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Severe Security Breach At PDX: Handgun Let Through  
User currently offlineS12PPL From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Posted (8 years 12 months 4 days 6 hours ago) and read 5718 times:

Aparently a hand gun was allowed through this time. Nice work TSA  

http://www.kgw.com/

There isn't a print story, but if you check the top story, under it is a video link to the story.

Aparently the handgun was caught at PHX. The punishment for the TSA screener who let this slip through? A suspension, then re-training. Then he'll be back on the job. Wonderful   Can we get rid of the TSA yet?????

[Edited 2005-12-25 02:45:51]

74 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineFlypdx From United States of America, joined Apr 2005, 636 posts, RR: 0
Reply 1, posted (8 years 12 months 4 days 6 hours ago) and read 5688 times:

A shame that they missed it. Also a shame that everyone feels a need to bash the TSA. They are trying.

User currently offlineJsposaune From United States of America, joined Oct 2005, 293 posts, RR: 1
Reply 2, posted (8 years 12 months 4 days 6 hours ago) and read 5675 times:

Funny, they are letting scissors and things through in order to focus on finding explosives.

Explosives, yes. The little things that shoot the explosives...not so much!!!
Hope this is a very isolated incident!



There are no stupid questions....only stupid people!!!
User currently offlineS12PPL From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 3, posted (8 years 12 months 4 days 6 hours ago) and read 5662 times:

Quoting Flypdx (Reply 1):
Also a shame that everyone feels a need to bash the TSA. They are trying.

I'm sorry, but what would you say when the agency started up with the sole purpose of stopping stuff like this from going through, LETS a handgun through?? Say "Hey, chin up! Keep trying guys!" ?????


This is a ridiculous lapse, and should NOT be tolerated. The TSA agent should be fired!


User currently offlineWarreng24 From United States of America, joined Nov 2005, 708 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (8 years 12 months 4 days 6 hours ago) and read 5654 times:

The TSA shows such a lack of common sense. There is such a huge amount of inconsistancy in the screening process. This is the major problem. They seem to either:
1) Not train them properly
2) Hire such idiotic people that they can't be trained.

TSA employees seem to have come from the following chain:

1) Rejected by CIA
2) Rejected by FBI
3) Rejected by State Troopers
4) Rejected by Local Police
5) Rejected by US Armed Services Recruiting
6) Rejected by private security company
7) Rejected by local nightclub (as bouncer)
8) Rejected by Wal-Mart (as shopping cart gatherer)
9) Rejected by McDonald's
10) Hired by TSA!

My last visit to BOS, I was amazed to see the screeners at the United terminal (same terminal where the 9/11 hijackers went through) just standing around chatting with each other. We all just got waived through. The guy watching the X-Ray screen was eating chips and talking with the other screeners! One lady was even gabbing on her cell phone.

I think that they ought to offer a higher pay rate, that way they can be more selective of their employees and fire off the imbeciles.


User currently offlinePilotpip From United States of America, joined Sep 2003, 3152 posts, RR: 10
Reply 5, posted (8 years 12 months 4 days 6 hours ago) and read 5636 times:

Quoting Warreng24 (Reply 4):
I think that they ought to offer a higher pay rate, that way they can be more selective of their employees and fire off the imbeciles.

That was the whole point of federalizing the screening by taking companies like Wackenhut and Huntleigh out of the picture and making them a Federal agency, paying the employees more and supposedly training them better in the long run.



DMI
User currently offlineSHUPirate1 From United States of America, joined Sep 2003, 3670 posts, RR: 16
Reply 6, posted (8 years 12 months 4 days 6 hours ago) and read 5634 times:

Quoting Warreng24 (Reply 4):
TSA employees seem to have come from the following chain:

1) Rejected by CIA
2) Rejected by FBI
3) Rejected by State Troopers
4) Rejected by Local Police
5) Rejected by US Armed Services Recruiting
6) Rejected by private security company
7) Rejected by local nightclub (as bouncer)
8) Rejected by Wal-Mart (as shopping cart gatherer)
9) Rejected by McDonald's
10) Hired by TSA!

Well, gee, thanks...what does that say about people like me who were rejected by the TSA?

Quoting Warreng24 (Reply 4):
The TSA shows such a lack of common sense. There is such a huge amount of inconsistancy in the screening process. This is the major problem. They seem to either:
1) Not train them properly
2) Hire such idiotic people that they can't be trained.

