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DL To Shed 2/3 Of Its Gates At MCO  
User currently offlineGroundStop From United States of America, joined Jun 2003, 611 posts, RR: 6
Posted (9 years ago) and read 9419 times:

http://www.orlandosentinel.com/busin...3056.story?coll=orl-home-headlines

Delta to shut down two-thirds of gates at OIA

Beth Kassab | Sentinel Staff Writer
Posted December 22, 2005, 3:28 PM EST


Delta Air Lines filed court papers this afternoon to shut down two-thirds of its gates at Orlando International Airport as part of its effort to emerge from bankruptcy.

If approved in New York bankruptcy court next month, Delta will shut down 16 of its 24 gates but said the change "does not signal a reduced commitment by Delta to the Orlando market," and it will not decrease its number of daily flights.

On average, Delta files 115 daily departures out of Orlando to 47 nonstop destinations. The carrier filed for bankruptcy protection in September.

Orlando is the first airport at which Delta has officially sought to decrease its number of gates.

Calls to Orlando Airport officials were not immediately returned this afternoon.

------------------------

Its about time. Most of those gates have gone unused since the DL Express days. Looks like there's gonna be some nice real estate available at MCO!!

69 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineNKMCO From United States of America, joined Oct 2005, 96 posts, RR: 0
Reply 1, posted (8 years 12 months 4 days 23 hours ago) and read 9359 times:

Oh man, it would be so nice to see NK over there, especially now when there is non-stop MBJ from MCO and having to have gates at two separate airsides with no time between flights... Having all that in one airside would be nice.

User currently offlineTOLtommy From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 3308 posts, RR: 5
Reply 2, posted (8 years 12 months 4 days 23 hours ago) and read 9329 times:

hmmmm.... 16 fewer gates, but no reduction in flying. If this is the way DL is going to play in bankruptcy, then they should never go to Vegas.

No reduction in flying, but 16 fewer gates? That would equal 14+ flights per day/per gate at the remaining 8. Not gonna happen. DL doesn't want to give up the gates, because someone WILL want them. But they want to pay less, hence the filing. It's a money move, and DL didn't play it right at all.

IMO the should've filed, and threatent to remove nonstop service from most non-hub markets. but they didn't. No big deal.


User currently offlineTornado82 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 3, posted (8 years 12 months 4 days 23 hours ago) and read 9316 times:

Quoting TOLtommy (Reply 2):
No reduction in flying, but 16 fewer gates? That would equal 14+ flights per day/per gate at the remaining 8. Not gonna happen. DL doesn't want to give up the gates, because someone WILL want them. But they want to pay less, hence the filing. It's a money move, and DL didn't play it right at all.

How many of those 115 flights are RJ's? I would think a pretty significant %. Is it not possible to pull two CRJ's per gate at MCO, or maybe 3 CRJ's per 2 gates?


User currently offlineDeltAirlines From United States of America, joined May 1999, 8913 posts, RR: 12
Reply 4, posted (8 years 12 months 4 days 23 hours ago) and read 9302 times:

Keep in mind that many of the current flights are Connection, which I'm sure will continue using the 60A-Q (or whatever it is) gates. Truth be told, the last several times I've been at MCO (since 2004), I've only seen a DL plane at the 90-99 gates once, and the only gate I ever see Delta at on 80-89 is Gate 80 (first one on the left). Shouldn't be too hard to consolidate mainline operations into the 70-79 pier, probably make 80-89 a common use international gate area (and maybe see CO and NW move into 90-99?...would allow them to be close to DL, World Club/Presidents Club folk would be able to use the Crown Room, etc.).

Jeff


User currently offlineCIDflyer From United States of America, joined Apr 2005, 2362 posts, RR: 3
Reply 5, posted (8 years 12 months 4 days 23 hours ago) and read 9292 times:

Quoting Tornado82 (Reply 3):
How many of those 115 flights are RJ's? I would think a pretty significant %. Is it not possible to pull two CRJ's per gate at MCO, or maybe 3 CRJ's per 2 gates

That's exactly what I am thinking, mainline jets will probably use the gates w/jet bridges, but you could probably park more than 1 RJ at a gate, and I think a significant part of those 115 flts are on RJ's....


