CharlesMD From United States of America, joined Dec 2005, 67 posts, RR: 2 Posted (7 years 4 months 4 weeks 1 day 17 hours ago) and read 1500 times:
I have been following several flights I am supposed to take, i.e. DFW-California and noticed that today's routings have a southerly deviation to the intersection of Texas and New Mexico (?) rather than the direct routing.
Does anyone know why this is? I was flying SFO-DFW yesterday and the turbulence was horrific-- perhaps this could be why??
Aaway From United States of America, joined Oct 2003, 1443 posts, RR: 14 Reply 1, posted (7 years 4 months 4 weeks 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 1462 times:
Can't speak for Bay Area-DFW routings as I haven't flown those routes in a while. But, the typical SoCal-DFW routings reflect the image from Flightaware you've linked. Once the CA/AZ border has been crossed, the routing is usually to TFD or GBN (Stansfield /Casa Grande or San Simon / Gila Bend - both between the Phoenix and Tucson areas), then J50 to INK (Wink, TX.) J50 takes you slightly north of ELP. J50 also parallels Interstate 20. So, from over Wink, thence MAF, thence ABI, thence DFW.
On occasion, the routing from over the Phoenix area is to TCS (Truth or Consequences), thence LBB, thence SPS, thence DFW.
[Edited 2005-12-29 04:55:29]
[Edited 2005-12-29 05:00:06]
With a choice between changing one's mind & proving there's no need to do so, most everyone gets busy on the proof.
Tom in NO From United States of America, joined Nov 1999, 7194 posts, RR: 40 Reply 2, posted (7 years 4 months 4 weeks 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 1454 times:
The eastbound SAN-DFW routing you link looks pretty good to me. There's a military operating area southwest of Phoenix that is pretty active. Every flight I've taken in that direction has skirted the MOA to the north. This routing usually takes one almost overhead of, or just south of Phoenix. Also, the El Paso area is a major intersection for flights crisscrossing the area. As I recall, continuing eastbound from ELP, the arrival routing to DFW crosses Abilene (ABI).
The last time I flew DFW-SAN westbound, we took a more northerly routing across Hobbs, NM, then across PHX and over to SAN.
Tom at MSY
"The criminal ineptitude makes you furious"-Bruce Springsteen, after seeing firsthand the damage from Hurricane Katrina
CharlesMD From United States of America, joined Dec 2005, 67 posts, RR: 2 Reply 3, posted (7 years 4 months 4 weeks 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 1436 times:
When you're actually flying the route how do you keep track of what the path is (if you aren't the pilot??)
OPNLguy From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 4, posted (7 years 4 months 4 weeks 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 1424 times:
Quoting CharlesMD (Thread starter): I have been following several flights I am supposed to take, i.e. DFW-California and noticed that today's routings have a southerly deviation to the intersection of Texas and New Mexico (?) rather than the direct routing.
Does anyone know why this is? I was flying SFO-DFW yesterday and the turbulence was horrific-- perhaps this could be why??
Two separate, yet related issues here...
DFW to the LA basin airports almost always head via ABI ELP and then split off to IPL (for SAN) and SSO PDZ (for LAX and ONT). They seldom travel a straight-line from DFW to SAN/LAX/ONT due to restricted area 5107 (R-5107, mainly used by Holloman AFB aircraft) which encompasses a big chunk of airspace in the south and south central part of New Mexico. Sometimes, during weekends or long holidays (like now) R-5107 is inactive ("cold") and J65 is usuable across it. Some DFW-LAX flights also get routed via CNX and PKE, which takes them across central Arizona.
As far as SFO-DFW, this is the season for big wet storms coming off the Pacific into the Bay area, and the winds across the Sierras produce all sorts of mountain wave turbulence in the lee of the mountains. Sometimes it can be avoided by planning certain altitudes on the normal routes. Other times, you have to change the route as well. There's a route J110 that runs CZQ-BLD (Vegas area) then east, but it runs right across R-2508 (another restricted area, but this one associated with Edwards AFB). Again with the holidays, it's probably available, but the other way out of the Bay area is south all the way to PMD and then east, either over the "cold" R-5107, or the slightly longer way via ELP.
Aaway From United States of America, joined Oct 2003, 1443 posts, RR: 14 Reply 5, posted (7 years 4 months 4 weeks 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 1403 times:
Quoting CharlesMD (Reply 3): When you're actually flying the route how do you keep track of what the path is (if you aren't the pilot??)
Well, I've been a bit of an oddball I suppose. In addition to being an airline fanatic, I also delved into airport and ATC matters. I use to practically study airport overviews and schematics. When flying over a midsized up to large city, I can usually recognize it if I can spot the airport.
May seem odd, but I bet there are other here who do the same.
As far as specific waypoints or fixes, purchase a copy of an Airport/Facility Directory. 8 different volumes grouped geographically. There's a section in each that details preferred IFR routes between most major terminal areas.
With a choice between changing one's mind & proving there's no need to do so, most everyone gets busy on the proof.
Aaway From United States of America, joined Oct 2003, 1443 posts, RR: 14 Reply 6, posted (7 years 4 months 4 weeks 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 1385 times:
Quoting OPNLguy (Reply 4): They seldom travel a straight-line from DFW to SAN/LAX/ONT due to restricted area 5107 (R-5107
Yes, a very good point OPNLguy. Just looking at a Jepp Hi plate, R-5107 (and associated R-5103 and R-5109) cover a HUGE area from just south of Soccorro on the north, just north of Newman on the south, Truth or Consequences on the west, and from a Corona to Hudspeth line on the east.
With a choice between changing one's mind & proving there's no need to do so, most everyone gets busy on the proof.
Ejmmsu From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 1692 posts, RR: 0 Reply 7, posted (7 years 4 months 4 weeks 1 day 11 hours ago) and read 1335 times:
Quoting Aaway (Reply 1): On occasion, the routing from over the Phoenix area is to TCS (Truth or Consequences), thence LBB, thence SPS, thence DFW.
Last year I flew LGB-DFW-SPS on AA, and I remember passing right over SPS as we just started our descent. I had an awesome visual of the rough map of the city which was really cool. Of course, about an hour later I got a more close-up view in my Saab340.
"If the facts do not conform to the theory, they will have to be disposed of"
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