I'll go for the latter. I think I got rejected by the TSA because I scored TOO HIGHLY on their exam.



Burma's constitutional referendum options: A. Yes, B. Go to Insein Prison!
User currently offlineFXramper From United States of America, joined Dec 2005, 7364 posts, RR: 85
Reply 7, posted (8 years 12 months 4 days 5 hours ago) and read 5618 times:
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Quoting SHUPirate1 (Reply 6):

Well, gee, thanks...what does that say about people like me who were rejected by the TSA?

Do you ride the short bus to school Britt?  Smile

In all fairness to TSA, they are doing a better job since 9.11.01 IMHO.


User currently offlineSHUPirate1 From United States of America, joined Sep 2003, 3670 posts, RR: 16
Reply 8, posted (8 years 12 months 4 days 5 hours ago) and read 5602 times:

Quoting FXramper (Reply 7):
Do you ride the short bus to school Britt?

No, in fact, I lived a whole 100 feet from my high school...if a bus had come for me though, I suppose it would have been the short bus, as anybody who lives that close to school and needs to take a bus probably belongs on the short bus!



Burma's constitutional referendum options: A. Yes, B. Go to Insein Prison!
User currently offlineANCFlyer From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 9, posted (8 years 12 months 4 days 5 hours ago) and read 5561 times:

Quoting Flypdx (Reply 1):
A shame that they missed it. Also a shame that everyone feels a need to bash the TSA. They are trying.

Trying only counts in Horseshoes and Hand Grenades. These morons are charged with OUR safety. Geez, I feel safer every time I fly. Don't you  sarcastic 

Quoting S12PPL (Reply 3):
The TSA agent should be fired!

At the least . . . .

Quoting SHUPirate1 (Reply 6):

Well, gee, thanks...what does that say about people like me who were rejected by the TSA?

That you're overqualifed and the TSA didn't want to immediately upstage it's entire senior staff  bigthumbsup 


User currently offlineLesMainwaring From United States of America, joined Dec 2005, 543 posts, RR: 3
Reply 10, posted (8 years 12 months 4 days 4 hours ago) and read 5527 times:

earlier this year i was flying back from ATL (where i grew up and where my folks still live) home to PHF and was a lucky one who got "selected" for special screening ...

i have about 80,000 airline timetables, most still at my folk's home in ATL, and was brining quite a bit back with me in my carryon luggage ...

now, keep in mind, these timetables are from the 1930s until 1960s, typically (the ones in my luggage)... there were about 100 timetables total on my person...

the screener kept on and on about why i was monitoring airline schedules, and i kept on like "ummm, these schedules are at LEAST 30 years old, they are collectibles" and i explained about commercial aviation being a hobby ...

after a good plastic explosives sniffing and further proding, i was let go 15 minutes or so later ... i have to say, i really didn't feel any safer because of the screener's inability to grasp the situation ...

oh, and my starbucks coffee seemed to be upsetting too ... maybe i was holding on to the precious cup of caffeine too tightly (it was early)or maybe he was a folger's guy ...

...
The Lester Mainwaring Party
...



I want something under my wheels thats plenty long and mighty dry --- Vern Demarest
User currently offlineGman3 From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 290 posts, RR: 2
Reply 11, posted (8 years 12 months 4 days 4 hours ago) and read 5520 times:

I am surprised it got through. PDX is the ONLY airport that we fly to that I will set off the metal detector. I literally almost have to strip down to avoid any metal detection. It is so sensitive that it detected a dime that was stuck in the seam of my pocket.

User currently offlineZone1 From United States of America, joined Jan 2005, 1035 posts, RR: 7
Reply 12, posted (8 years 12 months 4 days 4 hours ago) and read 5485 times:

Quoting Flypdx (Reply 1):
A shame that they missed it. Also a shame that everyone feels a need to bash the TSA. They are trying.

I'm glad we don't have the same attitude towards pilots.  sarcastic 
Last Thursday I was SSSS'ed, and the screeners didn't notice it at all. I got the usual security check. I'm not complaining, but they dropped the ball on that one.



