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10 + 5 A359 For TAM  
User currently offlineA333X From Switzerland, joined Dec 2005, 21 posts, RR: 0
Posted (9 years 1 day 21 hours ago) and read 6748 times:

http://fr.biz.yahoo.com/21122005/5/l...-tam-commande-dix-airbus-a350.html

Sorrry, link in French

42 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineBestWestern From Hong Kong, joined Sep 2000, 7303 posts, RR: 57
Reply 1, posted (9 years 1 day 21 hours ago) and read 6665 times:

In English

http://yahoo.reuters.com/financeQuot...05-12-21_15-27-56_n21190000_newsml

TAM, a longtime Airbus customer, said it intends to use the new aircraft to renew its fleet. The airline currently has 56 Airbus jets in its fleet, including the A330-200, which seats 213 passengers. The A350-900 will be configured in a three-class layout, seating up to 300 people.

TAM finished November with 43.8 percent of Brazil's domestic market.



The world is really getting smaller these days
User currently offlineBoomBoom From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 2, posted (9 years 1 day 21 hours ago) and read 6582 times:

The WSJ says:
TAM previously announced its intention to buy the jets at the Le Bourget airshow in June.

So I assume this means that this order will not get Airbus any closer to 200 orders by the end of the year, as it's already been counted?


User currently offlineClickhappy From United States of America, joined Sep 2001, 9664 posts, RR: 68
Reply 3, posted (9 years 1 day 21 hours ago) and read 6563 times:
AIRLINERS.NET CREW
PHOTO SCREENER

How come they will wait 6+ years for delivery? If they don't need them until then, fine, but why tie up the cash?

User currently offlinePM From Germany, joined Feb 2005, 7001 posts, RR: 63
Reply 4, posted (9 years 1 day 21 hours ago) and read 6547 times:

Quoting BoomBoom (Reply 3):
So I assume this means that this order will not get Airbus any closer to 200 orders by the end of the year, as it's already been counted?

What they signed for in Paris was 8 firm and 7 options. This is for 10 firm and 5 options so they're actually two closer. (But your negative spin is duly noted.)


User currently offlinePHXinterrupted From United States of America, joined Apr 2002, 474 posts, RR: 0
Reply 5, posted (9 years 1 day 21 hours ago) and read 6538 times:

Quoting BestWestern (Reply 2):
TAM finished November with 43.8 percent of Brazil's domestic market.

That number is quickly changing with the rapid growth of Gol.



Keepin' it real.
User currently offlineLipeGIG From Brazil, joined May 2005, 11459 posts, RR: 58
Reply 6, posted (9 years 1 day 21 hours ago) and read 6515 times:
AIRLINERS.NET CREW
FORUM MODERATOR

Good news. IMO I believe they probably will confirm their 5 options as well as i expect they keep some of the A332 for new routes.

TAM is doing a great job on their international network, but they are very conservative after droping Frankfurt and Zurich.

Wish to see them with all their 10 A332 flying next year.

Felipe



New York + Rio de Janeiro = One of the best combinations !
User currently offlineSabenapilot From Belgium, joined Feb 2000, 2728 posts, RR: 46
Reply 7, posted (9 years 1 day 21 hours ago) and read 6492 times:

Quoting BoomBoom (Reply 3):
TAM previously announced its intention to buy the jets at the Le Bourget airshow in June.

I thought they only announced their intention to buy 8 A350s at Le Bourget, not 10 like they have signed for now...


User currently offlineSabenapilot From Belgium, joined Feb 2000, 2728 posts, RR: 46
Reply 8, posted (9 years 1 day 21 hours ago) and read 6442 times:

Quoting BoomBoom (Reply 3):
I assume this means that this order will not get Airbus any closer to 200 orders by the end of the year

What do you mean?

Since the A350 is just a warmed up A330, not even worth of being called a kind of A330NG, you should live up to your claims and count ALL versions: by doing so, the fly-by-wire wide body twin from Airbus has already exceeded its very ambitious sales target months ago!  Silly


User currently offlineEI321 From Iraq, joined Jul 2009, 0 posts, RR: 0
Reply 9, posted (9 years 1 day 21 hours ago) and read 6429 times:

Quoting PM (Reply 5):
What they signed for in Paris was 8 firm and 7 options. This is for 10 firm and 5 options so they're actually two closer. (But your negative spin is duly noted.)