User currently offlineGroundStop From United States of America, joined Jun 2003, 611 posts, RR: 6
Reply 6, posted (8 years 12 months 4 days 23 hours ago) and read 9274 times:

The majority of those flights are RJ's. All of the RJ's technically operate out of Gate 60, which has several doors marked A through J. That leaves seven gates for mainline and Song. If you look at an airside map, they will be keeping the wing that protrudes to the north as well as the commuter gate below the monorail line.

User currently offlineIsitsafenow From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 4984 posts, RR: 23
Reply 7, posted (8 years 12 months 4 days 23 hours ago) and read 9243 times:

Does this mean that Mickey will shift his allegiance to Herb?
Just kidding.........
safe



If two people agree on EVERYTHING, then one isn't necessary.
User currently offlineInTheSky74 From United States of America, joined Sep 2005, 546 posts, RR: 0
Reply 8, posted (8 years 12 months 4 days 23 hours ago) and read 9225 times:

JetBlue has been searching for gates in MCO.... sounds like they can get the gates they wanted!

Rob


User currently offlineKahala777 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 9, posted (8 years 12 months 4 days 23 hours ago) and read 9224 times:

Quoting GroundStop (Thread starter):
If approved in New York bankruptcy court next month, Delta will shut down 16 of its 24 gates but said the change "does not signal a reduced commitment by Delta to the Orlando market," and it will not decrease its number of daily flights.

So in other words Delta Airlines wants the gates closed, suspended, and not given to any other airline until they have the money to do something with them? Sounds like a true American airline. However, look for a fight if the city of Orlando and another airline want to expand, bets are Delta will be the one left out in the cold.

Wasnt Delta Airlines trying to snake out of paying for gate space in Los Angeles not to long ago? Seems like the boys in Atlanta have some mighty high mountains to climb in a pair of oil greased shoes..


KAHALA777


User currently offlineFriendlySkies From United States of America, joined Aug 2004, 4120 posts, RR: 5
Reply 10, posted (8 years 12 months 4 days 23 hours ago) and read 9188 times:

Quoting Tornado82 (Reply 3):
How many of those 115 flights are RJ's? I would think a pretty significant %. Is it not possible to pull two CRJ's per gate at MCO, or maybe 3 CRJ's per 2 gates?

Have you ever seen T2 at ORD? I think UA parks 4 at some gates. At least it looks that way lol.


User currently offlineFlyPNS1 From United States of America, joined Nov 1999, 6731 posts, RR: 24
Reply 11, posted (8 years 12 months 4 days 23 hours ago) and read 9187 times:

Quoting Kahala777 (Reply 9):
So in other words Delta Airlines wants the gates closed, suspended, and not given to any other airline until they have the money to do something with them?

Where does it say that? DL wants to reject the leases and give them back to the airport authority. The airport authority would then be free to give them to whomever.

DL has way too many gates at MCO. There is no need for DL to be paying leases on gates they never use.


User currently offlineMidway7 From United States of America, joined Aug 2004, 154 posts, RR: 0
Reply 12, posted (8 years 12 months 4 days 23 hours ago) and read 9169 times:

Quoting Kahala777 (Reply 9):
If approved in New York bankruptcy court next month, Delta will shut down 16 of its 24 gates but said the change "does not signal a reduced commitment by Delta to the Orlando market," and it will not decrease its number of daily flights.

So in other words Delta Airlines wants the gates closed, suspended, and not given to any other airline until they have the money to do something with them? Sounds like a true American airline. However, look for a fight if the city of Orlando and another airline want to expand, bets are Delta will be the one left out in the cold.

I think when Delta says they are shutting down the gates, that is their way of saying that they are being returned to the City of Orlando.

Quoting Kahala777 (Reply 9):
Wasnt Delta Airlines trying to snake out of paying for gate space in Los Angeles not to long ago? Seems like the boys in Atlanta have some mighty high mountains to climb in a pair of oil greased shoes..

That's what the BK process is all about.


User currently offlineSTT757 From United States of America, joined Mar 2000, 16907 posts, RR: 51
Reply 13, posted (8 years 12 months 4 days 23 hours ago) and read 9103 times:

From my memory of flying both DL and CO out of MCO I remember that the Air side 4 offered more "amenities" while Airside One was a little more sparse, it would be nice if CO would move to airside 4 which would have benefits people mentioned like President's Club members access to DL's Crown Room.