/// U N I T E D
User currently offlineAPFPilot1985 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 13, posted (8 years 12 months 4 days 3 hours ago) and read 5416 times:

Due to my hobby as an aviation photographer and as a result of an overzealous local police force, i am on the selectee list and get the secondary screening. After having experienced them at a number of different airports from a number of different screeners I can still say, what a joke.... the federal government took a good idea and took the cheapest and easiest way out with the TSA.

User currently offlineZvezda From Lithuania, joined Aug 2004, 10511 posts, RR: 64
Reply 14, posted (8 years 12 months 4 days 3 hours ago) and read 5384 times:

Quoting Jsposaune (Reply 2):
Hope this is a very isolated incident!

My guess is a couple of handguns slip past the TSA every day. In nearly all cases, it's someone who absent-mindedly left it in their bag. Get over it. Professional terrorists wanting to use handguns have budgets that allow them to a) carry 100% non-metalic handguns and ammo, b) get hired by TSA, c) get hired as a cleaner, etc. There is always some risk. The idea is to bring it down to a level at which the cost of bringing it down further is about the same as the cost of bringing down further other risks like cancer, being hit by a bus, etc.

The only way to have security that is both effective and efficient is to make the airlines responsible. That means the airlines set the rules (with no government meddling) and then take _full_ responsibility i.e. AA and UA would have had to pay for the World Trade Center. Before someone says something stupid like "That would have liquidated AA and UA," don't assume they are worth more liquidated than whole and operating. The ownership of AA and UA would have changed and that would have been appropriate.


User currently offlineRamprat74 From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 1547 posts, RR: 2
Reply 15, posted (8 years 12 months 4 days 2 hours ago) and read 5348 times:

I swear the PDX TSA folks were all hired at a job fair at some SE Portland trailer park. I have never seen so many unprofessional looking people in one place, in all my life.

User currently offlineAJRfromSYR From United States of America, joined May 2005, 454 posts, RR: 0
Reply 16, posted (8 years 12 months 3 days 23 hours ago) and read 5278 times:

This just makes me think about the MIA FAM shooting. People tried to say that there should have been no worry of him having a bomb since he went through security.


-AJR-
User currently offlineANCFlyer From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 17, posted (8 years 12 months 3 days 22 hours ago) and read 5262 times:

Quoting AJRfromSYR (Reply 16):
This just makes me think about the MIA FAM shooting. People tried to say that there should have been no worry of him having a bomb since he went through security.

Ha Ha Ha - Yup!

Does rather crap on everyone that said, "Oooohhh, no WAY he could have had a bomb - after all he cleared TSA before attempting to reboard".

Touche' my friend. Well said, well played.  thumbsup 


User currently offlineMir From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 21866 posts, RR: 55
Reply 18, posted (8 years 12 months 3 days 21 hours ago) and read 5225 times:

Quoting Pilotpip (Reply 5):
That was the whole point of federalizing the screening by taking companies like Wackenhut and Huntleigh out of the picture and making them a Federal agency, paying the employees more and supposedly training them better in the long run.

Wow, a whole lot of good that did.  Yeah sure

Exactly how long is this long run?

To be fair, I haven't run into many incompetent TSA people. But their policies are ridiculous. They should head to Europe for training - the security people there do things right.

-Mir



7 billion, one nation, imagination...it's a beautiful day
User currently offlineJumpseat70 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 19, posted (8 years 12 months 3 days 18 hours ago) and read 5179 times:

Here in KC, we hear complaints all day long about the blankety blank TSA which is actually First Line. We have a private company that does our screening and I have to say , NOTHING gets through. Everyone sets off the scanner and everyone, without exception, complains. Even the Delta Pilots.

But they are professional and dedicated, and we respect them. It's a boring, offensive job.

They have caught guns in bags, box cutters in shoes, and a bag that once held plastic explosives. Just another day at the airport for them.

And if you try and sneak through less than 15 minutes for a flight, you might get a rude awakening. They have a very good relationship with us, the gate agents. Regardless of the whining, they do their job.


User currently offlineFlyorski From United States of America, joined Dec 2004, 997 posts, RR: 1
Reply 20, posted (8 years 12 months 3 days 18 hours ago) and read 5162 times:

Quoting Mir (Reply 18):
They should head to Europe for training - the security people there do things right.

I couldn't agree with you more.