In fairness to BoomBoom, I think he made an honest mistake. It happens.


User currently offlineMbj2000 From Germany, joined Dec 2005, 426 posts, RR: 0
Reply 10, posted (9 years 1 day 20 hours ago) and read 6218 times:

What's wrong with you guys, why all these negative comments?! I mean it is normal to be a bit biased towards one side or the other, but you seem to have developed this attitude everything comes from Airbus must be crap and can only be sold with big incentives, Airbus should shut down production lines and don't spoil the business for Boeing.

Is it so hard for Boeing fans to accept there might exist planes built somewhere else in the world that CAN be as good as Boeing's?!

Quoting BoomBoom (Reply 3):
So I assume this means that this order will not get Airbus any closer to 200 orders by the end of the year, as it's already been counted?



Quoting Clickhappy (Reply 4):
How come they will wait 6+ years for delivery? If they don't need them until then, fine, but why tie up the cash?



Quoting PHXinterrupted (Reply 6):
That number is quickly changing with the rapid growth of Gol.



Like most of life's problems, this one can be solved with bending -- Bender Unit 22
User currently offlineJoost From Netherlands, joined Apr 2005, 3186 posts, RR: 4
Reply 11, posted (9 years 1 day 19 hours ago) and read 6058 times:

Quoting Clickhappy (Reply 4):
How come they will wait 6+ years for delivery? If they don't need them until then, fine, but why tie up the cash?

You might well assume that in the price they pay a compensation for the intereset in deposits is calculated.


User currently offlineMBJ2000 From Germany, joined Dec 2005, 426 posts, RR: 0
Reply 12, posted (9 years 1 day 19 hours ago) and read 6040 times:

How many (fix) A350 orders has Airbus so far for this year? Has somebody got numbers?


Like most of life's problems, this one can be solved with bending -- Bender Unit 22
User currently offlineFlyPEGASUS From Portugal, joined Nov 2005, 72 posts, RR: 0
Reply 13, posted (9 years 1 day 19 hours ago) and read 5987 times:

Quoting WINGS (Reply 14):
This now leaves 8 unannounced orders which is expected to come this week from Latin America.

Any guess who it might be?

I would bet on TACA and Mexicana!!

Possible orders of A350 coming from Latin America Airlines has been discussed in a recent thread:
Viva Macau, Startup, Plans A350 Or B787 Order (by PanAm_DC10 Dec 15 2005 in Civil Aviation)#ID2493094
You can check some considerations about it there.

Quoting MBJ2000 (Reply 19):
How many (fix) A350 orders has Airbus so far for this year? Has somebody got numbers?

Last time I saw it was on a post from WINGS in one other thread. WINGS can you post it again?

Regards


User currently offlineWINGS From Portugal, joined May 2005, 2831 posts, RR: 68
Reply 14, posted (9 years 1 day 19 hours ago) and read 5968 times:

Well the following posts from PanAmDC_10 in another topic, gives some clues to the upcoming order.

http://www.airliners.net/discussions...general_aviation/read.main/2493094

I note the discussion as to the definition of the regions. Perhaps I should have been clearer. Mexico is included in the region. But I would be looking further south as to whom will place the order of note

Regards, PanAm_DC10



Hmmmm....Some good calls, let's hope I'm right Now, some more fuel to the fire.....

MIAMI (Dow Jones)--Airbus will sell 10 more aircraft in South America by the end of this year, said Rafael Alonso, Airbus' senior vice president for Latin America, Caribbean and Spain, on Wednesday. Alonso declined to say which companies will buy the aircraft, but said an announcement is expected shortly, probably next week.

More than 1 carrier, more than 1 model. The plot thickens...Guesses anyone?

Regards, PanAm_DC10


Regards,
Wings



Aviation Is A Passion.
User currently offlineWINGS From Portugal, joined May 2005, 2831 posts, RR: 68
Reply 15, posted (9 years 1 day 19 hours ago) and read 5929 times:

So far we have the following orders for the A350.

Qatar Airways 60
Tap Portugal 12
Tam 10
Air Europa 10
Eurofly 3
Kingfisher 5
US Airways 20
Gecas 10
CIT 5
ILFC 12
ALAFCO 12
Undisclosed 8 (LatinAmerica)

TOTAL: 167 Order/Commitments

Air MAdrid has also spoken of their interest in ordering 15 A350. Even if we take all of these orders/commitments it would still leave Airbus 18 frames short of their 200 goal.