Eastern Air lines flt # 701, EWR-MCO Boeing 757
User currently offlineTornado82 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 14, posted (8 years 12 months 4 days 23 hours ago) and read 9084 times:

Quoting FriendlySkies (Reply 10):

Have you ever seen T2 at ORD? I think UA parks 4 at some gates. At least it looks that way lol.

It's been years since I've been in MCO, and that was always US mainline, and once a private chartered 733 (HS band trip) at that. I kinda outgrew the whole Mickey Mouse scene, and if I'm going to FL now, I want a beach, not a mouse-infested swamp.  Wink That's why I asked, didn't know how the gates were at MCO and didn't want to make a false assumption.


User currently offlineB6sea From United States of America, joined Aug 2005, 340 posts, RR: 0
Reply 15, posted (8 years 12 months 4 days 22 hours ago) and read 9056 times:

Hmm... I know during school break times those gates are pretty well utilized from what I can recall of being there in the late 90s but maybe they've backed off... Hopefully we see some more B6 or NK service out of those free gates. Any guesses on who'll move in?

-Chans


User currently offlineDeltaGuy From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 16, posted (8 years 12 months 4 days 22 hours ago) and read 9033 times:

All the gates on the South end were always bustling with activity during the DLX days, and ever since they axed that operation, they've been mostly vacant- saw a few DL MD11's sitting idle there in 2003, but that's been about it- F9 was using one for awhile for some reason. I say, what's the point in keeping them if they're not going to be used? Save some extra money, but I'd be weary about B8 or other competiors taking them over- trade off I suppose.

DeltaGuy


User currently offlineScottB From United States of America, joined Jul 2000, 6826 posts, RR: 32
Reply 17, posted (8 years 12 months 4 days 22 hours ago) and read 9016 times:

Without being able to read the actual docket, here's my guess as to what the situation is:

Delta currently leases 24 gates in the Airside - 70-77, 80-87, and 90-97. Delta's Comair subsidiary likely leases the Gate 60 facility which is used for a large number of RJ boarding positions. Delta's current presence at MCO involves 42 mainline & Song flights; 8 gates ought to be more than enough for that. Comair is likely to retain its lease on the Gate 60 facility, so there will be limited impact to the RJ operations operated on Delta's behalf by OH, RP, and others.

I also was not under the impression that MCO was especially short on gates after the new airside had been built. One would imagine that the third wing of Airside 2 would have been built in that event.


User currently offlineRl757pvd From United States of America, joined Dec 1999, 4717 posts, RR: 11
Reply 18, posted (8 years 12 months 4 days 21 hours ago) and read 8861 times:

Remember since song is being rolled back in, there is no need for seperate gates. Even with Song....DL operated 95% of their flights out of the RJ gates and the gates in the 70's for a while no flights used 90-99 and only a handful of flights used the 80's. Delta has gotten better at turn times meaning a gate can reasonably do 8-10 flights per day so with 10 jet gates we are still talking 80-100 mainline flights. The days of an airline holding lots of unused realestate at airports are over. Ill bet CVG term A is next if they can do it.


Experience is what you get when what you thought would work out didn't!
User currently offlineDeltaMIA From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 1672 posts, RR: 17
Reply 19, posted (8 years 12 months 4 days 20 hours ago) and read 8746 times:

DL would use the gates on a per usage fee say $25 per use or whatever the going rate is right now. This has become more common in the last 5 years among all the airlines. Obviously though with 8 of the jetways there use would be so great that it is best to keep the lease going. It doesn't make sense to pay $150/day for a jetway and use it once when you can use it once for $25.


It's a big building with patients, but that's not important right now.
User currently offlineDeltaGator From United States of America, joined Sep 2005, 6341 posts, RR: 13
Reply 20, posted (8 years 12 months 4 days 20 hours ago) and read 8688 times:

Quoting DeltAirlines (Reply 4):
I've only seen a DL plane at the 90-99 gates once, and the only gate I ever see Delta at on 80-89 is Gate 80 (first one on the left). Shouldn't be too hard to consolidate mainline operations into the 70-79 pier, probably make 80-89 a common use international gate area (and maybe see CO and NW move into 90-99?...would allow them to be close to DL, World Club/Presidents Club folk would be able to use the Crown Room, etc.).