"None are more hopelessly enslaved, than those who falsly believe they are free" -Goethe
User currently offlineLetsgetwet From United States of America, joined Jul 2005, 609 posts, RR: 0
Reply 21, posted (8 years 12 months 3 days 18 hours ago) and read 5159 times:

Let's face it. It doesn't matter if every TSA agent was required to have a PHD, and we paid them $100,000/year. It doesn't matter if they work for the federal gvt. or the airlines. They are all human, there will always be mistakes. It is impossible to have a 100% perfect security system in place. There is no such thing. We should just be glad that MOST of the time the system works and we are somewhat safer with the system than without it. Nothing can ever be guaranteed.

User currently offlineDL1011 From United States of America, joined May 1999, 386 posts, RR: 2
Reply 22, posted (8 years 12 months 3 days 16 hours ago) and read 5105 times:

Having worked for the airlines since 1988, I'll take TSA anyday over the old system. Can it be improved? Sure. Is it better then the old system where the airlines hired the lowest bidder? Without a dout.

Just my 2 cts worth. Happy Holidays!


User currently offlineZvezda From Lithuania, joined Aug 2004, 10511 posts, RR: 64
Reply 23, posted (8 years 12 months 3 days 15 hours ago) and read 5056 times:

Quoting DL1011 (Reply 22):
Is it better then the old system where the airlines hired the lowest bidder?

The problem with the old system was that the airlines neither had the power to set the rules nor responsibility for mistakes.


User currently offlineLetsgetwet From United States of America, joined Jul 2005, 609 posts, RR: 0
Reply 24, posted (8 years 12 months 3 days 14 hours ago) and read 5041 times:

Quoting Zvezda (Reply 23):
The problem with the old system was that the airlines neither had the power to set the rules nor responsibility for mistakes.

Let the airlines concentrate on flying, and leave security to the government.


