CHRISBA777ER From UK - England, joined Mar 2001, 5964 posts, RR: 63 Posted (7 years 11 months 1 week 1 day 8 hours ago) and read 3760 times:
I have a load of questions about Swiss.
Ok so they are now a full Star Alliance member. What is their current fleet?
Last i looked it was nine A343E and A332 - any increases there?
Also what does their current short-haul fleet consist of? I know its nearly all Airbus narrowbodies but what about new deliveries/orders etc. Didnt they have some ERJ170/190 on order? When do they get delivered? Do they lease or own their fleet?
How likely would they be to get the A350? Does the 787 stand a chance?
Do Lufthansa Technik do their heavy MX work? Any operational ramifications of the Lufthansa takeover - will LH transfer any more A330s/40s? I know LX is desperate for more long-haul capacity - have they got rid of the last of their MD11s now?
Any help would be greatly appreciated.
What do you mean you dont have any bourbon? Do you know how far it is to Houston? What kind of airline is this???
Knightsofmalta From Malta, joined Nov 2005, 1536 posts, RR: 18 Reply 3, posted (7 years 11 months 1 week 1 day 8 hours ago) and read 3708 times:
Actually, LX won't be joining the STAR Alliance until april.
At the moment, negotiations are continuing to introduce an additional A. 330 and two A. 340 to the fleet in order to operate the long-haul flights on a daily basis again. The A. 330 in question is actually an old SR aircraft which went to LH ad interim until they received their own ordered A. 330. This means that if the aircraft actually comes, it wouldn't even need to be refurbished or anything.
As for the MD-11, sadly, the last LX aircraft left the fleet in 2004.
PM From India, joined Feb 2005, 6816 posts, RR: 65 Reply 4, posted (7 years 11 months 1 week 1 day 8 hours ago) and read 3679 times:
The MD-11s are long gone and the long-haul fleet is indeed 9 x A330-223 (with PW4168A) of which five have a three class configuration (i.e. with First) and four have two classes and 9 x A340-300E all configured with three classes. There's no immediate likelihood of further long-haul planes being added despite steady rumours.
On short-haul, the SAAB 2000s have all gone and the ERJs will be gone by the end of March. One RJ100 is going but six more are being brought in from British Airways. LX will then have 20 x RJ100 and 4 x RJ85.
The Airbus A32x fleet is currently 7 x A319, 14 x A320 and 4 x A321 - all with CFM. (There's also a leased Privatair BBJ doing a ZRH-New York run.)
The sundry E-170s and E-190s that have been deferred again and again seem unlikely ever to be delivered.
So, by this summer LX will be flying:
18 x A330/A340
25 x A32x
24 x RJ85/100
If they were buying new widebodies tomorrow I'd suggest that the A350 would be in a strong position. LX could replace A330s with the -800 and A340s with -900s thereby having one fleet and one engine for all long-haul services.
But they are NOT buying new widebodies tomorrow or even the day after tomorrow!
Traditionally, LX (i.e. SR) have not been a big Boeing customer (just seven 747s over the years) but whether that has any bearing on the possibility of a 787 order I have no idea.
In any case, it seems unlikely in future that LX will have a fleet that is markedly different from that of Lufthansa. As and when LH make some decisions about their future fleet (and once LH have decided on the future of long-haul routes out of ZRH) we should have an idea of what LX will be flying ten years from now.
HB-IWC From Greece, joined Sep 2000, 4450 posts, RR: 74 Reply 8, posted (7 years 11 months 1 week 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 3588 times:
Quoting Knightsofmalta (Reply 3): The A. 330 in question is actually an old SR aircraft which went to LH ad interim until they received their own ordered A. 330.
That would be one of the A332s currently parked at CGN? That is, if these 3 airframes are still there at this time. The two remaining A332s in Lufthansa's fleet, which are due to leave soon are ex-Sabena frames OO-SFT and OO-SFU.
Swiss is in dire need to reinstate daily operations to its core longhaul destinations (HKG, GRU, JNB, BKK, and even LAX and MIA if they want to sustain them). It has also been sitting on the rights to operate daily into NRT, but it has so far not done so, lacking the necessary resources.
actually, heavy maintenance on the long-haul fleet is mostly done by SR Technics in Zurich; ARJ's, ERJ's (and previously Saab 2000s) are done in-house by Swiss in Basel, in the former Crossair facility. Note that SRT is an independend company from LX: It is one of the few parts of the bankrupt SAirLines concern that was successfully spun-off and sold to an investor integrally, allowing it to continue trading.