You beat me to it. I was going to ask the same thing. Makes good sense for SkyTeam partners to be close together. The one thing that has bugged me about MCO sine they added the two eastern airsides is that you an't get to the original two without leaving the sterile are and going bak through security.

Quoting STT757 (Reply 13):
I remember that the Air side 4 offered more "amenities" while Airside One was a little more sparse,

Airside One was one of the first two built so yeah, it's a little old and busted.



"If you can't delight in the misery of others then you don't deserve to be a college football fan."
User currently offlineBeertrucker From United States of America, joined Dec 2005, 403 posts, RR: 0
Reply 21, posted (8 years 12 months 4 days 19 hours ago) and read 8652 times:

There is one more thing to remember. Delta does do the largest ground handling of international flights. What this means is that the east part would be for delta/song. The south part would be for international flights and over flow delta/song flights. And the west side would be returned to the city of Orlando. Gate 60 is for the rj flights and is a big part in Orlando. But delta will not give up the international Gates at all cause they make a killing in the contracting out the ground handling of those international flights.

I will take a closer look at the terminal on Saturday when I am waiting for my flight to SLC. And will get back to you when I get back on the 27th.



Fly HI
User currently offlineChrisNH From United States of America, joined Jun 1999, 4164 posts, RR: 2
Reply 22, posted (8 years 12 months 4 days 19 hours ago) and read 8644 times:

Can we at least stop calling these airlines 'majors?' Given the path that airlines like United, American, Delta, USAirways have been on, there is nothing 'major' about them. All they've done is shrink.

User currently offlineCrownvic From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 1954 posts, RR: 5
Reply 23, posted (8 years 12 months 4 days 19 hours ago) and read 8586 times:

How can you not call them "Majors". They are more major than ever....Major Disasters!

User currently offline717-200 From United States of America, joined Oct 2000, 601 posts, RR: 2
Reply 24, posted (8 years 12 months 4 days 19 hours ago) and read 8556 times:

Quoting ChrisNH (Reply 22):
Can we at least stop calling these airlines 'majors?' Given the path that airlines like United, American, Delta, USAirways have been on, there is nothing 'major' about them. All they've done is shrink

The appropriate name for the above mentioned carriers should be
"no frills" especially in AA's case.



