-700 and ATR's).
60 MauriceB : well think the biggest mistake is the AA MD-11's. they never provided them what they wanted, and that was also the thing why they didnt last long in t
61 A999 : As Al Capone said: "I`ll give you a deal you can`t refuse!" That`s exactly what Boeing told SAS , very eager to have a launch customer for the 736.
62 PanAm_DC10 : Does SQ and the MD-11 qualify? Regards, PanAm_DC10
63 UALMMFlyer : Didn't SQ order MD-11 and cancel them when they were in testing stage?
64 Kappel : Yes, but the 772LR's still aren't available to airlines, whereas the a345 has been flying for a couple of years already for AC. When will they receiv
65 SunValley : Horizon Air and the Dornier 328.
66 Srbmod : Everybody and their brother was ordering the 747-100 at that time. Airlines like Eastern and Delta were ordering them in order to keep up with the re
67 Manni : Thanks a lot for the very detailed answer!
68 Post contains links and images Capital146 : A few here from the UK. Judge for yourselves whether they were 'mistakes' but in each case the aircraft were delivered new, but soon sold on: BCal A31
69 AMSSFO : They've flown this type for 7 years; I once read (and I have know idea whether it's true or not) that KLM struck a deal with the lessor to take them
70 Aviaction : Condor is stuck with a fleet of some 13 B753 - which have virtually no re-sale value. When they realized that their expansion scheme had been way too
71 Ca2ohHP : Air Wisconsin (later UFS) and the ATP.
72 Matt27 : When SAS ordered the B737NG they also looked at the A32X, but the A319 and A318 that they had needed wasn't available in 1995 when SAS placed the ord
73 Leskova : True in the case of the A318, but the A319 was launched in 1993 and had it's first flight in January 1995... In what way would OS's A340s constitute
74 N1120A : Because they were given an amazing price by Airbus in exchange for launching the A380. Additionally, they lack true transcontinental US range, which
75 Post contains images Crazygrrl : Ordering mistakes: NW ordering A330s, they should have ordered 764s, as they operate a sizable fleet of 757s. LH for ordering A346, they should have o
76 N1120A : The 764's range is pathetic as compares to that of the A330, particularly the A332, making it useless on all but the shortest trans-pacific routes. N
77 Post contains images Crazygrrl : N1120A.... re:B764 That is true enough on TRANS-Pacific routes. Here I agree with you. However, NW doesn't use the A330 on these routes heavily, but t
78 Zoheb : Concorde due to it's high costs.
79 777ER : We all know that BA and AF operated then concorde, but how many other airlines ordered the concorde but cancelled their orders later on?
80 Onedude : Australian Airlines (TN - now Qantas) ordering Airbus A300's. And then QF years later ordering A330's (as indicated above) and expecting them to be ab
81 N1120A : Well, lets see. NW flies to NRT with the A332 from SEA, SFO and PDX. That is 3 out of 7 US gateways to Tokyo. Additionally, the A332 has commonality
82 Apodino : But when United placed the order, the 739 did not exist, or did you miss that part of his post. In fact, there was no Boeing 737NG at the time, the m
83 CHRISBA777ER : So pretty much every US airline thats ever bought an Airbus then?
84 NA : Condor had two 747-230Bs in the 70s (and leased a third from LH for a year or so after the first two were sold), which proved to be too big for all-ye
85 Post contains images Leskova : I'll agree in the case of the A342s, but - if I recall correctly - they've sold those by now, haven't they? Weren't they sold to France a few months
86 N1120A : The 777 is also generally prefered in passenger surveys.
87 MEA-707 : The KL763s were fine. KLM have made more mistakes in the midsize segment. In the early 1960s they ordered the Electra while everyone else in Europe t
88 Leskova : ... depending on who asks... ... and how the questions are asked...[Edited 2005-12-27 13:06:10]
89 TWAviator : Well... thanks to Carl Icahn. Also European net started it's downfall after LHR routes being sold to AA, thanks again to Mr. Icahn cheers TWAviator
90 Braybuddy : Aer Lingus took delivery of two 767s for a new route to LAX. These flights didn't materialise at the time, I think it could have been because of 11 Se
91 OzarkD9S : Wrong and wrong. TWA traded the Pacific authority to Pan Am in the mid 70's for some additional European routes. At one point in the 70's TWA was the
92 KaiGywer : I also heard from my uncle, who is an inspector for SAS MX, that they had some "lav issues" as well (think overflowing lavs due to being built for hi
93 Matt27 : Yes. Later I think three of the A300s that SAS had were sold to the Scandinavian charter airline Premiair, and they had constant problems with them.