Ironically, it is rather the other way round than where your question was heading to: SR Technics also does various maintenance tasks for Lufthansa & its associates, mainly on the MD-11F and the A340, while Swiss in Basel also started doing some heavy maintenance on Lufthansa Regional Avros.
ChrisZRH From Switzerland, joined May 2004, 423 posts, RR: 8 Reply 10, posted (7 years 11 months 1 week 1 day 2 hours ago) and read 3317 times:
It's very likely Swiss is going to drop the BKK-SIN leg as it's non-profitable. if there is going to be a successfull code-share agreement with SA they drop JNB as the plane stands around like 12 hours for nothing, so they can add additional frequencies.
Santiago is likely to get added in code-share agreement with LH from GRU on, so LX flies GRU-Santiago, while LH flies GRU-Buenos Aires
LX23 From United Kingdom, joined Aug 2004, 347 posts, RR: 3 Reply 11, posted (7 years 11 months 1 week 18 hours ago) and read 3114 times:
Well, PM, Knightsofmalta, and ChrisZRH all did a good job of saying pretty much everything I wanted to say.
The two A332s (the third is going to TP I think) at CGN that might or might not be added (like Chris, I'm somewhat sceptical about this...but then again, LX could use the extra airplanes!) are HB-IQM, HB-IQN ex SR birds, which would make me rather happy, as I've flown on both machines, and seeing them return to ZRH/GVA would be great
I also agree with Chris that LX dropping BKK-SIN is likely (and a wise move, if they can codeshare with TG).
But as long as I'm dreaming... I'd love to see a return of some intercontinental flights to GVA yes, yes, we have JFK... but it would still be nice to have something else
HB-IWC From Greece, joined Sep 2000, 4450 posts, RR: 74 Reply 12, posted (7 years 11 months 1 week 17 hours ago) and read 3077 times:
Quoting ChrisZRH (Reply 10): It's very likely Swiss is going to drop the BKK-SIN leg as it's non-profitable.
Singapore hasn't been profitable for SR/LX for quite a while now. Back in the 90s, when there were 3 weekly nonstops and 4 direct flights, the line was heavily in the red, and so the nonstops were axed. The station, however, has remained unprofitable, so a complete closure is now very likely. That being said, the flights are still in the CRS and seats to SIN can be booked.
Lufthansa and Swiss are also contemplating the use of LX's idle equipment at BKK if and when the SIN tag on were to be axed. A quick turnaround to KUL on behalf of LH is being considered. Alternatively, LX might reschedule its BKK operation into a Westbound dalylight pattern, so as to preserve aircraft utilization rates.
As for JNB, I wouldn't be surprised at all if at some point in the near future the LX-operated flight gets the axe. The flight was heavily lossmaking when it was operated as a daylight outbound. I haven't seen any figures for the new situation, but I would imagine that, with 2 Star airlines on the route, it is likely that SA could take over the entire operation, allowing LX to reallocate the equipment. JNB must be one of LX's most costly routes in terms of aircraft utilization, considering the long ground times.
In any case there are still some changes needed to introduce LX14 (second daily ZRH-JFK). The flightplan currently loaded into the reservation systems like amadeus will require one more A332 as of april. A rescheduling of BKK to westbound daylight would free up one A343 which could be used instead...
I personally would favor a 10th A332 and the termination of SIN, rescheduling of LX182/183 and using the freed-up A343 to increase operation to GRU (with extension to SCL), LAX and JNB (these destinations are mentioned as prime candidates for daily service favored by LX in the article above).
JoFMO From Germany, joined Jul 2004, 2211 posts, RR: 0 Reply 14, posted (7 years 11 months 1 week 1 hour ago) and read 2740 times:
The article in the Handelszeitung is a little bit pessimistic. First of all we should note that LX has given up the mentioned Asian destinations before their integration in LH.
And I don't see giving up SIN as such a big problem. LX will place it's code on SQ's daily nonstop. Now in the same alliance with SQ, I don't see why anybody should still fly LX onestop via BKK.
Another strong indication that the BKK-SIN leg will be scrapped is that LH cancels it's MUC-BKK flight from April. So LH might need some more seets to BKK, which they could fulfill with a codehsare on LX's ZRH-BKK.
I also see some new opportunities ariesing regarding 5th freedom destinations from BKK. LH and LX could operate a scissor hub in BKK. LH's 744 currently flies onward 3x to SGN and 4x to KUL. Together with Swiss, they could operate both destinations daily. Or LX could fly to TPE, a destination currently not served by LH because they want to appease China. But because LX doesn't operate to China they could fly to Taiwan.