72S 733 734 735 73G 738 742 752 763 E190 M82 M83
25 Beertrucker : I think we getting a little off the topic here.
26 WDBRR : Didn't the original Airtran in 1996 operate at one of these airsides before the merger with Valujet? maybe gates 70 - 77? I remember seeing them being
27 Beertrucker : If I remember I think they were over on the north A airside over near where ATA used to be on the east side of the concourse. I might be wrong about
28 Flyibaby : Technically DL would still have a say in who gets the gates, even once they are returned to the airport since the airport is run by the signatory airl
29 Beertrucker : I just did a little more looking. When Delta says they going to give back 2/3 of their Gates. I think you will find they will return the west side Ga
30 WDBRR : Didn't US Airways give back like 7 gates in MCO several years ago during their bankrupty?
31 B6fan : Negative. Today jetBlue just got 2 more gates . So they have a total of 4 gates. Those are gates 112, 111, 110, and 101. Right next to FL and WN.
32 Flyibaby : Out of curiosity...are those old WN gates...or was there a shift of gates with the concourse expansion down on the AirTran end?
33 ClearedDirect : They are expanding the WN end as well - just about done. CD
34 Lono : I remember when DL said MCO was going to be DL land (13 year DL cool aid drinker).... " the 3rd largest DL hub"... to me this means DL is falling back
35 NonRevKing : Each of those carriers can cut another 50% of their flights and STILL have greater reach than any two LCC's combined. They're the major leagues. B[Ed
36 MX757 : MCO has always been a low yield market at least for CO. Competition, F/F cashing in their miles, and people connecting from other destinations have k
37 FutureFO : DLC operates flights out of gate 90 as well as gate 60A-K. Sean from MCO and IND
38 FlyPNS1 : I would hardly call MCO an important market. It's primarily a leisure route with super low-yields. Hardly anyone makes good money at MCO (except a fe
39 B6FAN : It will be a shift because FL is taking the new gates at their end. B6 is taking 2 of FL gates.
40 PVD757 : Tell that to Massport (BOS)...
41 747LUVR : I live here in Orlando, I don't understand how you can call MCO an unimportant market....considering we get over a million visitors a WEEK here, thou
42 Midway737 : My guess would be Airtran Airways. Since it based in Orlando. so it make sense
43 ClearedDirect : Didn't MCO just pass MIA as the busiest (via passenger traffic) airport in FL? Thought I heard/read that somewhere. Could be wrong but I remember some
44 Tornado82 : Because the fares are so diluted... that nobody makes much money there anyways.
45 Slider : Technically, no they wouldn't. The City of Orlando can lease the gates if they are available. It's not a vote or something if that's what you're impl
46 N702ML : According to the August 1995 OAG, AirTran was in Airside 1 (Gates 1-29) along with Air Jamaica, American, ATA, Bahamasair, Carnival, Continental, Lac
47 DeltaGator : Well Delta makes a fair bit of money off of me just going ATL-MCO. My average ticket costs over the past two years has been ~$650 but then I fly unre
48 Tornado82 : $650 is a pretty cheap unrestricted/no Sat. ticket even.
49 JFKLGANYC : What a shame for MCO and Delta. At one point, didn't Delta have a 'mini-hub' at MCO with flights to FRA and LGW? I guess this was around the time of t
50 Bigdrewfl : B6 should have a total of 6 gates at MCO by the first quater of 06
51 Delta4eva : It doesn't make since for DL to keep the gates that they are not using....I expect them to decrease the size of the airplanes to MCO, but keep quite a
52 Post contains images Flynavy : It doesn't make since? Couldn't have said it any better.
53 DeltaGator : Yes and no. Yes in that I've had more expensive. No in that it is under 500 miles between the two and that you can find cheap tickets from $100 round
54 ClearedDirect : Agree wholeheartedly. I often fly this route (MCO-ATL) as well. Between Airtran and Delta there must be something like 15 flights a day and the fligh
55 GroundStop : Actually, between AirTran and Delta, there are 23 to 26 daily flights depending on the day of the week.
56 Tommy767 : I also remember when DL was the offical airline of the Walt Disney World Resort (and Disneyland for that matter.) They used to have their own ride at
57 Quickmover : Didn't Eastern used to be the big cheese in MCO? I thought they were once the official Disney airline.
58 Tommy767 : Yes indeed. From the early 70s through 1987 eastern was the offical carrier of the walt disney world resort. Eastern had the ride in Magic Kingdom's
59 WDBRR : I have an Eastern poster that shows EPCOT and Eastern as the official airline of WDW.
60 Kkfla737 : A big part of the problem in MCO for DL as I have stated over and over again on this site is that they have had a shifting strategy for Orlando. Firs
61 DAYflyer : FL will sccop some of those up I'm sure.
62 Quickmover : "FL will sccop some of those up I'm sure." I bet they are hoping DL will give up some ATL gates as well.
63 BonanzaAir : "FL will sccop some of those up I'm sure." "I bet they are hoping DL will give up some ATL gates as well." I was hoping through-out the entire DAL sys
64 JetBluefan1 : Are you sure about that? I thought they were only going up to 4. They have a good amount of flights daily - 13 to JFK, 4 to BOS, and 5 to EWR, but I
65 MAH4546 : Eastern was until 1990-1991, then Delta tookover. Delta even had their own ride at Disney World, in Tomorrowland at the Magic Kindgom. It was called
66 Tu154 : Wow...............and I just heard that TED wants to build in Florida.......... could it be MCO?????????????????????????????
67 DeltaMIA : Disney is a difficult company to have agreements with because they have a superiority complex. It is because of this complex that caused DL to end th
68 Phollingsworth : This move will get approved by the judge unless the City/Airport of Orlando is a major creditor of DL's. The gates are effectively and operating lease
69 Midway737 : What is the latest new? when would it happen?
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