94 Airfinair : I'm going to agree with EHHO on this one - from what I hear from coworkers and friends that fly LO to/from ORD often, the 767's are always full, over
95 B4real : N1120A and Crazygrrl: It comes down to the LD4 container type. This was the main reason NW went with the A330 vs. a 767 series aircraft for the less
96 Revelation : I'm not too clear on what you are saying. Do the reliability issues arise because of the frequency of takeoff/landing cycles, or due to the lack of t
97 Mandala499 : CX and the A346... mistake or not, well, they only ordered 3 for a reason... But, they're not happy with it. OK... here's a list of order mistakes by
98 DAYflyer : Everybody and the DO 328, 428, 528, 728 I bet CO would buy them now.
99 Columba : Depends on the airline that uses them: Put a passenger in a Jetblue A320 and a Ryanair 737 and ask him which of these aircrafts he prefered he will d
100 N1120A : It is a combination of things that include brake cooling, frying the electrical system, overheat on the engines, etc. The aircraft was not initially
101 N1120A : Actually, Eastern leased in 741s from PA while awaiting their L1011 arrivals.
102 Tope98 : Well i think its a matter of tastes. Ive flown both 777 and 340 and i usually prefer 340. But i also have flown very nicely configurated 777´s. Im ta
103 Btriple7 : Do you have a picture of these fully painted planes? As far as I know, the 767s were only an interim while waiting for the delivery of the A330s.
104 GDB : Crazygrrl, most people who are in this industry knows full well, that this notion of yours, across several threads, that US aircraft are great and tha
105 CHRISBA777ER : LOL thats just what we need - a REAL Boeing Cheerleader! GDB - spot on fella.
106 Post contains images Crazygrrl : GDB: I do have to disagree with you about the Concord. The Concord was hideously expensive to operate as an economic platform. However, I have heard t
107 BuyantUkhaa : I think TAP ought to be in this thread as well. While I'm not too well informed about TAP's history (other than this website) I do recall them placing
108 Post contains links EI321 : Sep 11? Those 763s were delivered to EI back in 1993, and they did indeed go into service with EI for a shorty whileon routes such as DUB-LHR before
109 Post contains links and images Srbmod : Eastern actually ordered four, but sold them to TWA prior to being delivered. N7401Q became N93113 for TWA N7042Q became N93114 for TWA: View Large V
110 Btriple7 : Ah, thanks for that EI321. Btriple7
111 Olympicbis : LH is VERY happy with the A346. Too many rumours about airlines being not happy with this plane, based on what ?
112 Post contains images SK909 : Actually, it is going well, but SK have changed their business plan, so that many of the Snowflake operations are again run by SK. Actually, Snowflak
113 Danny : Huh? Remember that at the time of United order Boeing was still offering 737 classic not NGs. Obviously A320 is way superior to the 737 classics and
114 474218 : Maybe cheaper?
115 Post contains images B4real : Yeah, but ask a passenger if they like a B6 A320 or a NW A320 and they'll choose B6 - this type of topic comes down to how the airline equips the air
116 Post contains links and images Bongo : Big Mistake: View Large View MediumPhoto © Derek Ferguson View Large View MediumPhoto © Miguel cano alva View Large View MediumPhoto ©
117 TimRees : Nobody's mentioned British Airways and its predecessors I understood that many of BEA/BOAC's purchases were politically influenced to protect our home
118 EA CO AS : Not exacty - it was more like EA became CO's source for cherry-picking resources. LGA gates, SystemOne, A300s, etc. The list goes on. Now as far as o
119 Post contains links GDB : Crazygrrll, you can disagree with me on the subject of Concorde all you like, however I have the slight advantage of having been involved on the aircr
120 NW727251ADV : I am generally Pro-Boeing but I think NW made more than a wise decision to purchase A330s over the 764. The 764 doesn't have the range nor passenger/
121 Psa188 : Nobody mentioned PA and NW's early orders for DC-8s, no doubt because Douglas was an established manufacturer of commercial aircraft while Boeing was
122 Psa188 : Oh, how about AA and those "Astrojet 400" BAC-111s? AFAIK, they didn't even make it into the current red/white/blue 3-stripe paint scheme. AA ended up
123 MD90fan : When did they order them and did they ever operate them? LH had an almost all Aibus fleet too and they seem happy with their A346 Do you remeber any
124 Braybuddy : Jesus my memory is getting bad! I can't believe it was that long ago. . .(not doubting you or anything EI321 -- just getting old). I thought there wa
125 474218 : TAP ordered 3 L-1011-500's, with 2 options in August 1979 and firmed up the order for all 5 in October 1980.
126 EI321 : Your right - the LAX route was promised to EI but never got off the ground at the time. The two 763s were aquired on the basis that EI would be allow
127 Post contains links and images GoldenArgosy : ??? View Large View MediumPhoto © Marcel Walther TWA and their 747SPs. Huh? Did those beautiful birds ever get to spread their wings and fly the
128 Lemurs : Not to be all timely and topical, but: CO and their love affair with the ERJ's. 279 -135, -145, and -145XR's before there was a solid business case fo
129 Mandala499 : MD90fan, Well, CGK-MES, CGK-UPG, CGK-BPN, UPG-MDC... Not exactly long... but UPG-MDC is 1h45 (I think) and the rest are 2H15... BUT, they fly it at FL
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