Regards,
Wings



Aviation Is A Passion.
User currently offlineBoomBoom From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 16, posted (9 years 1 day 19 hours ago) and read 5899 times:

Quoting Sabenapilot (Reply 9):
Since the A350 is just a warmed up A330, not even worth of being called a kind of A330NG, you should live up to your claims

My claims? Where did I say this? The only ones who seem to be bashing the A350 in this thread are the Airbus lovers, like you.

Quoting EI321 (Reply 11):
In fairness to BoomBoom, I think he made an honest mistake. It happens.

That's why I posed it in the form of a question because I really didn't know.

So I assume this means that this order will not get Airbus any closer to 200 orders by the end of the year, as it's already been counted?

But your "fairness" is greatly appreciated.

Also, Sabenapilot, that quote in Reply #8 was from the WSJ, I'm sure it was purely accidental that you tried to attribute it solely to me.

[Edited 2005-12-21 19:11:46]

User currently offlineCV990 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 17, posted (9 years 1 day 19 hours ago) and read 5891 times:

Hi!

Good show TAM!!! I understand that for some people in this forum it's a bit hard to "swallow" the fact that slowly but steady Airbus is building the numbers on the A350.... there's a great market for the A350 and I know that many airlines will order the A350 instead of the 787! Pacience is a virtue and Airbus know exactely what to do!
Regards


User currently offlineEddieDude From Mexico, joined Nov 2003, 7633 posts, RR: 42
Reply 18, posted (9 years 1 day 18 hours ago) and read 5804 times:

Quoting PHXinterrupted (Reply 6):
That number is quickly changing with the rapid growth of Gol.

RG is the carrier suffering the most as a result of Gol's growth. JJ has been steadily the number one in the domestic market and while Gol indeed is a threat, JJ is a really strong player with a lot of loyal customers.

Quoting FlyPEGASUS (Reply 20):
I would bet on TACA and Mexicana!!

Hopefully MX will order a few. The change of ownership might delay things a bit, however, MX is said to be close to ordering the A332 for EZE and JFK services and the A345 for Asian destinations (they have spoken of wanting to fly to PEK on time for the Olympics). With respect to next-generation twin engined planes, MX is said to be considering both the 787 and the A350.



Next flights: MEX-GRU (AM 77E), GRU-GIG (JJ A320), SDU-CGH (G3 73H), GRU-MEX (JJ A332).
User currently offlineN79969 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 19, posted (9 years 1 day 18 hours ago) and read 5765 times:

Good for Airbus. A respectable win for them.

Quoting Clickhappy (Reply 4):
If they don't need them until then, fine, but why tie up the cash?

Perhaps they do not need to front the cash yet or only had to commit a minimal amount. I would bet Airbus is offering some very flexible terms on the A350 to prime the pump a little.


User currently offlineMatterhorn From Switzerland, joined Feb 2004, 135 posts, RR: 2
Reply 20, posted (9 years 1 day 17 hours ago) and read 5623 times:

Quoting WINGS (Reply 23):

Qatar Airways 60
Tap Portugal 12
Tam 10
Air Europa 10
Eurofly 3
Kingfisher 5
US Airways 20
Gecas 10
CIT 5
ILFC 12
ALAFCO 12
Undisclosed 8 (LatinAmerica

you forgot the ones from finnair



Last Flight: BSL-AMS on EZY, Next Flight: ZRH-LHR on LX
User currently offlineLumberton From United States of America, joined Jul 2005, 4708 posts, RR: 20
Reply 21, posted (9 years 1 day 17 hours ago) and read 5620 times:

One thing that impressed me very much was the sincere contratulations to Boeing and QF from many admitted Airbus proponents when the announcement of large 787 order was released last week. That was a class act. May I reciprocate? Well done, TAM and Airbus!


"When all is said and done, more will be said than done".
User currently offlineWINGS From Portugal, joined May 2005, 2831 posts, RR: 68
Reply 22, posted (9 years 1 day 17 hours ago) and read 5515 times:

TOTAL: 176 Orders/Commitments

Quoting Matterhorn (Reply 29):
you forgot the ones from finnair

Ooooooooooops. How did I forget about Finnair.