If there is really so much demand from Switzerland to Singapore, than LX needs to fly nonstop to compete with SQ, but I doubt that there is enough room for 2 nonstops. I see more importance in serving China and India, currently underserved from Switzerland, than a 2nd Star Alliance flight to SIN.
something like 50 millions euros lost in the first 9 months of 2005, even bigger than the loss of some other millions during 2004...that is not being profitable. Why exactly did LH buy it?...
Why are we talking about new longhaul planes or routes if they are in such conditions...after already having folded and restarted?
Knightsofmalta From Malta, joined Nov 2005, 1536 posts, RR: 18 Reply 16, posted (7 years 11 months 6 days 8 hours ago) and read 2524 times:
Quoting HB-IWC (Reply 12): As for JNB, I wouldn't be surprised at all if at some point in the near future the LX-operated flight gets the axe. The flight was heavily lossmaking when it was operated as a daylight outbound. I haven't seen any figures for the new situation, but I would imagine that, with 2 Star airlines on the route, it is likely that SA could take over the entire operation, allowing LX to reallocate the equipment. JNB must be one of LX's most costly routes in terms of aircraft utilization, considering the long ground times.
As far as I know, minor maintenance is carried out on the aircraft during it's 12 hour stay in JNB and it's also washed on the outside.
As for LX dropping JNB, that might be a tricky one. Having to fly LH via FRA is hardly something you can expect passengers to do when there's a direct SA flight every day from ZRH. Ideally, there would be a code-share agreement between LX and SA, especially now that both are joining STAR. But from what I've heard, the relationship between the two carriers has been everything but rosy for the last couple of years and without LH using it's clout with SA for the benefit of LX, I hardly see anything happening really.
Quoting JoFMO (Reply 14): And I don't see giving up SIN as such a big problem. LX will place it's code on SQ's daily nonstop. Now in the same alliance with SQ, I don't see why anybody should still fly LX onestop via BKK.
That's easier said than done. Negotiations with SQ and LX have not been going well lately. SQ's point of view is that if they can manage to turn in a profit on their own on the SIN-ZRH route, they see absolutely no reason why they should have to share part of that profit with LX by placing their code on the flight. They do have a point. On the other hand, SQ has been making noises about changing the ZRH flight from a B. 747 to a B. 777. So maybe it's not that easy after all trying to fill the plane on their own...
JoFMO From Germany, joined Jul 2004, 2211 posts, RR: 0 Reply 19, posted (7 years 11 months 6 days 2 hours ago) and read 2275 times:
Quoting OzarkD9S (Reply 18): Quoting JoFMO (Reply 14):
Why exactly did LH buy it?...
To keep BA from getting it.
Beside the fact that the reply was not given by me, LH could only buy it because BA wasn't interested in sinking any money in Swiss at all.
Don't forget that LX decided to join Oneworld. Only after they gave BA half of their slots in LHR they realized that BA wasn't interested at all in them. They didn't want to take any risk just melt them.
Ka From Switzerland, joined Apr 2000, 649 posts, RR: 11 Reply 20, posted (7 years 11 months 5 hours ago) and read 2007 times:
So, do we have any new information on how LX plans to operate their summer 06 longhaul flights? It simply won´t be possible with the current fleet to operate all currently loaded flights.
March 26 is not too far away.
Kiwiandrew From New Zealand, joined Jun 2005, 8442 posts, RR: 14 Reply 22, posted (7 years 11 months 4 hours ago) and read 1928 times:
Quoting Aukahkay (Reply 21): LX is not a member of Star Alliance. It is a member of One World/Asia Miles.
it is not yet a member of Star Alliance ... although confusingly it is on the RTW fare .. expect it to become a member sometime around April this year .
it is not and never has been a member of OW - it withdrew it's membership application in Jun '04 before actually becoming a member ( although it is currently a member of the ff programmes of a number of individual OW airlines )
Moderation in all things ... including moderation ;-)
ZRH From Switzerland, joined Nov 1999, 5563 posts, RR: 38 Reply 23, posted (7 years 11 months 1 hour ago) and read 1776 times:
Quoting Aukahkay (Reply 21): LX is not a member of Star Alliance. It is a member of One World/Asia Miles.
At the Star Alliance meeting in Summer 2005 (I think in June) Swiss was confirmed to become a full member. It will be effective from April 2006. It must be like this as Swiss is fully owned by LH. Swiss never was a member of OW.