Rampart From United States, joined Aug 2005, 1203 posts, RR: 6 Posted (2 years 10 months 3 weeks 3 days 2 hours ago) and read 1077 times:
You pilots and related folk would probably have an answer for this. Driving to work this morning -- I live in northern New Jersey -- I was watching a "large plane", couldn't tell if it were military or airline, circle repeatedly in a large oval pattern at high altitude, evident in a series of perfect contrails that continued to blow downwind. I estimated it to be roughly over Passaic and Morris counties, if you are familiar with the region, but couldn't say what the actual radius was. I say high altitude because of the contrails (smeared into the cirrus overcast downwind), and because it looked like the normal NE corridor air traffic (Canada or Europe to the Southeast) had repeated flyovers with contrails, some just above and some just below the oval.
It took place at least over 30-45 minutes, and at least 10 revolutions.
What was this plane doing?
I didn't see another plane in parallel, so I counted out military refueling (doubtful over a metro area anyhow). Was it training? Holding pattern -- if so, why so high? An emergency of some sort?
Dolinja777 From United States, joined Feb 2005, 34 posts, RR: 0 Reply 2, posted (2 years 10 months 3 weeks 3 days 1 hour ago) and read 1044 times:
Wow, I saw the same thing as well this morning! I live in the Upper West Side of Manhattan and saw this as I was walking back from the gym (approximately 8am). First I saw lots of massive contrails up in the sky, at least 3 or 4 that were dispersing. Then I noticed the newest contrail turning and saw that the plane was making a large arc, almost a 180 degree turn. I thought it was strange but was too exhausted to make anything of it. Although I partially expected to get home and turn on the news to see something interesting going on. But nothing.
KELPkid From United States, joined Nov 2005, 3501 posts, RR: 3 Reply 3, posted (2 years 10 months 3 weeks 3 days 1 hour ago) and read 1032 times:
Holding pattern. The flight crew were told to hold at some point. Could be for many, many reasons (bad weather at the destination, an emergency, etc.) This is how you "park" a plane in the sky
Rulebooks and regulations are made from paper...and they do a poor job at preventing metal from contacting rock-Ernest G
Newark777 From United States, joined Dec 2004, 8796 posts, RR: 39 Reply 7, posted (2 years 10 months 3 weeks 3 days 1 hour ago) and read 987 times:
You see that a lot, for the EWR approaches at least, and I know I saw a lot last night. You tend to see it more with the heavier traffic, and tends to happen where you described, and over along the border near PA and Hunterdon county, and also down near Philly.
What time did you see this? I might be able to find the track for you.
Hmmmm... From Canada, joined May 1999, 2071 posts, RR: 5 Reply 8, posted (2 years 10 months 3 weeks 3 days 1 hour ago) and read 973 times:
Of course Bush was in that plane giving his neo-con oil baron friends a tour of the city that they would buy with their petro dollars. And in the back innocent Iraqi women were being tortured for their muslim beliefs. It's detailed in an expose in the New York Times.
An optimist robs himself of the joy of being pleasantly surprised
Newark777 From United States, joined Dec 2004, 8796 posts, RR: 39 Reply 10, posted (2 years 10 months 3 weeks 3 days 1 hour ago) and read 914 times:
Now, looking over the flights from this morning, are you sure you saw the same plane doing holding patterns, or was it the standard approach into EWR R22? It sounds like this isn't what it looked like, but the approach is a large arc over northern NJ:
Hmmmm... From Canada, joined May 1999, 2071 posts, RR: 5 Reply 13, posted (2 years 10 months 3 weeks 3 days 1 hour ago) and read 816 times:
Newark, so what are you saying? That Bush was not involved in some conspiracy here? Be prepared to have your evidence shouted down at any university across the land. I don't think professors and students alike will appreciate your pictures of holding patterns. "Fascist stooge!"
An optimist robs himself of the joy of being pleasantly surprised
Gkirk From United Kingdom (Scotland), joined Jun 2000, 23189 posts, RR: 59 Reply 14, posted (2 years 10 months 3 weeks 3 days 1 hour ago) and read 800 times:
Chemtrails
When you hear the noise of the Tartan Army Boys, we'll be coming down the road!
