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How Does A Plane Powerback?  
User currently offlineIAH744 From United States of America, joined Dec 2005, 133 posts, RR: 0
Posted (8 years 9 months 5 days 4 hours ago) and read 3461 times:

hello,

Just wondering how 727/md-80/dc-9 type aircraft "powerback"


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I never thought bucket reverse redirected enough power to push an aircraft backwards.
Is there something else that helps?

heres a video


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11 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineEMBQA From United States of America, joined Oct 2003, 9364 posts, RR: 11
Reply 1, posted (8 years 9 months 5 days 4 hours ago) and read 3452 times:

Quoting IAH744 (Thread starter):
I never thought bucket reverse redirected enough power to push an aircraft backwards.
Is there something else that helps?

Oh, heck yea it will. You apply slight fwd thrust, then pull reverse thrust. The reverse thrust will back the aircraft out. You need to be careful with the amount of thrust applied and the breaking as you can put the plane on its tail if your not careful.



"It's not the size of the dog in the fight, but the size of the fight in the dog"
User currently offlineSkySurfer From United Kingdom, joined Sep 2004, 1136 posts, RR: 12
Reply 2, posted (8 years 9 months 5 days 4 hours ago) and read 3441 times:

I did this last year on an NWA DC-9 at MSP......slight roll forward, then the buckets are deployed and back we go. Light braking to stop (as EMBQA rightly said, too hard and you'll end up on the tail) and after the buckets are stowed away you go. Waste of fuel? Maybe. But if there's no tug available then it's more than worth it using fuel for a 10-20 second powerback. I'm glad i experienced one.

Cheers



In the dark you can't see ugly, but you can feel fat
User currently offlinePhxplanes From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 436 posts, RR: 0
Reply 3, posted (8 years 9 months 5 days 3 hours ago) and read 3398 times:

Thats something you don't see everyday, kinda cool. What is the purpose? Wouldn't it not be as safe. It seems like it might be more convenient though. Also how do they decide when to do it.

Thanks


User currently offlineEMBQA From United States of America, joined Oct 2003, 9364 posts, RR: 11
Reply 4, posted (8 years 9 months 5 days 3 hours ago) and read 3381 times:

Quoting Phxplanes (Reply 3):
Thats something you don't see everyday

..?? You see that all the time at airports that have DC-9's, MD-80's and 727's.... it's a very common practice when push back tugs are not available.



"It's not the size of the dog in the fight, but the size of the fight in the dog"
User currently offlineGoBoeing From United States of America, joined Jun 2000, 2698 posts, RR: 14
Reply 5, posted (8 years 9 months 5 days 3 hours ago) and read 3350 times:

Northwest only permits powerbacks at the three hubs that DC-9s visit - MSP, DTW, and MEM. Furthermore, there are gates at each of those airports that powerbacks are not allowed to be performed from (too small an alley, close side-by-side arrangements, etc.).

The pilots know beforehand from the ground crew if they'll be doing a powerback and they inform ramp control of this upon initial contact after receiving the clearance. When the clearance for the powerback is given the ramper in front of the cockpit gives the ready-to-go signal and puts his goggles on.

Both pilots take their feet off of the rudder pedals and put them on the floor. The captain pushes the power just enough to breakaway thrust and rolls the jet forward a few feet to get the tires off of the soft spots so that minimal reverse thrust is needed. After moving forward these couple of feet, he or she goes back to idle and thing brings both engines into reverse thrust and keeps an eye on the ramper ahead of the cockpit who is now giving the both-hands-twirling "continue powering back" signal. I was pretty surprised at how fast it moves backwards after watching it the first few times from the jumpseat. It continues and the two wingwalkers will give a signal to the cockpit ramper that it's time to stop. He will signal that to the cockpit and the captain takes off the reverse thrust and lets idle thrust bring the jet to a stop. A little forward thrust and by this time the FO is already getting the taxi clearance.

Nick


User currently offlineOttoPylit From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 6, posted (8 years 9 months 5 days 3 hours ago) and read 3332 times:

Who says powerbacks have to be limited to DC-9 series aircraft? 737-200's are fully capable of powerbacks, as long as you are willing to suffer the consequences of everything on the ramp not secured down by steel pilings to be sucked into the engines, such as halon fire extinguishers, chocks, ramp agents, orange cones, and wands.  rotfl 


The pilot of Palm 90 attempted to help the ground crew during pushback by using the reverse thrusters to get the plane moving. All he managed to end up doing was throw more ice and slush up onto the tops of the wings, which were to play a part in its fall from the sky over Washington D.C. shortly afterward on January 13, 1982.


OttoPylit


User currently offlineDalb777 From United States of America, joined May 2005, 2192 posts, RR: 0
Reply 7, posted (8 years 9 months 5 days 1 hour ago) and read 3257 times:

So I take it that a plane has to have buckets in order to powerback. Can a plane without buckets powerback?


Geaux Tigers! Geaux Hornets! Geaux Saints! WHO DAT!!!
User currently offlineIAH744 From United States of America, joined Dec 2005, 133 posts, RR: 0
Reply 8, posted (8 years 9 months 5 days 1 hour ago) and read 3254 times:

Quoting Dalb777 (Reply 7):
So I take it that a plane has to have buckets in order to powerback. Can a plane without buckets powerback?

dont think the older 27s have them



Deliver Everyones Luggage To Atlanta
User currently offlineKaitak744 From United States of America, joined Jul 2005, 2377 posts, RR: 3
Reply 9, posted (8 years 9 months 5 days ago) and read 3233 times:

The reason they don't do this on larger aircraft is because the thurst can blow the terminal windows.

User currently offlineCrogalski From United States of America, joined May 2005, 514 posts, RR: 3
Reply 10, posted (8 years 9 months 4 days 23 hours ago) and read 3185 times:

I saw a airtran 717 do it the other day.


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User currently offlinePMN From United Kingdom, joined Mar 2005, 563 posts, RR: 0
Reply 11, posted (8 years 9 months 4 days 20 hours ago) and read 3109 times:

Quoting Dalb777 (Reply 7):
Can a plane without buckets powerback?

I'm sure I've read in similar threads here in the past that pretty much any aircraft equipped with thrust reversers can power back, it just isn't practiced on aircraft with under wing mounted engines for various reasons. I'm sure someone here can offer a more in depth explanation.

Paul



Edith in his bed, a plane in the rain is humming, the wires in the walls are humming some song - some mysterious song
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