25 CUSSkiosks : In my line of work, I have reason to print a lot of sample boarding cards and such from various airlines. I have a habit of then using these coupons (
26 S12PPL : Yes. But letting a HAND GUN go thorugh security is not acceptable. A pocket knife every now and then I can sort of understand. Nail clippers I can un
27 Jetboy319 : While is see your point (sort of) and respect your opinion, think of it this way: Pilots aren't paid to "Try" and fly the airplane. As such, TSA is p
28 Atmx2000 : A terrorist can't rely on screeners missing a gun on an off chance.
29 S12PPL : You've completely missed the point. That's ok, keep trying.
30 Aa757first : But would this handgun have gone through if a private company was responsible for screening? And, if it did, what would the punishment have been? Try
31 S12PPL : That's not my point. My point is this is another lapse in security by the TSA. How many times have we seen on the news "Today at _______, the entire
32 SHUPirate1 : Actually, all you have to do is pass a three-hour exam. Unfortunately, they don't tell you either your score or the necessary score, or whether you h
33 Letsgetwet : This happens every day. That is impossible. And if you think otherwise you tell me where to find tens of thousands of people who are PERFECT. (I don'
34 Post contains images EA CO AS : So what's acceptable to you then when this mistake occurs? Is termination good enough? Perhaps charging the person with a felony of "Endangering the
35 Artsyman : It is not possible for someone to get a handgun through security IF the person doing the screening actually looks at the x-ray screen. You could not m
36 11Bravo : That just isn't true. Depending on the screening angle it can be difficult to detect a handgun with a quick x-ray scan. If the weapon is in profile,
37 S12PPL : Just because I know the answer to this question all ready..... What would happen in your line of work if someone drove a Tug, or Belt Loader, or Push
38 EA CO AS : Actually, yeah! They'd be suspended pending an investigation, and if it was nothing more than mere operator error (no drugs or alcohol involved), the
39 Aa757first : And lawsuits get filed. Right? What happens here? AAndrew
40 Letsgetwet : You can't sue for something that COULD have hapened. There were no damages to sue for.
41 S12PPL : Maybe someone who'd been with the airline 5+ years. I've heard of people getting canned right away.
42 EA CO AS : If they were already in steps of discipline, then sure - they'd probably be sacked immediately. But someone who had no previous work-performance issu
43 Post contains images Boeingfanyyz : Of course they arent. You know as well as I do the amount of damage that gun could have caused, especially in the air. Let me quickly rephrase this..
44 Letsgetwet : I'm just saying that there is no such thing as a perfect security agent. Our government knows that, and anyone who works in any kind of security rela
45 Lnglive1011yyz : If you guys think that they can screen 100% of the time, and get it right 100% fo the time, you're sorrowly mistaken. It's like any job. When you rely
46 Letsgetwet : What would be the charges? Since when is carelessness against the law?
47 Grantcv : Yes, the TSA is trying. And they are doing a really good job. I go through a TSA checkpoint at least twice a week and have been doing so for as long a
48 Post contains images Ikramerica : Why be surprised? The screeners and JFK/EWR/BOS/LGA have always behaved this way, pre-9/11 when they were private, post 9/11 (one week later!) when t
49 S12PPL : Reckless endangerment. You may not have hurt the person, but they can still charge you with it. If you have passengers in a car, and you are driving
50 AsstChiefMark : I still can't figure out why someone puts a handgun in their carry-on bag and then forgets that it's there. Mark
51 KabAir : Letting a handgun through is a big mistake and I'm not condoning it. But people are human. By your logic should the AA FA who gave me the wrong drink
52 Post contains images Boeingfanyyz : So, you're basically saying that when a doctor loses a patient (even if he purposely kills him/her/it), he/she is said to have done a good job? I don
53 Lnglive1011yyz : Obviously NOT. I'm just saying that as humans, we can't be correct 100% of the time. It's not possible. Things are going to slip through. If they cat
54 Post contains images Boeingfanyyz : Let me ask you this: how many guns does the TSA uncover each day? I think we both know that the answer is quite low. So, on this day, we know that th
55 KabAir : I was very confused by your comments until I looked at your profile and saw that you're a student and still haven't entered the "real world" yet. How
56 S12PPL : NO! And I'll get to why as soon as I quote your next....whatever it is. Holey crap! We're talking about two different things here! For starters....Ge
57 KabAir : But how do you know it's the agent's fault? What if their trainer was a moron? Maybe far fetched, but you can't know for sure. And look, I understand
58 Post contains images Halls120 : TSA is trying? Wow. I guess we should all be thankful they are at least trying. Problem is, they are WASTING valuable taxpayer dollars, and obviously
59 11Bravo : I'm not defending TSA here. They clearly have a number of problems and they have a long way to go. The point of my post was to suggest that people ar
60 Letsgetwet : No it was a box cutter that was perfectly legal to be carried on board. The terrorist could have walked past security holding it up for everyone to s
61 Halls120 : IOW, a huge amount of federal tax dollars are being spent on an agency that after 3 years is still underperforming. And there is NO sense that anyone
62 Noelg : Can I just ask when there will be a day that the TSA does something right? One minute we hear "It's horrible, it's too intense, they make us feel like
63 S12PPL : I for one have never made the complaint they were "too intense". Yeah, the occasional pat down, and taking off the shoes can be a pain in the butt. Bu
64 Goaliemn : As of today, that'll not happen. Even "plastic handguns" have a pound or more of metal in them. They haven't come up with a good plastic barrel yet.
65 DeltaGator : I see you've met the screeners in ATL. The key word is supposedly. Makes me think of Tom Daschle and his "You can't professionalize unless you Federa
66 Letsgetwet : Well, if you think security should be outsourced to a private contractor, lets do it with the police and the military too. It's the governments respo
67 DeltaGator : Before 9/11 security was outsourced to private firms and did pretty good. None of the 9/11 highjackers did anything illegal up to the point of highja
68 HAWK21M : A single lapse could have been very serious if it had fallen in the wrong hands.Undoubtly its a serious lapse. Whats the TSA Official duty times.Out h
69 GDB : The Sept 11th hijackers, at least the non piloting 'muscle' element, had Mace. Some were stopped, but no bags were searched. I've only directly encoun
70 DeltaGator : As usual during the Clinton administration intelligence like this was ignored. Bin Laden was offered to us by The Sudan but Bubba passed it up for va
71 GDB : But did OBL not get the hell out of Sudan, double quick in 1996? Not that I'm sure of the timelines with this and with info from captured terrorists h
72 L-188 : That number is rapidly decreasing. I know that there was experiments with ceramic barrels on Glocks. Depends on the caliber. A 22 would do the job ni
73 DeltaGator : Very true. Unfortunately the slowness of governments to respond and the internal politics of agencies and administartions is ridiculous (pretty much
74 GDB : DeltaGator, true enough. A suicide attack was thought of, by Intel agencies in both Europe and the US (the former had the attempt to do Paris with a h
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