Newark777 From United States, joined Dec 2004, 8796 posts, RR: 39 Reply 15, posted (2 years 10 months 3 weeks 3 days 1 hour ago) and read 791 times:
Quoting Hmmmm... (Reply 13): Newark, so what are you saying? That Bush was not involved in some conspiracy here? Be prepared to have your evidence shouted down at any university across the land. I don't think professors and students alike will appreciate your pictures of holding patterns. "Fascist stooge!"
I never said they weren't spreading chemtrails at the same time...
Molykote From United States, joined Aug 2005, 1072 posts, RR: 9 Reply 16, posted (2 years 10 months 3 weeks 3 days ago) and read 790 times:
Quoting Hmmmm... (Reply 13): Newark, so what are you saying? That Bush was not involved in some conspiracy here? Be prepared to have your evidence shouted down at any university across the land. I don't think professors and students alike will appreciate your pictures of holding patterns. "Fascist stooge!"
Clearly these extended flight paths are a ploy to consume extra fuel to beneift Halliburton. Meanwhile the poor kittens were tortured onboard for an extra 15 minutes.
Newark777 From United States, joined Dec 2004, 8796 posts, RR: 39 Reply 18, posted (2 years 10 months 3 weeks 3 days ago) and read 714 times:
Quoting Timz (Reply 17):
But EWR approaches wouldn't be at contrail height over New Jersey. Check the altitudes on those Flightaware tracks.
I know, that's why I said it probably wasn't the case, just an idea. The odd thing is, the behavior seems right, the altitude is just off. Also, that loop above is the only I could find of any plane into EWR. My other guess is that it is planes at altitude doing holds enroute; the northeast corridor can get pretty jammed up at times.
Rampart From United States, joined Aug 2005, 1203 posts, RR: 6 Reply 19, posted (2 years 10 months 3 weeks 3 days ago) and read 710 times:
I had no idea I could spark such creative thought! These are great. Poor kittens!
Quoting Newark777 (Reply 10): It sounds like this isn't what it looked like, but the approach is a large arc over northern NJ:
Thanks for that suggestion, Harry, and for the subsequent example. I've experienced such approaches myself, but what I saw this morning wasn't one of them. This fellow was making beautiful repeated perfect ovals over a fixed location for better than 45 minutes. I'm sure it was one plane. I doubt it was a EWR, or any NYC airport approach, as it was much higher than those typically are. (Time was between 8:00 and 9:00 this morning, since you ask.) It could have been an approach to PHI, but wouldn't they already be at a lower altitude by then?
KELPkid's suggestion seems to make most sense, but I didn't know they had a practice of doing so at cruising altitude. (I'm guessing they were at cruising altitude, compared to similar traffic.)
Aren't chemtrails responsible for the dark substance that coats shingled roofs near airports?
KELPkid From United States, joined Nov 2005, 3501 posts, RR: 3 Reply 20, posted (2 years 10 months 3 weeks 3 days ago) and read 690 times:
Quoting Rampart (Reply 19): KELPkid's suggestion seems to make most sense, but I didn't know they had a practice of doing so at cruising altitude. (I'm guessing they were at cruising altitude, compared to similar traffic.)
I've been held at a cruise altitude once before...right as the weather started getting really crappy at my intended destination, and the IFR arrivals started bunching up. Although, for us single-engine, non turbo piston drivers, cruising altitudes are generally 5000'-10000'
Rulebooks and regulations are made from paper...and they do a poor job at preventing metal from contacting rock-Ernest G
Newark777 From United States, joined Dec 2004, 8796 posts, RR: 39 Reply 21, posted (2 years 10 months 3 weeks 3 days ago) and read 670 times:
Quoting Rampart (Reply 19): Thanks for that suggestion, Harry, and for the subsequent example. I've experienced such approaches myself, but what I saw this morning wasn't one of them. This fellow was making beautiful repeated perfect ovals over a fixed location for better than 45 minutes. I'm sure it was one plane. I doubt it was a EWR, or any NYC airport approach, as it was much higher than those typically are. (Time was between 8:00 and 9:00 this morning, since you ask.
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