So the numbers should look something like this for the A350.

Qatar Airways 60
Tap Portugal 12
Tam 10
Finnair 9
Air Europa 10
Eurofly 3
Kingfisher 5
US Airways 20
Gecas 10
CIT 5
ILFC 12
ALAFCO 12
Undisclosed 8 (LatinAmerica)

Total: 176 orders/commitments

If Airbus manages to sign Air Madrid for 15 A350, we have a grand total of 191 frames. This would only leave 9 frames to the 200 goal by year end.

Regards,
Wings

[Edited 2005-12-21 20:29:40]


Aviation Is A Passion.
User currently offlineRayChuang From United States of America, joined Jun 2000, 8037 posts, RR: 5
Reply 23, posted (9 years 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 5119 times:

Here's the question: with TAM buying up to 15 A350's, and given the nearly 1,000 nautical mile longer range of the A350, will that mean TAM is seriously looking at flying from GIG/GRU all the way to LAX?

User currently offlinePanAm_DC10 From Australia, joined Aug 2000, 4217 posts, RR: 89
Reply 24, posted (9 years 1 day 15 hours ago) and read 4830 times:
AIRLINERS.NET CREW
COMMUNITY MANAGER

Quoting Sabenapilot (Reply 8):
I thought they only announced their intention to buy 8 A350s at Le Bourget, not 10 like they have signed for now...

That is indeed correct. It should have actually been 12 got told that last week after reading another financial Filing of theirs. Not sure how it ended up 2 short at 10 but nice to see the firm order component increased all the same.

Quoting WINGS (Reply 21):
More than 1 carrier, more than 1 model. The plot thickens...Guesses anyone?

WINGS is only as good as the information that he had and again, this is a case of where I could have been clearer in what I said. Where I refer to the above statement, the attached article makes no mention of the A350. So more than 1 carrier, more than 1 model meant more than 1 Airbus model

If my English was not concise enough it warrants an apology for any confusion caused.

Regards, PanAm_DC10



Ask the impossible to achieve the best possible
25 Post contains images Glideslope : Well stated.
26 LipeGIG : Ray, could be. But i strong believe the first additional destination they should serve will be London. TAM is looking very close to RG's situation, b
27 WINGS : Hi PanAm, The one that should be apologizing is me. Your post was very clear. Unfortunately I miss read your post. You very well stated that it would
28 Post contains images PanAm_DC10 : Wigs Huh, a name change or no morning coffee yet? Always a pleasure discussing orders with you my good man. I still feel that I should have been clea
29 WINGS : Yep. Am still in need of a good caffeine shot. Regards, Wings
30 Post contains images Incitatus : How about calling it the A300 NG I would like to restate my point that the only reason TAM chose the A350 is because of its standing relationship wit
31 A360 : Well, Boeing didn't start from scratch to compete with the 320... they upgraded the 737 and created the 737NG which, as you must be aware, was/is a s
32 WINGS : Tap a classic example? What are you talking about? You should look closer to home for some examples of poor aquasitions. If you took sometime to lear
33 BoomBoom : Yes, but the 787 is a much more revolutionary design. The 737NG is able to match or beat the A320 in performance. But it doesn't necessarily follow t
34 Incitatus : Coursework on logic would help. I never stated that all derivatives are poor airplanes. I only stated that in this case the gap between the A330 and
35 WINGS : I was actually referring to Varig and their fleet options. Look at how many different types of aircraft and powerplants are currently being used by t
36 Post contains images DAYflyer : Two more frames firm. Sure is a hot seller!
37 WINGS : Its actually more than just two extra frames. Its TAMs faith in the A350 project that has lead them to excercise two options. The same that Tap Portu
38 TheSonntag : Neither is it taken for given that it doesn't. The A350 features a new wing, new engines of a already revolutionary design (the A330 was one of the f
39 BoomBoom : Sure, if you want to change the subject.
40 Post contains images Manni : Enought to upset you, apparently. BTW, Looking at Boeings orders/commitments for the 787 Icelandair 2 Xiamen Airlines 3 Vietnam Airlines 4 Royal Air
41 GARPD : With all due respect, I see no spin
42 PanAm_DC10 : TAM have announced that they have chosen GE for their engines. By Andrea Rothman Jan. 2 (Bloomberg) -- General Electric Co., the world's biggest maker
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